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Opinions about the Team Flare arc?

Epicocity

Well-Known Member
This wasn't enough. The games version was terrible, but they tried harder with Lysandre's motivations.
Um...his motivations in the game were the same, just without the extra backstory. There he claimed humans were selfish, greedy people who did nothing but compete and take things for themselves, the same as he explains in the anime. The anime just elaborates that he tried to help humanity only to be treated like this.

About the only depth Lysandre got in the games was his lamenting that Pokemon would also have to die, but at the same time the anime made it clear that before he was forced on his backup plan, he wanted to guide the world to a better future using people like Ash, which is very different from the hypocritical "chosen elite" that were actually the selfish humans he hated so much.

I don't know where you get the idea game Lysandre was any different since he was so barebones.
 

Jeal

Well-Known Member
Um...his motivations in the game were the same, just without the extra backstory. There he claimed humans were selfish, greedy people who did nothing but compete and take things for themselves, the same as he explains in the anime. The anime just elaborates that he tried to help humanity only to be treated like this.

About the only depth Lysandre got in the games was his lamenting that Pokemon would also have to die, but at the same time the anime made it clear that before he was forced on his backup plan, he wanted to guide the world to a better future using people like Ash, which is very different from the hypocritical "chosen elite" that were actually the selfish humans he hated so much.

I don't know where you get the idea game Lysandre was any different since he was so barebones.
I didn't say he was different. I said they tried harder explaining his motivations than a few seconds monologue, and a static flashback. Both were shallow, but anime Lysandre was more. Anime Lysandre's motivations were even weaker than game Lysandre's(this is a feat).
 

Spider-Phoenix

#ChespinGang
I mean, to me, the Flare arc was about everyone's character arcs wrapping up succinctly, not necessarily making sure they were all active and beating enemies. For Serena, that means her stepping closer to being Kalos Queen, which is giving to others without anything in return. That's what she was doing for Mairin.

And even so, she still kicked some vines to the curb alongside all the fighters before the Gym Leaders had to bail everyone out.

I'm not saying she couldn't have done more, so much as I don't think it was necessary to, because it was the perfect capstone on her character arc like it was for everyone else.
Fair points but everyone more or less played key and somewhat big roles. Ash was in the center of everything and battle Lysandre. Clemont had a dedicated episode with him doing his thing and having to cope with Clembot's sacrifice. Bonnie helped Squishy snap out. And all those more or less had dedicated episodes.

In the meantime Serena beat vines. Sure, she helped Mairin but that kind pales to what everyone else was up to. I mean, we got to see even Sawyer beating up vines and if I recall he was the one tasked with protecting everyone sheltered in the pokémon center.

I dunno, I think I would have liked Serena's role in this arc more if it wasn't so subtle. Yeah, sometimes less is more but sometimes things need to be spelled out for clarity
 

Jeal

Well-Known Member
Fair points but everyone more or less played key and somewhat big roles. Ash was in the center of everything and battle Lysandre. Clemont had a dedicated episode with him doing his thing and having to cope with Clembot's sacrifice. Bonnie helped Squishy snap out. And all those more or less had dedicated episodes.

In the meantime Serena beat vines. Sure, she helped Mairin but that kind pales to what everyone else was up to. I mean, we got to see even Sawyer beating up vines and if I recall he was the one tasked with protecting everyone sheltered in the pokémon center.

I dunno, I think I would have liked Serena's role in this arc more if it wasn't so subtle. Yeah, sometimes less is more but sometimes things need to be spelled out for clarity
It was very obvious that the writers didn't care about her in this point. I wonder if they disliked
her themselves, and just included her in the cast out of obligation, considering how she was treated the entire saga.

Man, even TRio made something.
 

