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Official Serebii 5th Gen Tier List & Standard Rules Discussion Thread

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Kindrindra

大事なのは自分らしいくある事
I feel the burning desire to put in my two cents.

I don't think Mew should be put on the banned list. The thing is, last gen the only thing Mew wasn't outclassed at was being able to Baton Pass +2 to ANY stat. Mew no longer has even this, really. As we all know, three mighty offensively boosting moves were introducted this gen- Tail Glow was upped to +3 Sp Atk, Butterfly Dance was introduced, and the amazing Shell Break was also introduced. Mew gets none of these. This means that Nasty Plot passing is rendered almost totally obselete, due to Volbeat's ability to pass Tail Glow- In fact, Volbeat boosts and passes with +1 priority, due to Mischevious Heart. But, unless you're passing to an already fast special sweeper, even that pales in comparison to Shell Smash, which Gorebyss (and, to a lesser extent, Huntail) can pass. +2 to both attacking stats and speed outclasses Mew almost totally. In short- If Victini doesn't get banned, Mew shouldn't either. Mew can't even claim exclusivity to Transform any more, thanks to eccentric Ditto. Heck, Mew doesn't even have a good typing.

tl;dr: Mew has their merits, but I don't think they even come close to Ubers.
 
I agree, it will probably never be banned at this rate. I think Mew is actually UU right now lol.
 

Mr. Marowak

was wrong about Gen6
If I may ask, why does Marowak always end up somewhere in UU? Thick Club is BEAST.

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Edit: Discovered that Marowak was first in UU, then BL, then OU, and now, and it pains me to say, NU. (o3e) Why? And does any other Pokémon bound from one tier to another, never being in the same way twice?

PS Tiers R 4 Queers! Heh heh heh lol.
 
If I may ask, why does Marowak always end up somewhere in UU? Thick Club is BEAST.

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Edit: Discovered that Marowak was first in UU, then BL, then OU, and now, and it pains me to say, NU. (o3e) Why? And does any other Pokémon bound from one tier to another, never being in the same way twice?

PS Tiers R 4 Queers! Heh heh heh lol.


Its slow and its only STAB move is incapable of hitting a lot of Pokemon. Its actually weaker than Life Orb Rhyperior. Rhyperior also takes hits FAR better (Solid Rock + Sandstorm means even Seed Bombs and Surfs are doing less to Rhyperior) and STAB Stone Edge is a huge boost.

Tiers don't matter really. The only important one is Ubers, past that the only reason you should care about tier placement is if you're playing UU or NU or something. If you feel Marowak is good, use it.
 

Ace Trainer Jet

Scientist Ichigo
.....So there are no Gen V banned Pokemon yet, aside from the unreleased ones?
 

A.J.

Wobba wobba wobba!
With the Drizzle / Swift Swim combo banned in several places, does this mean Politoed will become UU?
 

T-Moar

Resident Genwunner
Why is it that no thought has been given to banning Evolite?
I realize that I haven't quite been around the Competitive atmosphere for very long, but it seems to me that it is making several final forms (Blissey, Porygon-Z anyone?) almost completely obsolete. Sure, it's easily eliminated by Knock Off, but it still seems to me that Knock Off is largely a wasted move space otherwise.
 
Why is it that no thought has been given to banning Evolite?
I realize that I haven't quite been around the Competitive atmosphere for very long, but it seems to me that it is making several final forms (Blissey, Porygon-Z anyone?) almost completely obsolete. Sure, it's easily eliminated by Knock Off, but it still seems to me that Knock Off is largely a wasted move space otherwise.

Eh, Porygon-Z never really cut it in the past anyways. And Blissey is still used a little more than Chansey. The fact that it can carry Leftovers and can actually hurt stuff with its Special Attack are reasons enough to use it.
 

A.J.

Wobba wobba wobba!
I don't know - Porygon-Z is still a special beast, and even though it's been slightly outclassed by Chandelure, it has better HP and Speed, and IMO a better movepool.

