Paper Mario Discussion Thread (Origami King and Others)

[Bguy7]

So after a random renaming of the Wii U thread to the Paper Mario thread and then back, it would seem that we are in need of a dedicated Paper Mario thread. So here you can talk about the Paper Mario series in general or specifically the recently announced Color Splash.

 

[Ascended Dialga]

The only two Paper Mario games I've played have been TTYD and Super. I love the stories, the amusing dialogue, and the engaging gameplay of these games. Bearing in mind that Sticker Star is apparently the universally least liked of all the games in the series thus far, I've decided to hold off on any judgment for Color Splash until more info is revealed.

 

[Karxrida]

Super's gameplay is aggressively mediocre, but it's good enough to still be enjoyable when backed by everything else good about the game.

 

[Bguy7]

Super's gameplay is aggressively mediocre, but it's good enough to still be enjoyable when backed by everything else good about the game.

I think that in hindsight Super Paper Mario might just be my favorite entry in the series. When I first started playing it I was disappointed by the lack of battles, and I'm not normally a fan of working backwards and turning games that have made the transition into 3D back into 2D games, but Super Paper Mario made up for all of that with its great story and captivating play-style.

I do admit though, I have yet to play Thousand Year Door.

 

[Karxrida]

What was so captivating about Super's gameplay? The 2D-to-3D flipping was kind of cool, but nothing else seemed to stand out.

 

[KillerDraco]

I do admit though, I have yet to play Thousand Year Door.

You are definitely missing out. Everything that Paper Mario did well, Thousand Year Door did better. The gameplay had more depth and was a lot smoother, the story was considerably better, and the humor and fourth wall breaking were on point. Music was also solid as well. Honestly, just such a good game.

What was so captivating about Super's gameplay? The 2D-to-3D flipping was kind of cool, but nothing else seemed to stand out.

The gameplay was fairly standard. Basically standard Super Mario Bros fare outside of the 3D Flip, but with Pixls and Bowser. People mostly loved it for story and characters. Its humor wasn't bad, either.

People DEFINITELY did not love it for Sammer's Kingdom though. Doing effectively the same 3 fights over and over got tedious. Especially the post-game full 100. I mean, at least the Pit of 100 Trials mixed up the enemies, but those Sammer Guys were all pretty same-ish, with three basic archetypes (tiny, normal, huge).

 

[Bguy7]

What was so captivating about Super's gameplay? The 2D-to-3D flipping was kind of cool, but nothing else seemed to stand out.

I found the mixing of an RPG with a sidescrolling platformer to be a unique experience, and I liked the 2D/3D swapping well enough. Maybe a better word than captivating would be charming.

You are definitely missing out. Everything that Paper Mario did well, Thousand Year Door did better. The gameplay had more depth and was a lot smoother, the story was considerably better, and the humor and fourth wall breaking were on point. Music was also solid as well. Honestly, just such a good game.

I know. I've just never had the chance. I only started playing Paper Mario late in the life of the Wii when I bought the Virtual Console version on a whim. I have yet to come across a copy of Thousand Year Door at a Game Stop or something of the likes or else I almost certainly would have bought it.

 

[Auraninja]

You are definitely missing out. Everything that Paper Mario did well, Thousand Year Door did better. The gameplay had more depth and was a lot smoother, the story was considerably better, and the humor and fourth wall breaking were on point. Music was also solid as well. Honestly, just such a good game.

I have beaten Paper Mario N64 recently, so I might pick up TTYD sometime during the Summer.

I really like the N64 version's elements, so I really want to play the sequel.

Also, Petalburg City.