Epicocity

Well-Known Member
I didn't say he was different. I said they tried harder explaining his motivations than a few seconds monologue, and a static flashback. Both were shallow, but anime Lysandre was more. Anime Lysandre's motivations were even weaker than game Lysandre's(this is a feat).
They were the same motivation. Literally. I don't know why you're saying the anime version was dropped hard when he literally had more than game Lysandre who just went on random tangents about beauty and then said all humanity is selfish. This Lysandre at least was a philanthropist before becoming so misanthropic and genocidal. Not that Lysandre is meant to be a deep villain in any media, but I really don't see this idea of him being done better in the games...

It was very obvious that the writers didn't care about her in this point. I wonder if they disliked
her themselves, and just included her in the cast out of obligation, considering how she was treated the entire saga.

Man, even TRio made something.
How she was treated? Not to turn this into another Serena thread (Lord knows it happens enough here), but Serena has one of the most consistent character trajectories in the entire series, one that caps off in Flare. Perhaps as @Spider-Phoenix suggests, it's a bit more subtle than the bombastic Ash and Clemont parts, but her character line was pulled through the entire series and hardly forgotten at any point, especially when its major conclusion is after the arc.

I really don't know why people say the writers didn't care about her when they gave her one of the most well-rounded approaches up there with Dawn. Is it just because she's not battling all the time? Cause that's silly.
 

RafaSceptile

Well-Known Member
It was very obvious that the writers didn't care about her in this point. I wonder if they disliked
her themselves, and just included her in the cast out of obligation, considering how she was treated the entire saga.

Man, even TRio made something.
It feels like writers never care about her outside of Performances and Amourshipping,
 

Jeal

Well-Known Member
They were the same motivation. Literally. I don't know why you're saying the anime version was dropped hard when he literally had more than game Lysandre who just went on random tangents about beauty and then said all humanity is selfish. This Lysandre at least was a philanthropist before becoming so misanthropic and genocidal. Not that Lysandre is meant to be a deep villain in any media, but I really don't see this idea of him being done better in the games...


How she was treated? Not to turn this into another Serena thread (Lord knows it happens enough here), but Serena has one of the most consistent character trajectories in the entire series, one that caps off in Flare. Perhaps as @Spider-Phoenix suggests, it's a bit more subtle than the bombastic Ash and Clemont parts, but her character line was pulled through the entire series and hardly forgotten at any point, especially when its major conclusion is after the arc.

I really don't know why people say the writers didn't care about her when they gave her one of the most well-rounded approaches up there with Dawn. Is it just because she's not battling all the time? Cause that's silly.
Some of game Lysandre quotes

"People can be divided into two groups. Those who give... And those who take... It's just as how the Kalos region's two Legendary Pokémon gave life and took life. I want to be the kind of person who gives... But in this world, some foolish humans exist who would show their strength by taking what isn't theirs. They're filth!"

"Even though resources, space, and energy on this planet are limited, the number of people and Pokémon has increased to an unsustainable level. Whether it's money or energy, the ones who steal are the ones who win in this world. So, tell me. The Mega Ring, did you share it? When there is only one of something, it can't be shared. When something can't be shared, it will be fought over. And when something is fought over, some must survive without it. The only way to create a world where people live in beauty, a world without conflict or theft, is to reduce the number of living things."

"Pokémon... Shall no longer exist. Pokémon are wonderful beings. Humans have worked with Pokémon, and we have helped each other flourish. But precisely because of that, they will inevitably become tools for war and theft"

"If that were possible, all wars would have ended long ago! I can only see one future! One where selfish, foolish humans think about nothing other than themselves and steal more and more from one another... It's a tragic future!"




It's shallow and dumb, but it's something.



Anime Lysandre is something like this

"There was a time when I also tried to help people. But they started to think it was an obligation to help them. Therefore, I will kill everyone."

That's it. Game Lysandre talks about overpopulation, limited resources, theft, wars. Anime Lysandre talks about people demanding help.



I don't see how she and Dawn can be compared. Dawn was almost protagonist together with Ash. Serena was ignored for almost a year.

