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Official 6th Generation Competitive Metagame Discussion

Fruitt

SHARKEISHA
I've got mixed feelings about Mega Medicham. On one hand, it remedies all of regular Medicham's problems by bumping it up to a usable base 100 speed tier, and its piss-poor 60/60/60 defenses to a slightly better 60/85/85 spread.

On the other hand, it's a very high-maintenance Mega. It has to be super conservative with its HJK considering how Ghosts types are more popular than ever, with Gengar, Aegislash, etc. being on every other team (if not almost every team, period). While its speed is good, it's still outpaced by a lot of threats, and its bulk still leaves a lot to be desired. Its defensive typing is pretty bad too, so it isn't easy to switch in. It's also pretty easy to revenge kill, given its very vulnerable to Talonflame, and it doesn't resist any other forms of priority barring the uncommon Mach Punch/Vacuum Wave.

It just requires a lot more support than some of the other Megas.

True but I stuck Drain Punch on it so that it can use that if afraid of the Ghost switch, and even if they don't switch into a Ghost, it's definitely better than the risk of using HJK on a Ghost. Drain Punch can also be used for regaining health when it survives a hit, which is surprisingly not uncommon, at least from my experience.

Though Mega Scizor is a better option, I think Mega Medicham is not completely out of the question, and might throw people off. It can do huge damage if the opponent has nothing to deal with it. I admit there are better options, but I'm hoping to see it used a little more often.
 

ghost_dog97

the sweeper
True but I stuck Drain Punch on it so that it can use that if afraid of the Ghost switch, and even if they don't switch into a Ghost, it's definitely better than the risk of using HJK on a Ghost. Drain Punch can also be used for regaining health when it survives a hit, which is surprisingly not uncommon, at least from my experience.

Though Mega Scizor is a better option, I think Mega Medicham is not completely out of the question, and might throw people off. It can do huge damage if the opponent has nothing to deal with it. I admit there are better options, but I'm hoping to see it used a little more often.
Drain Punch is a smart decision as it is the same I made as well. Chain breed it to get bullet punch too btw, medicham has shocked me in a lot of ways (even w/out the mega evo). When I first saw its stats, I completely ignored pure power and judged its low 240 max attack. Now since it has its on mega stone, the champ of meditation will rise to the UU or RU tier. Its still frail in its mega state, but drain punch will help... as long as you don't switch into it against a talonflame, medicham has the potential to revenge kill and to sweep
 

stabby28

New Member
Question guys. I was doing rating battles and I vsed another player. I had a Gliscor and he had a Skarmory. Since the Skarmory was about to die it used Roost. Knowing it makes it lose the flying type for a turn I went for an Earthquake but it still didn't affect it? There's no way it had an air balloon since I already hit it. It used Roost again the next turn and I went for the Earthquake again but it still didn't affect it. Did I stumble upon a glitch?
 

RifleAvenger

See you starside
Question guys. I was doing rating battles and I vsed another player. I had a Gliscor and he had a Skarmory. Since the Skarmory was about to die it used Roost. Knowing it makes it lose the flying type for a turn I went for an Earthquake but it still didn't affect it? There's no way it had an air balloon since I already hit it. It used Roost again the next turn and I went for the Earthquake again but it still didn't affect it. Did I stumble upon a glitch?

Honestly, I don't know. It sounds like it though. If you were playing on Wi-Fi, this is something to post on a Nintendo forum. If this was on Pokemon Showdown it'd be something to report on their forums or on Smogon's Pokemon Showdown subforum.

True but I stuck Drain Punch on it so that it can use that if afraid of the Ghost switch, and even if they don't switch into a Ghost, it's definitely better than the risk of using HJK on a Ghost. Drain Punch can also be used for regaining health when it survives a hit, which is surprisingly not uncommon, at least from my experience.

Giving up HJK gives up the insane attacking power that makes MegaCham stand out though. It's a pokemon I really fear running into due to its wallbreaking power, which will run rampant through my stall teams if my ghost type is dead. Drain punch I can slack off while letting burn or toxic take its toll. HJK even lets you run jolly while still 2HKO'ing a premier physical wall like Hippowdon and seriously denting even things that resist it like Mega-Venusaur.

