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January Plot Discussion
- Thread starter lolipiece
- Start date
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shoz999
Back when Tigers used to smoke.
Speaking of the chapter, I've finally gotten around to read it. Pretty sad. I suppose it largely debunks my Sun having Alolan Royalty theory with Lunala calling out to Moon, the island being handed over to him by possibly Mohn and I believe the Tapu's recognize Moon as well who is from Sinnoh? I suppose there is a slight chance but at this point I doubt it. Someone did mention that Sun's Grandpa is possibly being taken to the graveyard of Alolan Royalty but I'm honestly slowly convinced that the theory I brought up may never be touched upon.
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Oh god, I'm so late to the party, but nonetheless I need to say that...
Thanks Coronis for all these years. You did a whole lot to popularize Pokemon Adventures, especially in the times when the manga was totally unavailable in the West, as Viz stopped releasing it after the seventh volume and the Second Edition was still nowhere on the horizon... You were THE Pokemon manga news source for most of us for so many years... It's really something. Also, great to see that you're not quitting the Pokemon fandom and I wish you good luck with your new website (bookmarked already), which looks really beautiful and I wish to see it grow.
Great job, Coronis. What you've done for the fandom will never be forgotten by long-year fans. Even though I disagreed with the usage of fanmade names, I always appreciated your efforts as a whole and continue to do so.
I feel that posts like this should be relocated into another thread, as they barely belong here. But I just couldn't stop myself from posting this. It's definitely the end of an era.
Thanks Coronis for all these years. You did a whole lot to popularize Pokemon Adventures, especially in the times when the manga was totally unavailable in the West, as Viz stopped releasing it after the seventh volume and the Second Edition was still nowhere on the horizon... You were THE Pokemon manga news source for most of us for so many years... It's really something. Also, great to see that you're not quitting the Pokemon fandom and I wish you good luck with your new website (bookmarked already), which looks really beautiful and I wish to see it grow.
Great job, Coronis. What you've done for the fandom will never be forgotten by long-year fans. Even though I disagreed with the usage of fanmade names, I always appreciated your efforts as a whole and continue to do so.
I feel that posts like this should be relocated into another thread, as they barely belong here. But I just couldn't stop myself from posting this. It's definitely the end of an era.
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shoz999
Back when Tigers used to smoke.
You mean how both the anime and manga adapts the Sun and Moon's island challenge in a loose manner. The anime is too centered heavily around one island while the manga's storyline is speeded up.
mehmeh1
Not thinking twice!
not only that, but the trials themselves, the rewards, and how everything is set up in general (for example, the anime only needing one trial to fight the kahuna while in special they don't even fight the kahunas, at least as of now, but that may be a special case because delivering the mirage berries is more important)
shoz999
Back when Tigers used to smoke.
Even though both sides are kind of understandable, anime's experimenting and manga has to deal with a tight schedule, you'd think the new and refreshing format for the Pokemon League would've been in Kusaka's favor. Instead of long team battles, it would've been quick one on two battles featuring boss-like Pokemon. I guess it has to do with the long routes in-between. However what's more disappointing is that the major adaptations have skipped chunks of the Alolan trials like it's a side story, which I suppose is kind of treated like one in the games too. Honestly though, Adventures Sun and Moon's take on the refreshingly new Alolan trials reminds me of the first time Adventures attempted to adapt the Gym battles in the RGB chapter. At least the SM chapter is doing the Ultra Wormhole stories justice.
Zhydra
Master of Chaos!
The wormhole thing, Sun's backstory, Plumeria and Anabel being given a bigger role and Gladion are the only things in the Manga I am liking.
Be ready for a rant as to why I am not liking this Manga in comparison to the games and the Anime.
It took an entire dump on Lillie for the following reasons. (Despite the PTSD thing being interesting.) The instant Guzma showed the second Cosmog... it is when things go downhill from a writing perspective, she didn't add anything to the plot besides some build up on Lusamine... which is taking way too long and is underwhelming. (Lillie taking Nebby and running amounted to NOTHING once the second Cosmog got used.) She didn't do anything at the Altar scene... you know where she plays the flute and plays a role in getting Nebby to evolve in the games. (The anime gets flack on that despite the things leading up to that scene but the Manga gets a pass?!) and practically no character growth besides ONE outburst during the Mimikyu chapter. (People complain about Lillie's growth in USUM... though every thing from SM is still there, just in a different place at a different time.)
Hau... contributed nothing. Moon... despite being miss rational, isn't doing much to resolve her goal of finding a cure for Piplup.
No Mina or Ryuki to expand upon to throw salt to this round.
Like you mentioned and this is something the anime is guilty off, the trials and most of the battles are an after thought!
Kasuka got one more year to make this Manga shine, it better not blow it.
shoz999
Back when Tigers used to smoke.
To be fair he has to do with a tight schedule. Also I just have the strange feeling that the Sun and Moon chapter isn't even near completion, as in what we saw could literally just be the beginning. The way the last chapter ended, with Lillie watching on sets a very ominous tone that this is only the beginning.
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Zhydra
Master of Chaos!
Again, it has one more year to do something. Because Lillie was robbed of a lot of things in the manga compared to her anime and game counter parts. (Both SM and USUM.) in overall role. (She should have partaken in the flute blowing at least or have SOME meaningful growth when we got to that point.) While I do agree we still have time to see her have actual development and our heroes returning to a world gone mad, we lost a lot of things with her.
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shoz999
Back when Tigers used to smoke.
