Most overrated character of all time!

[PorcelainVulpix]

Because that's the actual truth. SM Ash is a generic kids show character. You may have your own opinion but you need to back them up, which you didn't.
This discussion is not for this thread anyway.

I’ve backed up my opinion plenty of times in other threads, even in that thread in one of my replies. I’m just not going to keep going back and forth with a user like you who refuses to accept other people’s opinions. That’s not the “actual truth.” Dude not everyone is entitled to love XY the same way you do

 

[AznKei]

You are whining because XY didn't go according to what YOU wanted and SERENA wasn't handled according to what YOU wanted and SHE WAS Always dependent on Ash? (She wasn't)

LMAO this thread is hilarious.Everyone hates on XY when they didn't even watch the series to the end.
This is dumb.

Yeah, I was whining and I did something about it and moved on, unlike you who was whining about a whole series, claiming you represent the "majority" and still begging/depending the anime producers/writers to have it your way. At least I like to express what I dislike regardless what you think about it, but can accept the reality of the show.

 

[Sham]

Yeah, Serena relied on Ash to teach her all those Showcase moves! She couldn't win a single thing on her own because Ash did everything for her!

Actually she won through plot armor and when that didn’t happen she lost due to external forces that had nothing to do with her follow competitors. I don’t believe Ash taught her to throw fire and stone edge constantly and learn a new dance move magically within 24 hours js

Lmfao Ash didn’t do jack to get access to Infernape’s special Blaze. Heck Ash was actively against training Chimchar to tap into Blaze because of Chimchar’s mental state when going into that mode. Infernape just randomly mastered it 1 fine day against Volkner cuz ‘bond power’ without any active training for it on Ash’s part yet Ash had no problem exploiting special Blaze in the SL by having Infernape deliberately take Paul’s Electivire’s Thunder.

Compared to that Ash and Greninja actively trained and struggled in order to master the A-G form which frankly makes A-G’s power far more ‘earned’ than Infernape’s special blaze (and let’s be clear special blaze isn’t just Infernape’s default ability since while under Paul he activated blaze against Roark yet it was just normal blaze).

Actively believing and trusting someone is sometimes just as powerful as physical training. Ash was able to put his time and patience in Infernape and that was the reason he was able to master Blaze. Of course A-G had more physical training than Infernape because the latter actually involved his physical body. Infernape’s blaze was completely up to him and was about him handling his anger. It plays by the saying “you can only save yourself”. Ash could whatever “training” you thought he should be doing but it ultimately depended on Infernape and Ash’s love and support helped him get there. This doesn’t make A-G superior to Blaze by a long shot.

 

[J.Agera]

Yeah, I was whining and I did something about it and moved on, unlike you who was whining about a whole series, claiming you represent the "majority" and still begging/depending the anime producers/writers to have it your way. At least I like to express what I dislike regardless what you think about it, but can accept the reality of the show.

Lol when?
I have accepted that dropped the show already.

 

[AznKei]

Lol when?
I have accepted that dropped the show already.

I still watched the show casually as my sparetime, and even despite Ash constantly being there, I discuss about other things outside of him and Pikachu as well, just like my "writing reviews" about the recent episodes. Oh and why don't you drop the show then, since you complaints are louder than mine?

 

[Power Up]

Actually she won through plot armor and when that didn’t happen she lost due to external forces that had nothing to do with her follow competitors. I don’t believe Ash taught her to throw fire and stone edge constantly and learn a new dance move magically within 24 hours js


Actively believing and trusting someone is sometimes just as powerful as physical training. Ash was able to put his time and patience in Infernape and that was the reason he was able to master Blaze. Of course A-G had more physical training than Infernape because the latter actually involved his physical body. Infernape’s blaze was completely up to him and was about him handling his anger. It plays by the saying “you can only save yourself”. Ash could whatever “training” you thought he should be doing but it ultimately depended on Infernape and Ash’s love and support helped him get there. This doesn’t make A-G superior to Blaze by a long shot.

Considering the amount of work Ash had to put in with Greninja to master battle bond, I can safely say that battle bond is much superior to Blaze with a considerable amount of eps dedicated to improving Ash's bond with Greninja and mastering battle bond

 

[Sham]

Considering the amount of work Ash had to put in with Greninja to master battle bond, I can safely say that battle bond is much superior to Blaze with a considerable amount of eps dedicated to improving Ash's bond with Greninja and mastering battle bond

Ash invested emotional work into Infernape. He already knew Chimchar had “problems” and could of easily said “lol not my problem” and left him in Hearthome. Also the explanation for A-G was sloppy, which I can’t get behind because at that point it just seems like the writers were saying “we just gave him a power up because when can!”