The first episode of DP is completely focused on Dawn. Serena appears for a few seconds in the first 5 episodes.

Dawn had 6 episodes focused on her in the first 10 episodes. Serena don't get one until XY021.

Dawn's first battle is the focus of an episode. Serena's is offscreen.

Even looking at Serena's goal you see the writers didn't care enough to think on it. They simply mixed things Serena was good(bake poképuffs, interact with Rhyhorn) and ta-da! A goal for the protagonist.

Serena was the game protagonist, even so she didn't get the same level of focus as May and Dawn. As a fan of hers, I think this is outrageous.
 
It was ridiculous. If you think it was a plan that made sense, or was good, then there's no point.

They made it clear that the world would be completely destroyed if the Megalith and the Sundial were reunited. This includes his elite.

Oh, did you mean one scene while the rest of the episode revolved around Ash and Alan? A Clemont episode for sure.

A significant role lol she didn't even rescue it. Ash and Alan did it. She wasn't even able to make a scratch in one of the grunts's pokémon. She didn't even do the only thing that she was said to do, to protect Bonnie and Manon.

Oh, you mean that the explanation is simply he can do it? That's cool. We don't need things to make sense anyway.

No, even the games tried to give Lysandre some reasoning(it was still terrible, but they tried.) Anime doesn't even try. He makes a dumb monologue with a static flashback and that's it. Even the typical world domination goal has more reasoning, even the TM/TA's dumb goals had more sense in their motivation.

He didn't capture Ash, he stood still. He never had a antagonistic battle with Ash as the opening suggested.

No, Alan thought that Lysandre wanted world peace. Malva, on the other hand, seemed to be perfectly aware of Lysandre's true intentions. She knew Lysandre was manipulating Alan. She switching sides made no sense.

It was a good arc for Pokémon, but I am sure there are lots of better arcs in other animes.
Buddy, you don't justify anything. You give basic one-liners and don't substantiate. Nothing you say has any weight because it's literally just your opinion with nothing behind it. You're going to need to actually explain why you think it was ridiculous. Like, this has basically been your modus operandi this entire conversation. Say absolutely nothing of substance and pretend what you saw was the reality of what happened in the show.

Yes, they put plenty of focus on Clemont in that episode.

This is something that seems to be prevalent here, I'm not sure you've actually watched the TF arc or at least it's been a while since you've seen it. Serena was literally assigned to help Manon's Chespin and break into TF's home base. Did you forget that or are you just purposefully ignoring
that.

Are you just willingly ignoring what I said? I quite literally said that one can use deductive reasoning to ascertain that the power clearly comes from AG's connection with Ash and the power that comes from the bond. This isn't something that's hard to see.

Epicocicity already talked about Lysandre here.

Lmao, the opening didn't have an " antagonistic battle " with each other as well. It quite literally just framed it between Alain and TF arc versus the Kalos crew which happened in the show. There's no antagonistic battle in the opening between Alain and Ash in context of the Team Flare.

No, literally nothing in the ME Acts nor in the show itself showcased Malva's being aware that Lysandre was going to cull Pokemon and people alike in his efforts to reach his goals.


Some of game Lysandre quotes

"People can be divided into two groups. Those who give... And those who take... It's just as how the Kalos region's two Legendary Pokémon gave life and took life. I want to be the kind of person who gives... But in this world, some foolish humans exist who would show their strength by taking what isn't theirs. They're filth!"

"Even though resources, space, and energy on this planet are limited, the number of people and Pokémon has increased to an unsustainable level. Whether it's money or energy, the ones who steal are the ones who win in this world. So, tell me. The Mega Ring, did you share it? When there is only one of something, it can't be shared. When something can't be shared, it will be fought over. And when something is fought over, some must survive without it. The only way to create a world where people live in beauty, a world without conflict or theft, is to reduce the number of living things."

