Paul’s Torterra vs Sawyer’s Mega Sceptile; Poll Tally!

[Genaller]

While Paul may be the stronger trainer overall, how would Paul’s starter Torterra fare against Sawyer’s starter Mega Sceptile in a 1 vs 1 bout!?

I know that we have versus to discuss stuff like this though the primary purpose of this poll is to get a consensus of PAD opinion on this matchup as well as make comparisons with an analogous poll I’m running on another community though don’t worry I won’t bring them up over here.


— Paul’s Torterra

- Stone Edge (directed)

- Crunch

- Giga Drain

- Frenzy Plant (has recharge time)


— Sawyer’s Mega Sceptile

- Frenzy Plant (directed + no recharge time)

- Leaf Storm (does not get weaker with each use)

- Leaf Blade

- Dragon Claw


Note: In DP 100 we do see Paul’s Torterra directing Frenzy Plant to a mild degree in a practice session against Weavile; however, Torterra has never directed Frenzy Plant in an official match, so how well Torterra can direct Frenzy Plant in a proper battle by the end of Sinnoh is debatable and I’ll leave the answer up to each individual voter. For me it would be able to direct Frenzy Plant by a mild degree, but nowhere near how well it can direct Stone Edge or how well Mega Sceptile can direct Frenzy Plant.

It should be no secret that I consider Mega Sceptile to be stronger though I do think it’ll be a competitive match especially due to Paul’s superior trainer skill though ultimately I see Mega Sceptile come out on top with a decisive win.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

It should be no secret that I consider Mega Sceptile to be stronger

So does this mean you have Sawyer's Mega Sceptile over Ash's Charizard,Sceptile,and Infernape as well?

 

[Genaller]

So does this mean you have Sawyer's Mega Sceptile over Ash's Charizard,Sceptile,and Infernape as well?

Well... yes. I’ve been fairly consistent with my stance; Ash-Greninja is in the CBA/EMA spectrum which would put M-Sceptile in the realm of Flint’s Infernape for having a competitive match with him which as a consequence would put it over Zard, Ape and Scep.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

Well... yes. I’ve been fairly consistent with my stance; Ash-Greninja is in the CBA/EMA spectrum which would put M-Sceptile in the realm of Flint’s Infernape for having a competitive match with him which as a consequence would put it over Zard, Ape and Scep.

It being stronger than current Charizard and Infernape especially with it's blaze ability is kind of a long shot.I see the outcome of Torterra/Sceptile ending in a draw,we never saw Torterra's full capabilities in battle excluding the Garchomp battle and it's ability never activated on screen.Without ME it's not on Torterra's level,give Torterra the ability to ME as well and I definitely see Torterra coming out on top.

 

[mehmeh1]

what is CBA/EMA?

 

[345ash-greninja]

I don't think this should be even a question given Mega Sceptile superior ability to spam guided Frenzy Plants like crazy, while Torterra has to recharge after using Frenzy Plant (as per shown in the Lake Acucity battle). If regarding the strongest moves of the two Pokemon battling, one Pokemon's proficiency is this much superior, then it's pretty much obvious which Pokemon is the stronger one.

Mega Sceptile also clearly has shown to a beast in its base form, dominating Greninja in its base form and pushing it hard enough to activate the Synchro form, defeating Greninja in XY&Z26(albeit Ash being stunned after not being able to get Greninja to transform played a part), wrecking Tierno's Blastoise like joke, finishing of Ash's Pikachu without any sort of a struggle (which is definitely very impressive despite Pikachu being weakened, because in the battle against Alain we see Pikachu making Charizard kneel despite even being more weakened comparatively from the battle against Sawyer). Even in its base form Sawyer's Sceptile would give Paul's Torterra quite a tough fight.

With ME, Sawyer Sceptile would definitely would be a bit overkill, considering how much massive boost Mega Evolution in shown give a Pokemon based on conclusive evidences in the anime. Mega Sceptile were clearly competitive with Ash-Greninja, who showed more than enough feats in XY(Z) to show that it's capable of going toe to toe with the E4/Champion level Gods (no matter how much the naysayers want to deny it).

In conclusion, I'd say Mega Sceptile should win with upper mid-difficulty.

