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Marvel Universe Discussion Thread - **SPOILER WARNING** (movies, shows, etc.)

Locormus

Can we please get the older, old forum back?
**** Tom Cruise, him and everyone involved in Scientology is an auto boycott for me tbh.

Freedom of religion is a right though.. I'm not religious in any sense, because most of the wars in history were fought because of it.. that or landdesputes.. >.>
 

Jeepo12

Member
i like where they are going with the Kang architect idea.

having multiple versions of each character is interesting and i guess a way for them to get everyone involved and combine storylines and make them all canon.

pretty difficult job tbf so fair play for trying it and can explore some cool stuff.

lot like matrix tho with just different iterations of matrix, the 1 and how they defeat the architect each time with love in Loki was a bit on the nose.
 

Ishiftyounot

The Meme Supreme
So I finally got around to finishing The Falcon & The Winter Soldier which means I am completely up to date with the MCU now! At least until Moon Knight is out at the end of the month. I did not have high expectations for this series because everyone said it was the worst show out of the ones we've had so far (except What If?, but even then it's debatable), but you know what? I think it's my favourite show out of all of them! It tackled the mantle of Captain America really well and what it meant to be a "Super Soldier" and showed Sam having to put in effort to be worthy of it in the eyes of others and himself, which is really cool and I look forward to seeing this be expanded upon in Captain America 4. Having Isaiah Bradley, John Walker, Bucky, the Flag Smashers, Zemo and Sam himself all have different perspectives and ideas for the meaning of the role and the qualities behind it was done really well I think - nobody overstayed their welcome, everyone got some solid development and I honestly think it was a great well-rounded show!

I have criticisms of course - the last episode was really dark so made some of the action hard to see? The Flag Smashers felt kind-of odd as the antagonists but I think they were meant to - they were normal people who took the Super Soldier Serum to establish their own ideas of what the world should be, and that normalcy is what makes things feel a bit awkward to me (they had nice escalation of conflict towards the end too, you could side with them but gradually see their ideology and what they were willing to do to achieve it dwindle). Bucky did feel a smidge underpowered and it would have been nice to see him let loose a bit and come to terms with his past as the Winter Soldier a little bit more there? I also don't really get why everyone thinks the young Bradley will become the next Falcon or Sam's sidekick, he was barely a part of the show besides to support Isaiah (but yeah, would be cool to maybe see where they take that).

My ranking for the Disney+ shows is now this:
  1. The Falcon & The Winter Soldier
  2. Hawkeye
  3. Loki
  4. Wandavision
  5. What If?
Looking forward to Doctor Strange 2!
 

Locormus

Can we please get the older, old forum back?
So I finally got around to finishing The Falcon & The Winter Soldier which means I am completely up to date with the MCU now! At least until Moon Knight is out at the end of the month. I did not have high expectations for this series because everyone said it was the worst show out of the ones we've had so far (except What If?, but even then it's debatable), but you know what? I think it's my favourite show out of all of them! It tackled the mantle of Captain America really well and what it meant to be a "Super Soldier" and showed Sam having to put in effort to be worthy of it in the eyes of others and himself, which is really cool and I look forward to seeing this be expanded upon in Captain America 4. Having Isaiah Bradley, John Walker, Bucky, the Flag Smashers, Zemo and Sam himself all have different perspectives and ideas for the meaning of the role and the qualities behind it was done really well I think - nobody overstayed their welcome, everyone got some solid development and I honestly think it was a great well-rounded show!

I have criticisms of course - the last episode was really dark so made some of the action hard to see? The Flag Smashers felt kind-of odd as the antagonists but I think they were meant to - they were normal people who took the Super Soldier Serum to establish their own ideas of what the world should be, and that normalcy is what makes things feel a bit awkward to me (they had nice escalation of conflict towards the end too, you could side with them but gradually see their ideology and what they were willing to do to achieve it dwindle). Bucky did feel a smidge underpowered and it would have been nice to see him let loose a bit and come to terms with his past as the Winter Soldier a little bit more there? I also don't really get why everyone thinks the young Bradley will become the next Falcon or Sam's sidekick, he was barely a part of the show besides to support Isaiah (but yeah, would be cool to maybe see where they take that).

