Illegal Immigration

[legendarypokemonmaster]

Yeah but the native Americans didn't consider their land to be a country in the sense we use it today. And these Europeans won it from them fair and square.

So that makes it ok and a totally different situation.

No, you are an idiot. Their tactics weren't even fair. They made false promises to stop expanding into NA Territory and made 'peace' offerings like diseased blankets that killed off thousands, not to mention the trail of tears later in history.

 

[Alleviate]

Do you even know when the 'Trail of Tears' thing happened? Also there were no rules of engagement so who is to say what's fair and what isn't? They were weak and so they were conquered. It's how it goes.

 

[lugia p]

Soil or waters it is the same thing. Another problem is you do not want to have a bunch of people who just got off a small rickety boat take off running into the streets. Which is why you do see many turning back. On a purely security aspect you want them to get their refugee status immediately when they get in there, not when they are scooped up by ICE three years later.

Well yeah take them to the refugee center as sone as they get here but dont force them back to cuba.

 

[lugia p]

Do you even know when the 'Trail of Tears' thing happened? Also there were no rules of engagement so who is to say what's fair and what isn't? They were weak and so they were conquered. It's how it goes.

So it was fair to kill thousands of innocent people? So what if they were weak, babys are weak should we kill them to. wtf is wrong with people.

 

[BigLutz]

Well yeah take them to the refugee center as sone as they get here but dont force them back to cuba.

More than likely we don't have that set up and running. You are talking a matter of minutes to hours from where they are spotted to where they make landfall. In the meantime you need to accurately predict where they make landfall, have security and immigration officials there, and be ready to take them in.

 

[chuboy]

No, you are an idiot. Their tactics weren't even fair. They made false promises to stop expanding into NA Territory and made 'peace' offerings like diseased blankets that killed off thousands, not to mention the trail of tears later in history.

Poe's Law.

 

[Sasholon]

I come to find out that my neighbor is an illegal and she is telling me this because she just got her green card (*sigh* guess she isnt exactly illegal anymore but that is still messed up but whatever) and when I asked her what people think of America when they hear the name, she simply replied: "we believe that once we can make it on US soil, the money just starts coming to you which it has for me." Sounds like we need to change the system to make it so unfavorable for them to be here that they will stop coming.

 

[Skiks]

I come to find out that my neighbor is an illegal and she is telling me this because she just got her green card (*sigh* guess she isnt exactly illegal anymore but that is still messed up but whatever) and when I asked her what people think of America when they hear the name, she simply replied: "we believe that once we can make it on US soil, the money just starts coming to you which it has for me." Sounds like we need to change the system to make it so unfavorable for them to be here that they will stop coming.

It already is pretty bad for them to be here. But considering the alternative of possibly going back to a much worse life they'd be willing to do almost anything. I think you've never lived in a war torn nation. However the lack of education makes it so that some still believe this place is lined with gold or something. In this economy they can hardly find work that some actually move back.
Regardless I don't think the lady means she's living off your government. Some consider the money they can make here a lot more then they could ever imagine back at home.
Though you have to admit the system to immigrate is so damn broken on both sides. They make it insanely hard to leave in some countries to immigrate here so much so that some actually set up a lottery because the odds were way better then going through the normal route.

 

[Sasholon]

Hard? yes it is. My dad's colleague came to America for schooling, became a doctor, and still has to wait about 8 more years to be a citizen. On the flip side, I dont think it should be easy to become a citizen. And some of the people that come here through the smugglers pay most of their entire earnings (usually in the thousands) to come here.

On a side note, there has been an increase of illegals coming from India to America via Mexico.

 

[TNR_64]

As a few probably have said, most of them are taking the minimum wage jobs that I bet none of you want. Do you want to pick tomatoes for 12 hour shifts on minimum wage? Thought so. Also, why are most immigrants coming over? Oh yeah, to achieve a better life! Most are not going to go back to Mexico. Isn't this like how our ancestors came to the States for a second shot at life? Hypocritical much? I feel that impoverishing and repressing them. You're only going to create a vicious cycle, making most kids denied of higher education. I remember seeing this proposal for a program that would give kids brought here to get an opportunity for citizenship by doing certain things such as enlisting. After all, we love burning cash on the military. So, yeah, I look forward to the rage. Oh, one more thing, this is one of the many reasons the rest of the world hates us!

