October 21st: PM2019 129 - The Finals I: Torrent

[Sham]

 

[Jeal]

I know it's been brought up to death, and I'll keep it short, but that pre match "let's go" with his JN team just feels insulting. I'm not dissing them, but you try to make this feel like such a monumental battle with emotions, and you don't do it with his reserves who brought him here.

No reserves brought him here. It was the current team who brought him here.

 

[Sham]

No reserves brought him here. It was the current team who brought him here.

This logic kicks you guy‘s in the a** every single day. Multiple things can exist at the exact same time. It’s possible realizing that the anime has made it a personal determination to make this team seem like his most powerful.

What’s also true is that they provided no explanation on how and when he trained this team to be that strong to the point where he’s defeating Champions but the 1-7 team members couldn’t even win him a league despite us knowing more and how he trained them.

 

[cricketlaxwolvesbandy]

Meanwhile Squirtle, Goodra, Primeape, Pidgeot, Butterfree and Lapras dead in a ditch

 

[Bendicion]

I really think Misty should return, she's been gone far too long. She's still as important as she was back then because she was a main character at one point!!!

 

[janejane6178]

I really think Misty should return, she's been gone far too long. She's still as important as she was back then because she was a main character at one point!!!

I miss her so much
(Not her corrupted sm version tho)

 

[Pokegirl Fan~]

I miss her so much
(Not her corrupted sm version tho)

Or her TPCI dub voice

 

[Jeal]

This logic kicks you guy‘s in the a** every single day. Multiple things can exist at the exact same time. It’s possible realizing that the anime has made it a personal determination to make this team seem like his most powerful.

What’s also true is that they provided no explanation on how and when he trained this team to be that strong to the point where he’s defeating Champions but the 1-7 team members couldn’t even win him a league despite us knowing more and how he trained them.

Imagine defending and justifying inferior tell-don't-show storytelling.

The argument was that the reserves must be the ones battling here, not the current team because "it was the reserves that brought him here". What I said was that they, in fact, didn't bring him here.

 

[Broseph08]

This logic kicks you guy‘s in the a** every single day. Multiple things can exist at the exact same time. It’s possible realizing that the anime has made it a personal determination to make this team seem like his most powerful.

What’s also true is that they provided no explanation on how and when he trained this team to be that strong to the point where he’s defeating Champions but the 1-7 team members couldn’t even win him a league despite us knowing more and how he trained them.

TBF I'm only really curious about this for Lucario and Sirfetch'd who we saw him train up this season. It's way more understandable to me that he trained up a Dragonite and Gengar into being OP as hell

 

[Sham]

The argument was that the reserves must be the ones battling here, not the current team because "it was the reserves that brought him here". What I said was that they, in fact, didn't bring him here.

If you want to go with the “muh Ash’s experience” as the reason why they’re so strong then yes, they did bring him there. Otherwise you might as well say that this team being that strong to the point of defeating four (possibly five) Champions is convoluted

 

[Jeal]

If you want to go with the “muh Ash’s experience” as the reason why they’re so strong then yes, they did bring him there. Otherwise you might as well say that this team being that strong to the point of defeating four Champions is convoluted

Why they are so strong is irrelevant to the fact that they brought him here. That's the subject which I replied to. I am not making any arguments about their strenght, if their strenght is bad writing or unfair, or whatever. All I said is "the reserves didn't bring him here" to someone saying they did. That's all.

 

[Trillion]

i have a feeling we'll get cameos from squirtle, primeape, and goodra watching the match since they all have tv access. hell they could even be brought to watch in person

greninja can "see" it through lucario shenanigans

naganadel would be a bit more contrived, but still possible. it could just happen to come back to alola at the right time

can't think of anything for butterfree, pidgeot, or lapras unfortunately

i just feel all his pokemon should be able to see this battle. it's only right

i also think it'd be cool if they sprinkled in filler characters from os - sm whenever they pan to the audience. make it like a where's waldo/blink-and-you-miss-it type of thing

they could really go all-out with this, especially since they're already incorporating a lot of nostalgia with the companions/rivals and ash meeting pikachu flashbacks

 

[Jeal]

By 'here', I hope you meant PWC only and not his entire journey and his slow climb to being a top trainer in the world, which is the part Sham was going for. Because you fail spectacularly on the latter.