252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 228-268 (54.2 - 63.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 192-228 (45.7 - 54.2%) -- 4.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 144-171 (34.2 - 40.7%) -- 51.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mega Venusaur: 121-143 (33.2 - 39.2%) -- 100% chance to 3HKO

You'd need to switch out of Saur obviously, but you'd take a good chunk out of its health as it comes in. Most people I see mix the defense EV's on M-Saur too, so you'd probably get a bit more damage in actuality.

I'll admit that ghosts are really common, but that's why you include a good pursuit trapper on the team so you can remove the ghost before Medicham sweeps.

EDIT: I realize you're probably running Drain Punch and HJK. One issue with that is not running Psycho Cut lets M-Venusaur wall you. Fortunately, M-Venu is rare enough and I can't think of any other poison types that can take a HJK and don't fear either ice or thunder punch. Another is not being able to run a boosting move on Cham (Bulk Up is the only one of note). A third is that you can't run a priority move then, as I feel you need thunder and ice punch to dispatch various flying types that might otherwise prove troublesome.
 
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T-Bolt

Electrifying.
Question guys. I was doing rating battles and I vsed another player. I had a Gliscor and he had a Skarmory. Since the Skarmory was about to die it used Roost. Knowing it makes it lose the flying type for a turn I went for an Earthquake but it still didn't affect it? There's no way it had an air balloon since I already hit it. It used Roost again the next turn and I went for the Earthquake again but it still didn't affect it. Did I stumble upon a glitch?

Did Gliscor attack before Skarmory used roost? You would only be able to hit Skarmory with earthquake if Skarmory used roost and then Gliscor used earthquake.
 

Fruitt

SHARKEISHA
EDIT: I realize you're probably running Drain Punch and HJK. One issue with that is not running Psycho Cut lets M-Venusaur wall you. Fortunately, M-Venu is rare enough and I can't think of any other poison types that can take a HJK and don't fear either ice or thunder punch. Another is not being able to run a boosting move on Cham (Bulk Up is the only one of note). A third is that you can't run a priority move then, as I feel you need thunder and ice punch to dispatch various flying types that might otherwise prove troublesome.

I am also running Psycho Cut. My moveset is Drain Punch, HJK, Psycho Cut, and Bullet Punch. I don't find Bulk Up very useful since Medicham is powerful enough with Pure Power.

I feel safer with a priority move like Bullet Punch, since one if it's large problems is flying types, and even if you go for an Ice/Thunder Punch, flying types will easily outspeed Medicham (unless Sticky Web is up, then it might have a chance) so if you don't mind losing Medicham you could go for Bullet Punch to get off some extra damage, and it's also great for fairies.

Of course you could always switch out, but then you have the problem of giving Medicham a safe switch in, which isn't too easy. I personally think Bullet Punch is more useful, but then again I haven't even tried running any of the elemental punches, so I might do that.
 

RifleAvenger

See you starside
I feel safer with a priority move like Bullet Punch, since one if it's large problems is flying types, and even if you go for an Ice/Thunder Punch, flying types will easily outspeed Medicham

Of course you could always switch out, but then you have the problem of giving Medicham a safe switch in, which isn't too easy. I personally think Bullet Punch is more useful, but then again I haven't even tried running any of the elemental punches, so I might do that.

Without ice punch you have a hard time dealing the following: Dragonite, Landorus-T, Gliscor. All of which you outspeed when Mega-evo'd.

Without thunder punch Gyrados gives you trouble. Once again, you outspeed it.

Those were the 4 I could think of off the top of my head, all of which show up fairly often. There could well be more. I would at least carry ice punch.
 
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Fruitt

SHARKEISHA
Without ice punch you have a hard time dealing the following: Dragonite, Landorus-T, Gliscor. All of which you outspeed when Mega-evo'd.

Without thunder punch Gyrados gives you trouble. Once again, you outspeed it.

Those were the 4 I could think of off the top of my head, all of which show up fairly often. There could well be more.

