New Pokemon Discussion Thread

[Fairy Queen]

So which of the Generation 7 pokemon will be the most popular in competitive battling?

Toxapex and Celesteela have both come forth as prominent pokemon this Gen, both for their ability to stall and take attacks like there is no tomorrow. Both will be OU, and not in the low tier. Specific counters to them will likely see places on team, for nothing than to counter them. Toxapex is not only incredibly bulky, but it has reliable recovery in the form of recover and regenerator, and is the best toxic spreader, period (with the exception of Salazzle). It can also be quite offensive, with a venoshock merciless combination. It also isn't completely walled by Steel types, because it can spread burns with Scald as well. It's typing is also very good. Celesteela is yet another bulky pokemon, with 97/103/101 and arguably the best defensive typing in the game. It is immune to poison (bar Salazzle) and burn has been nerfed. While it is set back by its lack of recovery, it does have access to the random leech seed, and has some great moves (Heavy Slam which almost always does max damage, Flamethrower, Giga Drain, Autotomize, Earthquake, etc). Very hard pokemon to take down without the right tools.

Pheromosa and Kartana will also see some great usage. Pheromosa is an alt Deoxys, but has several factors over it. It has a base 151 speed, which means it outspeeds almost all pokemon, especially the common speedsters, like Mega Alakazam, Mega Aerodactyl, Mega Beedrill, Deoxys, etc. Its base 137 attack stats means that it hits VERY hard, and access to powerful moves such as U-turn and High Jump kick mean it will dent anything that isn't immune or doubly resistant. It also has Rapid Spin and Quiver Dance, for what it is worth. It is, however, set back by its HORRIBLE defenses, but it is nonetheless a POWERFUL glasscannon. Kartana has one of the highest attack stats in the game and also has a respectable 109 base speed, which means it outspeeds a lot of pokemon. Beast Boost also works in its favor, by acting like Moxie, making it hit even more powerfully. Its typing is also really good, and it has high defense. It is, however, set back by its terrible special defense and HP.

Other popular pokemon include the Tapus and Minior.

 

[Ioneos]

Pheromosa is stupid broken. A lot of people are comparing it to Aegislash, but at least Aegi had some element of luck or strategy to KS and all of its movesets. Pmo just demolishes everything with U-turn. Surprised it hasn't been quick banned yet.

 

[Fairy Queen]

Pheromosa is stupid broken. A lot of people are comparing it to Aegislash, but at least Aegi had some element of luck or strategy to KS and all of its movesets. Pmo just demolishes everything with U-turn. Surprised it hasn't been quick banned yet.

Agreed. Also surprised Kartana hasn't been quick banned either. It has insane attack, above average speed, and essentially moxie.

 

[RedJirachi]

Imagine if Misty from the anime met Araquanid or Golisopod. With Surskit it doesn't stay a Bug/Water type at evolution, but with this I wonder what her reaction would be of her phobia crossed with her favorite

 

[Ophie]

UBs are allowed in VGC?

that seems weird to me, but i guess their lopsided stats do tend to make them vulnerable

although I thought gamefreak disallows based on in game status rather then their actual potential, they just tend to be highly correlated.

The Battle Royal and Battle Tree allow Ultra Beasts, which indicates to me that Game Freak designed them to compete with normal Pokémon. Unless some of them become overcentralizing (which I can imagine Pheromosa, Kartana, and Celesteela becoming), I don't think they're going to get banned in anything anytime soon. That being said, all three of the aforementioned Ultra Beasts have their own reliable and consistent counters, which I think will keep them in check. (Buzzwole, Xurkitree, and Guzzlord do not have such extreme counters, but they cannot ravage whole teams the way the aforementioned three can. As for Nihilego, I have no idea. My hunch says Nihilego is better equipped for double and triple battling than single battling, but I haven't looked too deep into Nihilego's potential yet.)

I'd also say that Ribombee has potential in double battling, as having what is essentially Heal Pulse and Bug Buzz on the same moveslot will be quite valuable, but at the same time, you also need to have a good eye for what your opponent will do, as Ribombee cannot take many hits. Of course, I am also the person insane enough to bring Pokémon like Masquerain and Vivillon into online double battling (not on the same team, mind you), so I consider every fully-evolved Pokémon to have potential--some are just more difficult to figure out or use than others. My initial impression is that Ribombee is good for controlling the swing of battle in an otherwise even match due to its very good Speed, but will need to rely on its partner to get rid of or at least weaken things that can potentially one-shot it. It works best with bulky and hard-hitting partners, with Pollen Puff meant for clean-up hitting and for healing its partner if you know Ribombee is not getting attacked that turn.