"Pokémon... Shall no longer exist. Pokémon are wonderful beings. Humans have worked with Pokémon, and we have helped each other flourish. But precisely because of that, they will inevitably become tools for war and theft"

"If that were possible, all wars would have ended long ago! I can only see one future! One where selfish, foolish humans think about nothing other than themselves and steal more and more from one another... It's a tragic future!"




It's shallow and dumb, but it's something.



Anime Lysandre is something like this

"There was a time when I also tried to help people. But they started to think it was an obligation to help them. Therefore, I will kill everyone."

That's it. Game Lysandre talks about overpopulation, limited resources, theft, wars. Anime Lysandre talks about people demanding help.



I don't see how she and Dawn can be compared. Dawn was almost protagonist together with Ash. Serena was ignored for almost a year.

The first episode of DP is completely focused on Dawn. Serena appears for a few seconds in the first 5 episodes.

Dawn had 6 episodes focused on her in the first 10 episodes. Serena don't get one until XY021.

Dawn's first battle is the focus of an episode. Serena's is offscreen.

Even looking at Serena's goal you see the writers didn't care enough to think on it. They simply mixed things Serena was good(bake poképuffs, interact with Rhyhorn) and ta-da! A goal for the protagonist.

Serena was the game protagonist, even so she didn't get the same level of focus as May and Dawn. As a fan of hers, I think this is outrageous.
If you want to make a thread about Serena, go ahead, there's a million of them already made and I've already addressed many of the same, tired arguments. This is a TF arc, if you want to moan about Serena, do it somewhere else.

Nothing you've said here is accurate, several of the beginning episodes have plenty of moments focused on Serena interspersed in the episodes, addressing everything from what she was doing, why she was doing it, what kind of character she was, etc. Episode 7 is literally a Serena focused episode.

Are you sure you've watched XY? That's what I think is outrageous. Caling Serena's goal a mix of " baking pokepuffs and interacting with Rhyhorn " is idiocy to the highest extreme.
 

Jeal

Well-Known Member
Buddy, you don't justify anything. You give basic one-liners and don't substantiate. Nothing you say has any weight because it's literally just your opinion with nothing behind it. You're going to need to actually explain why you think it was ridiculous.

Yes, they put plenty of focus on Clemont in that episode.

This is something that seems to be prevalent here, I'm not sure you've actually watched the TF arc or at least it's been a while since you've seen it. Serena was literally assigned to help Manon's Chespin and break into TF's home base. Did you forget that or are you just purposefully ignoring
that.

Are you just willingly ignoring what I said? I quite literally said that one can use deductive reasoning to ascertain that the power clearly comes from AG's connection with Ash and the power that comes from the bond. This isn't something that's hard to see.

Epicocicity already talked about Lysandre here.

Lmao, the opening didn't have an " antagonistic battle " with each other as well. It quite literally just framed it between Alain and TF arc versus the Kalos crew which happened in the show. There's no antagonistic battle in the opening between Alain and Ash in context of the Team Flare.

No, literally nothing in the ME Acts nor in the show itself showcased Malva's being aware that Lysandre was going to cull Pokemon and people alike in his efforts to reach his goals.




If you want to make a thread about Serena, go ahead, there's a million of them already made and I've already addressed many of the same, tired arguments.

Nothing you've said here is accurate, several of the beginning episodes have plenty of moments focused on Serena interspersed in the episodes, addressing everything from what she was doing, why she was doing it, what kind of character she was, etc. Episode 7 is literally a Serena focused episode.

Are you sure you've watched XY? That's what I think is outrageous. Caling Serena's goal a mix of " baking pokepuffs and interacting with Rhyhorn " is idiocy to the highest extreme.
This is why I said it was pointless to argument. XY is this perfect series for you, no one can critizes it. If you think so, so it's ok. I won't try change your opinion.

And no, ep 7 was focused on Ash, not Serena.
 
This is why I said it was pointless to argument. XY is this perfect series for you, no one can critizes it. If you think so, so it's ok. I won't try change your opinion.