 

[Tangeh]

omg they finally announced a paper mario for wii U??? *slowpoke meme* wow I've been hoping for this for so long, but... it's based off of sticker star? :/ I'm actually heartbroken to hear that but oh well. ;___; Granted I never actually bothered playing sticker star because so many people told me not to bother and I didn't want it to ruin my love for the series, lol. I've watched bits and pieces of let's plays and it just felt disconnected and simplistic to me? To me the Paper Mario series is special because it brings the Mario universe together in a completely new light - for example, hey, not all goombas are evil minions of Bowser! Most of them live in towns and have jobs and you can have conversations with them! Or the fact that Bowser is actually hilarious and Peach has a bit of a spunkier side. It's the little things.

I would actually be totally fine with a paper mario game with no experience system if they could bring back, you know, a plot and loads of good characters to go with it. My favourite part of the first three entries was seeing where I needed to go for the next star/heart for the first time - especially in TTYD where the professor describes it to you beforehand. I'd get all hyped envisioning it before I got there, and every chapter had its own smaller plotline that connected into the overarching larger one - it was awesome, I honestly wish I could forget everything about TTYD just so I could play it over again and not know every line of dialogue because I've played it literally ten times. xD (I always had Goombella out and tattling everything and everyone too omg I miss her she was epic: "That's a Goomba. Umm... Yeah, I'm one of those, in case you hadn't noticed. Ahem... It says here: "Goombas are underlings of underlings." ...That is totally rude!") I definitely missed the partners in SPM and felt like the locations and worldbuilding were lacking in comparison to its predecessors, but I did like the protagonists and felt that the antagonists were the best in the series. I just thought it was different, not better or worse. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Sticker Star doesn't look like it has much in terms of plot or worldbuilding or character development or dialogue. Graphic look nice though so at least it has that going for it? (granted I finally got around to playing M&L dream team after buying it a year ago and I have the same opinion of it so far, so maybe I just haven't seen enough of the gameplay to make an informed decision yet)

Anyways, I guess I'll just have to wait and see for this new one. I'm already doubting I'm going to buy it despite TTYD being one of my all-time favourite games, but I hope I'm proven wrong!

People DEFINITELY did not love it for Sammer's Kingdom though.

Obligatory shout out to that tiny area you're in for like five seconds before the Sammer's Kingdom fight area that randomly has one of the best soundtracks in the entire series. seriously it's so wasted in that area it makes me sad

Also, seconding that if you haven't played TTYD, you should really do yourself a favour and play it. It's incredible. Shame you can't buy gamecube games on the virtual console. >_>

 

[bobandbill]

I'm cautiously interested about the new Wii U title. Too little not yet known, including important aspects like the plot and characters involved.

I've played all the PM titles bar the first one (one day I'll get to it via Wii U VC I suppose, maybe when it is on sale), and the crossover with M&L (although I do have that game and played a short bit). TTYD is one of my favourite games ever and I also strongly recommend trying it out, especially if you liked the others. That said, SPM had a better story and pretty comparable music. Gameplay wasn't as fun but I still enjoyed it, easily.

Sticker Star was the worst of the three, but... I still enjoyed it. Even with the plot ruined via executive meddling, the charm of the series was still there, and that's a huge pro for it imo. I would like to see the sticker battling system improved but it wasn't terrible imo. And the music again was on point.

Obligatory shout out to that tiny area you're in for like five seconds before the Sammer's Kingdom fight area that randomly has one of the best soundtracks in the entire series. seriously it's so wasted in that area it makes me sad

Haha, that is a great tune! It's also one of my friend's favourite songs from the game, and I went and learnt how to play it on my keyboard. Probably should later on try and learn other PM tunes, because as you said these games have great soundtracks.

 

[Bguy7]

So here's something to discuss.

Let's work under the assumption that Color Splash will be refinement of what we saw in Sticker Star (not saying it will be, but let's go with that for the sake of discussion). Without saying you just want original/Thousand Year Door back, what improvements would you like to see while still keeping the formula similar to Sticker Star? Is there anything they could do to redeem the game in your eyes?

Personally, I would be okay with almost anything they do gameplay wise as long as we get a better story.

 

[bobandbill]

So here's something to discuss.