 

[pOlarizer]

Toxapex is definitely in the spotlight like how Ferrothorn was in Gen V. UBs are quite broken and are VGC legal. Tapus not quite as broken but Koko and Lele already has won some hearts.

My personal favourite is undoubtedly Golisopod which has good bulk, beastly attack and access to STAB priorities. Emergency Exit can be circumvented if it is the last pokemon in play. Otherwise, it can take a hit after an Aqua Jet and then let your less bulky sweeper come in safely.

 

[goodpeople25]

Imagine if Misty from the anime met Araquanid or Golisopod. With Surskit it doesn't stay a Bug/Water type at evolution, but with this I wonder what her reaction would be of her phobia crossed with her favorite

I don't know? How she was written to react most likely, but it is interesting to think about so here's my two cents.

I don't think the interaction of the two types really helps any, and probably outright hinders. The Bug type has pretty clear qualifications and characteristics (hint: it's in the name) and the water type in the cases so far dosen't tone those down at all (I'm struggling to think of an example so far that that does actually) and to me the water type to surskit and the wimpod line really just adds water dwelling (or environment, i dunno) to the Pokemon beyond the mechanics. The Dewpider line has the water bubble for a closer connection but it's still a bug beyond that. (Though the content of it's moon pokedex does have good potential for any possible stories of it winning her over imo.)

I think I might have overthought this though...

 

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Just found a Dewpider! This Mon looks dope! Also evolved my Pikepik a while ago. Absolutely love Trumbeak can't wait to see the final evo!

 

[Victreebong]

Pheromosa, all Tapus, Toxapex, Araquanid, Magearna, Celesteela are all sure bets (Pheromosa is on a timer for Ubers). All of them are A and above competitively, with very little opportunity cost compared to their spoils.

Runner ups are Xurkitree, Kommo-O, Mimikyu, and Minior, that will have OU presence, but will not be top contenders. Xurkitree is analogous to Thunderus-T, Mimikyu has Sturdy 2.0, Kommo-O is the Gen VII equivalent of Mega Garchomp, and Minior is the anti-Archeops.

All of this will change when Marshadow gets released. That Pokémon is a perfect 9000+/10. Unbeatable STAB, the best ability ever for it, glorious Speed and Attack, wicked resists, it has all the right tools in all the right places.

It is Infernape's rebound. It is the Brad Pitt + George Clooney + Paul Newman hybrid of Pokémon. If Hoopa Unbound and Pheromosa have your an*s concerned, Marshadow is going to blow competitively play farther open than Megamence, Aegi and GunkNinja ever did. You have been warned.

 

[Wryteous]

All of this will change when Marshadow gets released. That Pokémon is a perfect 9000+/10. Unbeatable STAB, the best ability ever for it, glorious Speed and Attack, wicked resists, it has all the right tools in all the right places.

It is Infernape's rebound. It is the Brad Pitt + George Clooney + Paul Newman hybrid of Pokémon. If Hoopa Unbound and Pheromosa have your an*s concerned, Marshadow is going to blow competitively play farther open than Megamence, Aegi and GunkNinja ever did. You have been warned.

I don't see what makes Marshadow a game-changer.
It does have great STAB Coverage. Along with an interesting signature move. But aside from close combat, jump kick and focus miss and their drawbacks. It lacks stronger moves to abuse by STAB. Along with decent but average defence.
Unless it runs Poison Jab I think many Fairies are going to easily wall it.

 

[BlitzGirl41]

I'm still having a tough time understanding why so many people seem to love Mareanie and Toxapex. Sure, it's one of the few new Water-types, it has Poison moves...but it's design is incredibly ugly. I can't even see its face/body/head as Toxapex because its legs are enormous. I'm the type of Pokemon player who is not competitive, and chooses Pokemon in my team based on appearance as well as typing and stats. Which is why I also don't want to touch Galisopod. It's strong, yes, but it's such an overly-designed Pokemon that doesn't look like it belongs in the Pokemon franchise. Super tiny head and enormous, overly-designed appendage-crazy body. And fighting Guzma's was a pain in the butt.

However, I fortunately have found enough Alolan Pokemon I like to make my team pretty much 100% Alolan. yes, I have an Alolan variant, but the rest have solid designs. I still think this gen has more pros than cons, and the Pokemon with ugly designs still are relatively a minority.

Sorry if I offended anyone who loves Galisopod and Toxapex's designs! I just really needed to vent after getting through the main story up until the E4. No harm meant, just expressing my personal dislike for these fictional 'Mons.