 

[nickdt]

Well... yes. I’ve been fairly consistent with my stance; Ash-Greninja is in the CBA/EMA spectrum which would put M-Sceptile in the realm of Flint’s Infernape for having a competitive match with him which as a consequence would put it over Zard, Ape and Scep.

Charizard defeats Mega's in regular form though, an accomplishment both Ash-Greninja and Sawyers Mega still have to do. Even Alains Charizard had troubles defeating Zygarde in regular form and needed to Mega, which means Charizard is on equal footing with Alains Mega Zard and above Ash-Greninja and Mega Sceptile in raw strenght.

Mega Sceptile is stronger than Torterra though.

 

[345ash-greninja]

Charizard defeats Mega's in regular form though, an accomplishment both Ash-Greninja and Sawyers Mega still have to do. Even Alains Charizard had troubles defeating Zygarde in regular form and needed to Mega, which means Charizard is on equal footing with Alains Mega Zard and above Ash-Greninja and Mega Sceptile in raw strenght.

That's not really the topic though. Who is stronger between Paul's Torterra and Sawyer's Mega Sceptile, that's what the topic is asking. And when did Charizard defeat a Mega in regular form?

 

[nickdt]

That's not really the topic though. Who is stronger between Paul's Torterra and Sawyer's Mega Sceptile, that's what the topic is asking. And when did Charizard defeat a Mega in regular form?

The thing is: When did Greninja or Sceptile (Sawyer) defeat a Mega or legendary in regular form. They didn't, meaning Charizard in regular form is above both of them in terms of raw power (I meant Legendaries in my OG post), heck, even Pikachu is stronger than all three, since it did both while not being fully evolved.

 

[Akkipeddi]

Charizard defeats Mega's in regular form though, an accomplishment both Ash-Greninja and Sawyers Mega still have to do. Even Alains Charizard had troubles defeating Zygarde in regular form and needed to Mega, which means Charizard is on equal footing with Alains Mega Zard and above Ash-Greninja and Mega Sceptile in raw strenght.

Mega Sceptile is stronger than Torterra though.

You seriously can't be comparing Zygarde 50% with the Articuno Ash's Charizard battled, and using that as a means to downplay Alain's Charizard. The anime has clearly shown differences in various legendaries, and Zygarde counts on the upper spectrum of legendaries. There's no way Ash's Charizard is doing any better than Alain's Charizard did against Zygarde, and honestly, it's only a theory that it can defeat Megas in base form. Noobs like Trevor, maybe yes, but the against the stronger Megas, Ash's Charizard stands no chance.

 

[345ash-greninja]

The thing is: When did Greninja or Sceptile (Sawyer) defeat a Mega or legendary in regular form. They didn't, meaning Charizard in regular form is above both of them in terms of raw power (I meant Legendaries in my OG post), heck, even Pikachu is stronger than all three, since it did both while not being fully evolved.

How are lower calibre Legendaries like the Birds even comparable to the upper calibre God/Deity level Legendaries like Zygarde who can basically destroy an entire city by itself?

The Legendary Birds didn't have a very easy time against the likes of Ash's weakest Pokemon like Noivern:

 

[Dragalge]

what is CBA/EMA?

I think it means Collective Bargaining Agreement/Emergency Management Agency

As for thread, imo:

Torterra -> Non-Mega Sceptile but when Sceptile Mega evolves...eh I don’t know. Maybe Sceptile for the sake of not recharging Frenzy Plants like Torterra did

 

[345ash-greninja]

I think it means Collective Bargaining Agreement/Emergency Management Agency

As for thread, imo:

Torterra -> Non-Mega Sceptile but when Sceptile Mega evolves...eh I don’t know. Maybe Sceptile for the sake of not recharging Frenzy Plants like Torterra did

Can you remind me when Sceptile in base form needed to recharge after brutalizing Tierno's Blastoise/Ash's Pikachu with Frenzy Plant? Yeah, I highly doubt Torterra stands a chance in even beating Base Sceptile.

 

[Dragalge]

Can you remind me when Sceptile in base form needed to recharge after brutalizing Tierno's Blastoise/Ash's Pikachu with Frenzy Plant? Yeah, I highly doubt Torterra stands a chance in even beating Base Sceptile.

At the very least I could see Torterra tanking the hit somewhat better compared to Mega Sceptile lol. Maybe not by much but still.