 

[Kintaro]

Are people really arguing over whether DP/XY Ash helped Infernape or Greninja more? Can't we just agree he worked with both of them as hard as he could? I don't get this debate.

 

[Dragalge]

You, good sir are once again an inspiration for how members over here should strive to be. I’m perfectly fine with the stance that DP Ash was a more interesting character than XY Ash (I’d even agree especially when it concerns his interactions with Paul).

Aww thanks! I do like to not be in silly conflict and accept facts as they are! Do some facts seem a bit hard to accept at first? Sure. It can be hard. But if you pull through and pierce the heavens you will be happier as a result!

Besides having AG Ash as your favorite is the best camp to be in! Hardly talked about and we have muffins for days!

 

[Sham]

Are people really arguing over whether DP/XY Ash helped Infernape or Greninja more? Can't we just agree he worked with both of them as hard as he could? I don't get this debate.

I literally said in the post that I don’t think Ash physically training A-G more means it was superior to Infernape not that Blaze Infernape is better. Re-read the posts because I gave my reasons besides that why I prefer the latter.

 

[Power Up]

Ash invested emotional work into Infernape. He already knew Chimchar had “problems” and could of easily said “lol not my problem” and left him in Hearthome. Also the explanation for A-G was sloppy, which I can’t get behind because at this point it just seems like the writers are saying “we just gave him a power up because when can!”

Ash invested equal if not more emotional work in Greninja. He took episodes in understanding how Greninja ticked and was rewarded in a mastered battle bond. Ash understanding Greninja can be seen as far back as Froakie.

This of course came with obstacles and Ash faced and overcame them with Greninja and they both got a better understanding of each other.

Man, a good backstory is sloppy these days. Huh, going to explain what made it sloppy or are you just going to call it sloppy? Froakie was literally seen to be a different type of Pokemon from the beginning and this was consistently pushed throughout the series.

See 7th gym battle as a a key example of how how far back the backstory went and how well it was showcased. Their bond was something different

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

Greninja was Ash's closest thing to an Olympus Mon.

Who failed to take down something as plain as a modern Charizard.

Tight bonds my ***.

 

[Sham]

Ash invested equal if not more emotional work in Greninja. He took episodes in understanding how Greninja ticked and was rewarded in a mastered battle bond. Ash understanding Greninja can be seen as far back as Froakie.

This of course came with obstacles and Ash faced and overcame them with Greninja and they both got a better understanding of each other.

Man, a good backstory is sloppy these days. Huh, going to explain what made it sloppy or are you just going to call it sloppy? Froakie was literally seen to be a different type of Pokemon from the beginning and this was consistently pushed throughout the series.

See 7th gym battle as a a key example of how how far back the backstory went and how well it was showcased. Their bond was something different

Oh I’ve seen that episode. I have questions however. What made Froakie different? Why was Ash able to unlock this special form but not others? Do other Pokemon have battle bond? Is Battle Bond an ability or a mutation? Why have ever seen this ability on other Pokémon? Why is the trainer hurt alongside the Pokémon? Calling Froakie special and showing his egg doesn’t cut it. Anyway this is slowly turning into an entirely different debate. All I was arguing for was the validity of Blaze Infernape.

 

[Kintaro]

Greninja was Ash's closest thing to an Olympus Mon.

Who failed to take down something as plain as a modern Charizard.

Tight bonds my ***.

Alan's Mega Charizard was haxed and had plot armor.

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

Alan's Mega Charizard was haxed and had plot armor.

And he responded to Alain's heart.

His shaky, strangely ethically wrong heart.

 

[Power Up]

Oh I’ve seen that episode. I have questions however. What made Froakie different? Why was Ash able to unlock this special form but not others? Do other Pokemon have battle bond? Is Battle Bond an ability or a mutation? Why have ever seen this ability on other Pokémon? Why is the trainer hurt alongside the Pokémon?

This is pretty much what you get what you have people who don't pay attention...

Froakie was seen as different in the beginning since he would often leave his trainers and he preferred to train by himself than engage with other Froakie. He valued the trainer over everything and this is clearly seen

Seriously man, did you watch XY? He was able to unlock this form because he was different from the other trainers Froakie had and Froakie clearly saw that and chose him. Other trainers had problems Froakie saw. Ash was different. Their bond was different

No clue, this is never stated and it doesn't matter. Clear nitpick here. Maybe? How is this relevant? Not all Pokemon can Mega Evo either. Battle bond is simply the word I use to refer to the synchro. It's an ability in the games I guess?

