Muhammed and Pedophilia

[BigLutz]

Quite often children were promised at a young age and married at a young age. Though you are right to point out puberty happens at an earlier age for us, it still doesn't change that the practice of marrying prepubescent girls occurred and was common in that area pre-Islam.

Also, although we are experiencing puberty at earlier ages thanks to being pumped full of sweet chemicals, I would like to point out that back then more was expected of children at earlier ages in most cultures.

I wouldn't say that, again you get back to the word "Bloom" being used, including with Mohammad's followers marrying young girls. A 6 year old surely hasn't experienced puberty, nor has a 9 year old girl even today having done so. Again there would be no reason for them to have sex with a girl that young as they would be unable to carry a offspring for them, that is unless they just wanted to have sex with a child. Not to mention the physical damage it would do to a young girl's body at that age.

 

[SoulSilverMstr411]

Muslims LOVE? Give me a break. The whole relegion is built around hate and assimilation.

Mucs milsum.

 

[Yeul]

Even now, Irish travellers (also known as tinkers) marry girls as young as 11 (with the parents/court's blessing) in lavish ceremonies shown on TV and nobody gets done in for doing it. It was probably the same back then in Mecca, human standards'd probably be very low back then and such things wouldn't even warrant the batting of an eyelid.
Now it is wrong and we do have people (that aren't under the jurisdiction of the Catholic Church, of course) done in for fiddling with kiddies, but because life was so different back then we shouldn't impose our standards on something that can't be changed at all.

Do Muslims even give a fock about Muhammad having sexual contact (lol Jeremy Kyle) with a 6 year old girl?

 

[Snorunt conservationist]

but because life was so different back then we shouldn't impose our standards on something that can't be changed at all.

Why not? Muhammed set himself up as a moral authority and ultimately failed. Taking the paedophilia issue out of the question for a second, there is also the evident point to be made about the morality of Patriarchy. By having multiple wives and tying down girls at an early age, Muhammed actively helped encourage continued male dominance. I think it's ludicrous to just absolve him of this because it was "a long time ago".

 

[THRILLHO]

is this a serious thread

it just sounds like an excuse to insult muslims and the most important person in their faith

 

[Yeul]

Why not? Muhammed set himself up as a moral authority and ultimately failed. Taking the paedophilia issue out of the question for a second, there is also the evident point to be made about the morality of Patriarchy. By having multiple wives and tying down girls at an early age, Muhammed actively helped encourage continued male dominance. I think it's ludicrous to just absolve him of this because it was "a long time ago".

Man, and you said you wanted me to post more on these debates. :[

Considering the violence of Islam nowadays, I don't think we should push these issues even further on the Muslim community, who don't even tie down young girls and force them to marry into a polygamous relationship. What exactly would we achieve by doing such a thing, anyways?

 

[bel9]

I wouldn't say that, again you get back to the word "Bloom" being used, including with Mohammad's followers marrying young girls. A 6 year old surely hasn't experienced puberty, nor has a 9 year old girl even today having done so. Again there would be no reason for them to have sex with a girl that young as they would be unable to carry a offspring for them, that is unless they just wanted to have sex with a child. Not to mention the physical damage it would do to a young girl's body at that age.

Of course I am not debating the word bloom. I am merely pointing out that child marriages were common in that area. Although in general children did not hit puberty later, more was expected of them at earlier ages. Economically speaking within the context, a girl is worthless to a family unless you sell her and marry her off to someone of a higher class with money.

I daresay people should be more concerned with something happening now - the catholic church systematically shutting down anything that incriminates their followers for the molestation of young boys that has been going on over the last thirty years, where such an act has definitely been considered by the wider world as morally reprehensible.

Now can we consider focusing on the Catholic church instead, because their activities are wholly illegal if nothing else.

I made that point earlier. No one really seemed to care.

 

[BigLutz]

Of course I am not debating the word bloom. I am merely pointing out that child marriages were common in that area.

Well we need to define what was considered a child marriage back then, marrying off a kid at say age 6 would be considered a child marriage, marrying off a kid at the age of 11 or 12 like many of Mohammad's followers did, was not. Hell by some definition it wouldn't even be considered pedophilia, it would be considered Hebephilia. However what Mohammad did would be considered Pedophilia in any time frame, especially when you take into account that out of all his adult wives, he favored the child above the rest.

Although in general children did not hit puberty later, more was expected of them at earlier ages. Economically speaking within the context, a girl is worthless to a family unless you sell her and marry her off to someone of a higher class with money.