My ranking for the Disney+ shows is now this:
  1. The Falcon & The Winter Soldier
  2. Hawkeye
  3. Loki
  4. Wandavision
  5. What If?
Looking forward to Doctor Strange 2!

Great to see you liked it!

The mellow reception was because it came straight off the back from the well-received WandaVision and that it felt like "Jock"-Marvel. Female audiences weren't as interested for example.

Isiaiah Bradley's grandson IS part of the Young Avengers in the comics. Not so much Falcon, but I believe his character name was Patriot-something.

The guy who Sam gave his broken wings to will probably be the Falcon to his Cap.

The FlagSmashers felt off because the show (written in 2019, precovid) had a pandemic-storyline and this was deemed inappropriate and thus a lot of the FlagSmasher's storyline was cut and characterization/scenes had to be shuffled and/or audio needed to be added in post-filming to explain things.
 

Ishiftyounot

The Meme Supreme
Great to see you liked it!

The mellow reception was because it came straight off the back from the well-received WandaVision and that it felt like "Jock"-Marvel. Female audiences weren't as interested for example.

Isiaiah Bradley's grandson IS part of the Young Avengers in the comics. Not so much Falcon, but I believe his character name was Patriot-something.

The guy who Sam gave his broken wings to will probably be the Falcon to his Cap.

The FlagSmashers felt off because the show (written in 2019, precovid) had a pandemic-storyline and this was deemed inappropriate and thus a lot of the FlagSmasher's storyline was cut and characterization/scenes had to be shuffled and/or audio needed to be added in post-filming to explain things.
Oh I see, that explains a lot actually! Completely forgot about Torres and him being the next Falcon, think he'd be the better fit than Eli Bradley (although I do want a Young Avengers team at some point so hopefully Eli sticks around!) although I think you'd need to devote a bit more time to his character to bring him up to par with the rest of the squad. Although with how they integrated Falcon's wings and stuff into Sam's Cap suit I don't actually know if we'll get or need another Falcon? Not sure if the character is beloved enough that we need someone new taking up the mantle. I had heard about the Flag Smashers storyline being changed though, wonder how that storyline would have gone anyway? Would we still get an interesting debate on the concept of the Super Soldier? Because as much as the Flag Smashers felt a bit meh as villains I did like that discussion and how it played into Sam taking up the Captain America mantle (alongside Walker failing to do so). It worked out quite nicely.

As for the connection with Wandavision, I personally didn't like that show an awful lot so I guess I fall into the "jock" crowd there! I liked how each episode was a different era in television? And I loved seeing Wanda struggle with letting go and actually processing her grief? Which is admittedly a bit up in the air now judging by the Doctor Strange 2 trailers, but I have hope it'll all work out. Agatha was a cool villain (who I'm surprised is getting a spin-off show, but I'd love to see her on the MCU take on the Midnight Suns instead of Strange) but that's kinda it. The Fox Quicksilver thing was awful, the bits with SWORD weren't that exciting (although I like Darcy, Jimmy Woo and Monica Rambeau) and I thought it took too long to get to the point for my tastes. That's just me though, I know lots of folks loved that show and I totally get it! It's just not for me.
 

Zoruagible

Lover of underrated characters
Ms. Marvel looks alright, I'm honestly glad they changed her powers from being all stretchy. That is Reed Richard's thing and these new ones actually fit well with what Carol and Spectrum have, I like her character but I always thought her powers were stupid.
 

Locormus

Can we please get the older, old forum back?
Ms. Marvel looks alright, I'm honestly glad they changed her powers from being all stretchy. That is Reed Richard's thing and these new ones actually fit well with what Carol and Spectrum have, I like her character but I always thought her powers were stupid.

I like that the show is obviously targetting a different (younger) audience, without compromising the budget all too much.

As for her powers, I agree that this interpretation fits better once she joins Carol and Monica. But embiggening isn't the same as stretching. Creating a very big fist or extremely long legs aren't the same as the stretchy and twisty capabilities that Reed Richards has.

