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Kingdom Hearts 358/2 Days

Discussion in 'Other Video Game Discussion' started by Jegretis, Dec 29, 2009.

  1. Rald123

    Rald123 Member

    That scene still has me thinking even now... after I got done with all the crieng from beating the game I started thinking, "Now why did Xigbar see Ven?"
    I love this game.. but then again, after piecing together the story from this game and the story from KH2 I cried even more. Sad stuff, man.
  2. ~Sirnight~

    ~Sirnight~ Come along, dear

    I shall explain. Spoilers abound.

    Xion is made of Sora's memories, therefore whoever sees her sees who they had the strongest connection to, who Sora had memories of. The person's memory reflects off Xion, mingles with the memories, and bounces back. Roxas and Namine saw our adorable Kairi-themed one, since they were both made from him. Saix and Axel at first never even saw a face, since they didn't know Sora personally, and it is theorized that Riku may have just seen a blank face, or some other suprsing person at Beast's Bastle, leading to his surprise.

    Soooo, Xigbar seeing Ven off of Xion is meant to be one big foreshadowing towards BBS and that Braig has seen or met TAV, and we can also assume this from his line in KH2 "You're not even half the hero the others were". This we can confirm, as Braig appears in BBS and in fact even fights Terra in a cool boss battle in Radiant Garden. He must run into Ven as well, maybe having his own fight or meaningful meeting, and gaining a strong memory of him.

    Now, for him to be seeing Ven in Xion, who is made up of Sora's memories, means that Sora himself must have memories of Ven. Kind of likely since they have those obvious and known connections, right? In fact, even if they never met, it links up with the theory that Ven's heart is in Sora's since he was a child, after his death. But that is going off into something else entirely. The idea is that Sora knows or has memories of Ven somehow, and Braig, who had met Ven, saw Ven in Xion because of those memories reflecting off of her.

    Yeah um no.

    Reading that is the best thing anyone who likes KH could do.
  3. Rald123

    Rald123 Member

    Whoa...o.o Never even thought of it like that. How did you come to that conclusion may I ask?
  4. ~Sirnight~

    ~Sirnight~ Come along, dear

    Well, it comes with just knowing what Xion is and how she works. It isn't completely my idea though, and it comes from a collaboration of other theorests who areb etter than my on another forum. I'm just like the messenger boy.
  5. BlitzBlast

    BlitzBlast Busy with School

    Oh goodie, a KH debate. This won't end well.

    Which is exactly why I am proceeding through with it.

    The implication I got was that the reason Ven appeared was because Axel was nearby. Recall that Xion's form changing is associated with the memories of Sora. Also, note that near the end Xion's form was stabilizing, to the point that everyone started seeing her as Sora.

    Now, in the trailer to BBS, we can clearly see Lea and Isa interacting with Ven. And Axel states that he remembers his past. So, Xion absorbs the memories from Axel (who had met Sora in CoM), and along the way ends up taking the form of Ven (whether this is because Sora and Ven are connected or because Axel associated Ven with Sora is something I don't really care to find out) similar to the cutscene Snarl of Memories.

    Of course, BBS will probably give a completely different answer, so yeah.

    Er.. what?

    I posted a video clearly showing Roxas and Namine interacting and the fact that both of them are pretty happy about being together, and you post a site comparing Sora/Kairi and Sora/Namine?
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2010
  6. ~Sirnight~

    ~Sirnight~ Come along, dear

    I applaud you for going for it.

    Do we know everyone saw her as Sora though? I may be wrong, but Xion was only Sora from the beginning of the battle at the clock tower, when she first took her hood off after going through her problems, to when she was dying in Roxas' arms. All throughout the battle. The only thing we could assume is that Riku saw her while in that form, since they were out teaming up at the time. Possibly Xemnas, as well, but he too was too busy seeing her as Ven.

    Also, it wouldn't matter what Axel saw, since all that matters is what the individual sees. That's why Roxas could see her without the hood while Saix only ever saw her as a "doll".

    Now this could make sense, as it is possible Axel saw her as Ven. Though heck, for all we know he was even seeing her as Sora at this time, because of the transformation and al the time he spent with Sora at CO. Then again, that may have caused more of a stir that what was shown. Now, in this scenario while it does make sense that Axel could have seen Ven, I'm just saying that it isn't an excuse to say that that is why Xigbar saw Ven. From what we know, it is just in the eye of the beholder.

    I assumed this was to get me into a little canonical reltionship debate. I presented non-RokuNami evidence.
  7. BlitzBlast

    BlitzBlast Busy with School

    Here's one of the Secret Reports, straight from the game:

    "Xion's appearance should vary based on the relation of the viewer to her. Saix sees her simply as a pupper. The Program approaches completion. Through Roxas, Xion is assembling a copy of the hero of the Keyblade. As proof, she sometimes appears to take his form to my eyes."

    Now, the first few lines don't support my argument, but the last does: the person who wrote this report notes that Xion sometimes appears as Sora instead of whatever the person normally sees. In other words, Xion is stabilizing. Of course, if the person who wrote this was Riku, I'm completely wrong, so yeah.

    As I stated up above, it appears Xion's appearance is stabilizing, to the point that different people see the same thing. In other words, if both Xigbar and Axel remember Ven, and if Ven is associated with Sora in Axel's memories and the Keyblade in Xigbar's memories, it's not too much of a stretch for Xion to take his appearance.