That's true except for Gyarados. I faced a few with my Medicham and I had no trouble dealing with it, and I wasn't actually aware that Medicham outspeeds all of those, guess I should have researched more, so I guess I will include Ice Punch, thanks :)
 

ghost_dog97

the sweeper
after being baton passed a +2 swords dance boost, my medicham 0hko'd a gyarados with one ice punch, and without any boosts a drain punch would ohko a mega gyarados as well
 

RifleAvenger

See you starside
after being baton passed a +2 swords dance boost, my medicham 0hko'd a gyarados with one ice punch, and without any boosts a drain punch would ohko a mega gyarados as well

Sure, if you're running baton-pass a lot of things can happen. But in more standard uses of M-cham you're not going to have that happen.

-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Ice Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 111-131 (33.4 - 39.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO (Even with a SD pass, after intimidate you'd need SR or prior damage to OHKO with ice punch)
-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Psycho Cut vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 154-183 (46.3 - 55.1%) -- 64.8% chance to 2HKO
-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham High Jump Kick vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 144-169 (43.3 - 50.9%) -- 3.9% chance to 2HKO
-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 83-98 (25 - 29.5%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

252+ Atk Gyarados Waterfall vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Medicham: 160-189 (61.3 - 72.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

So you do stand a good chance of 2HKO'ing offensive gyra if you carry psycho cutter. Esp. if it switches into cutter. However, defensive Gyrados (which does exist)...

-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gyarados: 76-90 (19.2 - 22.8%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Psycho Cut vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gyarados: 106-126 (26.9 - 31.9%) -- 40.2% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gyarados: 99-117 (25.1 - 29.6%) -- 0% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gyarados: 57-67 (14.4 - 17%) -- possible 9HKO after Leftovers recovery

0 Atk Gyarados Waterfall vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Medicham: 120-142 (45.9 - 54.4%) -- 56.3% chance to 2HKO

Without thunderpunch you will lose this exchange.

And I never mentioned M-Gyra because, being dark typed now, it obviously gets smashed by HJK or drain punch.
 
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Zachmac

Well-Known Member
To add something else to RifleAvenger's argument...

252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Jirachi: 204-241 (59.8 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Adaptability Mega Lucario Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Jirachi: 284-336 (83.2 - 98.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham High Jump Kick vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Jirachi: 354-417 (103.8 - 122.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

...Unless Medicham uses High Jump Kick, it is almost completely outclassed. Luc carries both Swords Dance and significantly more powerful priority as well. Medicham needs something to set itself apart, and in this case, that is the shear force it's High Jump Kicks provide right off the bat.

Even if Luc gets banned...
252 Atk Terrakion Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Jirachi: 195-231 (57.1 - 67.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Terrakion does slightly less damage with no item, but it can carry a choice band or life orb and has higher speed.

252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Jirachi: 220-259 (64.5 - 75.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
'Nape also carries u-turn, higher speed, and STAB fire.

Not to mention ScarfMoxie Heracross.
252+ Atk Heracross Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Jirachi: 210-247 (61.5 - 72.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Heracross Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Jirachi: 313-370 (91.7 - 108.5%) -- 50% chance to OHKO

I could just keep on going if you want. Medicham may be extremely powerful, but that doesn't change that Drain Punch is weak.
 
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ghost_dog97

the sweeper
actually, drain punch has the power to ohko a gyarados (without mega evolving) when +plus 2 and used by adamant mega medicham (I baton pass a swords dance to it)
since gyarados isn't normally ev trained in defense (and to those trolls who say they are... just keep it to yourself)
drain punch can also keep medicham alive due to its frailty (not the movie)
 

KillerDraco

Well-Known Member
actually, drain punch has the power to ohko a gyarados (without mega evolving) when +plus 2 and used by adamant mega medicham (I baton pass a swords dance to it)

No it doesn't.

+2 252+ Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 272-321 (81.9 - 96.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

It's only a 1HKO with Stealth Rock or prior damage factored in. Even then, it needs a very specific set of circumstances, such as using an Adamant Nature, which is generally inferior to Jolly on Medicham anyway. It benefits from the extra speed more than the extra attack, lest it be outsped by positive base 87 Speed Pokemon (which are pretty common), and the fact that it's already got an absurd amount of Attack behind it due to Pure Power. Receiving a SD from Baton Pass is also not a guarantee, given its susceptible to phasing, and Medicham can be hit hard on the switch due to its poor bulk. And there's also assuming that Gyarados is already in, or Intimidate will cut your attack a stage.