Ie. Reed can stretch himself into a safetynet, Kamala shouldn't.
 

Blue Saturday

Unfurl your Blessed Wings!
Finally watched Homecoming and Far From Home, both were pretty okay.

I think Homecoming was a nice beginning movie, kind of on the bland side at times though. A little too much MCU-comedy is my only issue. It did feel grounded enough to be enjoyed on its own and fitting for a Spider-Man story. Definitely felt that Disney energy at times, Peter's conflict of responsibility really and connection with Iron Man, Aunt May and the cast were kind of...weak? They want to see Iron Man and Peter Parker as a brother-father combo but I just don't feel like there was much build-up outside of Iron Man being annoyed or ribbing him and Peter being a dorky kid. At the end of the day this movie is about Peter fighting a buglary and trying to figure him out while finding himself.

Far From Home was better I think? FFH suffers I think from trying to mix a teen romance movie with a superhero movie. Definitely didn't feel as grounded and more "fantastical" (which gets obnoxious with MCU) Kind of just retreaded a bit, basically Peter being his own person and not an Iron Man copy...kind of thought they dealt with that last film. Tony's passing obviously impacted him but I don't think we needed another movie about Peter finding himself and the person he wanted to be as Spider-Man rather than just another Iron Man. I did like the Spidey-Sense scene, the illusionary fight and aspects def gave the film some nice trickery/stakes/weight at times. This movie is mainly saved by Jake Gyllenhaal's amazing performance. The switch from charismatic, adoring hero to villanous manipulative trickster was conveyed really well.

MCU Spider-Man movies aren't bad, I just wish they could chill out with the all-over-the-placeness and madcap comedy, Tom Holland makes for a good awkward nerdy type but I kind of felt like he wasn't playing Spider-Man/Peter Parker at times, he was just "playing himself" more than anything.

 

Ishiftyounot

The Meme Supreme
Moon Knight has been out for a couple of weeks on Disney+ and nobody is talking about it apparently, so here I am to do so! Morbius is out as well but from what I've heard the MCU ties are horrendous and we all got duped by the trailers, so it's a shitshow I'm going to be avoiding until I can either stream it or watch it without paying.

Moon Knight though! It's really good, like really good. Who'd have guessed having no current ties to the MCU would be refreshing? I understand its importance for world-building but it does take away from the personal character stories when you have to make it fit an extended universe. I'd not heard of the character until they announced the show coming so I have no concept of the comics or what makes Moon Knight himself so special besides the mental health conditions and Egyptian theme, but I felt that way about every MCU character so it's nice to see how the movies and shows portray them in their way. This show has already broken even more pre-existing "rules" by showcasing the main villain and the suit in the first episode and it was incredible that they did so - Harrow is an amazing villain and I am so excited to see how his relationship with Khonshu shapes who he is now and his role as Ammit's Avatar, whilst the suit looks incredible especially in action!

The main concept I guess of the show is the Steven/Marc relationship and my god is Oscar Isaac such an incredible actor! They feel like completely distinct characters and already have some conflict brewing between them which is portrayed magnificently by him, absolutely incredible work. I'm not quite so sold on Layla yet but I'm sure she'll grow on me in future episodes. Steven is just such a loveable dork that it's hard to hate him not being so action-heavy, and using him to show off the world of Moon Knight works really well even if I think Marc is meant to be the "main" personality. I just like it, it's good stuff! Also the way they've seemingly made Mr. Knight Steven's version of the suit is actually pretty clever - from what I understand Mr. Knight is meant to be a more suave cocky detective type character whilst Moon Knight himself is the brawler, but having Steven's suit be Mr. Knight and watching him grow from this awkward dork into a more confident version of himself through the suit will be amazing to see. Khonshu is also a very cool character as he's a dick, but he's a god so that makes sense, so his attitude towards Harrow and Marc makes you both love and hate him. It's funky.
 

Locormus

Can we please get the older, old forum back?
Moon Knight has been out for a couple of weeks on Disney+ and nobody is talking about it apparently, so here I am to do so! Morbius is out as well but from what I've heard the MCU ties are horrendous and we all got duped by the trailers, so it's a shitshow I'm going to be avoiding until I can either stream it or watch it without paying.