And no, ep 7 was focused on Ash, not Serena.
Yes, it's pointless to argue with people who don't substantiate anything they've said and pretend that their opinions are somehow reality. What we should be doing is having a debate about the show and whether our opinions have merit, not spouting straight up lies about what happened and hiding behind the idea that it's just our opinions. Again, throughout this thread, you've quite literally given no specifics on what you believe besides a couple of statements that ring totally hollow since you seem incapable of expanding on it.

It's funny that you think that I believe XY is perfect. I went on a rant about my problems with the Kalos League on my profile.

...Lol, again, this is why I question whether or not you've actually watched the show. Episode 7 is literally about Serena and Rhyhorn and it's tied into what she wants to do with her life. Episode 7 is literally the episode in which Serena tells the group why she left as well as her background with Ash at the Summer Camp. Do you not know this?
 

Jeal

Well-Known Member
Buddy, you don't justify anything. You give basic one-liners and don't substantiate. Nothing you say has any weight because it's literally just your opinion with nothing behind it. You're going to need to actually explain why you think it was ridiculous. Like, this has basically been your modus operandi this entire conversation. Say absolutely nothing of substance and pretend what you saw was the reality of what happened in the show.

Yes, they put plenty of focus on Clemont in that episode.

This is something that seems to be prevalent here, I'm not sure you've actually watched the TF arc or at least it's been a while since you've seen it. Serena was literally assigned to help Manon's Chespin and break into TF's home base. Did you forget that or are you just purposefully ignoring
that.

Are you just willingly ignoring what I said? I quite literally said that one can use deductive reasoning to ascertain that the power clearly comes from AG's connection with Ash and the power that comes from the bond. This isn't something that's hard to see.

Epicocicity already talked about Lysandre here.

Lmao, the opening didn't have an " antagonistic battle " with each other as well. It quite literally just framed it between Alain and TF arc versus the Kalos crew which happened in the show. There's no antagonistic battle in the opening between Alain and Ash in context of the Team Flare.

No, literally nothing in the ME Acts nor in the show itself showcased Malva's being aware that Lysandre was going to cull Pokemon and people alike in his efforts to reach his goals.




If you want to make a thread about Serena, go ahead, there's a million of them already made and I've already addressed many of the same, tired arguments. This is a TF arc, if you want to moan about Serena, do it somewhere else.

Nothing you've said here is accurate, several of the beginning episodes have plenty of moments focused on Serena interspersed in the episodes, addressing everything from what she was doing, why she was doing it, what kind of character she was, etc. Episode 7 is literally a Serena focused episode.

Are you sure you've watched XY? That's what I think is outrageous. Caling Serena's goal a mix of " baking pokepuffs and interacting with Rhyhorn " is idiocy to the highest extreme.
"plenty of focus" lol, yeah. 3 minutes out of 20 minutes is a lot of focus.

Yeah, and exactly what she did? Steven did all the job. And chespin wasn't saved. It was absorved by the megalith and then it was saved by Ash and Alan.

It doesn't matter. They didn't explain why Greninja could see it. What are you saying is "they didn't explain, but we can think in something".

She knew Lysandre was manipulating Alan, so she obviously was aware of his true intentions.

Do you know read? I didn't say she never appeared, I compared her focus on the first episodes with May and Dawn. Compared to both, it was nothing.

So, do you deny that baking poképuffs and interacting with Rhyhorns were introduced as the thematic part on showcases? Will you go this far?
Yes, it's pointless to argue with people who don't substantiate anything they've said and pretend that their opinions are somehow reality. What we should be doing is having a debate about the show and whether our opinions have merit, not spouting straight up lies about what happened and hiding behind the idea that it's just our opinions. Again, throughout this thread, you've quite literally given no specifics on what you believe besides a couple of statements that ring totally hollow since you seem incapable of expanding on it.