    Er... no it wasn't. I was just responding to your statement that Roxas only sees Namine twice in the entire game and thus couldn't be very comfortable with her by posting a video that shows that in the final meeting the two are very comfortable with each other.
  8. Electivirus

    Electivirus Not really, no.

    Sounds like Xemnas to me.
  9. ~Sirnight~

    ~Sirnight~ Come along, dear

    Xion was naturally taking the form of Xion, yeah. Keep in mind though that Xemnas, who I believe wrote that particular report, met with Sora in KH1FM, so it's very possible it's that slipping out as well.

    While the report does show that the Sora side of her is stabilizing, I have more trouble thinking that the same goes for Ven or somebody else. Axel showed absolutely no surprise to what Xion may have looked like to him in that scene, which says a lot, consdiering that Xigbar just gave a small statement.

    Well, I'm still under the impression that they couldn't be completely happy with each other. I thought that they were just happy to become whole, rather than with each other. Misunderstanding mostly.
  10. BlitzBlast

    BlitzBlast Busy with School

    Okay, you know what? Screw using spoilers, everybody who even cares knows about this already.

    Either way, my point in this case was that Xion is no longer changing depending on who sees here, and that she is beginning to stabilize.

    As I stated earlier, both Axel and Xigbar had memories relating to Ven, and it's not too far of a stretch for them to associate Sora with Ven, and thus have her take that form. We only see the end of that encounter; for all we know she could have morphed into Sora, then Ven.

    Also, Axel and Xigbar are Nobodies, so of course they wouldn't be too surprised. Hell, all Xigbar did was crack a joke, then attack.

    Either way, these are both just theories that have been created. BBS will (hopefully) give the answer we seek.

    No, in that video they're clearly pretty happy to see each other. And, quite frankly they are Sora and Kairi, who love each other.
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2010
  11. ~Sirnight~

    ~Sirnight~ Come along, dear

    Good show.

    I agree. I just think that with such an abstract form it wouldn't be stabilizing for it.

    It's pretty obvious that Xigbar is suprised at Ven though, even if he went to Sora > Ven for some reason. Xigbar hadn't even seen Sora by that point.

    So they can joke but can't be suprised, mm?

    I kinda agree, but BBS probably won't give us much on Xion. Now, we know that Lea and Isa see Ven, and Braig sees Terra. If Braig doesn't see Ven I will give you this, but it's looking like that's what will happen.

    Well, yeah, I'm sure it's nice to see their kind of "doubles" and all. I still have trouble seeing them as a relationship tho--

    Yeah I'm gonna go and disagree with you again.
  12. BlitzBlast

    BlitzBlast Busy with School

    Well, as I stated earlier, both Axel and Xigbar have memories of Ven. Axel has memories of Sora and may or may not associate them with his memories of Ven. Xion's form is stabilizing now. Add in an *****pull, and you get an explanation.

    Well, considering Xigbar's personality...

    Wait what? If Braig doesn't see Ven my theory doesn't hold up either.

    And we don't need to know about Xion, we need to know Ven's connection to Sora (which would be why Xion even changed into him in the first place).

    Well, considering they're kind of nonexistent now, you really don't have to.


    Like it or not, they're the canon couple. You'd have to be blind, or deeply entrenched in another pairing to not see it.
  13. SoulSilverMstr411

    SoulSilverMstr411 Hikikomori

    RotS was a nightmare! Not because he was hard to damage, but because it was near-impossible for me to dodge his attacks.

    As far as I'm concerned the early bosses require no strategy at all. Seriously, I beat Darkside and Dark Follower by attacking their arms repeatedly. I didn't even bother dodeging 'cos every attack brought be one step closer to limit break. Though I'll admit that DF might have been hard if I didn't have Xaldin watching my back.

    Then Infernal Engine shows up and suddenly it's a whole new ball game. ;P
  14. BlitzBlast

    BlitzBlast Busy with School

    Ruler of the Sky is avoidable by simply not locking on to him; the camera will screw you over if you do.

    What you need to do is use Fire magic and burn him.

    Also, the Infernal Engine.. was really freaking easy, he's basically a giant wall who occasionally moves forwards. Attack his weakpoint for massive damage.
  15. Electivirus

    Electivirus Not really, no.

    Or just learn how to block.
  16. ~Sirnight~

    ~Sirnight~ Come along, dear

    There aren't any canon couples in KH, just implied and/or badly written ones. A la SoKai.
  17. ~Sirnight~

    ~Sirnight~ Come along, dear

    And how in the past three games they have no chemistry together and have no semblence of love outside of strong friendship?

    You know I felt like fighting but no. Just read this. I abide by it, and I follow the writter as she knows the game. I am not alone in what I believe and I follow it, and perhaps if KH was written differently then it would be easier to believe in these things.

    blahblah I stand by my opinion blah
  18. Burning Orphanage

    Burning Orphanage Liscensed Pedophile

    Aladdin and Jasmine. [​IMG]
  19. ~Sirnight~

    ~Sirnight~ Come along, dear

    I'll give you the Disney ones, bro.
  20. BlitzBlast

    BlitzBlast Busy with School

    Oh hey, time to C&P the list of points where it's pretty obvious Sora and Kairi like each other, with the ones that actually matter bolded.

    You can't actually block the Infernal Engine. You just have to move.
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2010

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