I replied to Akkipeddi, not Sham. He was the one saying "here", not Sham, referring to the Leon battle. Sham argued something completely unrelated to the original point, that was reserves the ones that brought him to be the Leon's opponent, and this is false. That's the argument here, ok?

 

[Sham]

I replied to Akkipeddi, not Sham. He was the one saying "here", not Sham, referring to the Leon battle. Sham argued something completely unrelated to the original point, that was reserves the ones that brought him to be the Leon's opponent, and this is false. That's the argument here, ok?

Because I've seen your posts. A good portion is defending Journeys teams in the past and I was referring to that conversation in a whole but considering this isn't the "main point" I'll leave it be.

 

[Sonic Boom]

Why would it be her?
This place might as well be taken by someone else.

Because specifically Chloe is here too, and Serena is the other friend that helped her find herself. And she doesn't have the handicap of being sort of a package deal like Lana is.

If Misty keeps up with Ash does that mean she was lowkey Champion level this whole time and would obliterated people like Steven etc?

Don't see why not. Paul turned out to be at least on the level of Raihan at this point, so why not get the main battling gym leader of the cast up to speed.

At any rate, Ash didn't "obliterate" Steven or Cynthia, they brought him down to one Pokemon as well. And if we're talking about the whole of the M8 matches, Leon's the only one so far who's won with more than one Pokemon standing, before Ash unpredictability's his way into a winning gamestate here, so all-in-all, the top 8 are all around similar power level. Misty turning out to be the same would just hit harder here because she'd show it after Ash has won the whole thing and is in danger of falling into the same trap Leon did. She wouldn't necessarily have to win, just get to him enough to reignite the spark. Think Yugi vs. Jaden in the finale of Yugioh GX. Sudden power feats can bend to the need for a good message and story beat, and in a series of gradual escalation, it may as well happen for this reason.

As a bonus....first friend in his journey that is also a champion-level Gym Leader of a town a hop, skip, and a jump away from what's currently his "workplace" that would be driven to compete with him? The Gym Leader also employs weather combos? Ash would have someone that is simultaneously his Sonia and his Raihan, avoiding the dilemma Sonia found herself in as Leon got better and got attention for it. The new generation fixing the weakness of the old one.



(ofc this is assuming this is an internal struggle Ash would be dealing with after winning, but if JN is not ending after this battle, and because I feel like this side of Leon was brought up peculiarly at the same time as the other Ash/Leon parallels were, I think this may have been intentional and would be a thing that they could be going into afterward.)

 

[Jeal]

Because I've seen your posts. A good portion is defending Journeys teams in the past and I was referring to conversation in a whole but considering this isn't the "main point" I'll leave it be.

Quote the posts of this "good portion defending journeys's team". I don't really care either way. You can complain about the journeys team and the reserves for the rest of your life, the writers obviously don't care. Deal with it.

But if you want to talk about the current's strenght, let's go:

1 - the reserves don't have any more experience than the current team, Ash always leaves them behind after one region.

2 - Some of them were already evolved and strong.

3 - Ash had to battle a lot of trainers to become top 8. And each class had stronger opponents, from regular trainers to 1000 best trainers, to 100 best trainers. That's a lot of practice.

4 - Ash didn't have to waste time walking for days around a region. A lot more time to train so he can stand a chance against the 100 best trainers.

 

[Bendicion]

Misty, Brock and Dawn watching Ash and Leon's battle!!!

 

[WaterShuriken]

So with a good portion of the world watching, I wonder how fast Ash's Counter Shield technique will spread. He already used it against Cynthia, and now Leon looks to be using it with Inteleon.

 

[Bendicion]

Misty and Dawn are about to meet I just know it.... Imagine Misty and Dawn bonding over Togekiss and Shopping omg my heart is a mess right now

 

[Kazuki Mirai]

It’s funny how Kaori barely cares about voicing May despite all the hype. Hilarious how she wasn’t even shown watching Ash battle but prefer to include her rivals.

She is literally sick with a very rare condition that has no cure. A crippling one at that.