Intense Electric Shock Training! A Rematch with Tapu Koko!! (962)

[Satomine Night]

I suspect another battle may occur in the long run.

This shown progress, while Pikachu was still obviously outmatched, he managed to knock Tapu Koko back a bit (in the first battle, the Z Move didn't even budge it, here it knocks it back into a tree). Obviously the deity wants to make sure Pikachu gets stronger.

I expect this is also why the battle was somewhat slow paced, Tapu Koko wasn't fully battling, it was testing, it wanted to see what Pikachu would pull off.

I agree. It was pretty clear to me that Tapu Koko was testing Ash and Pikachu, especially when it floated in place, waiting for Ash and Pikachu to use their Z-move, rather than taking advantage of the fact Pikachu was discombobulated to attack again. It wasn't battling with the intention of defeating Ash and Pikachu; it was battling with the intention of testing Ash and Pikachu.

I expect quite a few more battles between Ash/Pikachu and Tapu Koko over the course of this series.

 

[lemoncatpower]

Given how Gigavolt Havoc didn't even make it budge the first time, and this time sent it flying, it makes me wonder just how much damage it would do to Tapu Koko if it didn't shield itself.


That was hardly an island-threatening explosion, it didn't even leave a crater, and Tapu Koko has shown repeatedly to take an interest in Ash and Pikachu's development. Tapu Koko wasn't worried so much as excited to see what they had to offer after that demonstration on the wheel showed how much better they were at bringing out their power through the Z-Crystal.

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If I had to offer a criticism toward this episode its that the battle with Tapu Koko felt rather slow for most of it, and the pauses for commentary seemed lengthier than necessary. I was hoping to see the two zipping around the field at speeds almost too quick to follow and looking for openings like some of the higher quality XYZ battles, but the fight was mostly linear.

I'm wondering the same thing, if it didn't have its shield up and it smashed against the tree, I could see it doing a bit of damage to it. Now I'm curious how much damage it would do to Tapu Fini even with her shield up.

 

[TheWanderingMist]

To be fair, Tapu Koko does seem to have one overpowered ability in terms of shielding itself, those shields seem to negate everything (making Pikachu knocking it back quite a feat already). We also saw one iron tail to the face sends it flying, so Tapu Koko isn't really "that" powerful, he just has the ultimate defense move to hide behind and avoid taking a hit.

As for Pikachu, it did tank quite a few powerful attacks here, took the full brunt of discharge and still seemed fine even after being rescued from its near death fall.

Though have to wonder why Ash focused on Iron tail so much here, its a not very effective against electric types and since Tapu Koko can play turtle and shield itself he'd need faster attacks to overome that. Seems Quick Attack and Thunderbolt would have been a much better choice.

Iron Tail is neutral thanks to Koko's Fairy secondary typing while Quick Attack isn't a powerful move and Thunderbolt is resisted. And Koko basically has infinite defense in anime shield form.

 

[345ash-greninja]

No, showing only the end of the battle (or the finishing move, which is not the only thing we saw) does not imply that it was a curbstomp. We only saw the tail end of the battle; we have no idea how the rest of the battle went. Just because Rockruff finished off Mudbray with Breakneck Blitz doesn't mean Rockruff had the upper hand throughout the entire battle.

Except it does. Skipping the whole battle and showing the finishing move implies that it's a curbstomp. Otherwise skipping the battle doesn't make much sense. If the battle was hard-fought, then the writers would bother to show the full battle. But skipping majority of the battle and showing the finishing move somewhat gives the feeling that 'The battle was so one-sided that we didn't even bother to show the full battle'.

 

[Frozocrone]

Except it does. Skipping the whole battle and showing the finishing move implies that it's a curbstomp. Otherwise skipping the battle doesn't make much sense. If the battle was hard-fought, then the writers would bother to show the full battle. But skipping majority of the battle and showing the finishing move somewhat gives the feeling that 'The battle was so one-sided that we didn't even bother to show the full battle'.

Or that the cameo was forced in...

There's really no reason for this battle in hindsight. Abareru-kun didn't even make an appearance with the rest of the students...

 

[Satomine Night]

Except it does. Skipping the whole battle. And showing the finishing move implies that it's a curbstomp. Otherwise skipping the battle doesn't make much sense. If the battle was hard-fought, then the writers would bother to show the full battle. But skipping majority of the battle and showing the finishing move somewhat gives the feeling that 'The battle was so one-sided that we didn't even bother to show the full battle'.

No, skipping the battle does not imply that it was one-sided or that it was a curbstomp. The battle was probably skipped because it wasn't an important battle and/or because it wasn't related to the focus of the episode (Sophocles's training session and Pikachu vs. Tapu Koko). Rockruff won the battle with Breakneck Blitz, but it looked relatively evenly matched prior to that. It feels like a short-lived celebrity cameo, and that's about it.

