Omega Ruby & Alpha Sapphire: Expectations & Desires? [Not a speculation thread]

[Endolise]

unless they made facing the cover mascot optional

but that's literally never been done

But then, you may not see their SUPER-EPIC POWERS OF ULTIMATE MEGANESS.

 

[Excitable Boy]

But then, you may not see their SUPER-EPIC POWERS OF ULTIMATE MEGANESS.

and whose fault would that be? they'd still exist and be available, mind

 

[Endolise]

and whose fault would that be? they'd still exist and be available, mind

Yes, but what kind of weirdo doesn't want to harness those SUPER-ULTIMATE MEGA POWERS in a Nest Ball and then cut through the Elite Four like a hot missile through butter? Especially when there are more important things to play, like Candy Crush.

 

[Excitable Boy]

if you want it, then go get it?

 

[Endolise]

if you want it, then go get it?

Hmm... well, alright, that could work. But only if an NPC offers to port you there, and then does it anyway.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

I'm still waiting for Game Freak to remember how to do an evil team without involving major legendaries

Remember? They've never done a good plot that doesn't involve the legendaries.

unless they made facing the cover mascot optional

but that's literally never been done

Well technically they did in GSC, but that game didn't have much of a story.

At any rate, I don't think they'll do that, they put the legendaries in the storyline for marketing purposes. They draw in people by putting a badass legendary on the cover and build up to its eventual capture at the end. If they made it optional, players would feel cheated if they have trouble finding it.

 

[Excitable Boy]

Remember? They've never done a good plot that doesn't involve the legendaries.

I didn't use either the word "good" or the word "plot"

If they made it optional, players would feel cheated if they have trouble finding it.

How hard do you think it would be?

it's still Pokemon; it's not like the dungeons are some paragon of difficulty

 

[crystalphoenix88]

personally, I wouldn't mind a break from the Gen III - Gen VI formula of: villaneous team + boxart legendary = plan to takeover/obliterate the world that we the player must stop, which involves catching said legendary for ourselves. obviously I've stilled enjoyed those games, or I wouldn't still be playing, but I liked that TR was basically just a crime mob/mafia who use Pokémon instead of guns to accomplish their crimes, and not some cult with an extremist leader looking to literally reshape the planet, create a new universe, etc.

(I realize I'm smiplifying TR a bit here, but my point is I felt like they didn't dominate the story with an over-the-top goal involving legendary Pokèmon the way all subsequent teams have.)

 

[BurningWhiteKyurem]

But he did have a tragic backstory. You learn about it from his grandfather in the Battle Zone region area.

It wasn't nearly expanded enough. IIRC, the grandfather's dialogue basically came down to: loved being around machines rather than people > felt like he could never live up to his parents' expectations despite implication that he is a prodigy > came to the conclusion that emotions = bad. The problem is, how did he go from being rejected by parents and not having a figure to guide him, to making the conclusion that emotions are the strife of humanity? The 4th gen games didn't really make that connection clear enough, especially when these two things don't really appear to be mutually inclusive to the naked eye.

Well, the majority of Team Galactic either didn't even know what the end goal was, or believed it to be something that would benefit them, but they were a cult anyway.

Cyrus believed that emotions were the source of strife and suffering (and, is he wrong?), and sought to remove those things from existence. The myths of Sinnoh claim that spirit is integrally linked to time and space, and so by using Dialga and Palkia, he can break down the existing spacetime and replace it with one of his own design.

He isn't wrong per se, but resorting to re-creating a universe without emotions is ridiculous and comes with a bevy of problems. Without emotions, there'd be no incentive to improve one's status, and most significantly, there wouldn't be any communication which is vital to humanity's existence as a species. People in-game think he would've created a utopia, but in actuality, it would've been a dystopia.

But that was like... the whole point? Cyrus was only using his minions and followers as a means to an end; he didn't actually care about them, and intentionally hired idiots because they would do as they were told to do and wouldn't ask questions.

And yet his commanders were completely fine with what he wanted to do when they had knowledge of what Cyrus wanted to accomplish (even when they had their own agenda post-Cyrus disappearing in Distortion World). I suppose it works well in showing how Cyrus is devoid of emotion, but at the same time, it makes it pretty difficult to associate or even understand him. As for the team as a whole, if enough people share Cyrus's pain, and believe in his vision, they weren't going to question him anyway (just like no one within Team Plasma questioned the Sages, N, or Ghetsis when they all believed in the team's values).

 

[Marsalevsky]

The talk of another Kanto remake with a new story makes me think (not sure if this was posted) - I know the Birds have been way too common in the past, but what if they actually got a purpose? What if Team Rocket this time decided to harness their power, along with Mega Evolution, to basically take over the world? Simple story, yes, but it's a lot better than the original one.

