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Pokémon Sun and Moon - General Discussion Thread

.Aerodactyl.

Well-Known Member
I don't want the PLOT datamined. I wasn't as bothered by the ORAS Datamine because they plot was virtually the same as the original, which was the point. I'm okay with finding out the leaked dex and things like that... but I really want the plot unspoiled. Really anything to do with the characters at all. I don't want to know if we fight people like Lillie or Lusamine. I don't want to know if we fight or catch Ultra Beasts. Just the dex is fine... I'm okay with finding out who all the trial captains are, or the kahunas, or if the battle frontier is in, but don't want to know their party pokemon, when they occur, what their trial is, etc.

Anyone else agree with me?
 

clbgolden12

Alolan (and soon to be Galarian) trainer
I don't want the PLOT datamined. I wasn't as bothered by the ORAS Datamine because they plot was virtually the same as the original, which was the point. I'm okay with finding out the leaked dex and things like that... but I really want the plot unspoiled. Really anything to do with the characters at all. I don't want to know if we fight people like Lillie or Lusamine. I don't want to know if we fight or catch Ultra Beasts. Just the dex is fine... I'm okay with finding out who all the trial captains are, or the kahunas, or if the battle frontier is in, but don't want to know their party pokemon, when they occur, what their trial is, etc.

Anyone else agree with me?
Yeah, I agree. I honestly won't mind if the Dex is leaked, but I just REALLY don't want any story details to slip.
 

Sulfurian

Well-Known Member
I wonder if Ash-greninja will be breed able, for better ivs and nature, or a chance that it'll be shiny. Or is it gonna be locked out from all that because it's a special case?
 

Joltik-Kid

Simply Fantastic ಠ_ಠ
I wonder if Ash-greninja will be breed able, for better ivs and nature, or a chance that it'll be shiny. Or is it gonna be locked out from all that because it's a special case?
From all indications... it seems like Spikey Eared Pichu and Cosplay Pikachu
 

clbgolden12

Alolan (and soon to be Galarian) trainer
From all indications... it seems like Spikey Eared Pichu and Cosplay Pikachu
I doubt that, given this form change is dependent on its ability unlike those examples.
 

R_N

Well-Known Member
I doubt that, given this form change is dependent on its ability unlike those examples.

The description of the ability also doesn't imply this is a one off deal
Greninja that can become Ash-Greninja have an Ability that no Pokémon has ever had before—Battle Bond.
It's using Greninja in the plural sense

also unlike those 2 examples, they aren't useless garbage (spiky eared pichu) or mostly gimmicky-but-useless (cosplay)
 

Tsukuyomi56

Gesshin Powered
I doubt that, given this form change is dependent on its ability unlike those examples.

It may complicate breeding given Protean is Greninja's HA unless they make it a special case of Greninja having three abilities. Also Ash-Greninja likely will not make the early game a cakewalk since as it is likely considered to be an outsider Pokemon it will disobey your orders until you have enough of the equivalent of badges to make it obey you (it likely will be at least Lv 36 and the disobedience mechanic ensures it will never use a move).
 

Wulava

Bidoof'd
Staff member
Moderator
Probably discussed already but "Pokémon Sun & Moon Demo will require 400mb/3,100 blocks to download"?
That's pretty much twice the size of the ORAS Demo (250mb/1,935 Blocks). Said demo had every important data. Guess GF doesn't care about leaks anymore.

A part of me hates the fact that everything will be datamined. But another part of me want all the leaks now.
 

clbgolden12

Alolan (and soon to be Galarian) trainer
Probably discussed already but "Pokémon Sun & Moon Demo will require 400mb/3,100 blocks to download"?
That's pretty much twice the size of the ORAS Demo (250mb/1,935 Blocks). Said demo had every important data. Guess GF doesn't care about leaks anymore.

A part of me hates the fact that everything will be datamined. But another part of me want all the leaks now.
Maybe the demo just has a lot of playable content?

I really don't want leaks...
 

