Old Characters in PM2019

[Kuzehiko]

We know for a fact that both AG and Alain's Charizard can hold themselves against mega evolved champions. There's nothing that suggests Cynthia would curbstomp them.

>inb4 cynthia is stronger than diantha/steven in the anime
Prove it.

Just because they can hold up does not mean they can beat them. Nothing has suggested this. The fact that they can hold up against a champions' mega means they are strong close to that level. Alain's a straight E4 level tier and Ash is also close to that level in XY since he can not beat Alain. Champions are stronger than E4 trainer level so a hypothetical Cynthia with mega would still be stronger than either Alain or Ash, simple as that.

I never said that so I have to prove jack, mind you.

 

[Blue Saturday]

I don’t think she needs a dynamic personality for her to be interesting. She has more to her character than just her strength like her affinity for mythology and sweets. She’s also shown to be a great mentor figure. She’s not the world’s most complex character but she’s not just some generic person. Again, I can somewhat see why someone think she’s overrated but I heavily disagree with that if you look at her from that angle

I don’t think Shirona is that much to write home about ur either—her aesthetic as strong attractive waifu is her claim to fame in the fandom. What did she really offer? We got her being shown to be invincible and some slight myths/mentor work but she always seemed overhyped to me. “Strong female character” isn’t about just literal strength but actual character dynamics, developments and interactions/growth. Shirona is mostly just absolutely strong and perfect.

 

[Morax]

Champions are stronger than E4 trainer level so a hypothetical Cynthia with mega would still be stronger than either Alain or Ash, simple as that

You said Cynthia would curbstomp them. That means a one hit knock-out iirc. AG vs M-Gard and MCX vs M-Metagross weren't curbstomps, I don't see how cynthia would perform any differently unless you're assuming that she's stronger than diantha/steven in which case i would like to know how you arrived at that conclusion.

( Of course Cynthia would ultimately win but it wouldn't be an OHKO like it was with paul )

 

[Kuzehiko]

You said Cynthia would curbstomp them. That means a one hit knock-out iirc. AG vs M-Gard and MCX vs M-Metagross weren't curbstomps, I don't see how cynthia would perform any differently unless you're assuming that she's stronger than diantha/steven in which case i would like to know how you arrived at that conclusion.

( Of course Cynthia would ultimately win but it wouldn't be an OHKO like it was with paul ) I get you.

Oh got'cha.
Ok, that's correct, Didn't express correctly. I basically meant that she would beat them in a hypothetical battle. I agree it's not OHKO, It'd be a close battle but as you said she would ultimately end up winning.

 

[Ignition]

I don’t think Shirona is that much to write home about ur either—her aesthetic as strong attractive waifu is her claim to fame in the fandom. What did she really offer? We got her being shown to be invincible and some slight myths/mentor work but she always seemed overhyped to me. “Strong female character” isn’t about just literal strength but actual character dynamics, developments and interactions/growth. Shirona is mostly just absolutely strong and perfect.

There definitely are people who like her just for being strong and attractive but, to me, I like that she’s a very competent Trainer without doing just that. I understand if people don’t see those other aspects to her character as enough to warrant the hype she gets but it makes her character more memorable. I’d say the anime’s portrayal of her is her weakest but it’s still great. Cynthia does what she sets out to be near flawlessly imo. They could’ve elaborated on her other humanizing traits from the games like her relationship with the woman of the Unova Pokémon League or her being unorganized but that’s more so an issue with her not having enough time to do more than just give advice, look at myths & ruins, and battle. I stand by what I said but I can see where you’re coming from.

 

[game3524]

I don’t think Shirona is that much to write home about ur either—her aesthetic as strong attractive waifu is her claim to fame in the fandom. What did she really offer? We got her being shown to be invincible and some slight myths/mentor work but she always seemed overhyped to me. “Strong female character” isn’t about just literal strength but actual character dynamics, developments and interactions/growth. Shirona is mostly just absolutely strong and perfect.

Yeah, she is generic. Most of the champions are for that matter.

 

[Spider-Phoenix]

The only thing I want is more Cynthia over Leon. She is my favorite champion.

I still she is a good character on her own because at first look, she seems mysterious and not approachable when it's the opposite. I also like how she has archeology and history study as a side goal. Interestingly enough it ties quite well with what the boys' been doing.

 

[Leonhart]

I don’t think Shirona is that much to write home about ur either—her aesthetic as strong attractive waifu is her claim to fame in the fandom. What did she really offer? We got her being shown to be invincible and some slight myths/mentor work but she always seemed overhyped to me. “Strong female character” isn’t about just literal strength but actual character dynamics, developments and interactions/growth. Shirona is mostly just absolutely strong and perfect.