 

[BigLutz]

As a few probably have said, most of them are taking the minimum wage jobs that I bet none of you want. Do you want to pick tomatoes for 12 hour shifts on minimum wage? Thought so.

Take a person who is running out of money and is looking everywhere for work just to stay afloat and put food on the table and they will take it.

Also, why are most immigrants coming over? Oh yeah, to achieve a better life! Most are not going to go back to Mexico.

So do alot of people, those not fortunate enough to share a border with the U.S. do manage to abide by our laws though and come through the legal way.

Isn't this like how our ancestors came to the States for a second shot at life? Hypocritical much? I feel that impoverishing and repressing them.

They did not have to deal with a pre existing country who's borders and laws must be respected.

You're only going to create a vicious cycle, making most kids denied of higher education. I remember seeing this proposal for a program that would give kids brought here to get an opportunity for citizenship by doing certain things such as enlisting. After all, we love burning cash on the military. So, yeah, I look forward to the rage. Oh, one more thing, this is one of the many reasons the rest of the world hates us!

So let me get this straight the world hates us because we impose immigration laws to make it fair for everyone, and not for one group of people who can cross the border, when the rest of the world doesn't? Do you realize how insane that sounds?

 

[CSolarstorm]

As a few probably have said, most of them are taking the minimum wage jobs that I bet none of you want. Do you want to pick tomatoes for 12 hour shifts on minimum wage? Thought so.

The economy is bad, jobs are scarce, and I'm only one of a dozen young adult United States born citizens I know who are desperately need of jobs to start lives as independant adults. Yes, we actually do want to do the work. You're the one assuming that the jobs are too hard for current United States citizens to want to take over.

Also, why are most immigrants coming over? Oh yeah, to achieve a better life! Most are not going to go back to Mexico. Isn't this like how our ancestors came to the States for a second shot at life? Hypocritical much? I feel that impoverishing and repressing them. You're only going to create a vicious cycle, making most kids denied of higher education.

And I feel that by letting Mexican families come to America to give their kids a higher education instead of staying in their country and building their own foundation for a better life, we are actually permitting Mexico to become co-dependant upon just simply sending all of its citizens to America. We are not a pioneer's country anymore. We are built, developed, a superpower of the world. Mexico needs to create an environment as condusive to success as America is. If they continually give up on their own country and come here, there will be no material, no productivity going into Mexico.

I remember seeing this proposal for a program that would give kids brought here to get an opportunity for citizenship by doing certain things such as enlisting. After all, we love burning cash on the military.

Yes, the DREAM Act. I believe that lets them also gain citizenship by getting a college degress and having a clean record of no crime. I like that idea.

So, yeah, I look forward to the rage. Oh, one more thing, this is one of the many reasons the rest of the world hates us!

Wait, calm down. Canada is incredibly strict about its citizenship. Sweden is even more strict. People who try to immigrate illegally to Mexico can be shot and killed. The world is filled with harsh immigration laws and borders are a simple fact of the world. I'm pretty sure the world does not hate us for enforcing our border laws, and often in a way that is more politically correct and sensitive than any other country.

 

[TNR_64]

First Quote: @Sunny & BigLutz: I didn't say that no one would take it. The average American would not take the job. Now, my tone wasn't the right way to point that out.

Second and Third Quote: @Lutz: Most of them who do it illegally are probably in a situation where it's do or die. Granted I try to have optimism towards humanity.

@Sunny: That is true, but most have no chance do so. Mexico does have an especially good economy, and they don't have much to work with. I think DREAM would be a nice step forward.

Final Quote: @Sunny and BigLutz: This where I dropped the ball. What I meant to say was how we do it. In Arizona, I heard they want officers to ask for papers at anytime similar to practices by Nazis with Jewish citizens. I should have made that point.

 

[BigLutz]

First Quote: @Sunny & BigLutz: I didn't say that no one would take it. The average American would not take the job. Now, my tone wasn't the right way to point that out.

