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How have your opinions on each series shifted over time?

Discussion in 'Pokémon Animé Discussion' started by Blastmaster, Jul 19, 2020.

  1. Blastmaster

    Blastmaster Well-Known Member

    This forum has a reputation for arguing in circles and sticking adamantly to certain opinions no matter what. I can't really change that, but I'm curious as to what opinions actually have changed, for better or worse.

    OS hasn't changed too much for me, I don't think it's aged well in most departments. That said, I've gotten a lot more appreciation for its comedic dialogue, which even I have to admit is still the best to this day. It does really make me wish they'd kept Ash's snarky edge moving forward.

    AG's gone down somewhat because of the highly aged animation and just having a lot of awkward middle child syndrome. I respect that it changed a lot for its time, but compared to what we have nowadays it does feel very "safe" for the most part.

    DP unsurprisingly has pretty steadily increased over time, though for different reasons than you might think. It's actually Dawn and Piplup that have grown on me the most. I think they easily earn their main character status the most out of all the main cast, and Dawn's relationship with Ash is probably my favorite in the show, compared to years ago when I found them to be nothing special. The angle they took with Paul also only gets better for me the older I get. That said, I do understand the criticisms about pacing and filler formula.

    BW I've actually softened up on a good amount. While I don't find it great or anything, I have more appreciation for its changes to the TR formula (though I still have issues with them) and the semi-frequent battle tournaments, which are actually really well done.

    XY has soured significantly over the years, which probably won't come as much of a surprise. I actually loved it when it was airing, but rewatching it and reading others' thoughts kills sooo much of the hype factor that really carried it for me in retrospect. I'm also a lot harsher on the Superman-esque interpretation of Ash in this series, which I don't think has aged well. With that in mind, I respect Alain a lot more than I used to. I have my issues with him, but the "victory is boring" trope they used with him is actually pretty admirable.

    SM... really hasn't changed much for me, though I was never all that hard on it to begin with. It's mostly just okay on average with a few really amazing moments sprinkled here and there. Breaking the formula has its merits but it still has a lot of the anime's inherent flaws.
  2. Leonhart

    Leonhart Imagineer

    My opinion of DP has decreased over time after having re-watched all the episodes a couple of years ago and finding a lot of the filler episodes to be unbearably dull. My opinion of BW has increased as of late, however. I actually miss Iris and Dent.
  3. Pokegirl Fan~

    Pokegirl Fan~ ^Me whenever I visit the PAD

    I've come to appreciate the OS-DP series more, but the formulaic cotd/Team Rocket episodes and the weekly format make it a chore to rewatch these series.
    BW-XY hasn't really changed much for me, both are unbearable to watch except for a handful of episodes. I do miss Iris and recently Serena a little bit now though.
    SM had great filler episodes but I feel that the story arcs were lacking, excluding the Lillie story episodes. I still feel she had the best episodes of the series.
    Pokemon Journeys is still a train wreck imo.
  4. RafaSceptile

    RafaSceptile Well-Known Member

    Better than my first impressions: OS OI Arc, AG BF Arc
    Same impressions: OS Johto Arc (in a good way), DP (in a good way), BW Unova (in a bad way), SM (in a good way)
    Worse than my first impressions: OS Kanto Arc, AG Hoenn Arc, BW DA Arc, XY
    Ubermuk likes this.
  5. Spider-Phoenix

    Spider-Phoenix #ChespinGang

    My opinion changed on some ways

    First series remains more or less the same for me. Has nostalgic value but other than that, it's not that impressive aside a few select episodes.

    AG, haven't watched it much but I like what I saw. What hurt it was being stuck in the formula of CoTD and mandatory TR scheme+boss fantasy

    DP my opinion improved after the passing of years made me get over the Aipom-Buizel trade (believe or not that soured me on the season to the point I didn't feel like really following despite liking most of the episodes I've watched)

    BW, I still like for what the good things it brought. Sure it could have been better but I still like it for what it was.

    XY and SM remains the same.

    For XY I'm still pissed and bitter over Ash not getting Chespin (I HAVE A BIAS) but everything else in the series is still pretty good and holds off incredibly well.

    SM is the same. The start was somewhat solid, not being the trainwreck I thought it'd be. It improved post-Necrozma arc apart some select episodes like the return of the kanto companions (doesn't help I hate them) or the Eevee fiasco but other than that, it's average I'd say.

