May 6th: PM2019 109 - VS Kibana! A Fight with Masters Eight on the Line!!

[Locormus]

As Locormus said, it's virtually impossible for this to happen now. This is insane, OTT irrationality.

Imagine people getting upset because Infernape could take an L so that Torterra and Gliscor could get some love.. and saying that he'll end up as a 'turbojobber'.

But honestly, saying it will start jobbing at this point of the series is nonsensical. If anything, this may be Gengar's last chance to Gmax and rack up a win or two?

 

[Blood Red]

Lets see, Dragonite already beat a Mega Evolution and a regional champions ace.

If you think it's going to be a "turbo-jobber", then that's simply your skewed perception.

If anything, it's likely Dragonite is taking an L so that Gengar (the one that has historically taken L's so that others could shine) can get a win or two with Max Hailstorm being a critical aspect.

Gengar getting wins over Dragonite has been a long time coming.

As Locormus said, it's virtually impossible for this to happen now. This is insane, OTT irrationality.

Imagine people getting upset because Infernape could take an L so that Torterra and Gliscor could get some love.. and saying that he'll end up as a 'turbojobber'.

But honestly, saying it will start jobbing at this point of the series is nonsensical. If anything, this may be Gengar's last chance to Gmax and rack up a win or two?

'Wow, I can't believe people think a Pokémon with a previously good track record can start jobbing for the sake of other Pokémon!'

Yeah...no. With how Pokémon has historically handled some of Ash's team members, I don't see how I can be blamed for thinking this is might be 'it' for Dragonite. Being pessimistic about certain Pokémon has helped me in the past, because my worst fears usually end up coming true.

 

[Yuugis Black Magician]

The anime hires a lot of female staff and Omode's a veteran Pokéani writer, so this isn't exactly new territory for the series.

I'm aware. The women typically write the episodes for the female characters (which they ought to), not so much the big plot episodes for the male characters, hence why I'm looking forward to it.

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

If anything, it's likely Dragonite is taking an L so that Gengar (the one that has historically taken L's so that others could shine) can get a win or two with Max Hailstorm being a critical aspect.

Gengar getting wins over Dragonite has been a long time coming.

Imagine looking less impressive than this Gengar.

 

[Morax]

I'm aware. The women typically write the episodes for the female characters (which they ought to), not so much the big plot episodes for the male characters, hence why I'm looking forward to it.

Josei would be more your thing.

 

[TheNewGuy]

'Wow, I can't believe people think a Pokémon with a previously good track record can start jobbing for the sake of other Pokémon!'

Yeah...no. With how Pokémon has historically handled some of Ash's team members, I don't see how I can be blamed for thinking this is might be 'it' for Dragonite. Being pessimistic about certain Pokémon has helped me in the past, because my worst fears usually end up coming true.

Sorry, but that first paragraph whitewashes the bizarre stuff you have been saying until this point.

 

[Blood Red]

Sorry, but that first paragraph whitewashes the bizarre stuff you have been saying until this point.

Sure, let's just pretend that Dragonite, with its three wins in more than 100 episodes (out of which one Pokémon was already weakened, and the other is still questioned by some people) makes it completely immune to becoming a jobber later on. 'Bizarre stuff', as if this anime doesn't have a horrible track record with some of its Pokémon (Gengar being one of them, in fact).

Seriously, get real; there's plenty reason to be pessimistic, especially when a Pokémon's first battle in 40 episodes is a complete no-win wipe.

 

[Feelitstill23]

if ash wins the PWC 50/50 chance, it’s not the end for him.

 

[Sham]

Dang Sirfetch'd doesn’t exist

 

[Yuugis Black Magician]

Josei would be more your thing.

I've been watching and reading various types of animation and comics since 1997, I am well aware of the existence of josei and do read it. That being said: the idea that children's cartoons (especially those aimed at boys) must be written solely by men is something I believe to be extremely faulty and tends to lead to misogyny. Men can learn from women, too, and as such I will continue to advocate for decisions like the one to tell a boy's stories through the pen of a woman.