When you have 9% unemployment for many years, the average American will look at anything to stay afloat.

Second and Third Quote: @Lutz: Most of them who do it illegally are probably in a situation where it's do or die. Granted I try to have optimism towards humanity.

So are hundreds of million of people across the world, why should those living in Mexico receive special treatment? You know what is being optimistic toward humanity? Is by looking at the flood of humanity that wants into this country and saying: You all deserve the same chance to come here, every one of you is equal, and no one person deserves any special treatment.

Final Quote: @Sunny and BigLutz: This where I dropped the ball. What I meant to say was how we do it. In Arizona, I heard they want officers to ask for papers at anytime similar to practices by Nazis with Jewish citizens. I should have made that point.

Which is completely absurd comparison. In Arizona they had it where if a officer has pulled you over for another offense, they can ask you for proper identification. That is well within the police's power, illegal immigration IS a crime and one deserving punishment, unlike being a Jew.

 

[CSolarstorm]

First Quote: @Sunny & BigLutz: I didn't say that no one would take it. The average American would not take the job. Now, my tone wasn't the right way to point that out.

The fact that the 'average American' would not take the job is quite off the point, because the average American would not be doing the job; it would be the Americans who really need jobs. No 'average Mexican' would take the job, either.

@Sunny: That is true, but most have no chance do so. Mexico does have an especially good economy, and they don't have much to work with. I think DREAM would be a nice step forward.

Well the problem is, to save some people, you have to disenfranchise other people. Helping people requires resources, and resources don't come from nowhere.

Final Quote: @Sunny and BigLutz: This where I dropped the ball. What I meant to say was how we do it. In Arizona, I heard they want officers to ask for papers at anytime similar to practices by Nazis with Jewish citizens. I should have made that point.

That's quite melodramatic. Get to know Godwin's Law. Very few things are remotely comparable to Nazi Germany, but people like to make a dramatic point by drawing similarities.

The law Arizona SB 1070 makes it so that illegal immigrants, otherwise known as undocumented immigrants have to register themselves as undocumented immigrants and carry these documents around them at all times. Immigrants did their paperwork. Even citizens did their paperwork. If you want a state ID and a driver's license, you have to be known as a person by the city, the state, and the federal government. Illegal immigrants are required to carry around papers because they never filled out any documents identifying themselves in the first place.

 

[Sasholon]

I was reading on the Huffington post that Iowa passed their own version of the "dream" act. Its basically illegals getting money for college. I also read on the same site that Alabama was going to write into law a bill much like the one in Arizona. The thing is, the federal government is suing Alabama over this. Yep, lets reward criminals but sue one of our own states for enforcing the law.

 

[Mr. Reloaded]

i agree with malanu i dont want dem dirty wetbacks taking my jobs! if your visa expires shoot em up!

That's way to much hate i think immigration really helps america.

 

[KuroiMawile]

well sir i have to disagree. even if mexicans take those dirty low wage jobs, we're in a recession and i know PLENTY of legal citizens struggling to find any work to feed themselves. instead they have to rely on welfare and unemployment like a certain race of people. this is what o*****ma wants. socialist regime where we cry for his help.

I'll bite.

An entire race relies on welfare and unemployment? As in everyone member of that race?
I agree legal immigration helps the country, but illegal immigration just seems to help larger companies deny actual citizens over pay and treatment. Though I put more blame on those hiring undocumented immigrants than those who try to enter a country illegally.

 

[CSolarstorm]

well sir i have to disagree. even if mexicans take those dirty low wage jobs, we're in a recession and i know PLENTY of legal citizens struggling to find any work to feed themselves. instead they have to rely on welfare and unemployment like a certain race of people. this is what o*****ma wants. socialist regime where we cry for his help.

Even if there was a socialist conspiracy, Obama hasn't had power long enough to be part of it. He would be a mouthpiece. XP

I think the term wetback is derogatory, but at the same time you are right, keeping American jobs American is very important. Legal citizens do need work, and it only makes sense for Americans to have first priority in the jobs where they are supporting themselves.

 

[rocky505]

What they should do is make the fence completely impossible to climb over/under.