    Journeys technically shouldn't count but my opinion didn't really change much. Has some good stuff but there's a few issues holding it back.
    Ubermuk likes this.
  6. Ubermuk

    Ubermuk Sticky & Sweet

    I used to think X&Y was amazing but now I think it's just sorta good. I mean I don't hate it now either but my love for it dwindled and I dunno why.
    Leonhart likes this.
  7. Leonhart

    Leonhart Imagineer

    I think I've actually warmed up to the Kalos saga a little bit. At first I didn't like the cast's chemistry much, because it seemed like Satoshi's traveling companions were just there to cheer for Satoshi and make him feel better about himself, but over time I've come to appreciate the zaniness of Citron and Eureka.
    Applecorp and RafaSceptile like this.
  8. Power Up

    Power Up ...

    OS - It’s as good as I remember it. Hilarious and incredibly entertaining episodes. The group dynamic was great and while it was an absolute failure of a season on the trainer front, it was the only series that nailed comedy to the T. Also incredibly nostalgic.

    AG - Steady. I unfortunately don’t remember much.

    DP - In a decline. It’s kind of hard to appreciate great character writing when it’s surrounded by absolutely horrendous pacing and terrible animation in battles. Watching the Paul vs Ash battles is incredibly tedious and boring. Total snooze fest. It’s fallen to 3rd in my rankings of the series.

    BW - I actually have somewhat of a soft spot for BW. While Ash was an incredible idiot in every form imaginable and everything trainer/battle wise was absolutely horrific, the group dynamic was entertaining to watch.

    XY/XYZ - Still incredible, and I’ve actually grown to appreciate the first half even more than before after a rewatch. Incredibly entertaining characters with a great group dynamic. Serena was easily the best girl for me. Ash in this series is actually underrated for how much subtlety and depth the put into his character. Easily the best plot narrative and is an example of how good the Pokémon series can be when it’s on. Could go on and on about how incredible this series was and I imagine my opinion will only increase when I finally rewatch XYZ.

    SM - An utter failure in every form imaginable besides animation outside of battles.
    SH65, OshyHikari and Spider-Phoenix like this.
  9. Zoruagible

    Zoruagible Lover of underrated characters

    Everytime I watch BW I just get more and more ticked off at all the wasted potential. They just had the perfect moment to write Ash off but nooo, let's create a last minute plot device so he loses! -_-
    Would have been more bearable if it was say, Hilbert acting like a complete idiot? Or Ash was playing the mentor role to Hilda who was making the noob comments?
    RetroPokeFan and Leonhart like this.
  10. mehmeh1

    mehmeh1 Welcome to capitalism, Neku

    I have a softer spot for OS (even some of Johto) and AG now, still love DP and XY about the same as before, still dislike BW as much as before, and I'm still trying to solidify my position in SM as I appreciate early SM more than I did before but dislike mid-SM more. My opinion on Journeys has improved after episode 10 too
    J.Agera and Leonhart like this.
  11. volcanionmaster123

    volcanionmaster123 Well-Known Member

    That’s what gets me about BW. Hilbert/Hilda and even Nate/Rosa were my favorite protags and of course they had to choose Gen 5 as the one to not include any of them in the anime. Of course now they’re not really adapting game protags to the anime anymore but still...
  12. SerGoldenhandtheJust

    SerGoldenhandtheJust Well-Known Member

    OS - Still absolutely love the humor of the series and fillers though ive grown to disdain how badly they handled ash as a trainer arc. Great humor, terrible plot, fun fillers

    AG - I have grown to find it more boring pre Battle Frontier. May was meh to me, brock had become stagnant, max was annoying, ash became more plain. The contests for me in AG sucked and it didnt feel like Ash progressed that much as a trainer tbh (Keep in mind im still talking pre BF) . Ive really grown to dislike how Team aqua/magma was handled and the hoenn league. However my opinion on BF has grown heavily, its really a testament to how Ash should be with his team and it was what AG should have been. Contests still sucked though.

    DP- Man have I come to appreciate the Paul/Ash/Infernape storyline so much over the years. It was just so well written and planned out, especially when you consider how no storyline has even come close to its brilliance. Contests were made enjoyable to me from this season as well, i really appreciate Team Galactic more too, they may not have had an epic finish on the levels of Team Flare in XY but them being since the beginning and slowly built up is how evil team arcs should be handled. I have grown to dislike how torterra was treated though and that one year gap causing pacing problems.