Because Ash and Greninja's bond is different? It's never seen before and no one has it. It's unique, that's why it's important

I have to ask again, did you watch the show? Literally stated that since AG and Ash were highly syncronized, they would feel pain due to it with added benefits like Ash seeing through Greninja's eyes, etc...

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

Oh I’ve seen that episode. I have questions however. What made Froakie different? Why was Ash able to unlock this special form but not others? Do other Pokemon have battle bond? Is Battle Bond an ability or a mutation? Why have ever seen this ability on other Pokémon? Why is the trainer hurt alongside the Pokémon? Calling Froakie special and showing his egg doesn’t cut it. Anyway this is slowly turning into an entirely different debate. All I was arguing for was the validity of Blaze Infernape.

It's a bs powerup created for only Greninja to fare against Mega users

Alan's Mega Charizard was haxed and had plot armor.

So apparently the mega evolution specials didn't exist.Alain won fair and square.

 

[Genaller]

Actively believing and trusting someone is sometimes just as powerful as physical training. Ash was able to put his time and patience in Infernape and that was the reason he was able to master Blaze.

The point is none of that time was ever dedicated to mastering Blaze and Ash was explicitly against doing so due to the trauma it caused Chimchar. The issue is that Infernape even had to end up using special Blaze at all; through Ash’s love and trust in addition to his training Infernape should’ve been good enough to get the job done without the need for special Blaze and matter of fact that would have sent a far stronger message to Paul since it would show that Infernape’s true strength as a pokémon doesn’t come from special Blaze, but instead he’s bascially proven right in a sense since Ash actively exploited special Blaze in order to win the match by having Infernape deliberately take a point blank Thunder.

Of course A-G had more physical training than Infernape because the latter actually involved his physical body. Infernape’s blaze was completely up to him and was about him handling his anger. It plays by the saying “you can only save yourself”. Ash could whatever “training” you thought he should be doing but it ultimately depended on Infernape and Ash’s love and support helped him get there. This doesn’t make A-G superior to Blaze by a long shot.

Love and trust was also a large part of what allowed the A-G form to be mastered yet the key difference here is said love and trust was actively directed towards achieving said mastery yet it never was for special Blaze which yes in addition to the actual training does make A-G feel comparatively more ‘earned’.

To be clear the post I was responding to was undermining A-G for not being ‘earned’ while claiming Base Greninja to be worse than the other aces (which is false but that’s a separate issue), and my rebuttal was that if the A-G form isn’t worth being considered ‘earned’ than neither is special Blaze. I actually do think both were earned in a sense, but the A-G form gets more of a nod because Ash and Greninja were actively trying to master it.

 

[J.Agera]

This is pretty much what you get what you have people who don't pay attention...

Froakie was seen as different in the beginning since he would often leave his trainers and he preferred to train by himself than engage with other Froakie. He valued the trainer over everything and this is clearly seen

Seriously man, did you watch XY? He was able to unlock this form because he was different from the other trainers Froakie had and Froakie clearly saw that and chose him. Other trainers had problems Froakie saw. Ash was different. Their bond was different

No clue, this is never stated and it doesn't matter. Clear nitpick here. Maybe? How is this relevant? Not all Pokemon can Mega Evo either. Battle bond is simply the word I use to refer to the synchro. It's an ability in the games I guess?

Because Ash and Greninja's bond is different? It's never seen before and no one has it. It's unique, that's why it's important

I have to ask again, did you watch the show? Literally stated that since AG and Ash were highly syncronized, they would feel pain due to it with added benefits like Ash seeing through Greninja's eyes, etc...

Finally someone who noticed that people in this thread make it obvious that they didn't watch XY or didn't pay attention to it.

 

[J.Agera]

It's a bs powerup created for only Greninja to fare against Mega users

So apparently the mega evolution specials didn't exist.Alain won fair and square.

You seriously need to pay attention.
Ash and Greninja did lots of training to master it and there was an entire arc dedicated to it.
Writers said they didn't want Ash to have mega evolution so they created "Ash Greninja". You people seriously need to stop whining about. Writers did what they wanted with the story. It's the Anime, not the games.
As much as Alain was strong that large shuriken should have destroyed him. That's BS pulled by the writers to make him lose.