Moon Knight though! It's really good, like really good. Who'd have guessed having no current ties to the MCU would be refreshing? I understand its importance for world-building but it does take away from the personal character stories when you have to make it fit an extended universe. I'd not heard of the character until they announced the show coming so I have no concept of the comics or what makes Moon Knight himself so special besides the mental health conditions and Egyptian theme, but I felt that way about every MCU character so it's nice to see how the movies and shows portray them in their way. This show has already broken even more pre-existing "rules" by showcasing the main villain and the suit in the first episode and it was incredible that they did so - Harrow is an amazing villain and I am so excited to see how his relationship with Khonshu shapes who he is now and his role as Ammit's Avatar, whilst the suit looks incredible especially in action!

The main concept I guess of the show is the Steven/Marc relationship and my god is Oscar Isaac such an incredible actor! They feel like completely distinct characters and already have some conflict brewing between them which is portrayed magnificently by him, absolutely incredible work. I'm not quite so sold on Layla yet but I'm sure she'll grow on me in future episodes. Steven is just such a loveable dork that it's hard to hate him not being so action-heavy, and using him to show off the world of Moon Knight works really well even if I think Marc is meant to be the "main" personality. I just like it, it's good stuff! Also the way they've seemingly made Mr. Knight Steven's version of the suit is actually pretty clever - from what I understand Mr. Knight is meant to be a more suave cocky detective type character whilst Moon Knight himself is the brawler, but having Steven's suit be Mr. Knight and watching him grow from this awkward dork into a more confident version of himself through the suit will be amazing to see. Khonshu is also a very cool character as he's a dick, but he's a god so that makes sense, so his attitude towards Harrow and Marc makes you both love and hate him. It's funky.

Oscar Isaac is killing it. That being said, I'm 98% sure it's intentional, but I'm frustrated by the lack of concrete direction. I mean we're supposed to be as in the dark as Marc/Steven/etc are - but I'm confused (read annoyed) by how Harrow would suddenly show up at convenient moments just so that the episode can finish on a fightscene. And to be honest, the fightscenes aren't that impressive, compared to say, DareDevil's..
 

Ishiftyounot

The Meme Supreme
Oscar Isaac is killing it. That being said, I'm 98% sure it's intentional, but I'm frustrated by the lack of concrete direction. I mean we're supposed to be as in the dark as Marc/Steven/etc are - but I'm confused (read annoyed) by how Harrow would suddenly show up at convenient moments just so that the episode can finish on a fightscene. And to be honest, the fightscenes aren't that impressive, compared to say, DareDevil's..
That's valid, I never really thought about Harrow getting around until you mentioned it and now I'm aware... yeah, how does he just show up randomly? Sometimes it makes sense and sometimes it doesn't, maybe I need to rewatch the episodes and see if it makes sense. The fight scenes are whatever, I don't really remember the ones in episode 3 outside of Steven getting impaled a bit but I liked the one in episode 2 with the jackal (I think it's my favourite episode so far), but I haven't watched Daredevil to see how good his fight scenes are for comparison! Feels pretty standard MCU for me. Looking forward to the rest of Moon Knight, I saw some leaks for the next episode and it sounds pretty interesting!
 

Blue Saturday

Unfurl your Blessed Wings!
Moon Knight is pretty dank, watched ep1. Not disappointed, I find super hero shows to be good in live action when they don’t slip into CW-styled nonsense. Haven’t seen any other recent Disney+ live actions (will watch Wandavision soon) but I can’t complain thus far. Isaac Oscars also does a lovely job, he deserved better as Poe.


Also Thor: Love and Thunder finally shows itself, looks super campy, imagine it’s a red-herring before things get wild in the third act. I was whatever about it after watching but you know, I guess it could be something a little new and surprising? Don’t care about Guardian of the Galaxy characters tho….
 

Locormus

Can we please get the older, old forum back?
Episode 4 certainly was something. So many Indiana Jones-vibes.

First live-action mummy/zombie in the MCU?! Nice!

