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Is exploiting glitches cheating?

WaterTypeStarter

Well-Known Member
Like using the Missingno glitch to get infinite TMs of strong moves like Earthquake and Blizzard or even good items like Rare Candies or Master Balls. Or to catch some rare Pokemon early on, like getting a Lapras or Scyther before Misty, using an extension of the Mew glitch. Or even exploiting things in battle like Hyper Beam not recharging if your opponent is defeated. It's not like it is one sided. For instance, Focus Energy lowers your critical hit instead of increasing it. And a glitch causes moves other than Swift (and in the Japanese versions Swift is not immune) to potentially miss. If the game is unfair with its own rules, is it not fine to exploit for your benefit, given it is not like you are using any external devices? And many young kids might not have realized the developers did not intend these to happen and just used them on discovery.
 
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BCVM22

Well-Known Member
It's absolutely cheating. You're using glitches to do something the developers didn't intend. Only question is who/what if anything is being harmed and how much it bothers you.
 

pacman000

On a quest to be the best...
Well I memorized the Missingno trick by reading a cheat code site...

Never heard of that hyperbeam trick; if I were playing the games I’d assume the move recharged whlie my opponent was selecting their next Pokemon. I don’t doubt that it’s a glitch, but without looking at the source code or a design document, there’s nothing obviously wrong.

If we’re talking about competitive play, stick within whatever rules the competition’s organizers have set up. On your own time have fun with the games, even if it means trying out bugs.
 

TheCharredDragon

Tis the Hour to Reload
I personally think that depends.

More generally glitches are considered cheating because that isn't what the creators intended and thus might ruin the experience they were going for. Not only that, but not everyone can cause these things to happen, especially in a competitive scene where it's meant to be a test of skill and not using easy/cheap means to get there.

However, as pointed out by @Gamzee Makara that isn't really the case in speedrunning and the FGC, or at least with Smash Bros. Melee anyway, the only one I know for sure where they are technically using glitches in competitive play. And as I'm discussing this, I think part of the reason it's more accepted, in this case I mean more for the speedrunning community, since the majority of the games are being played in a way that isn't intended, with sequence breaking, overpowered items, physics failing and more being used...if they're allowed. Because iirc there are some speedruns that try to do it without 'em.

Tl;dr generally yes it's cheating unless it's allowed in the rules of something and it might ruin a playthrough unless you don't care about that.
 

Mewtwo's Amber

Don't cry Mewtwo
I believe all content the game provides is legit since glitches are unintentional errors in the data, therefore, can't be held against the players.

The application is where a fine line is drawn.

The word 'Cheating' can be best applied here as an intransitive verb and as such has two possible definitions:
1. to practice fraud or trickery
2. to violate rules dishonestly

In a multi-player situation, if an item and/or Pokemon obtained via exploiting a glitch is accessible to all participants and used with mutual foreknowledge and acceptance it is neither of the above and is fair therefore does not constitute cheating.

Nor does it when used in a single-player capacity in which case no one else is affected apart from the exploiter.

As there is no profit to be gained or lost on either end it also does not fall under that definition of 'cheating'.

There is a gray area as well.

For example, let's say that someone uses a Mew obtained from the Mew glitch in a link battle against someone who was not aware of this glitch nor told beforehand of the intention.
This is unfair and asinine but can it be defined as cheating?
Personally, I believe not because the Mew was provided by the game even if it was not meant to be.
 
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Leonhart

Imagineer
I don't consider it to be cheating, although I've rarely taken advantage of glitches to begin with. I remember using the Mew glitch a couple of times in R/B, and the cloning glitch in Crystal and Emerald, but I tended to avoid glitches in general since I was always afraid that exploiting them would ruin my save file, which did actually happen once.
 

Venomshock

Well-Known Member
In a manner of saying but since most glitches happen when you're playing the games by yourself I feel that exploiting them doesn't affect other players so it's not the worst thing in the world.
 

Captain Jigglypuff

Leader of Jigglypuff Army
I only use the Missingno item cloning glitch to get multiple Nuggets and certain TMs. I’ll also do the Cinnabar wild Pokémon glitch for Safari Zone exclusive Pokemon due to how frustrating some are to catch inside the Park.
 