 

[nickdt]

How are lower calibre Legendaries like the Birds even comparable to the upper calibre God/Deity level Legendaries like Zygarde who can basically destroy an entire city by itself?

The Legendary Birds didn't have a very easy time against the likes of Ash's weakest Pokemon like Noivern:

You have too keep in mind the evolution buff for Noivern though.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

Yeah, I highly doubt Torterra stands a chance in even beating Base Sceptile.

!!!!!!!!!

So you got Sawyer's Base Sceptile over both Paul's Torterra and Ash's Sceptile?

 

[Genaller]

You have too keep in mind the evolution buff for Noivern though.

Okay let’s play! 100% Zygarde was decisively stronger than every single Pokémon in the final battle for Kalos combined including Steven’s Mega Metagross, Diantha’s Mega Gardevoir, Malva’s Mega Houndoom, Alain’s Mega Charizard X, Ash-Greninja, Kalos Peakachu and many more powerful Pokémon. This easily makes 50% Zygarde > a Champion Mega Ace by a considerable margin.

The Charizard that beat BF Articuno later on looses to Brandon’s Dusclops. Now sure that loss was more on Ash; however, we know for a fact that Dusclops has over half of its health remaining after beating Charizard since it survived 4 rounds of Bulbsaur’s Leech Seed draining where by the definition of the move each iteration drains 1/8th of the foe’s max hp (4 * 1/8 = 1/2) and still needed to be struck by Razor Leaf and Solarbeam before getting KOed. Charizard essentially got caught off guard resulting in the deciding Sucker Punch being a critical hit; now even though it was very likely a crit, it strains credulity to say that Zard had the majority of its health before the Seismic Toss blunder especially since it had taken substantial damage from Dusclop’s attacks before hand a.k.a Charizard was most likely loosing even before the Seismic Toss folly and at best the match could have gone either way had said folly not occurred. This puts Brandon’s Dusclops in the same realm as BF Charizard and hence in the same realm as Articuno (it would certainly be ludicrous to believe that Articuno was significantly better than Dusclops).

I’ll now let you figure out just how absurd it is to compare BF Articuno with 50% Zygarde (unless you seriously think Brandon’s Dusclops is Champion Mega Ace lvl+). Matter of fact 50% Zygarde would utterly eviscerate BF Articuno with non-existent difficulty.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

If you have Brandon's "All Great and Powerful Dusclops" over BF Charizard and Articuno then wouldn't it make sense to also put it above Brandon's 3 Regis and Ash's Peakachu Haxachu?

 

[Genaller]

If you have Brandon's "All Great and Powerful Dusclops" over BF Charizard and Articuno then wouldn't it make sense to also put it above Brandon's 3 Regis and Ash's Peakachu Haxachu?

To be precise Regice Peakachu > Regice >= Dusclops ~ end of BF Zard >= beginning of BF Zard ~ Articuno commanded by Noland. I’ve been fairly consistent on Peakachu being Ash’s strongest from end of BF onwards until Ash-Greninja became a thing. I have Regice, Dusclops, BF Zard and Articuno in the same “sub tier” (S-) while I have Regice Peakachu a “sub tier” higher (S).

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

To be precise Regice Peakachu > Regice >= Dusclops ~ end of BF Zard >= beginning of BF Zard ~ Articuno commanded by Noland. I’ve been fairly consistent on Peakachu being Ash’s strongest from end of BF onwards until Ash-Greninja became a thing. I have Regice, Dusclops, BF Zard and Articuno in the same “sub tier” (S-) while I have Regice Peakachu a “sub tier” higher (S).

Maybe Pikachu became stronger than Charizard in SM with that Z-Move but before that I don't think so at least not realistically.

OS Charizard>Pikachu
AG Charizard>Pikachu
DP Charizard>Pikachu
BW Charizard>Pikachu
XY Charizard>Pikachu

Only time Pikachu is stronger than Charizard is when plot demands it (DEM) or when it gets some power up like the Z-Move.But when it comes to the opponents that Haxachu beat I could see Charizard doing the same thing against the likes of Regice and Latios.

The Charizard that battled Articuno and the Charizard that battled Dusclops are clearly on different levels.The people that don't accept that just go along with this silly notion that Dusclops is some high tier 1 level pokemon.