 

[XXD17]

I'm still having a tough time understanding why so many people seem to love Mareanie and Toxapex. Sure, it's one of the few new Water-types, it has Poison moves...but it's design is incredibly ugly. I can't even see its face/body/head as Toxapex because its legs are enormous. I'm the type of Pokemon player who is not competitive, and chooses Pokemon in my team based on appearance as well as typing and stats. Which is why I also don't want to touch Galisopod. It's strong, yes, but it's such an overly-designed Pokemon that doesn't look like it belongs in the Pokemon franchise. Super tiny head and enormous, overly-designed appendage-crazy body. And fighting Guzma's was a pain in the butt.

However, I fortunately have found enough Alolan Pokemon I like to make my team pretty much 100% Alolan. yes, I have an Alolan variant, but the rest have solid designs. I still think this gen has more pros than cons, and the Pokemon with ugly designs still are relatively a minority.

Sorry if I offended anyone who loves Galisopod and Toxapex's designs! I just really needed to vent after getting through the main story up until the E4. No harm meant, just expressing my personal dislike for these fictional 'Mons.

People like toxipex because of it competitive viability. That's probably 80% of the people that hype it. The other 20% are probably people that really appreciate it's design and lore. For me, although I really appreciate the lore, I thought nothing much about toxapex until I saw how good it is competitively. Mimikyu is the same way for me. Didn't care for it's design, but using it a ton for competitive...

 

[BlitzGirl41]

People like toxipex because of it competitive viability. That's probably 80% of the people that hype it. The other 20% are probably people that really appreciate it's design and lore. For me, although I really appreciate the lore, I thought nothing much about toxapex until I saw how good it is competitively. Mimikyu is the same way for me. Didn't care for it's design, but using it a ton for competitive...

It's a shame that there's such a divide between competitive and casual Pokemon fans, most noticeably in forums such as these. As a "casual", it makes it hard to relate to the Pokemon that are likable competitively, and I'm sure it's the same in reverse for competitive players.

 

[Ophie]

I'm still having a tough time understanding why so many people seem to love Mareanie and Toxapex. Sure, it's one of the few new Water-types, it has Poison moves...but it's design is incredibly ugly. I can't even see its face/body/head as Toxapex because its legs are enormous. I'm the type of Pokemon player who is not competitive, and chooses Pokemon in my team based on appearance as well as typing and stats. Which is why I also don't want to touch Galisopod. It's strong, yes, but it's such an overly-designed Pokemon that doesn't look like it belongs in the Pokemon franchise. Super tiny head and enormous, overly-designed appendage-crazy body. And fighting Guzma's was a pain in the butt.

However, I fortunately have found enough Alolan Pokemon I like to make my team pretty much 100% Alolan. yes, I have an Alolan variant, but the rest have solid designs. I still think this gen has more pros than cons, and the Pokemon with ugly designs still are relatively a minority.

Sorry if I offended anyone who loves Galisopod and Toxapex's designs! I just really needed to vent after getting through the main story up until the E4. No harm meant, just expressing my personal dislike for these fictional 'Mons.

I'm actually really liking Toxapex for its design, particularly that tiny body just hanging there. It's hilarious. That, and I like its basis of the crown-of-thorns starfish, capturing the cruel nature of that animal.

I'm afraid I'm going to see it everywhere though, causing me to get tired of it. It happened with Infernape in Generation IV, Reuniclus in Generation V, and Klefki in Generation VI. Good thing there are plenty of backups.

It's a shame that there's such a divide between competitive and casual Pokemon fans, most noticeably in forums such as these. As a "casual", it makes it hard to relate to the Pokemon that are likable competitively, and I'm sure it's the same in reverse for competitive players.

I'm somewhere in between, actually. I understand the competitive side, but I'm a nonconformist through and through. I am what Magic: The Gathering players refer to as an "Uber-Johnny." As Mark Rosewater, head designer, states it:

"They are out to prove that what conventional wisdom says can't be done, can be done. To them, no card is too bad to find a use for. No deck archetype is too unworkable. Nothing truly is off limits. The Uber Johnnies thrive on doing the undoable. They live to demonstrate that they were the one to succeed where all the others failed."

I do this because I bore easily of seeing the same things over and over, however. It's why I almost always play in For Fun in Super Smash Bros. 4: I got so sick of seeing Final Destination in Super Smash Bros. Brawl that I cherish the mode that omits it.