Yet all the same unless the person was a pedophile, the child would be useless to the person until they 'bloomed'. Especially since you are essentially adding another person to the household, with out any of the the benefits that come with a wife in that era ( cleaning, cooking, taking care of the kids, etc etc ). Remember that age was mainly spent training the child to be a good wife for when she did reach puberty.

 

[Fenix]

Internet atheists lol.

/thread .

 

[Calamity™]

Even if Muhammed's actions were normal due to the time he lived in, the fact that people still look up to him now is ludicrous. People are so blinded by religion...

 

[Razor Xtreme]

^ You clearly don't study other religions, you probably only repeat what you hear.

 

[Calamity™]

^ You clearly don't study other religions, you probably only repeat what you hear.

I know about other religions, but this is a thread that is discussing one. I would mention other religions if this was a thread that involved them. Besides, I'm not saying that one religion is messed up and the others aren't, I'm not a religious person for a reason...

 

[Yeul]

Even if Muhammed's actions were normal due to the time he lived in, the fact that people still look up to him now is ludicrous. People are so blinded by religion...

Well, for the time that he was alive he taught some pretty good values on love and peace, you could pretty much call him a Jesus that isn't born from God. But, because of that he was affected with humanity's flaws, and now look at the Islamic community's current state of disarray in places like Lebanon and organisations like Al-Qaeda ruining the prophet's name even more with their violence over Cielo knows what.
I'm not even a Muslim, but from what I learned of him he was a pretty cool guy who wanted to help the poor and misfortunate. Who wouldn't?

 

[BigLutz]

Well, for the time that he was alive he taught some pretty good values on love and peace, you could pretty much call him a Jesus that isn't born from God. But, because of that he was affected with humanity's flaws, and now look at the Islamic community's current state of disarray in places like Lebanon and organisations like Al-Qaeda ruining the prophet's name even more with their violence over Cielo knows what.
I'm not even a Muslim, but from what I learned of him he was a pretty cool guy who wanted to help the poor and misfortunate. Who wouldn't?

I like that, I tend to say he was a amazing person who was slowly corrupted by the harsh and evil nature of the Middle East as he went on. He went from a man of absolute peace, but found that the only way to spread his message was by the point of a sword.

 

[Yeul]

I like that, I tend to say he was a amazing person who was slowly corrupted by the harsh and evil nature of the Middle East as he went on. He went from a man of absolute peace, but found that the only way to spread his message was by the point of a sword.

The pen is mightier than the sword, but actions speak louder than words.

 

[Snorunt conservationist]

Man, and you said you wanted me to post more on these debates. :[

Just because I disagree doesn't mean I don't value.

Considering the violence of Islam nowadays, I don't think we should push these issues even further on the Muslim community, who don't even tie down young girls and force them to marry into a polygamous relationship. What exactly would we achieve by doing such a thing, anyways?

Again, I have to disagree incredibly strongly. These issues should be pushed onto these communities even harder, so that people can see the rather heinous views that lie behind them. We can't just pretend they don't exist.

Do you think women are anything close to being equal in the majority of the Arab world? Polygamy, social freedoms and so on are still far far below what they should be. At least part of this can be attributed to the Prophet being a polygamist.

I'm not even a Muslim, but from what I learned of him he was a pretty cool guy who wanted to help the poor and misfortunate. Who wouldn't?

There is of course the chance that his words were distorted, but I imagine you weren't taught about what happens to apostates in Islam (as discussed in the Hadith, assumed to be a collection of teachings either spoken or approved by Mohammad). They get killed.

 

[Sabconth]

Well, for the time that he was alive he taught some pretty good values on love and peace, you could pretty much call him a Jesus that isn't born from God.

Other than being considered prophets, I don't see much of a comparison.

Didn't Muhammed order assassinations? I don't remember Jesus ever doing a thing like that.

I think the difference between the 2 can be summed up like this:

Jesus stopped a woman from being stoned.

Muhammed organized stonings.

 

[Auraninja]

I would like to point out that though not to an equal status, Muhammad did raise the role of women in society, and with the founding religion, female infanticide, common in Pre-Muhammad Arabia, was now considered a crime.

 

[JoshYEAH]

It's like all the people in the world who are completely ignorant are converging into one place in this thread.

 

[THRILLHO]

Considering the violence of Islam nowadays

hng why do people generalise like this
islam isn't the problem, it's just a select few muslims
same applies to any monotheistic religion it seems