It's funny that you think that I believe XY is perfect. I went on a rant about my problems with the Kalos League on my profile.

...Lol, again, this is why I question whether or not you've actually watched the show. Episode 7 is literally about Serena and Rhyhorn and it's tied into what she wants to do with her life. Episode 7 is literally the episode in which Serena tells the group why she left as well as her background with Ash at the Summer Camp. Do you not know this?
It is you who is spouting lies to defend your favorite series.

Oh yeah, getting mad about Ash losing makes you less of a XY worshipper.

Fine, it's a Serena episode. I will give it to you.

Ignoring XY' flaws don't make them disappear. I was like you too at the time, I thought XY was perfect. Now I can see the flaws.

A genwunner will always say that the first season is the best one ever, even the battles being a joke, the plot nonexistent and no character arcs.
 
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RafaSceptile

Well-Known Member
"plenty of focus" lol, yeah. 3 minutes out of 20 minutes is a lot of focus.

Yeah, and exactly what she did? Steven did all the job. And chespin wasn't saved. It was absorved by the megalith and then it was saved by Ash and Alan.

It doesn't matter. They didn't explain why Greninja could see it. What are you saying is "they didn't explain, but we can think in something".

She knew Lysandre was manipulating Alan, so she obviously was aware of his true intentions.

Do you know read? I didn't say she never appeared, I compared her focus on the first episodes with May and Dawn. Compared to both, it was nothing.

So, do you deny that baking poképuffs and interacting with Rhyhorns was introduced as the thematic part on showcases? Will you go this far?

It is you who is spouting lies to defend your favorite series.

Oh yeah, getting mad about Ash losing makes you less of a XY worshipper.

Fine, it's a Serena episode. I will give it to you.

Ignoring XY' flaws don't make them disappear. I was like you too at the time, I thought XY was perfect. Now I can see the flaws.

A genwunner will always say that the first season is the best one ever, even the battles being a joke, the plot nonexistent and no character arcs.
One of the flaws of the XY series is that even when some scenes are beautiful the script is ridiculously bad. For example, when Serena cut her hair, The scene is precious and it is symbolic of change, but the fact that Palermo magically was interested in a random girl in front of the sea cutting her hair for apparently no reasons kill the end of this scene. And this is a problem even during serious episodes, and it wasn't intentionally.
 

Jeal

Well-Known Member
One of the flaws of the XY series is that even when some scenes are beautiful the script is ridiculously bad. For example, when Serena cut her hair, The scene is precious and it is symbolic of change, but the fact that Palermo magically was interested in a random girl in front of the sea cutting her hair for apparently no reasons kill the end of this scene. And this is a problem even during serious episodes, and it wasn't intentionally.
I didn't have a problem with Yashio, but I thought that Serena's crying was exaggerated. It sounded more dramatic than I thought it should have been.
 

RafaSceptile

Well-Known Member
I didn't have a problem with Yashio, but I thought that Serena's crying was exaggerated. It sounded more dramatic than I thought it should have been.
Serena crying is fine imo, she is still 10 years old. But cutting her hair in that form was definitely exaggerated.
 

Jeal

Well-Known Member
Serena crying is fine imo, she is still 10 years old. But cutting her hair in that form was definitely exaggerated.
I thought it was a beautiful scene. One of the best of the entire anime, in my opinion.

I wonder what was the point of Yashio. Aside from sending Serena to Hoenn, she did nothing. I think Serena could have decided that on her own.
 

Yago_jm

Member
I enjoyed it a lot, that arc really gave me Pokémon Special/Adventures vibes with Ash and Alain vs Lysandre and everyone vs fake zygarde, Bonnie singing moment and even Clembot's death was well done.
 
"plenty of focus" lol, yeah. 3 minutes out of 20 minutes is a lot of focus.

Yeah, and exactly what she did? Steven did all the job. And chespin wasn't saved. It was absorved by the megalith and then it was saved by Ash and Alan.