Also, Steven being romantically interested in Layla seems so awkward, even a bit forced.

Of course Harrow finds her alone just in time to have a destabilizing chat that resets interpersonal relations going into the final stretch. I'm guessing personality #3 (in the second shaking sarcophagus) killed her dad (probably the one that went on a stabbing spree earlier as well).

Alexander the Great? Really? I was sure it was going to be Ramatut (aka Kang) looking at the face of the sarcophagus - and the Ramatut reference on the clothing of some of the extra's, but I guess if Steven sees Macedonian that it could make sense.. Who knows, maybe Feige pulls the Kang = Nathaniel Reed / He Who Remains / Ramatut /& Alexander the Great?

That ending was hilarious.


Moon Knight is pretty dank, watched ep1. Not disappointed, I find super hero shows to be good in live action when they don’t slip into CW-styled nonsense. Haven’t seen any other recent Disney+ live actions (will watch Wandavision soon) but I can’t complain thus far. Isaac Oscars also does a lovely job, he deserved better as Poe.


Also Thor: Love and Thunder finally shows itself, looks super campy, imagine it’s a red-herring before things get wild in the third act. I was whatever about it after watching but you know, I guess it could be something a little new and surprising? Don’t care about Guardian of the Galaxy characters tho….

Odds are high that Gorr starts wrecking God's as early as the first act, with Thor being unaware at first.
 

Blue Saturday

Unfurl your Blessed Wings!
Also, Steven being romantically interested in Layla seems so awkward, even a bit forced.
Yeah, this portion was super forced. Really felt like they were trying to jutaxposition Marc to being the man she's with and Steven being the one who she needs. Was hoping they wouldn't shove a relationship in here, not like this show needs it given we have six episodes.
Of course Harrow finds her alone just in time to have a destabilizing chat that resets interpersonal relations going into the final stretch. I'm guessing personality #3 (in the second shaking sarcophagus) killed her dad (probably the one that went on a stabbing spree earlier as well).
Yeah, a bit forced, no lie.

All caught up, I really dug the episode. Marc and Steven's relationship is super sweet and I liked the work in displaying two sides of Oscar Isaac to express that, dude is a lovely actor and super talented. I do feel like this shows weak point is how things happen so haphardzly without little transition, we just zoom around without a lot of breathing room. Layla also just kind of accept Steven a little too easily where she called him out on faking before? I'm not particularly an action snob so I'm cool with the fight scenes, Mr. Knight and Moon Knight are both confusing concepts in a certain sense. Seems like Steven had control of his powers and accepted the craziness of this whole deal very easily and fast? That being said both design of Mr/Moon Knight are sick.

Creative value was a 10/10, beautiful sets, scenery, nice CGI and VFX effects, nice outfits and quality clothing and references. I adored the aspect ratio switch with the Indiana Jones vibe to literal mental health hospital. The mirror effect of having both Marc and Steven in person was wondeful.
 
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Locormus

Can we please get the older, old forum back?
Episode was definitely 8/10, maybe higher.

Apparently, Kevin Feige pitched episodes 1 and 5 to Oscar Isaac when he offered him the role. He admitted he knew nothing of the character, binged an incredible amount of MK-comics, understood the endless possibilities for the character(s) and said yes. So I'm pretty sure we're in for a banger coming Wednesday. :)

Another observation: I'm not used to Ethan Hawke looking this.. worn? In my head he's always the gunhoe rookie government agent from Lord of War.

Maybe I'm the only one, but did anybody else have a flashback to the ending of Joaquin's Joker? I mean both scenes had a mental health patient running through extremely lit white halls of a mental health institution.
 
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G-SANtos

Well-Known Member
So far, we don't know if Moon Knight will have a second season. It seems to be in the Limited Series category at the Emmy's, indicating no Season 2, but Marvel has recently to episode 6 as a "season finale" instead of "series finale", and I heard they deleted tweets that called it a series finale. Plus, I've read an article the other day talking about how they are seemingly referencing characters from Moon Knight's comics, but avoiding actually using them, as if they are being saved for later stories.