 

[345ash-greninja]

No, skipping the battle does not imply that it was one-sided or that it was a curbstomp. The battle was probably skipped because it wasn't an important battle and/or because it wasn't related to the focus of the episode (Sophocles's training session and Pikachu vs. Tapu Koko). Rockruff won the battle with Breakneck Blitz, but it looked relatively evenly matched prior to that. It feels like a short-lived celebrity cameo, and that's about it.

And it makes more sense for unimportant battles to be curbstomps. If a battle isn't that important then making it a hard-fought battle doesn't make sense from the perspective of the show.

 

[lemoncatpower]

No, skipping the battle does not imply that it was one-sided or that it was a curbstomp. The battle was probably skipped because it wasn't an important battle and/or because it wasn't related to the focus of the episode (Sophocles's training session and Pikachu vs. Tapu Koko). Rockruff won the battle with Breakneck Blitz, but it looked relatively evenly matched prior to that. It feels like a short-lived celebrity cameo, and that's about it.

It almost made z-moves just look cheap. It's an even battle without one seemingly doing much damage to the other. Then out of no where, Ash pulls out his special bracelet that he got specially from the guardian that only 3 others trainers have that we know right now in the anime, and "pow" fight over.

 

[PAndrews]

It almost made z-moves just look cheap. It's an even battle without one seemingly doing much damage to the other. Then out of no where, Ash pulls out his special bracelet that he got specially from the guardian that only 3 others trainers have that we know right now in the anime, and "pow" fight over.

Its not any cheaper then Mega Pokemon. If anything those are even cheaper since unlike Z-moves its a permanent strength increase for the remainder of the battle and not just one powerful (and dodge able) move.

 

[TheWanderingMist]

It almost made z-moves just look cheap. It's an even battle without one seemingly doing much damage to the other. Then out of no where, Ash pulls out his special bracelet that he got specially from the guardian that only 3 others trainers have that we know right now in the anime, and "pow" fight over.

Mudbray must have had Own Tempo or Inner Focus. If it had Stamina it would probably have taken the Breakneck Blitz (not well, but it probably wouldn't have fainted)

 

[Satomine Night]

And it makes more sense for unimportant battles to be curbstomps. If a battle isn't that important then making it a hard-fought battle doesn't make sense from the perspective of the show.

How does it make more sense for unimportant battles to be curbstomps? What does the battle being unimportant have to do with whether or not it's a curbstomp? The battle wasn't the focus of the episode, so the writers didn't give it much screentime. It's as simple as that. It might not have been a very tough battle, but that doesn't mean it was a curbstomp. Rockruff won, but Mudbray was doing fine until Rockruff used Breakneck Blitz.

It almost made z-moves just look cheap. It's an even battle without one seemingly doing much damage to the other. Then out of no where, Ash pulls out his special bracelet that he got specially from the guardian that only 3 others trainers have that we know right now in the anime, and "pow" fight over.

I disagree. Ash and Rockruff may have won with Breakneck Blitz, but Rockruff was exhausted afterward. That just shows that using a Z-move is very taxing on a Pokémon's strength. One could even argue that it leaves a weaker or less experienced Pokémon such as Rockruff vulnerable, since while it's recovering from the Z-move, the opponent has a chance to attack.

Mudbray must have had Own Tempo or Inner Focus. If it had Stamina it would probably have taken the Breakneck Blitz (not well, but it probably wouldn't have fainted)

IIRC, the PokéFan magazine specifically mentioned Mudbray's Stamina ability, which makes me think this Mudbray had Stamina; it just wasn't enough to withstand Speedy Puppy Gonzales.

 

[lemoncatpower]

Its not any cheaper then Mega Pokemon. If anything those are even cheaper since unlike Z-moves its a permanent strength increase for the remainder of the battle and not just one powerful (and dodge able) move.

I agree there a little bit. The big difference with how they go about it though is that with megas, they can have even mega level battles. You didn't see too many battles between a mega and a non-mega (I can name about three). With z-moves they're basically a cheap cop-out to winning the battle, especially if the other doesn't have one. You could say not to use them which is fine, but that's not the deal here.

Also with z-move battles, you have to:
A) use them at the same time OR
B)hope to god you can tank it (we have yet to see a normal pokemon tank a FULL z-move) or dodge if they use it first OR
C)pull it off first so you can get the auto win and hope they don't dodge

 

[Daniel31]

It almost made z-moves just look cheap. It's an even battle without one seemingly doing much damage to the other. Then out of no where, Ash pulls out his special bracelet that he got specially from the guardian that only 3 others trainers have that we know right now in the anime, and "pow" fight over.

My money would've been on Rockruff anyway because of its performance at "Pokémon Fight Club" and having Ash for a Trainer, but I couldn't help but feel that way also in a sense, I understand what you mean (when I saw Ash use the Z-move and Mudbray was KO'd). I mean the fact that it looked evenly matched at first, doesn't make this a curbstomp IMHO.