Joltik-Kid

Simply Fantastic ಠ_ಠ
also unlike those 2 examples, they aren't useless garbage (spiky eared pichu) or mostly gimmicky-but-useless (cosplay)
Talking Event Only Pokemon... The Description you glossed over would indicate otherwise

"Ash-Greninja has powered up thanks to the strength of its bonds with Ash. This is the form Greninja takes when it has gained new power due to the miraculous occurrence known as the bond phenomenon. This can be brought on by the bonds between people and Pokémon. It seems that it has only known to have occurred once—several hundred years ago."

If you can get it any other way, how exactly is it unique and why put so much focus on it in the demo?
 

R_N

Well-Known Member
It may complicate breeding given Protean is Greninja's HA unless they make it a special case of Greninja having three abilities. Also Ash-Greninja likely will not make the early game a cakewalk since as it is likely considered to be an outsider Pokemon it will disobey your orders until you have enough of the equivalent of badges to make it obey you (it likely will be at least Lv 36 and the disobedience mechanic ensures it will never use a move).

An alternative if they really do not want to give Power Bond as a second slot ability or a 4th slot/second hidden: just make a second set of froakie's line, whose ability (hidden or otherwise) is Power Bond (Froakie & Frogadier gotten in this way can just keep Torrent)
They actually did this with Spiky Eared Pichu & Cosplay Pikachu. Cosplay Pikachu is in the undiscoveredt egg group and can't evolve in addition to its different model. The difference here is those were introduced mid-generation while power bond greninja is introduce within the same generation. There shouldn't be a need to limit it solely to the demo's gift and you should be able to trade it/bank it onward with no issues.

Also they kind of have to do this already with pichu, pikachu, exeggcute & cubone. I'm presuming they'll need a way to differentiate "evolves into alolan form" and "evolves into normal form" that a location value alone can't fix.

Talking Event Only Pokemon... The Description you glossed over would indicate otherwise

"Ash-Greninja has powered up thanks to the strength of its bonds with Ash. This is the form Greninja takes when it has gained new power due to the miraculous occurrence known as the bond phenomenon. This can be brought on by the bonds between people and Pokémon. It seems that it has only known to have occurred once—several hundred years ago."

If you can get it any other way, how exactly is it unique and why put so much focus on it in the demo?

We're already playing fast and loose here. It claims it can do it only because of the bond with ash but actually its because of the ability. The moment it leaves Ash it can turn into ash-greninja in any battle with any trainer after that. So why can't this one breed the ability downward?
If they wanted to specify that only this Greninja can get the ability, they could have just stated when describing the ability rather than saying "Greninja that can become Ash-Greninja have an ability [...] Power Bond"
 
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Joltik-Kid

Simply Fantastic ಠ_ಠ
Another indication is just like Spiky Eared Pichu, Ash-Greninja is banned from battles (Battle Frontier in Pichu's Case, Rated Battles in Greninja's case)...

Who knows, maybe I'm just too big of a devil's advocate though
 

yuoke

Treasure huntin'
Probably discussed already but "Pokémon Sun & Moon Demo will require 400mb/3,100 blocks to download"?
That's pretty much twice the size of the ORAS Demo (250mb/1,935 Blocks). Said demo had every important data. Guess GF doesn't care about leaks anymore.

A part of me hates the fact that everything will be datamined. But another part of me want all the leaks now.

I'm honestly going to be completely offline as soon as I get word that the datamining has started and just wait it out for the month.
 

scififan21

Well-Known Member
I'll get the demo and will probably avoid forums. Just will watch trailers on Youtube, but that is it.
 

.Aerodactyl.

Well-Known Member
Probably discussed already but "Pokémon Sun & Moon Demo will require 400mb/3,100 blocks to download"?
That's pretty much twice the size of the ORAS Demo (250mb/1,935 Blocks). Said demo had every important data. Guess GF doesn't care about leaks anymore.

A part of me hates the fact that everything will be datamined. But another part of me want all the leaks now.

If it is datamined and reveals tons of info, what is the Serebii policy on this? Can I check the front news without spoilers? I don't mind finding out about all the pokemon. I just don't want any plot info. I can avoid the forums for a month, but I don't know if I should avoid Serebii altogether
 

R_N

Well-Known Member
Another indication is just like Spiky Eared Pichu, Ash-Greninja is banned from battles (Battle Frontier in Pichu's Case, Rated Battles in Greninja's case)...