True but personally I think we saw enough of Lille in the manga currently to develop her character in the future. In the games, her major turning point in character is when she gets kidnapped by Team Skull. I feel like the friendly interactions and her PTSD were enough but you are right that a lot of the smaller character interactions she had previously are just not there. Personally I thought how the games handled it made you, Lillie and Hau felt like a travelling of trio of sorts. Instead some of Lillie's little interactions that you guys are talking about, the stuff that was robbed, is partially fulfilled by Moon.
Zhydra
Master of Chaos!
I'll say it like this. Those who played both SM and USUM got very angry when Lillie didn't get the Exeggutor island scene. USUM to this day, is still condemned for that... even though the general gist of that scene is moved to the RR episode and the battle tree in USUM. (Taking actual steps to becoming a trainer, confessing her feelings for you AND showing the trainer part on screen unlike in SM. She is the best partner for the Battle Tree.)
The Manga took most of Lillie's scenes and gave it to a character that really should have done her own thing. Leaving her with nothing but a PTSD trait.... the fact that THIS is getting a pass compared to USUM is what makes me angry about it.
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shoz999
Back when Tigers used to smoke.
Your frustration is quite understandable but you misjudge what I said. I never said Lillie's character right now should get a pass. I said that Lillie currently has enough decent character development to develop into a stronger character in the future. If Lillie does not develop into a satisfactory character in the future then all the decent character development right now that she does have, which you admitted that she does have some despite some missing scenes here and there, will then truly feel meaningless, empty. However if Lillie does grow into a stronger character into the future, then the Lillie we see saw mostly on the third Alolan Island, the PTSD you mentioned, will feel less like a robbed character and more like the first introduction to a new character, a great beginning to something.
Zhydra
Master of Chaos!
Again, the Manga has one more year to make this development actually happen, because right now... she is bare bone compared to both games. (While the anime done its own thing with her and have a different problem I have that is minor in comparison. "Giving her a ton of development in one Arc and finished her character. Leaving the rest of her growth to be very slow.")
That is why I am waiting to see what happens.
shoz999
Back when Tigers used to smoke.
Fair enough. However I am personally intrigued by how Lillie's character will develop from here on out. I have quite high expectations due to the number of routes it could take so I'll probably be the most disappointed lol if Lillie's character is rushed. Furthermore there is something else that I'm intrigued by how things will turn out in the end of the SM chapter. If things turn out wonderful for the majority of us, then it's another great addition of the Pokemon Adventures series. But if things start turn out truly rushed, like I mean even by Pokemon Adventures standards where they hasten certain story lines to meet deadlines (for example the BW chapter hastened Drayden's gym/battle). It makes you wonder if Kusaka is finally at his limit with all these projects and deadlines. I don't know about you but how the SM chapter started out is certainly different from the rest, it's make you wonder if he planned it all out because it does work smoothly to an extant but at the same time it is skipping more chunks than even past Pokemon Adventure chapters have, outside of remake/expansion-based chapters of course.
Zhydra
Master of Chaos!
This problem started at the Gen 3 Manga due to taking way too long to finish and causing a build up that reared its ugly head at the Gen 5 Manga. (By the time THAT one is finished, we will be like AZ!)
I heard a lot of good things about the Gen 4 Manga and Gen 6 was a VAST improvement from the games. (Seriously even the Anime did Team Flare better justice despite that I have a lot to say against the XY anime.)
The only option he has at this point is to start making fast paced stories with the material given and HOPE he catches up. (Since the Manga works in tie with the games, story planning HAS to change on the fly when we have Platinum/ BW2/ USUM show up.) This would lead to another problem in the likes of Gen 5 and Gen 7 which are known for having big slower paced stories to adapt into the Manga, but something has to be done.
shoz999
Back when Tigers used to smoke.
Yeah but the difference between then and now is that the Gen 3 manga went pretty smoothly and covered so much material in-time. Sun and Moon on the other hand literally just skipped (largely guesses) 3/4th of the first island, 1/4th of the second island and 2/4th of the third island including surprisingly the destruction of Malie City, one of the most popular locations in the game that left a good impression in gamers. Even the 6th gen chapter covered most of it's minor locations through a quick picture and then moves on, here it literally skips so many locations it's pretty surprising even for an Adventure fan whose used to the Adventures series rushing things from time to time. All the more interesting how the Sun and Moon chapter will turn out in the end.
Zhydra
Master of Chaos!
The Gen 6 thing went that smoothly because it had a different plot from the games. (If you even call what they gave us in the Kalos games a plot!) The plot was more focused on our two heroes surviving against Team Flare... who had an influence in everywhere in addition to parts from the games it DID keep in.
The current one and the Gen 5 Manga... tried adapting too much of the games plot while adding too much of its touches in. (Instead of doing its own thing from scratch while keeping the spirit of the story intact. Then we have Gen 1 and 2 which had NO plot in the games and that became the highlight of the Mangas history.)
shoz999
Back when Tigers used to smoke.
Fair enough but see all the previous storylines, the storylines based on the original games that started a generation, not remakes or expansions, covered the majority of the games mechanics, settings, characters and to an extant even plot. That's one of the major ways they keep the spirit of the games. Even though Black and White does focus more closely to the plot, it still heavily covers so much ground without interfering too much with the flow for most readers anyways. Sun and Moon however, I'm not quite sure. It doesn't cover nearly on the same ground as previous story arcs. I say I'm not quite sure because sometimes story arcs cover the rest of the games, even early material, late in the story.
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