 

[TheWanderingMist]

IIRC, the PokéFan magazine specifically mentioned Mudbray's Stamina ability, which makes me think this Mudbray had Stamina; it just wasn't enough to withstand Speedy Puppy Gonzales.

Stamina is their signature Ability, so PokeFan could have just been guessing. After all, casual fans probably think Stamina is its only normal (non-hidden) Ability, like the guardians and their respective Surges. Or perhaps Stamina simply didn't get a chance to activate before the Z-move hit.

 

[mystic9899]

why does it matter whether it was a curbstomp or not lol. point is, ash won a battle, rockruff successfully used its first z-move, and it gained a bit of experience.

 

[345ash-greninja]

How does it make more sense for unimportant battles to be curbstomps? What does the battle being unimportant have to do with whether or not it's a curbstomp? The battle wasn't the focus of the episode, so the writers didn't give it much screentime. It's as simple as that.

You're not getting the point. If the battle is so much unimportant that the writers decided to skip the majority of the battle and show the finishing move, how much sense would it make from the perspective of the writers to imply that the battle was hard fought? If the writers wanted to imply the battle as hard-fought, won't they bother to give it more importance and show more of the battle onscreen?

]It might not have been a very tough battle, but that doesn't mean it was a curbstomp. Rockruff won, but Mudbray was doing fine until Rockruff used Breakneck Blitz.

Just because Mudbray and Rockruff collided once onscreen means that Mudbray was doing fine and the battle wasn't a curbstomp? That's like saying that Mega Charizard-X vs Mega Charizard-Y wasn't a curbstomp because there were a few clashes between moves(like Flamethrower vs Flamethrower) before Mega Charizard-Y got KO'd. If one defeats it's opponent without any notable difficulty, the battle can be called a curbstomp. And there is nothing that happened onscreen from which we can infer that Rockruff had any trouble.

 

[Xenon Blue]

Nice how Pikachu went through actual training and improved it's speed by quite a bit to contest Tapu Koko. Hopefully the power increase can stay relatively consistent throughout all of Ash's Pokemon. It is clear that both Rowlet and Rockruff is no where near Pikachu's level, so I don't want to see either of them becoming equals with Pikachu until they show some training that establishes they got a lot better.

Also Sophocles is the definition of irrelevant.

 

[DatsRight]

why does it matter whether it was a curbstomp or not lol. point is, ash won a battle, rockruff successfully used its first z-move, and it gained a bit of experience.

Pretty much. This just seemed to be there to demonstrate Rockruff using a Z move in a way that flowed with the plot, plus we saw a bit more of the populace in the school besides the main lot, which is hardly a bad thing.

Rockruff just recently had an episode with intense battling and training that was developed well, so I think we can forgive the lightness of this one.

Also Sophocles is the definition of irrelevant.

Sophocles (from what I understand without subs) was training Ash's team and testing their capabilities. Had he not pushed Ash to try out this method he and Pikachu would not have set off their Z power bolt, we would not have known the exceptional level of strength they muster, and the battle with Tapu Koko would not have occurred.

Sopociles offered some amount of substance to the arc with Tapu Koko's fixation on Ash and Pikachu.

 

[Satomine Night]

You're not getting the point. If the battle is so much unimportant that the writers decided to skip the majority of the battle and show the finishing move, how much sense would it make from the perspective of the writers to imply that the battle was hard fought? If the writers wanted to imply the battle as hard-fought, won't they bother to give it more importance and show more of the battle onscreen?

I never said the battle was hard-fought. I said we cannot assume it was a curbstomp. A curbstomp is "a fight that's extremely one-sided, where one side just absolutely trashes the other with little-to-no effort." The battle may not have been very tough (and "not very tough" =/= "curbstomp"), but we only saw the tail end of the battle, and there was nothing that gave the impression that Rockruff spent the whole battle trashing Mudbray. In fact, nearly the first thing we see is Mudbray repelling Rockruff's Rock Throw. That's not exactly being trashed.

And there is nothing that happened onscreen from which we can infer that Rockruff had any trouble.

There was also nothing that happened on screen from which we can infer that Mudbray was struggling until Ash and Rockruff broke out the Z-move.

 

[VoltTacklingPika]

I actually thought this was a poor episode. The battle between Pikachu and Tapu Koko was very lackluster, showcasing neither of the Pokemon's strengths nor making the difference in power at all evident. Tapu Koko came off as just an ordinary strong Pokemon rather than a Legendary. Then rather than add to the intrigue surroundings Tapu Koko's fascination with Ash and his Z-Moves, it just repeated what we already knew: Tapu Koko has a thing for taking Gigavolt Havocs. For what should have been a big encounter with a Legendary, it all felt very standard and underplayed.

The whole mouse wheel thing before the battle was weird, too. I don't see how that was helpful to Ash at all. I thought the point of his visit to Sophocles' house was so they could work out a way of countering Tapu Koko's Electric Terrain, not to improve Pikachu's speed or endurance or whatever.