I agree, especially with the sentiment that she was portrayed as perfect, which actually irked me. I tend to dislike characters who don't have any noticeable character flaws, and Shirona is one of the few characters that we've encountered who seemed not only invincible as a trainer, but also just too much of a goody two shoes even by this anime's standards.

I think I might actually prefer Carnet over her if only because her Mega Sirnight took a pummeling from Satoshi's Gekkouga, so one could argue that she wasn't as invincible as other Champions are often portrayed.

 

[Jibanyan]

Sure Cynthia is kinda meh but Steven and Lance are the exact same type of character: no flaws at all, beloved and strong and nobody complains about them. I know her fanboys are annoying but the fact people go "sHe iS a MARy sUE" while so are Steven and Lance is ://. The only champion that is mildly interesting is Alder but the games kinda **** over him and then he gets replaced in the sequels with a characters that does nothing during the games.

 

[Ignition]

I agree, especially with the sentiment that she was portrayed as perfect, which actually irked me. I tend to dislike characters who don't have any noticeable character flaws, and Shirona is one of the few characters that we've encountered who seemed not only invincible as a trainer, but also just too much of a goody two shoes even by this anime's standards.

I think I might actually prefer Carnet over her if only because her Mega Sirnight took a pummeling from Satoshi's Gekkouga, so one could argue that she wasn't as invincible as other Champions are often portrayed.

I’ve already spoken about the characteristics criticisms but how was she portrayed as invincible when her first appearance had Paul’s Torterra weaken her Garchomp and was at least near Caitlin’s Gothitelle’s strength?

I wonder how all this started because I said Cynthia vs Ash would be the most hype battle to me.

 

[janejane6178]

I want to see Diantha again..

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

I want to see Diantha again..

Maybe this time no (limited) power of hype will let Ash trounce her much.

 

[Morax]

I want to see Diantha again..

If only she was more involved with the plot but i'd still choose steven over her.

 

[Aryash Bajaj]

I don't know what it is but everytime I meet a Cynthia fan it's all about how hard she was. Maybe I just freaking love weavile so much but I had one on all playthroughs and one time 6 - 0'ed her with one. (Adamant with Sword Dance, Ice Punch, Brick Break and Night Slash. SD against Spiritomb, non STAB silver winds are pathetically weak).

Maybe it's the age when others played the games because in all honesty, Pokemon is never hard if we strategise even a little bit. And that moveset was just just one I came up with on the spot.

But on the other hand, the other champions offer even less than her. Platinum made her role in the galactic affairs very large compared to the other champions. Alder's I think was more connecting to the player but that's for another day.

But the final part to her popularity is ... raw appeal (for the lack of a better word). The amount of fanart that is of those sorts isn't a coincidence. A badass female character who is super strong also helps with that I think.

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

Cynthia is also hard to beat because her game of origin simply didn't have viable level grinding other than literally level grinding through her turf, coupled with how dangerous she is for having a diverse team set up.

Come next game, Audino encounters are born, and everything became history.

 

[Ignition]

Considering we have a game about Sinnoh’s past coming up, it’d be cool to see Drasna make her debut. Doubt it’d ever happen but no one ever saw Wikstrom debuting or Chuck of all people returning so who knows?

 

[PsychoLogical]

Considering we have a game about Sinnoh’s past coming up, it’d be cool to see Drasna make her debut. Doubt it’d ever happen but no one ever saw Wikstrom debuting or Chuck of all people returning so who knows?

If they were willing to bring back someone as forgettable as Chuck then there’s no reason why they shouldn’t or wouldn’t debut Drasna. Would also be a good opportunity to do so if JN ends up being a 4 year series (which ofc would be the first since the DP saga)

Which also reminds me that there are some “certain” E4 members that could use a debut.

 

[Ignition]

If they were willing to bring back someone as forgettable as Chuck then there’s no reason why they shouldn’t or wouldn’t debut Drasna. Would also be a good opportunity to do so if JN ends up being a 4 year series (which ofc would be the first since the DP saga)

Which also reminds me that there are some “certain” E4 members that could use a debut.

Agreed. I think every major character in the games should have some showcasing in the anime whether it’d be past series or Journeys.

 

[SatoSereFan224888]

If Dawn is to return, I would like to see her having a Houndour cutely named Howie who basically is a guard dog for her. Don’t worry, the Houndour would be well trained.

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

If Dawn is to return, I would like to see her having a Houndour cutely named Howie who basically is a guard dog for her. Don’t worry, the Houndour would be well trained.

None of the characters are Ritchie.

Or Gary while in a Mewtwo movie.