Not to mention that it can OHKO a Calm Mind or Choice Specs Chandelure with a single Dark Pulse. :D
 

dahappybomb

New Member
i think the only reason manaphy is in ubers is cuz kyogre is there also. i mean manaphy kicks *** with rest and rain, plus it could also make a decent special sweeper. but ya with all the changes i think it should probably be brought down to OU, since its in many ways weaker than mew (which is probably, if not already, being brought down).
 
I know the banning with smogon regarding drizzle/swift is done. I personally don't have a problem with this as long as there's only one swift swimmer on their team. Usually I kill the kingdra phew its dead then bam here comes kabutops with swift swim, crap another serious threat. Can I stop this one? Nope ok I wipe fun. Why ban swift swim/ drizzle completely and let sand rush and chlorophyll continue? Either they should be a limit put on these things for teams or its all just going to get banned in very stupid fashion.

Manaphy is too powerful with drizzle, I have nothing against this. I should probably ask this on the smogon forums.
 
Why ban swift swim/ drizzle completely and let sand rush and chlorophyll continue? Either they should be a limit put on these things for teams or its all just going to get banned in very stupid fashion.

The difference is that Swift Swim pokes get their Water STABs boosted, while Sand doesn't boost anything for Sand Rush pokes, and there are no Fire types with Chlorophyll. With Sun and Sand you have to choose between power and speed, while with Rain you get both which makes it better than other forms of weather. The Swift Swim + Drizzle ban simply eliminates the speed part of rain teams to make them more balanced.
 

BaldWombat

Mortal Wombat!
I know the banning with smogon regarding drizzle/swift is done. I personally don't have a problem with this as long as there's only one swift swimmer on their team. Usually I kill the kingdra phew its dead then bam here comes kabutops with swift swim, crap another serious threat. Can I stop this one? Nope ok I wipe fun. Why ban swift swim/ drizzle completely and let sand rush and chlorophyll continue? Either they should be a limit put on these things for teams or its all just going to get banned in very stupid fashion.

Manaphy is too powerful with drizzle, I have nothing against this. I should probably ask this on the smogon forums.

The difference is that Swift Swim pokes get their Water STABs boosted, while Sand doesn't boost anything for Sand Rush pokes, and there are no Fire types with Chlorophyll. With Sun and Sand you have to choose between power and speed, while with Rain you get both which makes it better than other forms of weather. The Swift Swim + Drizzle ban simply eliminates the speed part of rain teams to make them more balanced.

Need to add that water is a great attack type with good coverage and that most water pokes, even those with swift swim, tend to have solid bulk which is unique when compared to the Chlorophyll list.
 
The difference is that Swift Swim pokes get their Water STABs boosted, while Sand doesn't boost anything for Sand Rush pokes, and there are no Fire types with Chlorophyll. With Sun and Sand you have to choose between power and speed, while with Rain you get both which makes it better than other forms of weather. The Swift Swim + Drizzle ban simply eliminates the speed part of rain teams to make them more balanced.

Alright fair enough, it makes sense shouldn't be allowed the best of both worlds so easily.
 

NAMBIRI

Member
I'll throw in my two cents.

Deoxys-S: I'm afraid that D-S will just play the same role that it did back when it was previosly allowed in OU. Even without a solid lead metagame, D-S will still be the fastest Taunter, Spiker, Dual Screener, and attacker in OU...worse, the entire game. This means that he will still likely be broken under the support category. I say keep him Uber

Just to let you know that Deoxys is not the fastest Taunt user. It falls behind every Pokémon that has the ability Prankster and is able to learn Taunt, even level one Sableye which is invincible To lead Deoxys with Taunt, Spikes, Stealth Rock and ExtremeSpeed. OU it is. Beating Aerod. to it.
 

NAMBIRI

Member
Even in Ubers Darkrai has no trouble killing half a team. I used Sub Darkrai almost exclusively and even for teams with a Blissey it was hard to take out.

Now with the new sleep mechanic I say good luck to anyone getting a Dark Voided Pokemon awake again.

Choice Scarf Darkrai in the middle in Triple Battle using Dark Void with Victini by its side and a Pokémon that can trick pass leftovers to Darkrai and trick pass it to one of the opposing Pokémon. That would simply and most certainly womb you the game with 10% accuracy boost due to Victory Star from Victini xD.
 
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