It doesn't matter. They didn't explain why Greninja could see it. What are you saying is "they didn't explain, but we can think in something".

She knew Lysandre was manipulating Alan, so she obviously was aware of his true intentions.

Do you know read? I didn't say she never appeared, I compared her focus on the first episodes with May and Dawn. Compared to both, it was nothing.

So, do you deny that baking poképuffs and interacting with Rhyhorns was introduced as the thematic part on showcases? Will you go this far?

It is you who is spouting lies to defend your favorite series.

Oh yeah, getting mad about Ash losing makes you less of a XY worshipper.

Fine, it's a Serena episode. I will give it to you.

Ignoring XY' flaws don't make them disappear. I was like you too at the time, I thought XY was perfect. Now I can see the flaws.

A genwunner will always say that the first season is the best one ever, even the battles being a joke, the plot nonexistent and no character arcs.
Lol, and you've done exactly what I thought you would do. Spouting one-liners and complaining about my favoritism towards XY while being completely contradictory and incoherent in your responses. It's really quite hilarious.

Again, Clemont isn't the only character in the TF arc. If you want to complain about how much time Clemont got, have it at it, but understand that there are other characters in other positions all with conflicting interests. Clemont for his part literally got a bit in which Clembot, a pride and joy of his, something that he created and assigned to his gym, was destroyed in his effort to take down the tower that was affecting Zygarde. It's not only but the time that is given, but the significance of what is happening in that time frame also matters. And I think that was important.

See how I do this? I try to justify everything being said with what went on in the show.

Dude, first you said she did nothing and now you're saying she didn't do enough? How incoherent is this? You have to move goalposts to make a point. Stick to something.

I beg of you. Watch episode 41. I seriously don't think you're aware of what happened in the episode. Steven intercepts several TF members to allow for Manon, Serena, and Sycamore to get into the TF base. They were able to rescue Chespin and get further into the base where they find the huge Mega Stone. There, Chespin was absorbed.

...Do you need the show to spell everything out for you? I think it's pretty clear the power comes from the Bond Phenomenon. Scratch that, they literally do explain that it's a power only AG has, meaning that it's clear that its from the Bond Phenomenon.

You backtrack again! First you say that she knew what Lysandre was planning and now you're of the position that she knew Lysandre was going to kill millions of Pokemon and people because....he was manipulating Alain? Is this a serious discussion?

It's kind of hard to argue with somebody who makes statements like, " do you know read " lmao, but I'm trying really hard. You're aware that I never said that you said " she never appeared. " I Iooked through my post several times. It's concerning that you just make things up on the fly.

Lmao, so, let me get this straight, since parts of the showcases sometimes dealt with Pokepuffs and one time dealt with Rhyhorn, this is indicative of her goal? Will you go this far? It's not a thematic part, it's literally just a part of her showcase.

I haven't made a single lie. You've backtracked, changed the goalposts, complained about my favoritism, all the while saying absolutely nothing.

I've watched XY/XYZ several times. I rewatched XYZ for literally two weeks ago. You on the other hand, don't seem to be aware of the events that happen in the show.

Thankfully, I can defend any supposed flaws and be honest about the flaws that do actually exist since I'm aware of what actually happened in the anime.

One of the flaws of the XY series is that even when some scenes are beautiful the script is ridiculously bad. For example, when Serena cut her hair, The scene is precious and it is symbolic of change, but the fact that Palermo magically was interested in a random girl in front of the sea cutting her hair for apparently no reasons kill the end of this scene. And this is a problem even during serious episodes, and it wasn't intentionally.
It's so hard to take things like this seriously. Palermo wasn't " magically interested in a random girl, " she was watching Serena in the showcase itself and happened upon Serena cutting her hair.
 

RafaSceptile

Well-Known Member
Lol, and you've done exactly what I thought you would do. Spouting one-liners and complaining about my favoritism towards XY while being completely contradictory and incoherent in your responses. It's really quite hilarious.