I came up with this episode 6 theory during the week, but if there's another season, it probably debunks it.
Jake Lockley is how Marc and Steven ressurrect. Because he hasn't been judged by the Scales of Justice, he's not completely dead yet, and guarantees Steven and Marc are able to return to the living world. After Khonshu is freed, Jake fights as the Shadow Knight before Steven and Marc are able to return to the body.

This was my original theory after episode 5, before I read this was supposedly a limited series. With season 2 now being hinted as a possibility, this one might be more likely.
Jake is revealed in a post-credits as the season 2 tease. He is the Shadow Knight, but this might not be revealed yet.

For those who don't know, Shadow Knight is a character from the comics, but he's Marc's brother in that version. Because Moon Knight doesn't have a third costume in the comics, I'm assuming Shadow Knight will serve the purpose of Jake's suit, like Mr. Knight is Steven's suit.
 

Ishiftyounot

The Meme Supreme
Anyone else insanely excited for Doctor Strange 2? I'm from the UK so it's out in cinemas tomorrow, but I'm booked to go see it on Friday afternoon once I'm finished with uni! I'm so hyped, I've kept up to date on the leaks / theories and if what they say is true it's going to be one of my favourite MCU movies! Knowing the plot doesn't matter to me, it's all about execution and I think Marvel does that pretty damn well for my tastes. It sounds incredible, with a few things here and there I'm cautious about seeing but again, will see how it's executed on screen.

Anyway, the main reason I'm posting is this: I have seen all 6 episodes of Moon Knight. Episode 6 came out today and it is AMAZING. This is my favourite MCU show by quite a bit! I'm so excited for a potential season 2, they have to do it - with the way this episode ended you can't not do another season. So good! Reddit was getting a bit antsy about the run-time when it was revealed because the last episode of MCU shows have typically been a bit rushed, mediocre and not actually reached a satisfying conclusion? I can see that, but I think Moon Knight nailed it and everything got cleared up relatively well outside of a few threads they want to extend to the aforementioned potential season 2.

I adored the Marc/Steven dynamic in this episode and how they've finally figured out how to coexist together! Marc going back for Steven in the Duat was really touching and the way they covered each other both during the final battle (more on that in a bit) and afterwards when their life (lives?) resumed normality was awesome. Seeing Steven grow into a more confident person was great as well, now he's realised his true potential he's no longer borderline incompetent outside of his Egyptology knowledge - he's still goofy but he's semi-capable as well. Watching him chat to Khonshu before the final battle was quite funny as well.

I quite liked Layla in this episode, who became Tawaret's Avatar (temporarily, although we didn't see her give up the role) and fought alongside Marc/Steven against Harrow. Apparently she's meant to be an interpretation of the Scarlet Scarab from the comics? That's pretty neat, loved her costume and we have a true proper Egyptian superhero now! I hope she stays the Avatar, if only so Tawaret sticks around because I love her character. I wish we saw more of her interactions with Marc/Steven after they won the battle, mainly because I'm curious as to how her dynamic with Marc/Steven will work since they both seem to share control of the body? Guess the episode was rushed in that sense, but it leaves development for a potential season 2 so I'm cool with it.

The final battle was neat, seeing Khonshu taking on Ammit whilst Moon Knight fought Harrow was dope! I loved how Steven and Marc would swap during combat and the suit would change too, Mr. Knight finally getting into the action and doing pretty damn well for himself! Steven does have it in him to kick ass, and he's a different enough fighter from Marc that it works - Marc is more acrobatic from what I saw whilst Steven is more of a bruiser-type. Neat! Harrow felt reasonably strong but I would've liked to have seen him in his own Avatar attire, him in just a suit fighting Moon Knight and Layla in her get-up was fine but nothing super exciting. The end of the fight was a nice twist though! In the sense that we didn't actually see what happened until the aftermath, but you know it's bad and Marc/Steven were pretty freaked out by it. I thought that was cool.