 

[SerGoldenhandtheJust]

They are definitely having Dragonite job to sell the intensity and stakes of the match, considering he is Ash's unbeaten Ace and always is the class breaker, they are subverting expectations by having him actually go down without a win in the final class promotion match
It's a point meant to say 'Oh ****, Raihan is no joke and Ash is seriously screwed' as well as lending credence to Raihan's insane strength

 

[Rikerran]

They are definitely having Dragonite job to sell the intensity and stakes of the match, considering he is Ash's unbeaten Ace and always is the class breaker, they are subverting expectations by having him actually go down without a win in the final class promotion match
It's a point meant to say 'Oh ****, Raihan is no joke and Ash is seriously screwed' as well as lending credence to Raihan's insane strength

I just hope to God Gengar beats Flygon after. Seeing Lucario beat 3 pokemon in a row especially in the final battle before Master Class would be odd. What's the point of a team if only one pokemon gets the job done.

I know Lucario will beat Goodra and Duraldon but Gengar needs to get Flygon

 

[Locormus]

Sure, let's just pretend that Dragonite, with its three wins in more than 100 episodes (out of which one Pokémon was already weakened, and the other is still questioned by some people) makes it completely immune to becoming a jobber later on. 'Bizarre stuff', as if this anime doesn't have a horrible track record with some of its Pokémon (Gengar being one of them, in fact).

Seriously, get real; there's plenty reason to be pessimistic, especially when a Pokémon's first battle in 40 episodes is a complete no-win wipe.

"Get real"? Seriously? You're entitled to your pessimistic worldview - but don't suppose many are eager to join you.

You've repeatedly brought up Goodra as a comparison of a pseudo 'gone jobber'. Here's the key difference: Goodra was only put on Ash's team to raise the stakes for Ash vs. Clemont. Despite the hype of Ash owning a fully evolved pseudo, Ash's particular Goodra wasn't made out to be all that, being young and not really accustomed to battles - it barely even managed to beat Clemont's Luxray. If you had expectations of it carrying much of Ash's battles in the Kalos League, then I don't know what to say. Gliscor had a similar one-and-done situation when it came back out of training. Dragonite has been here since the beginning - and has repeatedly received good battles and results.

What have we seen in the past couple of fights? A win for Gengar, Sirfetch'd and Dracovish. Those are there for one reason: for us to say 'well, at least Gengar won against Marley and Raihan'/Sirfetch'd and Dracovish had a win against Drasna - so it's okay if Pikachu, Dragonite and Lucario step up again during the Master 8'.

Point being: Ash's B-tier Journey's Pokemon are getting their arguably last chance to shine before Pikachu, Dragonite and Lucario get their moments against Cynthia, Leon and whoever is Ash's first round opponent (probably Lance).

That being said. I'll give you Torterra as a carrier-gone-jobber. That situation was irredeemable. Yes, it carried Ash as a Turtwig in the early stages of Sinnoh (read, pre-Buizel/Chimchar), looked promising as a Grotle - with hints that it might turn its speed-issue around with a nice bit of development, even had a unique mode of attack with swallowing EnergyBall.. and then Torterra happened and nothing except an attempt at Bertha's Hippowdon and a wash against Volkner and Paul. That however, isn't comparable to Dragonite's situation - at all - as there's no reason to assume that Dragonite has hit a problem while on Ash's team (like Torterra's slowness).

 

[ShadowForce720]

I just hope to God Gengar beats Flygon after. Seeing Lucario beat 3 pokemon in a row especially in the final battle before Master Class would be odd. What's the point of a team if only one pokemon gets the job done.

I know Lucario will beat Goodra and Duraldon but Gengar needs to get Flygon

It’s not guaranteed that Lucario will be the one to take out Goodra as it could easily be the case that Gengar takes out both Flygon and Goodra while Lucario takes out Duraludon.

 

[SerGoldenhandtheJust]

It’s not guaranteed that Lucario will be the one to take out Goodra as it could easily be the case that Gengar takes out both Flygon and Goodra while Lucario takes out Duraludon.