    BW- I still think its a mess of a series when it comes to plot and potential but man have i grown a soft side for it. The fillers were amazing, 3rd best behind SM and OS. It has nice quirky humor and even tho iris's arc was a mess, I enjoyed character dynamics of the group. Bad plot and arcs, good humor filler and characterizations.

    XY - My opinion has changed negatively towards it the last few years. Back when it was airing I too was on the Hype train and I absolutely loved it, but looking back, it was a mess of its own. Moments leading to hype but ultimately not delivering, a certain pokemon's storyline taking away from the other mons, storylines ending on a disappointing note etc. I do think though that Yajima is a great storyteller, its just that he had only one year for XYZ and executives above him wouldnt let ash win i guess. I have grown to appreciate early XY though. Ash as a character sucked, he was bland, yeah he was a strong shonen hero but his personality was non existent. XY was the most humorless of any other series and more self contained. Ive also grown to hate Amourshipping when i was a big fan of it and Serena's character arc in general. But I have grown to appreciate XY's battle animation over the years though, especially the use of the 3D camera. The Team Flare arc conclusion was absolutely stunning. I do not dislike XY but i have grown to realize its highly overrated and sometimes put on a higher pedestal than it deserves. Ive also grown to really appreciate clemont and Bonnie more too.

    SM- Gods have my opinions about this series have the biggest U-Turns. I admit i too was one of those people who after seeing the trailer and Ash's character artstyle immediately hated it and didnt give it a fair chance in the beginning. But man was i wrong. The artstyle of SM only made Ash and to a lesser extent TR look bad but it was perfect for everyone else (yes, even lillie). It did have too bright colours at time and should have been more saturated at some points but it was in no way bad. The animation was so fluid and amazing. After the souless series preceding it the humor and personality shown in this series was AMAZING. All the cast may not have had proper development arcs i admit but each one of them had a rich personality and were in no way dull. Best group dynamic easily, no contest. The pokemon too had such vibrant personalities. Its fillers were amazing. The way this series broke the mold and brought much needed change to the series was welcome. The family theme of the series was great and the way alola's culture was shown and how Ash embraced it, he deserved to become Alola's Champion. I know people have a disdain for the second year of SM but i personally binge watched many of the second year episodes and so instead of waiting each week, watching them at once i believe will give you a more positive outlook on it, the second year was fun. The League arc is my fav anime arc ever and gave proper focus the league where Ash finally wins needed. The kukui battle is my fav battle in the anime and the way Ash and Pikachu defeated Tapu Koko and Kukui is deinitely their greatest feat yet. I always have a good laugh at people who claim its utter trash because of the artsyle and new changes it brings to the series. And it also expertly dealt with mature topics such as death and did have good story arcs. Not as ambitious as XY but that way not as disappointing and failing, and had good resolutions. This series has grown from one i hated to my fav.

    I know many say Pre BW era was the best anime era and i strongly disagree. DP was great but imo Pokemon anime is the greatest its ever been right now. XY, SM and as of now PJ are three incredible series, Ash finally feels like he is progressing, the show is no longer stagnant and is having many creative decisions being taken, unpredictable and fun. Best time ever to be a Anipoke fan
  13. J.Agera

    J.Agera Well-Known Member

    My opinions on OS and Johto are the same. Screw writing, it's just mindless fun.

    For AG, its the same for the most part except May, I just don't think she is actually all that good anymore except that she still has the best rivals for a pokegirl.

    For DP, Surprisingly, my opinion on it has actually decreased, especially Dawn, even though she is relatively well written compared to most characters in the show, I have realized that I personally just don't find her character appealing or impressive. She is currently #3 or #4 for me on the Pokegirl list. Also, not a fan of her design at all. Love her dynamic with Ash but that's it.
    Paul too, Still the best rival, but how edgy he turned out after his brother's failure doesn't sit right with me.

    For BW, no change in opinion. I still like it but it's definitely at the bottom.

    For XY, my opinion on Serena actually decreased for a while recently, and then increased again after watching an analysis on her. #1 Pokegirl. Not much change after that, still the best series imo.

    For SM, I hated it at first, started liking it, for a while, but now I am just indifferent towards it and sits at a 5/10 score. I started liking Lillie a lot more though, she is now my #2 pokegirl.
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2020
  14. BabaVanga

    BabaVanga Well-Known Member

    OS - nothing major changed. I still love it's humour, #bestAsh and fillers (some of my favourite episodes were Johto fillers actually), Misty grown on me recently. Still find its battles and focus on companions underwhelming.