 

[Excitable Boy]

seems pretty unique

never heard of Pokemon doing something like that before

how could it possibly play out

truly, I am now motivated to play Pokemon for the plot

 

[Disaster_Lord]

The talk of another Kanto remake with a new story makes me think (not sure if this was posted) - I know the Birds have been way too common in the past, but what if they actually got a purpose? What if Team Rocket this time decided to harness their power, along with Mega Evolution, to basically take over the world? Simple story, yes, but it's a lot better than the original one.

Sounds like many lame FF to me. TR on all media seemed profits and would do everything from them, getting a bioweapon on some media was just another way to get on their way. Giovanni was never a megalomaniac just a very shaddy mob Lord with the gym leader facade and high steem to roll on rookie trainers.

 

[Aielyn]

The talk of another Kanto remake with a new story makes me think (not sure if this was posted) - I know the Birds have been way too common in the past, but what if they actually got a purpose? What if Team Rocket this time decided to harness their power, along with Mega Evolution, to basically take over the world? Simple story, yes, but it's a lot better than the original one.

Team Rocket are the mob. They want money. So it wouldn't make sense for them to try to use the Birds for some sort of world domination. But I like the idea of the birds having a real purpose. They could perhaps use the birds along with some of the other Teams to make things a bit more interesting. Perhaps Team Plasma, Team Galactic, and Team Flare could each go for one of the Birds (the natural choices would be Galactic -> Articuno, Plasma -> Zapdos, Flare -> Moltres), with each having a mega evolution that suits the team's plans (with the abilities being something a little unconventional)...

Team Galactic wanted to remake the world in order to remove emotion. Their goal was undoubtedly the coldest, wanting to remove the heat of emotions. For them, Articuno would be their target. A mega ability suited to such an idea wouldn't be too hard to come up with (a very rough idea, that probably wouldn't be sufficiently workable, would be to make "attraction" cause physical harm). Articuno would essentially be the legendary bird of the cold heart. Also notice that their team name effectively refers to the coldness of space.

Team Plasma wanted to separate humanity from pokemon (viewing from N's side, not Ghetsis's side). Although the connection with electricity is vague at best in terms of goals, the name of the team suits Zapdos well, and its mega ability could easily be something to do with making Pokemon refuse to obey their trainer (perhaps with Happiness levels influencing the chance of failure to obey?).

Team Flare has a more selfish motive, wanting to enhance "beauty" by obliterating all that they consider un-beautiful. Moltres would probably be called the most beautiful of the birds, and the idea of rebirth to a more beautiful form suits Moltres given its obvious connection to the Phoenix. Its ability could perhaps cause its attack power to be higher for pokemon that don't have high Beauty condition (I'm assuming, here, that pokeblocks or equivalent reappear), or something like that. Alternatively, it could go more literal, and have its ability be more of a rebirth process whereby, upon switching pokemon after it's KO'd, it revives with 1 HP, meaning it can only be defeated if it's the last pokemon in the team.

Obviously, that's just one example of a scenario that could work. I'm not saying this is the way it should be done, just demonstrating the potential.

Alternatively, they could simplify it down, make Flare the team that want all three, and have them all represent rebirth (they all resemble the Phoenix, albeit with different elements) and beauty. Perhaps their rebirth capabilities could mean that, in their Mega forms, they're together capable of powering the Ultimate Weapon without requiring more pokemon. Their combined power could also perhaps be capable of revitalising an area, thus giving a positive purpose to their power.

 

[Lorde]

I'm enjoying OR on its own far more than I anticipated, so I can live without Frontier, but this still comes off as weird. I understand know what he's saying about getting frustrated with these types of places, but I've also felt that the last few generations have already taken some steps to make things easier. .

I don't see how battle facilities themselves are any easier in recent games; the Battle Maison in OR/AS is a challenge on its own imho; I would've personally loathed to have seen the BF and its complexity return.

 

[BurningWhiteKyurem]

I don't see how battle facilities themselves are any easier in recent games; the Battle Maison in OR/AS is a challenge on its own imho; I would've personally loathed to have seen the BF and its complexity return.

Not sure how the BF is any more "complex" than the Battle Maison. Not to mention, the Maison is challenging for all the wrong reasons (as has been the case ever since Gen IV), all thanks to its reliance on artificial difficulty. Even worse so, the challenge factor is rehashed from older facilities anyways, so it's the same old boring experience.

 

[Alexander18]

I don't see how battle facilities themselves are any easier in recent games; the Battle Maison in OR/AS is a challenge on its own imho; I would've personally loathed to have seen the BF and its complexity return.

