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Mutant Gummy Bears Are Taking Over The World!!![RMT]

Discussion in 'Older Gen RMT' started by Hi_Hi_Dude17601, Jun 19, 2007.

  1. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    I posted this a few weeks ago but I only one person gave me advice (thx Raikou77) so any more would be greatly appreciated.

    Anyway, this is my first attempt at a competitive team, so it might not be that great. I'm open to any suggestions, so please feel free to criticize it. Also, keep in mind that the first pokemon I post doesn’t necessarily mean it’s the one I send out first. and yes, I do realize its an OU team, but I’m not gunna change that, or I’d have to completely start over from scratch. Thx in advance people!!!

    ;248;
    1) Tyranitar @ Leftovers
    Sandstream
    252 Attack, 180 Speed, 76 HP
    Adamant
    ~ Earthquake
    ~ Dragon Dance
    ~ Taunt
    ~ Crunch

    My main Physical Sweeper. Your basic Dragon dance Set; Taunt, a few Dragon Dances, then sweep.


    ;350;
    2) Milotic @ Leftovers
    Miracle Scale
    212 HP, 176 Defense, 120 Special Attack
    Bold
    ~ Surf
    ~ Ice Beam
    ~ Rest
    ~ Sleep Talk

    I’m guessing that this guy is used as a Double Wall, so that’s how I’m planning on using him. He has superb special defense, and with the invested defense EVs and especially if his ability is activated, this girl can take some physical hits as well.


    ;242;
    3) Blissey @ Leftovers
    Natural Cure
    252 HP, 252 Def, 4 Special Defense
    Bold
    ~ Soft-boiled
    ~ Seismic Toss
    ~ Ice Beam
    ~ Aromatherapy

    My main Special Wall and Aromatherapist. Great Special Wall and Supporter too.

    ;468;
    4) Togekiss @ Leftovers
    Serene Grace
    252 Sp. Attack, 252 Speed, 6 HP
    Modest
    ~ Air Slash
    ~ Aura Sphere
    ~ Thunder Wave
    ~ Roost

    My main Special Sweeper. He might be on the slow side, but with TW support he can pull it off.


    ;477;
    5) Dusknoir @ ???
    Pressure
    252 HP, 76 Defense, 180 Special Defense
    Careful
    ~ Pain Split
    ~ Will-O-wisp
    ~ Thunder Punch / Fire Punch
    ~ Ice Punch / Fire Punch


    I want this guy to be my primary Physical Wall. I don't know which elemental punch i should get rid of, because people have told me i should have FP on him as a Hera Counter.

    ;464;
    6) Rhyperior @ ???
    Rock Solid
    Not sure, but with the boosted SP. Defense from the sandstorm i think i should put some EVs in Sp., Defense
    Adamant / Impish
    ~ Earthquake
    ~ Stone Edge
    ~ Swords Dance
    ~ Substitute / Megahorn / Avalanche

    Physical Sweeper / Wall. Also, due to Tyranitar's ability, this Physical Wall can take a few Special hits, or even serve as an emergency Special Wall if needed. I'm a bit indecisive on the last move though

    OR


    6) Infernape @ Life Orb / Expert Belt
    Blaze
    252 Speed, 129 Special Attack, 129 Attack
    Niave / Hasty
    ~ Close Combat
    ~ Flamethrower
    ~ Stone Edge
    ~ Grass Knot

    Mixed Sweeper "suicide" Infernape. He would also be my starter.


    For the last slot i'm leaning towards the Infernape because then i will have 1 Special Sweeper, 1 Physical Sweeper,

    Well, there's my team. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated, so thanks. = )
     
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2007
  2. Vanderzant

    Vanderzant Keeping it Real

    @ milotic - Are the 12 speed EV's on her there for a reason? Better off in another stat. Also, if you want a "wall" I'd probably max out hitpoints first (it boosts both defence against spec and non spec hits) then split the rest between the two defences. That much spA may also be unneccesary

    And for the last slot, they are all good pokemon, but I'd go with a suicide infernape (life orb)
     
  3. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    Remember that that EV spread was from the POTW thing and wut he says is that the 12 speed EVs are for outrunning things like DD tyranitars and such since around 201 is where they want to be to take advantage of the speed boost from DD. With the 12 EVs it will put Miltic's speed above that mark and give it the ability to attack first, hopefully seriously hurting / killing the opponent. Yeah i'm probably gunna go w/ the max HP and less Sp. attack (maybe somewhere around 50) but the point is with a base Sp defense of 135 and a base defense of 85 (or 80, not sure) so i should invest much more in Defense, but thanks alot for your advice.
     