That final battle leads into the mid-credits scene... Jake Lockley revealed! He's Hispanic which is funky, and seems to be the reason why Moon Knight is sticking around for the future. Khonshu knew Marc was way more broken than even he realised and only released Steven/Marc it seems from servitude, but Jake gets to stick around and be Moon Knight and do Khonshu's dirty work. Very crafty of Khonshu, major dick move but that's to be expected. Jake is clearly the more violent and aggressive personality, either born out of Marc's rage at his circumstances or maybe he was the one who actually took the beatings from his mother? Would explain why Steven doesn't remember the violence and saw his mum in a positive light when he was meant to be the personality who took the beatings for Marc. Who knows, hopefully they explore that in season 2. Rather than there being a major villain to fight like Ammit/Harrow maybe the conflict is personal and smaller? Dealing with Jake's rage and remaining the Moon Knight whilst combating a smaller foe like Bushman (who was name-dropped in episode 4 or 5 I think)? I'd watch it. Bring in more Egyptian gods reeling from Ammit's awakening + Gorr's massacre in Thor: Love and Thunder for some additional razzle-dazzle and we are good to go I think!

My new MCU TV rankings:
  1. Moon Knight - awesome character, great supporting cast, had good character development and Oscar Isaac is incredible
  2. The Falcon & The Winter Solder - made me like Sam/Bucky way more, Zemo was awesome, I liked the whole debate on the implications of being a super soldier and Captain America BUT the Flag-Smashers were not the most exciting villains out there
  3. Hawkeye - we stan Kate Bishop, Yelena & Jack, loved seeing Clint deal with his past/Natasha's death and they brought back Kingpin BUT the villains weren't that big a deal and I think things could've been done a little bit better
  4. Loki - Tom Hiddleston nails it, the Loki/Mobius dynamic was great, enjoyed seeing He Who Remains and the last couple of episodes were dope BUT selfcest is weird (even if I understand it's about Loki learning to love himself) and I just thought the show started a bit slow?
  5. Wandavision - again we stan Wanda and Vision, Agatha was a funky villain, loved that they brought back Jimmy Woo and Darcy (I'm so-so on Monica) and each episode representing a different TV era/decade was awesome BUT it was so slow and honestly the first few episodes were really boring for me? Also Ralph Bohner should never have been a thing.
  6. What If? - Strange Supreme is busted, we love Captain Carter / Star-Lord T'Challa / Ultron-Vision and some of the episodes had funky concepts BUT I'm not a huge fan of the art-style and feel 50/50 on the importance of the show in the wider MCU (on one hand, it's nice to have a show not tied to MCU canon or be a required watch for full understanding! On the other hand, we have Strange Supreme who's actually Supreme Strange and a Captain Carter who's not one we've encountered before in Doctor Strange 2 and that feels weird to me personally, but not a major deal), plus some episodes were just a drag (episodes 3, 5, 6, 7 and honestly kind-of 8?)
 

Locormus

Can we please get the older, old forum back?
Just throwing this out there.

I just came back from DoctorStrange2.

Without spoiling anything: They went and fcking did it. WOW!
 

Zoruagible

Lover of underrated characters
The finale was awesome, Layla becoming a temporary avatar was unexpected and cool. I wasn't necessarily a fan of them skipping over Jake beating Harrow but at least they showed him off, as soon as the post credits started I knew it had to be him collecting Harrow.

There's obviously going to be a season 2, they're just waiting for the emmys to be over.
And now the long wait for Obi-Wan begins!
 

Ishiftyounot

The Meme Supreme
I have now seen Doctor Strange 2! Funny story about that, I'm actually going to end up watching it 3 times - today, Sunday with my family and Tuesday with a friend. Even funnier is that I'm actually glad I'm doing so because I don't know how I feel about this movie?

Multiverse of Madness is both really good and really disappointing, and I think my main disappointment is in how they treat Wanda as a villain. Not in the sense that she is one, but in that it kind-of comes out of nowhere? I watched Wandavision and if I remember right it ends with Wanda with the Darkhold doing sinister magical stuff, which does set her up for less-than-heroic behaviour going forward. But by the time she interacts with Strange suddenly she's full-blown villain prepared to slaughter everyone to reach America Chavez, having already sent Gargantos to go kidnap her I believe. It's a bit of a disconnect for me. I understand the Darkhold corrupts, but I would've liked to have seen it corrupt more? Show her being tormented by her dreams of her kids with the Darkhold playing on her desire to see them again to push her towards villainy, not suddenly be like "oh yeah I know about the new kid, I'm going to kill all of you to get her now". Some build-up would be appreciated!