I disagree, the Battle Maison had no business being in the Hoenn region, Game Freak should have brought the Battle Frontier back as well as other Emerald based stuff. But they mess it up by sticking too close to the original. They should have left the Battle Maison for the next Kalos game. And lets not forget that they allowed Deoxys into the game but not Jirachi, we now got a gap between it and Rayquaza. They could have included Jirachi but nope they choose otherwise. And I wanted to see the two Primals battle in Sootopolis but that didn't happen. These are the cons to these games and I think Game Freak should have done better in my opinion. But I enjoyed new features such as Soaring and going to Southern Island. I also liked the starters of other regions being in the game as well as other legendaries.

 

[Lorde]

I disagree, the Battle Maison had no business being in the Hoenn region, Game Freak should have brought the Battle Frontier back as well as other Emerald based stuff. But they mess it up by sticking too close to the original. They should have left the Battle Maison for the next Kalos game. And lets not forget that they allowed Deoxys into the game but not Jirachi, we now got a gap between it and Rayquaza. They could have included Jirachi but nope they choose otherwise. And I wanted to see the two Primals battle in Sootopolis but that didn't happen. These are the cons to these games and I think Game Freak should have done better in my opinion. But I enjoyed new features such as Soaring and going to Southern Island. I also liked the starters of other regions being in the game as well as other legendaries.

These were hyped as remakes of R/S specifically, so why were Emerald elements like the Groudon vs. Kyogre thing in Sootopolis expected when it would conflict with the events from R/S?

 

[Endolise]

It wasn't nearly expanded enough. IIRC, the grandfather's dialogue basically came down to: loved being around machines rather than people > felt like he could never live up to his parents' expectations despite implication that he is a prodigy > came to the conclusion that emotions = bad. The problem is, how did he go from being rejected by parents and not having a figure to guide him, to making the conclusion that emotions are the strife of humanity? The 4th gen games didn't really make that connection clear enough, especially when these two things don't really appear to be mutually inclusive to the naked eye.

Well I would assume that all of the neglect and stress that he experienced caused him pain and inner turmoil, and that his aim of eliminating emotion was a response to that. He feels this pain, and is conditioned to hold himself to too high a standard. And he sees that other people are suffering as well, and that they are experiencing similar pain. So maybe this pain is the root of the problem - if nobody had their emotions, then they wouldn't be held back by them, and maybe they could become complete. That's how I took it, anyway, but it's not as if this is even the norm for their villains. We don't know what started Giovanni on his life of crime. We don't know what made Archer so unflinchingly loyal to Giovanni. We don't know what convinced Maxie to seek more land for human expansion. We don't know why Ghetsis is the cruel monster that he is. We do get some details on the roots of Archie's and Lysandre's beliefs, and a lot on N's, but it's not as if Cyrus is lacking any more than a good deal of the rest. The problem there extends beyond just Cyrus.

He isn't wrong per se, but resorting to re-creating a universe without emotions is ridiculous and comes with a bevy of problems. Without emotions, there'd be no incentive to improve one's status, and most significantly, there wouldn't be any communication which is vital to humanity's existence as a species. People in-game think he would've created a utopia, but in actuality, it would've been a dystopia.

None of that matters, though, because his ideal universe is one that includes only himself. A population of one doesn't have anyone else to communicate with, and he didn't want people to expand or advance. He wanted to return things to how they were in the beginning of the universe, when only time flowed and space expanded. Before spirit came along and tainted it all.

And yet his commanders were completely fine with what he wanted to do when they had knowledge of what Cyrus wanted to accomplish (even when they had their own agenda post-Cyrus disappearing in Distortion World).

Even the Commanders weren't aware of the full scope of the plan. Saturn, for instance, knew that the intention was to create a new universe, but he did not know that Cyrus wanted to rid the world of spirit, and later, after finding out about it, comments on how it would have been horrible if he had succeeded.

I suppose it works well in showing how Cyrus is devoid of emotion, but at the same time, it makes it pretty difficult to associate or even understand him. As for the team as a whole, if enough people share Cyrus's pain, and believe in his vision, they weren't going to question him anyway (just like no one within Team Plasma questioned the Sages, N, or Ghetsis when they all believed in the team's values).

That is an equally valid way of going about it, yes.

 

[Psynergy]

While I hate to cut this discussion short, it seems that this thread is starting to overstay its welcome and stray from its intended purpose. We don't really need this thread to turn into a discussion of "what do we expect/desire for the next game" since this was meant for Expectations and Desires in OR/AS, but now that the game is already out there's not much reason to discuss what desires we have for a game that's already out.

If you guys want to discuss/complain about the Battle Frontier's absence take it to the Hoenn Region Thread, character discussion can go in the respective thread, etc.