Moment of Lumiose Truth! (870)

[Rohanator]

What Heliolisk survives a super effective STAB High Jump Kick anyway? None I tell you.

Anyway, initially I wanted there to be one more clash after Goodra's Bide hit Luxray but I changed my mind. I just love that moment where Ash is like "I want this to last as well.......but Imma still take that badge LOL DESTROY HIIM"

 

[Lord Trollbias]

It was one Iron Tail, Bunnelby got hit once. I have no idea why Quick Attack was counted when it was a mere callback to their first battle, the real battle began when Bunnelby used Wild Charge. So yeah, it basically got one-shotted since Pikachu beat it in one blow.

Lol a hit doesn't count now? Please. Quick Attack, a direct Iron Tail, an Iron Tail while Bunnelby was using Dig (and before you say that doesn't count I suggest you go watch Ash vs. Volkner because Luxray wrecked Infernape by doing that, pushing it to the point of Blaze), and recoil which was clearly stated by Limone/Meyer.

He didn't switch tactics, he decide to "improvise" which was basically him mimicking Ash's style of battling instead of doing something creative of his own. So the narrative was basically telling me that Clemont right to the end had to once again copy and emulate Ash if he wanted to succeeded, but the problem is no one can out Ash Ash himself and Clemont and Ash knew Clemont was going to lose at the end. The battle was a lost cause from Clemont's end once Rain Dance fixed the field and Goodra's Paralysis.

When tactics end up not working people tend to improvise. Just because Ash isn't a tactician doesn't mean he suddenly owns the copyright to improvising in a battle.

 

[Emperor Empoleon]

If that's legit...Clemont being a Gym Leader mimicking his challenger [that he looks up to no less] when his own chips are down is a little depressing for a character whose arc deals with confidence and self esteem :/

I mean he already got styled on. lol. Let the man fall with pride.

 

[Rohanator]

If that's legit...Clemont being a Gym Leader mimicking his challenger [that he looks up to no less] when his own chips are down is a little depressing for a character whose arc deals with confidence and self esteem :/

I mean he already got styled on. lol. Let the man fall with pride.

Nothing stated that he was specifically mimicking Ash. It's just that his pre-made plan failed so he had to improvise at Luxray VS Goodra. What are you supposed to do in that situation, just give up?

And in the end he said to Ash that "A fighter like you needs a calm type like me by his side" so clearly he's not feeling bad about himself nor does he think he should become like Ash.

 

[Soniman]

It was one Iron Tail, Bunnelby got hit once. I have no idea why Quick Attack was counted when it was a mere callback to their first battle, the real battle began when Bunnelby used Wild Charge. So yeah, it basically got one-shotted since Pikachu beat it in one blow.

I really dont understand why you're ignoring basic, facts here. Yes it was a callback to their first battle but it WAS STILL A PART OF THE BATTLE.

If you're going to complain about Bunnelby was treated then take everything that actually happened into account, don't just pick and choose the bits that help your arguement and outright ignore the ones that dont, that's not fair at all.

Aso Helioisk got hit with TWO super effective attakcs, I guess two = one now?

 

[phanpycross]

Improvise = attacking a pokemon using bide.

For some reason that makes luxray vs. Goodra a better battle for me, since it wasnt as much bad writing as Clemont simply panicking and doing the wrong thing.

 

[Soniman]

Improvise = attacking a pokemon using bide.

For some reason that makes luxray vs. Goodra a better battle for me, since it wasnt as much bad writing as Clemont simply panicking and doing the wrong thing.

Honestly with the state Goodra was in after using Bide, I think Clemont was just betting on Luxray's power being enough to overpower it, nad it almost worked to.

 

[phanpycross]

Honestly with the state Goodra was in after using Bide, I think Clemont was just betting on Luxray's power being enough to overpower it, nad it almost worked to.

Yup, that was actually what was stated, and the confidence he stated it with actually made the battle exciting, since it basically became a rush for bide to activate before goodra could fall.

 

[Rohanator]

Honestly, there's kinda no way to play around Bide in the anime unless the Mon knows crippling status moves. You can't just sit there and wait for the "turns" to pass. And even if Clemont set up a new Electric Terrain before attacking Ash could just switch up to Rain Dance and that's a cycle I'm sure the animators would rather avoid. As stated betting on Luxray's power was all he could really do.

 

[WaterShuriken]

It was one Iron Tail, Bunnelby got hit once. I have no idea why Quick Attack was counted when it was a mere callback to their first battle, the real battle began when Bunnelby used Wild Charge. So yeah, it basically got one-shotted since Pikachu beat it in one blow.

Uhh no.

Using that logic the first Dig, and the Double Slap didn't count against Pikachu as well.

So the damage "counted" would have been

Bunnelby : Wild Charge recoil, underground Iron Tail, Iron Tail
Pikachu: Wild Charge, Dig

Don't let Clemont being your favorite character cloud the obvious.

 

[Rohanator]

You also gotta consider that getting slammed into the ground (Bunnelby) or getting smashed into a wall (Heliolisk) also deals damage. This ain't the games.
Having the ground smashed while you're digging probably hurts too.

 

[Dephender]

I watched the battle with the Spanish subs and something I found interesting was that Ash said right before Goodra launched Bide that "he had already won the badge." Has Ash ever been that confident in a Gym Battle before?

Subs aren't always accurate.

And if that translation is, then no I don't think he has.

It's not accurate. The Spanish fan translations are terrible, please don't watch them and definitely don't quote them or base any opinions of them, or run the risk of getting your posts deleted for being misleading.

 

[Blue Saturday]

If that's legit...Clemont being a Gym Leader mimicking his challenger [that he looks up to no less] when his own chips are down is a little depressing for a character whose arc deals with confidence and self esteem :/

I mean he already got styled on. lol. Let the man fall with pride.

