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Is Ash really that bad??

Discussion in 'Pokémon Animé Discussion' started by queerstin, Feb 25, 2015.

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  1. Red and Blue

    Red and Blue Well-Known Member

    It probably won't happen, but if Ash wins the Kalos League, I really hope it leads to some actual character development for him afterwords
     
  2. U.N. Owen

    U.N. Owen In Brightest Day, In Blackest Night ...

    Ash will win a league when dogs become flying fish.
     
  3. Satoshi & Touko

    Satoshi & Touko 58 Days Until SwSh!!! :D

    Or when they finally decide to make a pairing for him canon. Getting this more on topic, if I were to attribute "Is Ash really that bad?" to only his standing on love and romance, I can answer the OP's question in 3 words: Goodness ****ing YEEESSSSS!!!

    Edit: I mean in terms of not being dense, not that he would be a bad boyfriend ^_^;
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2015
  4. Crystal

    Crystal The Pokemon Observer

    This one I'll agree. Ash is really that bad...... to be one's lifelong special one.

    I feel sorry for Serena :p
     
  5. Mrs. Oreo

    Mrs. Oreo Banned

    Or when the show gets close to ending which I admit seems far off cuz the show still retains alot of popularity. If it were up to me however Ash would've won a league a decade ago.
     
  6. Aegiscalibur

    Aegiscalibur Add Witty Title Here

    Actually, I do think it's a fair comparison because nothing is forcing them to produce long-running series to begin with. If you don't have enough material for 300 episodes, then don't write that many. Responsible authors put an end to their works before that.
     
  7. U.N. Owen

    U.N. Owen In Brightest Day, In Blackest Night ...

    Pokemon has managed to outlive both the original art staff and its creator. I don't think any of the current writers will live to see the end of this thing.
     
  8. Aegiscalibur

    Aegiscalibur Add Witty Title Here

    I used the word "author" really loosely.
     
  9. RedJirachi

    RedJirachi Veteran member

    The kids who watched this show have kids of their own watching the same show. I don't think they are going to live to see the end of this thing
     
  10. Bguy7

    Bguy7 The Dragon Lord

    Care to explain why?
     
  11. Bguy7

    Bguy7 The Dragon Lord

    Personality isn't the issue here, as this thread is about him as a trainer. If you want to argue about his character, there's another thread for that. And how is he a perpetual loser when he wins over 90% of the battles he enters?
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2016
  12. Mew2

    Mew2 Team Rocket's Enemy

    It's the fact that Ash never wins the big one. He comes close but can never quite pull it off, much like the Buffalo Bills in early 1990s. They got to the Super Bowl three years in a row, and lost each and every one of them. That's a lot like Ash is right now in the animé. I said that he's not as bad a Trainer as a lot of people are portraying him to be, but he's not the best, either. He needs to win a League before he can break through to the upper tiers. And the issue with him is that he has the team to win Leagues if he uses his reserves wisely. The problem is that he never does so.
     
  13. Mrs. Oreo

    Mrs. Oreo Banned

    I dunno I felt that he used his older pokemon well in Sinnoh's league. He lost cuz of the plot requirement not cuz of his team in my view. ^^;
     
  14. Navin

    Navin MALDREAD

    Ash didn't have the team depth to win either Kanto or Johto Leagues. Maybe if he had reserves for Hoenn and used a team like Pikachu, Charizard, Bulbasaur, Kingler, Snorlax, and Glalie, he could have ridden that past the semifinals and done well in the finals, but that may not have been enough. Definitely agree for the Sinnoh League, although they destiny dropped a Tobias to stop him. As for Unova...well that was basically a 'reset,' so there was never a chance in the first place.

    Kalos League is the make or break it point.
     
  15. JudySpell

    JudySpell Banned

    Ash is a good kid but he's not the best trainer since his decisions are often questionable. Like when he had Charizard use a Fighting move against a Ghost type during his competence peak (the BF).
     
  16. Bguy7

    Bguy7 The Dragon Lord

    So you don't like him as a character because he isn't being written well. Okay fair enough, but you have said nothing that makes him a bad trainer. Sure he loses in the leagues, but just because there's someone better than you doesn't mean your bad. Just fact that Ash can consistently make it to the league in the first place shows that he is a talented trainer, because only the best make it there at all.
     
  17. Mrs. Oreo

    Mrs. Oreo Banned

    That was kind of awkward cuz he should've known that it wouldn't work. It was like some thing I'd expect from Best Wishes' Ash. ^^;
     
  18. Bguy7

    Bguy7 The Dragon Lord

    Once again, this thread is about him as a trainer. If you want to bash his character, go to the thread about his character.

    If we can agree he's a strong trainer, then there's not much of reason to continue this debate, but I would like to point out that the I believe you are underestimating the league. It is a gathering of the best of the best from all around the world, and only one in several hundred people can win it (There were 256 people in the Indigo Conference, and 512 people in the Ever Grande Conference). The fact that Ash can consistently make it to at least the top 16 and even as high as top 4 is an absolutely incredible achievement if you stop and think about it. Say what you'd like about winning where it counts, but I think it just doesn't matter given his accomplishments.
     
  19. Crystal

    Crystal The Pokemon Observer

    The leagues were never the "gathering of the best from all around the world". They are all regional leagues, so the best is only the gathering of the best from that specific region, including a few cross-region trainers that are willing to travel to faraway foreign lands.

    Don't mix up the regional league with any world-scale tournaments. The anime had not yet featured any tournaments that are world-scale which is truly the "gathering of the best from all around the world".

    Personally I'm not that impressed by Ash's achievements, because it is like watching and cheering for a soccer team that had never ever survived the qualifying tournament which is just the preliminary to the FIFA World Cup. Yeah he tried the challenge again and again in different regions, but still it doesn't change the fact that he didn't even past the qualifying tournament that is just an entrance ticket to something bigger. This is not about the quantity, but more about the quality.
     
  20. Bguy7

    Bguy7 The Dragon Lord

    We see Ash and a few others such as Paul or Harrison who travel to other regions and compete in leagues. With the several hundred people entering, there's no reason to believe that none of them are from other regions. Even if saying they're the most powerful from around the world is stretching things a little, it's still a gathering of the best in the region, who managed to defeat eight gym leaders, trainers certified by the league to be some of the best in the region, and worthy of testing the skills of trainers.

    I'm not to knowledgeable about anything in the sports world, but I'm assuming that what Ash achieves would be the equivalent of a team being ranked highly in their nation. They may not be the best and make it to the World Cup, but they are still one of the greatest in the nation (and I'm assuming said nation has many teams). To me that sounds impressive. Maybe not as impressive as the champions, but impressive none the less. If said team then moves to another country and proves that it can be one of the best there too, it only more firmly proves that they are a good team.
     
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