Of course, this is moot point given that both HJK and Psycho Cut outdamage Drain Punch against a Gyarados anyway.

That said, being able to KO a Gyarados is not exactly the biggest benchmark for success. Mega Medicham still suffers from less than ideal bulk and speed, which most other fighting types have (one of the other). And if it has to be Baton Passed a boost in order to be successful, why not use a fighting type that's more self sufficient?

Don't get me wrong, Mega Medicham is a solid Pokemon, but its flaws make it somewhat outclassed. It'll probably be a solid UU/niche OU Pokemon, but it's got some serious issues to work around that prevent it from being standard. HJK's extreme power is what helps to carve a small niche for itself.
 
+2 252+ Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 272-321 (81.9 - 96.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
guaranteed OHKO

So yes, an Adamant +2 Mega Medicham will always OHKO an offensive Gyarados after Stealth Rock, which is some of the simplest and easiest support out there. ghost_dog97 wasn't extremely specific about the example, he just said that it has the power to OHKO a Gyarados after being Baton Passed a Swords Dance. It turns out that Mega Medicham can do just that with pretty minimal support, so he was right. But honestly, can we stop arguing about petty things like this? Seriously, it's like every time ghost_dog97 posts something, there's this collective knee-jerk reaction to try to argue with random stuff he says. Even when he technically isn't wrong, someone always tries to find some way to spin the argument so that he is.

I honestly don't see why Adamant Mega Medicham is so taboo, to be honest. Yes, the extra speed can be important from time to time, but it's not like it's mandatory. Genesect runs Scarf the vast majority of the time, in which case you'll lose. Excadrill tends to be Adamant at least a small majority of the time (the spreads in the usage stats add up to ~52%, and there's no telling how many other slower spreads aren't represented). Fast Gliscor hardly even exists. Close to all Lucario run Lucarionite which makes them too fast anyway, and regular SD Lucario dropped in popularity when Mega Gengar was banned and teams like MikeDecIsHere's Gas Pedal were no longer usable. Plus, it's generally Adamant. Jolly/Naive Landorus-T with max Spe is pretty rare outside of Choice Scarf sets. You might beat some sets of stuff like Hydreigon, Haxorus, Kyurem, and Kyurem-B, but their usage percentages range from "uncommon" to "what happened to you?" It's useful for speed tying base 100s like Volcarona, Charizard, and Salamence, but a lot of those guys commonly run Spe boosting moves or Scarf sets. Bottom line is that Jolly is far from mandatory when so many of the Pokemon between that 88-100 base Spe area probably outspeed you anyway or common run slower sets that you can outspeed with an Adamant nature. Jolly is probably better since there are still times where that extra speed will come in handy (better safe than sorry), but the raw power of an Adamant Mega Medicham cannot be ignored.

EDIT: I also noticed that Psycho Cut was mentioned a lot on this page and not once was Zen Headbutt mentioned. To be honest, Zen Headbutt is generally the better move. The 14% extra power and chance to flinch slower opponents (in other words, most defensive Pokemon) is definitely worth the drop in accuracy, which is still pretty reliable at 90%. One of the main reason to even use a Psychic STAB is Jellicent, and Mega Medicham needs an Adamant nature and Stealth Rock support to guarantee the 2HKO against physically defensive Jellicent, while Zen Headbutt 2HKOs over half the time even with a Jolly nature and no prior damage whatsoever. Zen Headbutt is also Mega Medicham's only chance at OHKOing physically defensive Mega Venusaur after Stealth Rock.
 
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KillerDraco

Well-Known Member
So yes, an Adamant +2 Mega Medicham will always OHKO an offensive Gyarados after Stealth Rock, which is some of the simplest and easiest support out there. ghost_dog97 wasn't extremely specific about the example, he just said that it has the power to OHKO a Gyarados after being Baton Passed a Swords Dance. It turns out that Mega Medicham can do just that with pretty minimal support, so he was right. But honestly, can we stop arguing about petty things like this? Seriously, it's like every time ghost_dog97 posts something, there's this collective knee-jerk reaction to try to argue with random stuff he says. Even when he technically isn't wrong, someone always tries to find some way to spin the argument so that he is.