    AG - my opinions stay the same. I'll never forgive this series starting the trend of Ash leaving all his Pokémon except Pikachu at Oak's, getting new outfit and going to a new region. May is still #1 Pokégirl for me though.

    DP - I appreciate it a little bit more than before. Dawn's character and Paul's rivalry were great but by the time Ash lost all of it's spark from OS and he wasn't all that interesting to watch. Brock and his gag hitted the bottom in this series and I didn't like his new goal either.

    BW - I also like it a little more but it's still at the bottom. Major turn off is artstyle and Pokémon/characters designs which wasn't (only) anime's fault but I still can't stand it. I might be alone in this but I liked DA arc more than rest of the series.

    XY - I like it when it aired but my opinion on it decreased once SM started. I still find Ash unbearable to watch, I still don't care about Ash-Greninja, Alain's OP Charizard or Bonnie and Squishy. I used to like Serena more than I do now, writers pandering to shippers and her not-so-interesting goal unfortunately wasted her potential. I like Clemont a lot more now.

    SM - still love it. Lots of wasted potential but the humour, tone and characters made up for it. SM was the first series since OS that made me care about Ash, and that's quite a big achievement.

    Journeys - it's not as good as I expected to be but I still have high hopes for this series. I like breaking the status quo and letting Ash catch older Pokémon, and especially that
    Ash didn't caught any starter so far and I really hope it stays that way
  15. DatsRight

    DatsRight Well-Known Member

    I think the second year was pretty stagnant but had enjoyable filler. It's just a shame they waited too long to bring in the last roster of captures since Sandy, Shaymin and Meltan could have arguably shone better in the light hearted fillers.

    I think eras like this are the ones most effected by second rewatches since you are no longer waiting for the big arcs and events to occur. This is maybe also why more people are divisive with the OS and BW depending on how many times they've watched since a lot of it is disappointing arc wise but the episodes do often stand out better episodically with more memorable plots that maybe aren't works of art but are light hearted fun and don't just feel like padding, making it fun if you sometimes just wanna go back and watch and odd episode or two. It's also why opinions of arc heavy series like XY maybe wane a bit on rewatch since the hype train is no longer there and fillers are often repetitive lower tier compared to the main story.

    OS and SM are often more fun to watch in chunks or single episodes for this reason (though DP has some decent wacky fillers as well if you pick the right episodes).
  16. SerGoldenhandtheJust

    SerGoldenhandtheJust Well-Known Member

    Completely agree
    Applecorp likes this.
  17. Leonhart

    Leonhart Imagineer

    In terms of sagas with the most re-watch factor, I personally don't consider SM to be a priority. While its filler episodes did tend to be wacky and fun, many of them felt like copies of OS fillers. So if given the choice between re-watching OS fillers or SM ones, I'd almost always go for the OS ones because of nostalgia mostly. I feel that way about most BW fillers as well: even the best ones aren't quite on par with OS filler episodes.
    Pokegirl Fan~ likes this.
  18. DatsRight

    DatsRight Well-Known Member

    I do think OS has the most memorable single plot episodes, but more in terms of being the one that established everything and was when the formula was at its most fresh. That said, I also think OS sometimes has the issue of being too mean spirited at times, due to Shudo's earlier more cynical premise not always meshing with the show wanting to stay light hearted (trying to make a cynical premise look idealistic rarely works out).

    I feel like SM is probably the best in terms of being a laid back saga, a mostly light hearted series that also has several quiet and introspective plots. I also think it holds up best in terms of plots not held back by formula, not having too many stories that don't get fully realised due to Team Rocket or some other recurring plot device.
  19. Applecorp

    Applecorp Well-Known Member

    I used to think Sun and Moon was bad but now I think it's somewhere in the middle of my series ranking above XY but below OS and DP. The best parts of Sun and Moon were the laid back episodes that didn't have major plots going on.
  20. SerenaRulez

    SerenaRulez Well-Known Member

    OS: I like it more now than I did years ago because I thought Johto was too slow.
    AG: I thought it was ok before but now I barely remember the episodes other than the contests and the gym episodes. :(
    DP: I like it the same as always but I haven't watched a DP episode in a long time.
    BW: I think I like this series alot more now because of Generation 5 nostalgia.
    X&Y: Loved it before and I still love it now because of Serena and Ash's gym battles. :)
    S&M: It felt like a step back to me before and my thoughts on it are still the same.

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