KRSplat

Unevolved Mankey
⌂ Personally, I'd rather think of it in terms of:
  • -Is it worth doing when it doesn't affect anyone except for myself?
  • -If it does affect someone else, is it going to be helpful or beneficial to them somehow?
  • -And if it's not, then is that going to be bothersome or detrimental to their experience?
  • -And, what repercussions are there, quantifying a valuation of the sincerity of the game's effect?
◙ The use of in-game terminology wrongly suggests that a player's choices in a game actually matter.
For example,​
-Scenario where one player wins and one player loses, one of the kids beats the other kid up​
->In that example, it was cheating to exploit the glitch​
-Scenario where one player loses and crys about it and another player won​
->In this example, it was exploitation that there was a glitch​
-Scenario where a group of players agreed upon a set of predetermined rules for the game​
->Cheating can be construed to have a more clear definition once players aren't emotionally fragile​
 
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TwilightBlade

Well-Known Member
I've never thought of exploiting glitches in RBY as cheating. If GF had done more bug testing for RBY and gotten rid of the glitches like they were supposed to, nobody would be able to exploit those glitches in the first place. So I blame them for not programming the old games correctly.
 

RedBlastoise

Cerulean Blues
I don't count glitch exploitation as being the same as cheating but I wouldn't use glitches because they can harm your cartridge if done wrong.
 

Locormus

Can we please get the older, old forum back?
Well I memorized the Missingno trick by reading a cheat code site...

Never heard of that hyperbeam trick; if I were playing the games I’d assume the move recharged whlie my opponent was selecting their next Pokemon. I don’t doubt that it’s a glitch, but without looking at the source code or a design document, there’s nothing obviously wrong.

You youngsters.. This was playground stuff back in the day. xD

Hyperbeam was a strat which basically dominated competitive Gen1. Have a Dragonite set-up with an Agility (or Thunderwave), whittle down the opponent with Wrap (which didn't give you an extra turn upon release, meaning you could trap as long as you wished as long as you outsped) and then when you're in Hyperbeam-range, you could just KO for the kill and repeat until you win. Add on IceBeam for any opposing Dragonite, Rhydon or Golem.

Basically as frustrating as ParaFlinchTogekiss.

I believe all content the game provides is legit since glitches are unintentional errors in the data, therefore, can't be held against the players.

The application is where a fine line is drawn.

The word 'Cheating' can be best applied here as an intransitive verb and as such has two possible definitions:
1. to practice fraud or trickery
2. to violate rules dishonestly

In a multi-player situation, if an item and/or Pokemon obtained via exploiting a glitch is accessible to all participants and used with mutual foreknowledge and acceptance it is neither of the above and is fair therefore does not constitute cheating.

Nor does it when used in a single-player capacity in which case no one else is affected apart from the exploiter.

As there is no profit to be gained or lost on either end it also does not fall under that definition of 'cheating'.

There is a gray area as well.

For example, let's say that someone uses a Mew obtained from the Mew glitch in a link battle against someone who was not aware of this glitch nor told beforehand of the intention.
This is unfair and asinine but can it be defined as cheating?
Personally, I believe not because the Mew was provided by the game even if it was not meant to be.


You're basically going against all the parameters you set earlier on.

Was the Mew used with mutual foreknowledge and acceptance? No, one player did - the other did not. If only all participants had foreknowledge and acceptance can it not constitute as cheating. This is clearly not the case per the situation you described, hence it's clearly cheating.

Also, 'to practice fraud or trickery'. The game clearly intends there to be only one Master Ball. Using MissingNo to create literal infinites cannot be not seen as fraud or trickery - hence clearly cheating. Even if it does not harm anybody else and you can catch everything with a regular pokéball.

Clearly, you're within your legal rights to exploit whatever you want. Just like you're allowed to have opinions on a book that defer from what an author might have intended, but like an author - the developers clearly had an idea of what's exceptable and what's not.

Using a glitch to walk through walls clearly isn't 'playing the game honestly'. It clearly violates the 'roadblocks' GameFreak intended you to face (the 'rule' being you can't proceed until you complete steps 1, 2, and 3). That's playing the game dishonestly. Lets say you've just arrived at Cerulean City. The game wants to test your progress by giving you a rival battle at a bottleneck location. Using WtW, you can skip the entire battle and 'cheat' your progression the game intended to check.
 

Captain Jigglypuff

Leader of Jigglypuff Army
I think it also depends now if you are using the exploit online for your own benefit. I don’t agree with the cloning glitch and do find that to be cheating because you can end up with dozens of Lucario hypothetically and then put them on the GTS and screw over players who just wanted a Lucario to battle with that they can’t use now because it isn’t a legal Pokémon.
 

pacman000

On a quest to be the best...
Neither Lucario nor online play existed in Gen1 or 2.
 
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