Oh, it has nothing to do with him. It's just a bias of mine; I don't consider "after being Baton Passed a boost" to be a very compelling argument for a Pokemon, given that it's something that literally every Pokemon can receive. It could be Baton Passed to Mega Aggron, Mega Abomasnow, whatever. A discussion of a Pokemon's viability shouldn't be contingent upon Baton Pass; rather, it's more of a boon than anything. No one doubts that when Scolipede passes an SD and a Speed Boost to Mega Medicham, things are going to be hurting, but at the same time, the same is probably going to be true for 90% of physical sweepers receiving the Baton Pass. I mean heck, other fighting types love being passed SD.

+2 252 Atk Life Orb Terrakion Close Combat vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 308-363 (92.7 - 109.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 Atk Adaptability Mega Lucario Close Combat vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 345-406 (103.9 - 122.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 265-312 (79.8 - 93.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

Edit: Yes I am aware that most of these, most notably Terrakion, would have moves they'd rather use against a Gyarados but this is just for the sake of argument.

Pretty much any physical Pokemon likes getting Baton Passed a Swords Dance. I'm just of the opinion that whether or not a Pokemon should be viable should be discussed without Baton Pass support, because it's generally a given that once a Baton Pass is received, things are going to be hurting. That'd be a separate discussion about the viability of Baton Pass itself, and certain Pokemon acting as passers.

And when we throw in the context, it ultimately came down to a discussion of Drain Punch vs. Hi Jump Kick on Mega Medicham. And the underlying point was that Drain Punch does require a bit more support than HJK in order to secure some crucial 1HKO's. Especially since HJK's frighteningly high power is part of Mega Medicham's niche over its competitors; the overwhelming power it possesses is what makes Mega Medicham as good as it is. Forgoing that, despite not having as much risk (what with HJK's nasty side effect), does produce a noticeable decrease in damage output.

I honestly don't see why Adamant Mega Medicham is so taboo, to be honest. Yes, the extra speed can be important from time to time, but it's not like it's mandatory. Genesect runs Scarf the vast majority of the time, in which case you'll lose. Excadrill tends to be Adamant at least a small majority of the time (the spreads in the usage stats add up to ~52%, and there's no telling how many other slower spreads aren't represented). Fast Gliscor hardly even exists. Close to all Lucario run Lucarionite which makes them too fast anyway, and regular SD Lucario dropped in popularity when Mega Gengar was banned and teams like MikeDecIsHere's Gas Pedal were no longer usable. Plus, it's generally Adamant. Jolly/Naive Landorus-T with max Spe is pretty rare outside of Choice Scarf sets. You might beat some sets of stuff like Hydreigon, Haxorus, Kyurem, and Kyurem-B, but their usage percentages range from "uncommon" to "what happened to you?" It's useful for speed tying base 100s like Volcarona, Charizard, and Salamence, but a lot of those guys commonly run Spe boosting moves or Scarf sets. Bottom line is that Jolly is far from mandatory when so many of the Pokemon between that 88-100 base Spe area probably outspeed you anyway or common run slower sets that you can outspeed with an Adamant nature. Jolly is probably better since there are still times where that extra speed will come in handy (better safe than sorry), but the raw power of an Adamant Mega Medicham cannot be ignored.

Taboo it certainly isn't, but it's certainly something for which results will definitely vary. The Adamant vs. Jolly and Modest vs. Timid argument has been around forever, and I won't deny that it's largely a personal preference thing. That said, the number of Pokemon that can check you is affected by that 10% difference in speed. Call it paranoia on my part; getting checked by a Lilligant on one of those rare occasions when you don't use a Speed boosting nature is something that comes back to haunt you, and definitely makes a person stick to Speed boosters when given the choice.