I'm also a bit iffy on Strange being so chill to use the Darkhold - I didn't feel any particular emotional weight to the act of corrupting himself to save Chavez and doing another "there is no other way" conclusion, especially since we just watched Wanda be corrupted by it (kind-of out of nowhere) and Supreme Strange (not to be confused with What If?'s Strange Supreme) having been corrupted enough to have a third eye. He just was like "yeah time to use the book of the damned, cool" which felt a bit disjointed to me? I'll come back to this thought when I watch it again on Sunday.

I have mixed feelings about the Illuminati and I think my main issue there is that they were underused, and a few more scenes with them would really flesh out what it is they're meant to do in the movie. My interpretation is that they're there to show Strange what he could become if he goes down a similar path as Wanda - either corrupted and borderline beyond saving, or even more egotistical and believing they know best about all matters. They also act as a secondary obstacle to Wanda's goal and allow her to show off her powers against some different foes rather than purely magical ones. They're lacking in both, in my opinion - I would have loved a scene of them discussing Strange-616 and what to do with him to show off how egotistical (for lack of a better word) they are in thinking their way is the only way (a trait shared by Strange across all timelines it seems) and I would've loved to see them all put up slightly more of a fight versus Wanda. Mordo was also a disappointment - a throwaway line about MCU Mordo trying to kill Strange which we haven't seen? Seriously? Makes me wish the rumour Wanda killed him in the opening scene had happened.

I liked the Illuminati aside from that though - I kept up to date with the "leaks" about which cameos we were getting (which included Superior Iron-Man played by Tom Cruise, Deadpool and Balder the Brave played by Bruce Campbell) but I loved the ones we got and I'm not upset we didn't get anyone else - seems like they're saving the big cameos for Secret Wars. John Krasinski as Mr. Fantastic is fan-casting that works, and I think it's great that Anson Mount got to come back as Black Bolt! This movie brought the Inhumans, Fantastic Four and the X Men to the MCU for the first time, incredible. Also Hayley Atwell as Captain Carter is my dream woman and I hope she gets a Disney+ show or a movie! Lashana Lynch as Captain Marvel is also a surprisingly good match, she was very arrogant which I didn't like (which is good, she was meant to be unlikeable) so that rocked.

The mid-credits scene and the ending had me feeling a bit meh? Charlize Theron is perfect casting for Clea so excited to see her, but the movie ended on the "Strange is corrupted by the Darkhold and has a third eye" thing which I feel the mid-credits took away from. Would've liked one or the other, personally. No comment on the end-credit scene because I didn't stick around for it (had to catch a train) but will give my thoughts on Sunday if I remember!

What did I like? Wanda was absolutely terrifying and I loved it, especially her rampaging against the Illuminati. Would've liked a scene about her being pissed they were using Ultron robots but can't have everything. She was so powerful and so scary and I need more, Elizabeth Olsen nailed it! So did ol' Cumberbatch, he's so good as all variants of Strange and did an amazing job! Wong was great too, we love Wong. Magic seemed way cooler in this than it did in any other movie besides Infinity War (which this is on par with, just about) which was good because it was so boring in the original Doctor Strange. I loved that the Strange vs. Strange battle used music given their connection to it throughout both movies? Rachel McAdams was amazing and honestly deserves a bigger role in the MCU other than Christine, but alas. America Chavez was cool, I liked what she added to the movie and thought she was fun? Didn't think the speech at the end from Strange to her was that bad (everyone was moaning about it online) either.

Overall, good movie, has a few issues I need to rewatch to figure out (the Illuminati, the ending, Strange using the Darkhold, Wanda's motivations) but otherwise a solid outing. Not as good as No Way Home, on par with Shang-Chi only because I adore Strange and Wanda so much, better than Eternals. Moon Knight was better overall too.
 
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