Let's work under the assumption that Color Splash will be refinement of what we saw in Sticker Star (not saying it will be, but let's go with that for the sake of discussion). Without saying you just want original/Thousand Year Door back, what improvements would you like to see while still keeping the formula similar to Sticker Star? Is there anything they could do to redeem the game in your eyes?

Personally, I would be okay with almost anything they do gameplay wise as long as we get a better story.

Story for sure. The dialogue was always entertaining in Sticker Star, it just missed the story and other memorable characters (or well, more of them - again, various ones in SS were already good).

I like turn based battles, so maybe some more refinement of how battles work (more of a punishment for running away from battles, or just bring back exp? Also some refinement of the sticker system - cards could offer that if consideration is given). More unique enemies would be neat too. SS lacked in that, but it did give us Sombero Guys I suppose...

 

[Tangeh]

Haha, that is a great tune! It's also one of my friend's favourite songs from the game, and I went and learnt how to play it on my keyboard. Probably should later on try and learn other PM tunes, because as you said these games have great soundtracks.

Funny you say that, sixteen year-old me also learned this for keyboard and uploaded it to youtube. Such talent. >_> If you're looking for more sheets definitely check out NinSheetMusic. They still get on my nerves for putting accuracy above actual playability but they have pretty much all of the Paper Mario tunes on there. A few of them were arranged by me so you know those ones are good.

My favourite track in the series is probably the Floro Sapien Caverns actually.

So here's something to discuss.

Let's work under the assumption that Color Splash will be refinement of what we saw in Sticker Star (not saying it will be, but let's go with that for the sake of discussion). Without saying you just want original/Thousand Year Door back, what improvements would you like to see while still keeping the formula similar to Sticker Star? Is there anything they could do to redeem the game in your eyes?

Personally, I would be okay with almost anything they do gameplay wise as long as we get a better story.

Yeah, I pretty much already said this in my last post but I'd be fine with a less intuitive battle system if the plot and worldbuilding and charming characters are all present and accounted for.

 

[Houka]

I liked Sticker Stars so as long as they improved it it should be a fun experiences, as far as I'm concern (Can't say the same about all of the basing on it). Doesn't need a complex story to be good just a better told one. I do love how SS didn't go with the recolor (Lazy) Route Shiny are kinda but I find them better then just recoloring everything. Hoping that Paint Splash at least try to fix of the other issues.

I've played all of the Paper Mario game (Except Paper Jam, but not sure if that count as a Paper Mario game) SPM with TTYD 2ed to my favs. Just th feel of them both are great. Sticker stars not so much but then it was made by an unexperiences team so I give them some slack this time.

 

[KillerDraco]

Well, in addition to the aforementioned issues about the plot (or lack thereof), my biggest gripe with Sticker Star was undoubtedly the fact that there's no incentive to battle.

It's not just a matter of "No exp". It's that the entire system is inherently flawed. After all, your reward for battling is Coins. What are coins used for? Buying stickers. But you have to expend stickers in order to battle, and thus the Stickers that you buy with the coins you get for battling are replacing the ones you expend by battle. In other words, by skipping the battles, you are exactly in the same place you would be regardless of if you battle or not. Not only that, but since the best stickers are found and not bought, there's really very little incentive at all. I mean, the fact that you can literally skip every single optional battle in the game and still not have any problem with any of the bosses seems like an inherently flawed gameplay mechanic, so why bother with battles at all?

 

[Tangeh]

Well, in addition to the aforementioned issues about the plot (or lack thereof), my biggest gripe with Sticker Star was undoubtedly the fact that there's no incentive to battle.

It's not just a matter of "No exp". It's that the entire system is inherently flawed. After all, your reward for battling is Coins. What are coins used for? Buying stickers. But you have to expend stickers in order to battle, and thus the Stickers that you buy with the coins you get for battling are replacing the ones you expend by battle. In other words, by skipping the battles, you are exactly in the same place you would be regardless of if you battle or not. Not only that, but since the best stickers are found and not bought, there's really very little incentive at all. I mean, the fact that you can literally skip every single optional battle in the game and still not have any problem with any of the bosses seems like an inherently flawed gameplay mechanic, so why bother with battles at all?