I really hope that happens instead

 

[Power Up]

Misogyny is the least of the show's problems right now. I'd like competent writing in battles. Good thing is that Omode wrote the Sawyer vs Ash Kalos League battle, which besides the opening episode and a couple other things, was one of the few wholly good things about that League so there's some hope.

 

[Blood Red]

I've been watching and reading various types of animation and comics since 1997, I am well aware of the existence of josei and do read it. That being said: the idea that children's cartoons (especially those aimed at boys) must be written solely by men is something I believe to be extremely faulty and tends to lead to misogyny. Men can learn from women, too, and as such I will continue to advocate for decisions like the one to tell a boy's stories through the pen of a woman.

lmao this is hardly a revolutionary concept, and one that Pokémon isn't even the best example of; Fullmetal Alchemist, one of the most beloved shonen series ever, was written entirely by a woman.

"Get real"? Seriously? You're entitled to your pessimistic worldview - but don't suppose many are eager to join you.

You've repeatedly brought up Goodra as a comparison of a pseudo 'gone jobber'. Here's the key difference: Goodra was only put on Ash's team to raise the stakes for Ash vs. Clemont. Despite the hype of Ash owning a fully evolved pseudo, Ash's particular Goodra wasn't made out to be all that, being young and not really accustomed to battles - it barely even managed to beat Clemont's Luxray. If you had expectations of it carrying much of Ash's battles in the Kalos League, then I don't know what to say. Gliscor had a similar one-and-done situation when it came back out of training. Dragonite has been here since the beginning - and has repeatedly received good battles and results.

What have we seen in the past couple of fights? A win for Gengar, Sirfetch'd and Dracovish. Those are there for one reason: for us to say 'well, at least Gengar won against Marley and Raihan'/Sirfetch'd and Dracovish had a win against Drasna - so it's okay if Pikachu, Dragonite and Lucario step up again during the Master 8'.

Point being: Ash's B-tier Journey's Pokemon are getting their arguably last chance to shine before Pikachu, Dragonite and Lucario get their moments against Cynthia, Leon and whoever is Ash's first round opponent (probably Lance).

That being said. I'll give you Torterra as a carrier-gone-jobber. That situation was irredeemable. Yes, it carried Ash as a Turtwig in the early stages of Sinnoh (read, pre-Buizel/Chimchar), looked promising as a Grotle - with hints that it might turn its speed-issue around with a nice bit of development, even had a unique mode of attack with swallowing EnergyBall.. and then Torterra happened and nothing except an attempt at Bertha's Hippowdon and a wash against Volkner and Paul. That however, isn't comparable to Dragonite's situation - at all - as there's no reason to assume that Dragonite has hit a problem while on Ash's team (like Torterra's slowness).

Again, I don't know why we're pretending Dragonite has a 'stellar' battle record when the only reason it even HAS it is because it barely battles. This is its first fight in ages, and it's coming back to lose. Horribly.

 

[Ragnarok4]

Omode wrote the second best 1v1 in anime history, Greninja vs Sawyer. So yall shouldn't worry about this battle. I love how Omode has Lucario in his hands 6 years after Greninja and that both are so similar, good decision Tomiyasu.

(the best 1vs 1 is Pikachu vs Tapu Koko and I don't count Infernape v Electivire because that was 1 vs 3)

 

[Master Pikachu 11]

It’s not guaranteed that Lucario will be the one to take out Goodra as it could easily be the case that Gengar takes out both Flygon and Goodra while Lucario takes out Duraludon.

That’s my prediction as well because it is something that most people would not see coming

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

Ash's Goodra was a strange beast with a lot of potential that it evolved every single focus episode it got and even cheated the weather evolution part while remaining with no losses until it returned and could barely deal with a Slurpuff because it literally got no training whatsoever.

Misogyny is the least of the show's problems right now. I'd like competent writing in battles. Good thing is that Omode wrote the Sawyer vs Ash Kalos League battle, which besides the opening episode and a couple other things, was one of the few wholly good things about that League so there's some hope.

Only grating thing about that battle was how everyone treated Sawyer like this very dangerous trainer but not Ash just because Ash had a brain fart that let Sawyer win. Even Diantha vouched for Sawyer, despite getting cornered by Ash herself.