• We're currently experiencing a minor issue with our email system preventing emails for new registrations and verifications going out. We're currently working to fix this
  • Be sure to join the discussion on our discord at: Discord.gg/serebii
  • If you're still waiting for the e-mail, be sure to check your junk/spam e-mail folders

Pokémon 2019 Title - The Case for An Open Environment

PrinceOfFacade

Ghost-Type Master
I made a post about this in a Let's GO thread, but I decided to make a thread about it here to discuss it with everyone else. I wanted to make a case for the possibility for a legitimate open environment in the Gen 8 title, and I'm using Let's GO to do it! :D

First let me say, though it was likely unintentional, Pokémon Let's GO is actually the series' first open world game. Kinda. lol

Perhaps the best feature of the game is its open environment, which is obtained after completing the second gym. Due to the removal of HMs, travelling became far easier, and since the Secret Techniques aren't bound to gyms like HMs once were, you can travel literally anywhere whenever you want. All you need is the require Secret Technique, all of which are easy to obtain. I'm we've all by now seen stories of players taking down harder gyms earlier in the game, such as that one player who defeated Blaine after Misty. The amount of freedom I had in Let's GO was everything I could have possibly wanted. Unlike Sun and Moon, I wasn't walking in a straight line. I was going wherever I wanted, playing missions whenever I wanted. Truly, it was very reminiscent of Grand Theft Auto, which has non-mandatory story missions. Being able to play missions whenever I wanted in Let's GO was also heavily refreshing. Not once did I ever feel I was being forced to do anything. This is what I hope for with Gen 8.

I do know it's likely Game Freak didn't explicitly intend on Let's GO having such grand openness, but I do hope they recognized it, and plan on incorporating such openness into the Gen 8 title. Since Masuda did state the next core series RPG will be "open world-ish," I'm hoping this is the case. After Let's GO I cannot go back to linear gameplay. Open environment or GTFO!


So, what do you all think? Do you feel this openness can be expanded upon? Do you think this is all a bunch of BS? Feel free to post your thoughts!
 

PrinceOfFacade

Ghost-Type Master
I don't remember Masuda saying that ever but sure I'm not opposed to openness as long as it's not done like Johto.
This is stated in a Game informer interview prior the release of Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon.

In this video, Masuda [and a developer whose name was never mentioned] confirmed a fan question asking if an "open-ish world console game" would ever be made. Their response was, "Yes, we're making it." The one thing they deconfirmed was the possibility of the game having 40+ hours of gameplay. Here's the video, if you'd like to see it.
 

Sceptile Leaf Blade

Nighttime Guardian
Looking at it on Serebii, it doesn't look like that to me. If you are in Cerulean you shouldn't be able to go to Cinnabar yet because you don't have the swimming secret technique yet. Or could you also go there by trading in Lapras or something?

If all Open World means that you still have to travel through all the towns in order but you can just skip the gyms, is that actually Open World? You still have to go through the same line from Cerulean City to Vermilion City to Route 2 to get your flashlight to Rock Tunnel to Lavender Town to Celadon City and so on.
 

Bolt the Cat

Bringing the Thunder
Looking at it on Serebii, it doesn't look like that to me. If you are in Cerulean you shouldn't be able to go to Cinnabar yet because you don't have the swimming secret technique yet. Or could you also go there by trading in Lapras or something?

If all Open World means that you still have to travel through all the towns in order but you can just skip the gyms, is that actually Open World? You still have to go through the same line from Cerulean City to Vermilion City to Route 2 to get your flashlight to Rock Tunnel to Lavender Town to Celadon City and so on.
I haven't really played the game, but it really doesn't look like they've made it any more open than it already was in the originals. I mean, you don't need to beat Koga to Surf anymore, but is that really such a big deal.

Yeah no, this isn't open world by any stretch of the imagination. First of all, a game isn't generally considered to be open world without a seamless overworld with no barriers. For example, I should be able to walk from Pallet Town to Cerulean City in a straight line instead of having to go to Rt. 1, then Viridian City, then Rt. 2, then Pewter City, and so on. That has never been a thing in the main games.