 

[goodpeople25]

I quite like toxapex's design, (though I think the worst I can say about any pokemon is that's it's not particularly interesting or that part of it is pretty out there or that it's just simplistic) and on the divide it is a shame that sides are so often defined like that. I don't really get into competitive myself but I do quite like the mechanical and data parts of a design as well as the as the aesthetic aspects. Merciless is quite an interesting ability to me and I doubt everyone who talks about it is thinking only of it's competitive benefits or even it's ingame benefits. (heck I get a vibe that merciless in competitive circles gets overhyped and that it's not just because they misjudged it's power) I also appreciate it's variant of spiky shield, it's somewhat atypical for it's type stats, and some of the moves it gets.

I could go on and move on to galisopod but i don't want to bore anymore people so I'll cut it off there.

 

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Holy crap Salazzle looks dope!! That totem battle was hard as anything even my OP Lyconroc (lv 25 rest of my team like Lv 22/23) struggled but managed to win otherwise a blackout was happening!

But yeah really like Salazzle, reasons like this I am so glad I strayed away from spoilers and datamines.

 

[Graficcha]

I'm still having a tough time understanding why so many people seem to love Mareanie and Toxapex. Sure, it's one of the few new Water-types, it has Poison moves...but it's design is incredibly ugly. I can't even see its face/body/head as Toxapex because its legs are enormous. I'm the type of Pokemon player who is not competitive, and chooses Pokemon in my team based on appearance as well as typing and stats. Which is why I also don't want to touch Galisopod. It's strong, yes, but it's such an overly-designed Pokemon that doesn't look like it belongs in the Pokemon franchise. Super tiny head and enormous, overly-designed appendage-crazy body. And fighting Guzma's was a pain in the butt.

However, I fortunately have found enough Alolan Pokemon I like to make my team pretty much 100% Alolan. yes, I have an Alolan variant, but the rest have solid designs. I still think this gen has more pros than cons, and the Pokemon with ugly designs still are relatively a minority.

Sorry if I offended anyone who loves Galisopod and Toxapex's designs! I just really needed to vent after getting through the main story up until the E4. No harm meant, just expressing my personal dislike for these fictional 'Mons.

I ended up getting a Mareanie mostly for the tactical prowess, and it did indeed save my unprepared heinie a few times. Can't but appreciate that, especially since those were important plot-battles.

Then Poké Refresh and seeing them in-battle livened up the designs to me a lot, I find it quite marvelous how flexible and alive-squishy they look. Might not be your thing, and their lore makes them our to be nasty little beasties, but as a partner they can be pretty adorable in their own right.

Accompanying mental image: a slippery Salandit wiggling its way under Toxapex's dome to chill out there in the dark and take a nap. Naww.

With regards to other 'mons:

- Wimpod is *ridiculously* adorable, oh my gosh that spiky tail, the way it tucks it legs under when you send it out, my heart. Golisopod is so un-cute/unexpressive I kind of stopped caring though, I hadn't expected that to happen. It's utterly useless before it evolves though... Oh well. I can just keep one around for petting.

- Salandit line's great imo, they're animated really well and I still laugh my butt off finding them in that pokéfinder spot.

- Shiinotic is a beast, wow. I'd expected it to just about hold up, instead it became one of my more reliable and versatile pokemon in my game-team. Really interesting movepool, can take a hit and dish one out, too. Maybe not competitively viable but definitely solid in-game.

- Lele stands out to me for the tapu quartet. Something about being a slightly psychotic Pinkie Pie seems to call out to me, her lore really makes her sound capricious and kind of dangerous, like a proper guardian spirit. Asbestos fairy ftw!

Overall I'm really satisfied with what we got this time around. They're not all winners in my book, but I think there's something in this pool for everyone and the lore's really fresh.

 

[Captain Jigglypuff]

I think Mareanie and Toxipex look great for what they represent. They look like menacing destroyers of the sea. The crown-of-thorns starfish is rather destructive in nature and it won't let anything stop it from eating coral reefs.

 

[BlitzGirl41]

While I do like Salazzle, and even have a level 52 one on my team, I still feel like her design is lacking. It's not that she's too simple or anything like that, but I at least would have wanted to see something on her head, or for her body to not be as slender. Her pose also is weird to me - looks best when she's on all fours attacking.

 

[Victreebong]

Maraenie is straight up Yokai material, with its little toothed smile and devious visage. We now have three Poison/Water Pokemon families and they're all dope!

Actually, GF did quite well with the Water types this time, there's a little something for just about everyone. Want a big boss, go Wishiwashi. Need a big boss badass bug, go-go Golisopod! How about a quirky bubble spider? Yep. Fabulously triggered?! Pun intended. Can't stand all of these Pokemon with appendages; Puykimuku's gonna give you a hand. And at the end of the day when everyone needs some new fuzzy frumpy thing to lasciviously think about, GF didn't skimp on the furry material with a part mermaid walrus.