  4. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    Bump?

    anybody else?
     
  5. Raikou77

    Raikou77 Well-Known Member

    It's not worth it. Give Milotic 212 HP / 176 Def / 120 Sp.Atk and Hypnosis > Mirror Coat

    Give Blissey Ice Beam > Thunderwave

    Give Togekiss 252 HP / 252 Sp.Atk and Thunderwave > Nasty Plot and maybe Wish > Roost

    Dusknoir should be Careful w/ 252 HP / 76 Def / 180 Sp.Def

    imo, use Rhyperior as the sixth slot. It works well with Togekiss and can be your physical wall I guess.
     
  6. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    damn i already started EV training my Milotic, but can i use that one berry to get rid of those speed EVs even if i already leveled her up after recieving those EVs?

    If i put Ice Beam on Blissey should i invest some Sp. Attack EVs or leave it how it is?

    Thx for the advice on Togekiss, i'll switch thunder Wave and Nasty Plot, but im going to leave Roost on him.

    Just a question that dusknoir nature / spread is geared towards a Special Wall, but with Blissey and Milotic already on my team, do u think its nessicary and if not do u think i should replace him for a special sweeper?

    I like the idea of Rhyperior, but then my only Special Sweeper will be Togekiss. do u think that could be a problem because if so i might switch Dusknoir out for a Special Sweeper.

    thx for the help!!!
     
  7. DMFG

    DMFG Aim for the horn!

    Oh, I deleted the bit where you listed your possibilities for your 6th poke. I think it's more useful if I list the things you need to deal with that your current 5 can't already, and you pick the 6th yourself.

    So, I'm going to assume you're going with a sp def Milotic for reasons I've outlined above (not that it matters here - even max HP and Def+ Milotic doesn't counter T-tar, Garchomp or CBMence anyway in sandstorm).

    To start with, the 3 pokes above are serious threats that you need to handle somehow. As Raikou77 mentions, Rhyperior is a good counter to T-tar and physical Mence, though it cannot stand up to Garchomp.

    Cress meanwhile will beat Garchomp and physical Mence but lose to T-tar.

    Gliscor is another option - with EQ/Ice Fang/Roost/SR it can handle all three reasonably well and give you a much needed SRer. You don't need AA as you still beat non-SD Hera with this set and you have Dusknoir for the SD ones.

    On the same principle, Hippo can do a similar job and also act as a backup SS starter if someone else starts messing around with weather.

    Metagross can give you issues if you go with any of these options though - it is one of the very few threats that phy def Milotic actually covers, but even then it can beat Milotic 1 on 1 thanks to Sandstorm. Watch out as CBgross's Meteor Mash will often 2HKO physical walls that don't resist it - Swampert will put an end to that as well as acting as a decent (if not completely ironcast) counter to the others as well.
     
  8. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    thx but if i go special with my dusknoir and milotic then including blissey i have 3 special walls and no physical walls. Which do u think i should get rid of then, and is there any way to make dusknoir a physical wall?

    thx alot 4 the help DMFG
     
  9. aquasuicune

    aquasuicune Well-Known Member

    OK, read this post and attempt to match it up with the correct pokemon.

    Milotic usually like the standard sleeptalker set with surf and ice beam.

    Your togekiss should be modest. I don't know if it was, but you don't have a nature for it.

    Blissey can also T-wave to help set up togekiss. If you use it, put it over ice beam.

    Keep dusknoir as careful. Burning halves their attack, so he always has a hypothetical defense of over 600.

    Specsmence is better than the physical version.

    Magmortar should be mild with cross chop.

    Physical salamence should have either a choice band or dragon dance. No roost.

    I really don't like your tyranitar being on the team. He's a great pokemon, but his sandstream never goes away, which really hurts the rest of your team. If you got rid of him, rhyperior would be a perfectly viable option. I like the impish resttalk version holding a life orb.
     
  10. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    thx aquaSuicune u helped alot. i probly will make milotic into a STalker, and then miracle scale hopefully will make it into a deccent Physical wall, despite DMFG's statistics.

    sorry, yes the togekiss was supposed to be modest, i just forgot to post it.

    i had thunderwave on bliss but switched it to ice beam incase a garchomp or dugtrio switched in on me, and then put TW on Togekiss to make up for it and make him fast enough to sweep.

    thanks for the advice about Tyranitar. I know his ability virtually negates all my team's lefties, but i love this guy and feel kinda torn between whether or not to ditch him. i was thinking maybe to partally resolve the problem is to wait and save him for late-game sweeping so he can set up DD more easily and not affect the rest of the team as much w/ his trait. I know i should probably get rid f him but i hate letting him go.

    thx alot 4 the help = )
     
  11. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    i editted my first post of my team, incorperating you guys' advice.