Again, Clemont isn't the only character in the TF arc. If you want to complain about how much time Clemont got, have it at it, but understand that there are other characters in other positions all with conflicting interests. Clemont for his part literally got a bit in which Clembot, a pride and joy of his, something that he created and assigned to his gym, was destroyed in his effort to take down the tower that was affecting Zygarde. It's not only but the time that is given, but the significance of what is happening in that time frame also matters. And I think that was important.

See how I do this? I try to justify everything being said with what went on in the show.

Dude, first you said she did nothing and now you're saying she didn't do enough? How incoherent is this? You have to move goalposts to make a point. Stick to something.

I beg of you. Watch episode 41. I seriously don't think you're aware of what happened in the episode. Steven intercepts several TF members to allow for Manon, Serena, and Sycamore to get into the TF base. They were able to rescue Chespin and get further into the base where they find the huge Mega Stone. There, Chespin was absorbed.

...Do you need the show to spell everything out for you? I think it's pretty clear the power comes from the Bond Phenomenon. Scratch that, they literally do explain that it's a power only AG has, meaning that it's clear that its from the Bond Phenomenon.

You backtrack again! First you say that she knew what Lysandre was planning and now you're of the position that she knew Lysandre was going to kill millions of Pokemon and people because....he was manipulating Alain? Is this a serious discussion?

It's kind of hard to argue with somebody who makes statements like, " do you know read " lmao, but I'm trying really hard. You're aware that I never said that you said " she never appeared. " I Iooked through my post several times. It's concerning that you just make things up on the fly.

Lmao, so, let me get this straight, since parts of the showcases sometimes dealt with Pokepuffs and one time dealt with Rhyhorn, this is indicative of her goal? Will you go this far? It's not a thematic part, it's literally just a part of her showcase.

I haven't made a single lie. You've backtracked, changed the goalposts, complained about my favoritism, all the while saying absolutely nothing.

I've watched XY/XYZ several times. I rewatched XYZ for literally two weeks ago. You on the other hand, don't seem to be aware of the events that happen in the show.

Thankfully, I can defend any supposed flaws and be honest about the flaws that do actually exist since I'm aware of what actually happened in the anime.



It's so hard to take things like this seriously. Palermo wasn't " magically interested in a random girl, " she was watching Serena in the showcase itself and happened upon Serena cutting her hair.
Yes and she barely know anything about her. It is irrealistic and even more with the drastic decision. It was just bad writing in an emotional scene.

I thought it was a beautiful scene. One of the best of the entire anime, in my opinion.

I wonder what was the point of Yashio. Aside from sending Serena to Hoenn, she did nothing. I think Serena could have decided that on her own.
The scene is beautiful, but the writing behind the scene is...not great
 
Yes and she barely know anything about her. It is irrealistic and even more with the drastic decision. It was just bad writing in an emotional scene.



The scene is beautiful, but the writing behind the scene is...not great
Lol, yes, I know that she doesn't know anything about her. Did you think that she stepped out of the car and confronted Serena? How is this not realistic? Palermo's job is literally to evaluate performers. She took interest in Serena's performance, especially when she failed, and then while she was in her car, saw Serena cutting her hair. How is any of this not realistic? She didn't step out and try to cheer Serena up or anything, she literally just watched her while in the car.

Nothing about this is bad writing. Nothing you've said here makes coherent sense.
 

RafaSceptile

Well-Known Member
Lol, yes, I know that she doesn't know anything about her. Did you think that she stepped out of the car and confronted Serena? How is this not realistic? She took interest in Serena's performance, especially when she failed, and then while she was in her car, saw Serena cutting her hair. How is any of this not realistic? Palermo's job is literally too evaluate performers.

Nothing about this is bad writing. Nothing you've said here makes coherent sense.
Ah yes, because having interest in the only one that failed is SOOO realistic... (Sarcasm).
 
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