Is that really all coins could be used for in the game? That's hilarious. I knew there was no exp, but I was under the impression you would at least be able to buy some sort of character upgrades to up your HP etc. Does your HP stay the same the entire game?? A coin only system would essentially be equal to an exp system if you could buy upgrades, or if at least you needed to spend coins in order to get anything other than the most basic of stickers. I usually tried to skip optional battles in the first two paper mario games even with the exp incentive (unless it was a new enemy I could tattle) so I can imagine myself waltzing through the game without battling anything... which would be alright if there was a story underneath it all, otherwise what's the point of playing?

From the footage that's been released it doesn't look like there's any sort of EXP system. There was a clip of Mario winning a battle and he only gained coins. There was also a paint bucket thing that looked like the equivalent of Tippi / whatever the thing in sticker star was called, so I'm gonna guess there isn't going to be any partners either...

 

[KillerDraco]

Is that really all coins could be used for in the game?

The only other thing is the Battle Spinner, which lets you use a slot machine with 3 slots to get extra attacks per turn and bonus effects based on the icons that you match. You spend 3 coins to activate it. Needless to say, you'll have more than enough Coins to use the default Battle Spinner. You can "rig" it for bonuses by paying an additional 15 coins to automatically match 2 icons, and you can pay an additional 30 coins on top of that to slow down the final icon. If you overuse it though the price increases. However this is completely optional and most battles are winnable without it. It's just a perk.

At least, that's as much as I remember. I never had any intention of replaying the game after beating it.

I will say though, that the Gooper Blooper battle in this game has a hilarious battle theme in that the boss moves and claps to the beat of the music. The silver lining of this game, honestly.

 

[Bguy7]

I will say though, that the Gooper Blooper battle in this game has a hilarious battle theme in that the boss moves and claps to the beat of the music. The silver lining of this game, honestly.

I forgot entirely apart that part, that was so hilarious.

The other noteworthy part of Sticker Star was the Enigmansion level. It was basically a recreation of a more traditional open area of original Paper Mario instead of a fairly linear level like normal.

 

[Nothingjustgo.]

My biggest gripe with sticker star was its noticeable lack of charm. It literally felt like a New Super Mario Bros game with stickers instead of a Paper Mario game.

Colour splash seems to be fixing that but ehhhhhhhhhhh. It's still too much sticker star for my liking.

 

[bobandbill]

Funny you say that, sixteen year-old me also learned this for keyboard and uploaded it to youtube. Such talent. >_> If you're looking for more sheets definitely check out NinSheetMusic. They still get on my nerves for putting accuracy above actual playability but they have pretty much all of the Paper Mario tunes on there. A few of them were arranged by me so you know those ones are good.

My favourite track in the series is probably the Floro Sapien Caverns actually.

Heh, neat! I can comfortably say you are a better piano player than me, haha. Already aware of ninsheetmusic - that's where I got the sheet for Sammer's Kingdom for example. :V

I will say though, that the Gooper Blooper battle in this game has a hilarious battle theme in that the boss moves and claps to the beat of the music. The silver lining of this game, honestly.

That was a great part, and a pretty nice theme by itself as well. That may be my favourite part of the game too, actually.

My biggest gripe with sticker star was its noticeable lack of charm. It literally felt like a New Super Mario Bros game with stickers instead of a Paper Mario game.

Colour splash seems to be fixing that but ehhhhhhhhhhh. It's still too much sticker star for my liking.

Got to disagree there. The above Gooper Blooper battle is an example of that charm, and other things like the standard level of dialogue, the reappearance of the game show quiz, sombero guys, the unexpected Birdo cameo, the baffle woods...

I mean, each to their own, but lack of charm is not a complaint I had.