But even putting that aside and focusing on what you're alluding to, which is open progression, you don't even have that much. Yes, you have some relative freedom over which order to challenge the gyms, but you don't have relative freedom over what order you visit the areas. You have a few choices, but in general you do have to follow a set path, up and around to Cerulean City, down to Vermillion, around to Lavender Town, then Celadon, then down to Fuchsia, then across the sea to Cinnibar. There's still too many roadblocks to call this open progression, if it were open progression you wouldn't need to wait until Vermillion to use Chop Down and go to Diglett's Cave or Rt. 9. You wouldn't need to go to Celadon to get the Tea in order to gain access to Saffron City. You wouldn't need to get the Poke Flute in Lavender to clear out the Snorlaxes and gain access to the routes leading to Fuchsia. And you wouldn't need to go to Fuchsia City to get Sea Skim before you can access Cinnibar. You could just go there whenever you feel like.

The only time they ever came close to this was with Kanto in GSCHGSS. The moment you set foot in Vermillion City you can go anywhere in Kanto except the western areas, the only roadblocks in the entire region were Snorlax blocking Diglett's Cave, the one way ledges on Rt. 4, and the boulders from Cinnibar's eruption blocking Rt. 19. Beyond that one instance, Pokemon has never had anything remotely resembling an open world.
 

captainfez3

The Chill Trainer
I want it, but I think it is going to be a slow and painful transformation. Gamefreak seems incapable, for whatever reason, of distilling their good ideas throughout the years into a super-hit. I honestly think this is intentional. They are well aware that Pokemon is a series that is more than capable of running out of gas, and I think that Pokemon's global phenomenon status has put them in a really nice position to have job security through Nintendo, as long as they keep making games that milk that fan base. I mean, why do you think Masuda is pushing hardware so much, ha ha. Reggie is probably calling him every day and saying "PUSH THE SWITCH" lol.

I am hopeful for this game though, because I think with what the Switch is and Nintendo really needing a strong showing with this console, they are going to swing for the fences. I wonder too if they aren't trying to find ways to change the basic Pokemon formula so they can monetize it more easily with DLC. As it stands, they need each new game series to reset a fundamental draw of their games, Dex completion. If they find a way to tweak their game mechanics so they could give us a set of 200-300 to get in the main game, and then dole the rest out with DLC areas, they'd have a bigger cash cow than they already do. Yes, I understand they already do that with regional and then national dexes, but complete means complete. Completing a part of something does not scratch that neurotic itch I have lol.

Honestly, the main reason I loved the Let's Go titles so much is because it put Dex completion back into a reachable realm for me. As it stands, the number of Pokemon just makes the task ridiculously unappealing, mostly implausible. I understand that only adds to the sense of accomplishment, but if player percentage for Dex completion could be tracked across time, the number of people doing it would be tenths of a percent, if that.

Also, btw, if anyone has a Melmetal they could swap me for the dex entry, I would appreciate it lol. I have my Go account linked but my Bluetooth went out on me and I am at that point where I think, 152... maybe that is enough. But then I KNOW... and if you don't understand you never will lol.
 

Storm the Lycanroc

Oshawott Squad
I've said it in a previous thread but I'll say it again... Pokemon doesn't need to an expansive and interconnected world similar to BotW or Skyrim. What I would be fine with is bigger routes in which the scale has been expanded. There could be multiple paths through the route, say one through a mountain path and the other through a treeline below the mountains. Additionally there could be lots of little corners to explore that contain hidden items, trainers, and entrances to caves/dungeons.
 

AgentKallus

Whovian
I'd like it but it doesn't need it.
You still have to go through the same line from Cerulean City to Vermilion City to Route 2 to get your flashlight to Rock Tunnel to Lavender Town to Celadon City and so on.
Not to nitpick but you can get through rocktunnel with out lighting it up quite easily in pikavee.
 

Akkipeddi

White Yaksha
Even if it's not open environment, I'd like the game to follow something like Platinum or BW2, where even if the gyms were in order, the region itself didn't feel so linear and restrictive.
 

captainfez3

The Chill Trainer
I'm honestly somewhat confused sometimes by the lack of excitement for more effort to be put into Pokemon. I agree that I do not need an open world a la BotW or Skyrim, but I always interpret these conversations as "more detailed, expansive world" which just seems like a no-brainer, especially since they have developed a mobile title that seems to fit the gamer on the go niche. What reason is there to keep Pokemon impoverished and on the sprite scale?
 