Who knows, maybe I'm just too big of a devil's advocate though

Rotom's forms were also banned in Platinum. It's feasible that the reason this is banned is because currently, it's linked to an event. Which is pretty silly, yes, but that rotom ban somehow applied in HGSS and that one just required *a* rotom. And for some reason this ban still includes Phione because event despite being an otherwise undesirable pokemon

Alternatively. It could be banned for other, less arbitrary (more arbitrary?) reasons like:
-greninja isn't in the alola pokedex & rated battles will follow that rule for at least until the pokemon bank update is out
-greninja from the demo doesn't have the needed marker in the first place
-megas are banned in WCS mode...perhaps that ban extends to the first set of Rating rules? Ash-Greninja isn't a conventional mega, but it might be close enough in the same vein as Primals.

Honestly the fact it's seemingly banned slipped through when I was reading it before. It's only mentioned once on the page and not even in a direct manner
In a special Season 1, which will begin November 18, this special format is anticipated to be a Single Battle format where you’ll be able to participate with Pokémon that cannot take part under other battle rules: the Legendary Pokémon Solgaleo and Lunala, the Magearna that can be obtained through the QR Scanner, the Ash-Greninja obtainable through the Special Demo Version, and others!

so...I'm out of arguments here
 

Joltik-Kid

Simply Fantastic ಠ_ಠ
If it is datamined and reveals tons of info, what is the Serebii policy on this? Can I check the front news without spoilers? I don't mind finding out about all the pokemon. I just don't want any plot info. I can avoid the forums for a month, but I don't know if I should avoid Serebii altogether
Serebii will always hide datamined info in a spoiler tag on the main site... here on the forum, I'm guessing you might need to avoid threads for a month

Rotom's forms were also banned in Platinum. It's feasible that the reason this is banned is because currently, it's linked to an event. Which is pretty silly, yes, but that rotom ban somehow applied in HGSS and that one just required *a* rotom. And for some reason this ban still includes Phione because event despite being an otherwise undesirable pokemon

Alternatively. It could be banned for other, less arbitrary (more arbitrary?) reasons like:
-greninja isn't in the alola pokedex & rated battles will follow that rule for at least until the pokemon bank update is out
-greninja from the demo doesn't have the needed marker in the first place
-megas are banned in WCS mode...perhaps that ban extends to the first set of Rating rules? Ash-Greninja isn't a conventional mega, but it might be close enough in the same vein as Primals.
To be honest, I didn't take much of that into account, but I think line 2 isn't an option because the ORAS demo gave you a legit from the region Glalie/Steelix depending on which regional version you played. Honestly can't see this Greninja not being marked. Line 3 is a stretch since Mega Pokemon have items while Greninja is clearly an ability, but I suppose the hidden behind that is maybe the stats put it up there I guess?

Honestly the fact it's seemingly banned slipped through when I was reading it before. It's only mentioned once on the page and not even in a direct manner


so...I'm out of arguments here
This is like my only argument though, so you probably have a good enough point : )
 
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Wulava

Bidoof'd
Staff member
Moderator
If it is datamined and reveals tons of info, what is the Serebii policy on this? Can I check the front news without spoilers? I don't mind finding out about all the pokemon. I just don't want any plot info. I can avoid the forums for a month, but I don't know if I should avoid Serebii altogether

Serebii will always hide datamined info in a spoiler tag on the main site... here on the forum, I'm guessing you might need to avoid threads for a month

Actually, no. The main site did not post or even linked to the datamined info because it was way ahead of release date. We don't want any trouble again.
Everything was discussed on the forum.
 

Joltik-Kid

Simply Fantastic ಠ_ಠ
Actually, no. The main site did not post or even linked to the datamined info because it was way ahead of release date. We don't want any trouble again.
Everything was discussed on the forum.
Oh really... huh, must have confused it with something else (Knowing me, it was the spoilers from the actual game release). Guess that means I did a pretty good job in ORAS considering I knew just about nothing outside of the demo
 
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