    [off topic] awesome i went up a rank
     
  12. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    bump (10charlimit)
     
  13. jolteonjak

    jolteonjak *swoons for Noland*

    I would probably suggest Rhyperior for your last slot so that you have a reliable Flying/Normal resist.
     
  14. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    yeah i think i am, and he can also be a back-up physical sweeper
     
  15. DMFG

    DMFG Aim for the horn!

    You still have no rock attack on T-tar and you still have no physical defence whatsoever. As I pointed out in my earlier post, Milotic does not stop any kind of powerful physical attacker, especially not with those EVs and doubly especially not in Sandstorm.

    If you want some physical defence there instead then switch out Milotic for someone else but don't use that set because it does nothing except take up a slot while gaining nothing.

    You still don't have a 6th member and what you have already still suffers from the same problems it had last time I saw it, so there's really nothing to gain from me rating this again because it will just be a copy/paste. Fix your team first.
     
  16. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    DMFG, i would put SE on Tyranitar, but then i would have it on 2 pokemon (Rhyperior) and no dark type moves. On the contrary, Milotic can wall Physically rather effectively, especially with the STalk set aquasuicune suggested, which boosts her defense by 1.5, and with Defense EVs, she should serve well as a double wall. Also Dusknoir after burning the opponant has plenty of defense, and Rhyperior who i just added also.

    i might switch Rhyperior for another sweeper, like maybe a mixed infernape, but i'm not sure. Right now my team has 4 walls, even tho Rhy could also be used as a phyical sweeper. Any1 have any input on whether or not i should switch him?
     
  17. DMFG

    DMFG Aim for the horn!

    Having a Rock move on Rhyperior isn't going to help T-tar when he needs to use a rock move himself.

    I'm not going to argue with you over whether Milotic can wall physical pokes, I'm just going to post some damage calcs.

    CBTar Stone Edge to 384/261 (your EVs) Milotic: 65-76%
    CBTar Crunch to 384/261 (your EVs) Milotic: 52-61% (always 2HKO in SS)

    CBMence Dragon Claw to 384/261 Milotic: 52-62%

    CBChomp's EQ to 384/261 Milotic: 58-68%
    CBChomp's Dragon Claw to 384/261 Milotic: 46-55% (almost always a 2HKO in SS)

    All the pokes mentioned outspeed your Milotic, so when you switch in you have to take at least 2 hits before you can move.

    Your Dusknoir still has Ice Punch and Thunderpunch and still cannot do anything to Heracross, who just batters you down with repeated attacks before starting on the rest of your team which, conveniently, he outspeeds every poke in. You can't burn him because that increases his attack instead of decreasing it.
     
  18. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    True Milotic can't switch in on those poke's, but remember, Milotic isn't my main physical wall. and besides, Milotic can switch in on most of those pokes if they arent carrying CB, adn if she can get a rest off, her defense will double, making Cbtar's SE and Crunch do 33-38% and 26-31%, CBMence dragon Claw 26-31%, CBChomp's EQ and dragon claw do 29-28% and 23-28% according 2 your numbers, and Milotic conveniantly has a supereffective attack for each of them.

    "Your Dusknoir still has Ice Punch and Thunderpunch and still cannot do anything to Heracross, who just batters you down with repeated attacks before starting on the rest of your team which, conveniently, he outspeeds every poke in. You can't burn him because that increases his attack instead of decreasing it."

    U r right about me being in need of a Hera counter. I could put Fire Punch on Dusknoir, but would putting an Infernape in instead of Rhyperior be better? He by far out-speeds hera, and with flamethrower/flare blitz, you'd have one burnt bug. Do u think that could work?
     
  19. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    sorry, i forgot the miracle scale only multiplies the defense by 1.5, not doubles it. But still that makes CBTar's SE and Crunch do 42-51%, CBMence's Dragon Claw do 35-42%, CBChomp's EQ and Dragon Claw do 39-45 and 31-37.
     
  20. Hi_Hi_Dude17601

    Hi_Hi_Dude17601 <--He's my bishie!!!

    Bump

    Any other suggestions?
     

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