My 'Nam Flashbacks aside, I find it comes down to the Pokemon. When Lando-T is acting as an offensive pivot rather than a sweeper or revenge killer, yes, it prefers a bit more bulk over speed. From what I've seen most Lucario tend to be running Timid/Jolly nowadays, though I'd be lying if I said I knew the exact margin. Excadrill, I'll admit, surprised me to see how popular Adamant is lately, but eh. That said, I'd agree with what you're saying; Adamant does have the highest power, but I've already been one to air on the side of caution, and go for Jolly to be safer. I suppose if you're going for an all-out wallbreaker, Adamant certainly has its merits, but at the same time... Jolly's definitely something that can narrow the number of checks if even only just.

Plus, at the end of the day, I reference my signature Not the Weepinbell fusion part though. It comes down to personal biases, and I'm one to be strongly biased in favor of speed boosting natures.
 
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Oh, it has nothing to do with him. It's just a bias of mine; I don't consider "after being Baton Passed a boost" to be a very compelling argument for a Pokemon, given that it's something that literally every Pokemon can receive.

I understand that, and if you had just focused your argument on that line of thought without opening up by debating his comment about the OHKO, I probably wouldn't have had a problem with it. It's just that I'm tired of seeing people jumping on ghost_dog97 every time he says something dumb (and even sometimes when he doesn't). It's obvious that he's inexperienced, but there have been several times over the last few weeks where one or more people have snapped at him when he made a mistake instead of kindly correcting his error and trying to teach him. This isn't directed specifically at you, but I honestly just had to say something since it's a problem I've seen for a while now, and the last thing we need is for someone who doesn't visit this sub-forum much to see stuff like that and get the idea that this community is full of elitist jerks or something (which a lot of people already believe as it is).

Also, for future reference, I'm basing my usage comments on statistics found here. There's a section in the usage stats threads for moveset stats, which show the popularity of certain moves, items, etc. If you weren't already aware of this, you can use these stats to back up usage-based arguments in the future.
 

Cuthrout

Well-Known Member
I understand that, and if you had just focused your argument on that line of thought without opening up by debating his comment about the OHKO, I probably wouldn't have had a problem with it. It's just that I'm tired of seeing people jumping on ghost_dog97 every time he says something dumb (and even sometimes when he doesn't). It's obvious that he's inexperienced, but there have been several times over the last few weeks where one or more people have snapped at him when he made a mistake instead of kindly correcting his error and trying to teach him. This isn't directed specifically at you, but I honestly just had to say something since it's a problem I've seen for a while now, and the last thing we need is for someone who doesn't visit this sub-forum much to see stuff like that and get the idea that this community is full of elitist jerks or something (which a lot of people already believe as it is).

Also, for future reference, I'm basing my usage comments on statistics found here. There's a section in the usage stats threads for moveset stats, which show the popularity of certain moves, items, etc. If you weren't already aware of this, you can use these stats to back up usage-based arguments in the future.

Just from what I've personally seen, competitive threads generally have members that are themselves competitive, not in just how they play but its their nature to be competitive, and it may come across as being an "elitist jerk" to people who don't spend enough time around these people. So what might seem like a counter argument from a member who is active on the competitive thread, may come across as harsh as a member that just drops by ever so often.
 

Eaglehawk

Banned
^^Much fight. Such angry. Wow.

Moving on to something new, the good people at Smogon has discovered some new toys from PokeBank, notably:
- Sacred Fire Entei
- 120 BP Techno Blast (Genesect's signature move)
- Destiny Bond Aegislash (via chain-breeding)
- Moonblast Cresselia
- Imprison Sableye
- Switcheroo Klefki

P.S. **** MegaMedicham. That thing's sh!t,
 

KillerDraco

Well-Known Member
^^Much fight. Such angry. Wow.

Moving on to something new, the good people at Smogon has discovered some new toys from PokeBank, notably:
- Sacred Fire Entei
- 120 BP Techno Blast (Genesect's signature move)
- Destiny Bond Aegislash (via chain-breeding)
- Moonblast Cresselia
- Imprison Sableye
- Switcheroo Klefki

Sacred Fire Entei? That's something worth noting. Entei's always had decent bulk on its side, so throw in a 50% chance to burn and you've really got something there. Mind you, it's still got competition for a team slot from things like Mega Charizard X and Talonflame as a physical fire type, and it might not be enough to make OU, but at least Sacred Fire, in addition to old staples such as Extreme Speed, give it a niche to differentiate itself.
 
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