MidnightMelody

Hopeful for Gen 8
I'm honestly somewhat confused sometimes by the lack of excitement for more effort to be put into Pokemon. I agree that I do not need an open world a la BotW or Skyrim, but I always interpret these conversations as "more detailed, expansive world" which just seems like a no-brainer, especially since they have developed a mobile title that seems to fit the gamer on the go niche. What reason is there to keep Pokemon impoverished and on the sprite scale?
I want an open but linear world. Like one you explore but are not forced into exploring. That is why I loved Uncharted 4. It was linear but the landscape was so breathtaking and big it didn't feel linear.
 

Bolt the Cat

Bringing the Thunder
I've said it in a previous thread but I'll say it again... Pokemon doesn't need to an expansive and interconnected world similar to BotW or Skyrim. What I would be fine with is bigger routes in which the scale has been expanded. There could be multiple paths through the route, say one through a mountain path and the other through a treeline below the mountains. Additionally there could be lots of little corners to explore that contain hidden items, trainers, and entrances to caves/dungeons.
Sure it doesn't need an open world. Just like it doesn't need difficulty modes, Pokemon in the overworld, 0r the Dexnav. There's a lot of things Pokemon doesn't "need", but it would benefit and improve the series if they did.

I want an open but linear world. Like one you explore but are not forced into exploring. That is why I loved Uncharted 4. It was linear but the landscape was so breathtaking and big it didn't feel linear.
You can hardly really call that "exploration" when it's just funneling you into following the same path every time, that's not really exploration, that's giving you an illusion of freedom. If you don't want to be forced into exploring, what they need to do is make it clear where the mandatory events in the storyline are. They could still have an open world and not force you to explore if they make it clear where all of the gym cities are and send you on your merry way, then if you don't want to explore you could just head straight for the cities and ignore the rest of the game. But the way Uncharted is handling it is kind of the opposite scenario, you're basically forcing people not to explore and the people that want to would be unhappy with that. Basically, the more options, the better.
 

KyogreThunder

Call of Fate
I don't really want the Generation VIII games to have open-world setting, but I definitely want them to be fairly non-linear and have multiple branching paths and lots of backtracking. Sinnoh and Hoenn games had the best balance of exploration and storyline (shame you can't challenge Gyms out of order in OR/AS).
 

paipr_christian

grass type fan.
I don't really want the Generation VIII games to have open-world setting, but I definitely want them to be fairly non-linear and have multiple branching paths and lots of backtracking. Sinnoh and Hoenn games had the best balance of exploration and storyline (shame you can't challenge Gyms out of order in OR/AS).
I agree with ya there. Open world isn't what I want for Pokemon. But more option to explore as you go would be great.

Honestly I think it was a glaring mistake in gen7, that they didn't opt to make each island mostly open with a few areas closed off till you complete certain trials.

Like if you could fully explore each island separately till you progress to the next. That would've been interesting.
 

ebevan91

Well-Known Member
I don't think I'd want a completely open world at least from a narrative perspective.

I think more open routes where you could choose which way to get to the next city would be good enough for me, with the option of going back the other way to see what you missed out on the first time.
 

Storm the Lycanroc

Oshawott Squad
I can think of a few examples of expansive routes in previous games that have lots of detail to them.
  • Sinnoh Route 206 - On top it has the Cycling Road where you can battle plenty of trainers. On the bottom it has lots of grass, some berry fields, and the entrance to Wayward Cave.
  • Unova Route 6 - A linear route that weaves through the forest but is also connected to Chargestone and Mistralton Cave. Two extra locations that give you more to explore.
  • Kalos Route 15 + 16 - While it may be two separate routes they do connect outside Dendemille Town. Additionally they share some similarities and could be seen as an extension of each other.
  • Alola Route 17 - An example of what I mentioned in a previous post. A route that has multiple ways to reach the end of it, that end being Po Town. You can either take the easy path by battling a few Skull Grunts or go through the mountainside which is a bit more challenging.
What I'd like to see is more than one route per game that's as expansive as these few mentioned above.
 

Wulava

Chuffed to bits
Staff member
Moderator
I have to agree that the game doesn't need to be open world. I'd rather explore a route with optional areas rather than a huge open space that has nothing but grass, rocks and trees on it.
 
Top