Pretty much my sentiments unfortunately :/ Don't kick him while he's down.

Lol a hit doesn't count now? Please. Quick Attack, a direct Iron Tail, an Iron Tail while Bunnelby was using Dig (and before you say that doesn't count I suggest you go watch Ash vs. Volkner because Luxray wrecked Infernape by doing that, pushing it to the point of Blaze), and recoil which was clearly stated by Limone/Meyer.

It got flushed out of the hole but Ash finished it with one Iron Tail.

I really dont understand why you're ignoring basic, facts here. Yes it was a callback to their first battle but it WAS STILL A PART OF THE BATTLE.

If you're going to complain about Bunnelby was treated then take everything that actually happened into account, don't just pick and choose the bits that help your arguement and outright ignore the ones that dont, that's not fair at all.

Aso Helioisk got hit with TWO super effective attakcs, I guess two = one now?

It got one-shotted because Meyer said it was fully health after using Parabolic Charge, so Karate Chop's damage was voided. So, yep, one-shot.

Uhh no.

Using that logic the first Dig, and the Double Slap didn't count against Pikachu as well.

So the damage "counted" would have been

Bunnelby : Wild Charge recoil, underground Iron Tail, Iron Tail
Pikachu: Wild Charge, Dig

Don't let Clemont being your favorite character cloud the obvious.

It was one Iron Tail, try again. The fact remains it got smashed in one-shot, the writers treated it as "the real battle beginning" with Wild Charge. Ash ended things so easily Clemont might as well have thrown the battle himself. If we're counting that pre-battle hype from XY001 than it's even more BS Pikachu survived an array of Super Effective Attacks and other attacks from the rabbit. But honestly, I'm not really that concerned about Clemont's character much anymore, fave or not. I'm fully expecting him to fade into the background again and be used as fodder.

Sometimes I wonder if fans care much at all about other characters, as long as we're getting a "competent" Ash it's okay to screw other characters it seems.

 

[Navin]

You do realize what a one shot is right? As in Bunnelby took 2 Iron Tails, a Quick Attack, AND recoil damage from Wild Charge, all while greatly damaging Pikachu in the process? A one shot that is not. Switching tactics when they get countered = worshiping now? Please. Only legitimate gripe in your comment is Heliolisk's KO.

Bunnelby was just as bad actually. In fact, that entire battle was not great because it simply copied the first one right up to the WC, and then Bunnelby lands a few hits, but Pikachu finishes it then with a single IT. The damage off the IT on the Dig can be minimal because it's unclear how fast Bunnelby was moving underground and at what depth the rabbit was tunneling. The early Quick Attack didn't seem to do much at all. Honestly, when the battle was supposed to "really start", which was the unveiling of the WC, Pikachu ended matters very quickly with an IT.

 

[Soniman]

Sometimes I wonder if fans care much at all about other characters, as long as we're getting a "competent" Ash it's okay to screw other characters it seems.

The irony is pretty strong here since you're the one who's been saying throughout this topic about how worthless Clemont is while others have been saying that he wasnt and he did a pretty good job when all's said and done, so I wouldnt be making wild acusations about the Ash fans here to try and prove a point

 

[Navin]

The irony is pretty strong here since you're the one who's been saying throughout this topic about how worthless Clemont is while others have been saying that he wasnt and he did a pretty good job when all's said and done, so I wouldnt be making wild acusations about the Ash fans here to try and prove a point

Yeah, it's not that Clemont sucked but more so what he did seemed irrelevant because Ash sort of E4 styled him.

 

[WaterShuriken]

It got one-shotted because Meyer said it was fully health after using Parabolic Charge, so Karate Chop's damage was voided. So, yep, one-shot.

That's not the case. Hawlucha took a Parabolic Charge so its health was down, Heliolisk already took a Karate Chop, and healed some damage. All Meyer said was that they are now even. That would mean they are about the same "HP" Hawlucha had.

It was one Iron Tail, try again. The fact remains it got smashed in one-shot, the writers treated it as "the real battle beginning" with Wild Charge.

It was a Quick Attack, Wild Charge recoil, underground Iron Tail, and Iron Tail. Try again.

 

[Rohanator]

Dayum. We got told. *waits for other people's replies*

 

[Dephender]

It got one-shotted because Meyer said it was fully health after using Parabolic Charge, so Karate Chop's damage was voided.

Where are you getting that nonsense from?

 

[Soniman]

Maybe because I'm not delusional, it's been most nothing but Clemont-lovers blatantly admitting how we know this gym was **** for him. We can't pretend it wasn't.

And the "clemont loves" have been doing nothing but give him **** even before this Gym but I digress.

*Ash rant*

Haha WOW sir, very classy of you. Yes because I didnt treat the Gym as a kick to the groin I (and others) must be gross Ash fanboys because we don't agree, god forbid anyone has legitmate reasons to LIKE the Gym, nope, we're fanboys because we don't agree with YOUR viewpoints right? Give me a break dude, I don't know why you must always DO this.

Don't go pretending like I have nothing bad to say about the Gym since the FIRST THING I said in the topic was that I didnt know how to feel about it. I didnt like Bunnelby shafting or the fact that Heliolisk didnt get a win but at the end of the day I thought it was a good match. Though i guess that's not good enough for you, I should've put Ash's head on a stake and complain about him constantly right? Sigh.

I know you really hate Ash and (from what I can tell) the people that like or enjoy his character but please dont default to "they disagree with me therefore they much be blinded Ash fanboys" every time someone doesnt agree with your viewpoints because its' honestly ****ing obnoxious