• Hi all. We have had reports of member's signatures being edited to include malicious content. You can rest assured this wasn't done by staff and we can find no indication that the forums themselves have been compromised.

    However, remember to keep your passwords secure. If you use similar logins on multiple sites, people and even bots may be able to access your account.

    We always recommend using unique passwords and enable two-factor authentication if possible. Make sure you are secure.
  • Be sure to join the discussion on our discord at: Discord.gg/serebii
  • If you're still waiting for the e-mail, be sure to check your junk/spam e-mail folders

Pokémon Sun and Moon - General Discussion Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.

EmphaticPikachu

A tired little girl~
http://www.thonky.com/pokemon-x-y/post-game
because s&m's postgame doesn't have a single new island or city for that matter



you are kind of missing the point. I'm not simply saying i disliked the fact they focused on catching legendaries/ubs, i'm saying that even if i liked doing that, ORAS still did a way better job. Just look at the amount of legendaries you could catch on that game:
http://www.serebii.net/omegarubyalphasapphire/legendary.shtml
And we also got a postgame sidequest which was the Delta Episode and at least the Delta Episode was relevant for the pokemon world's as a whole and not just alola, introducing the multi verse for the first time and exploring the mega evolution's origin.

I'm not rly sure how I feel about sun and moon's post game content, but comparing it to a remake and not a brand new game is unfair due to the difference in required creative direction.

Of course the remake is going to have more content, because they know what direction they're going to follow and have the main game already set up in skeleton, ontop of an engine already made and no excessive changes to it.

SM may still have a small post game still, but I disagree with that comparison.
 

clbgolden12

Alolan (and soon to be Galarian) trainer
Doesn't change anything, if you want another example, that is fine. trainers from Restaurant Le Wow + trainers from Sushi High Roller + battles in the Looker Episode = 17 battles.
Well...

Poni post-game areas (16) + Looker trainer battles (3) + Battle Buffet (9?) = 28 Battles.

Edit: Also the battle with either Red or Blue, brings total over to 29.
 
Last edited:

goodpeople25

Well-Known Member
Doesn't change anything, if you want another example, that is fine. trainers from Restaurant Le Wow + trainers from Sushi High Roller + battles in the Looker Episode = 17 battles.

And the battle buffet beats out the restaurants by 5 since I counted 15 (exact looker count I'm not sure about, a 42 lvl difference and most often an evo is pretty much a new trainer, but a few?) anyway your the only one who's arguing what equals content and the exact amount. But fiene keep moving the goalposts and trying to prove your opinion on what equals postgame content.
 

Xuxuba

Well-Known Member
Well...

Poni post-game areas (16) + Looker trainer battles (3) + Battle Buffet (9?) = 28 Battles.

Edit: Also the battle with either Red or Blue, brings total over to 29.

lol

All of those i mentioned (17) + postgame Battle chateau after becoming the Duke (13 new teams to beat, we could beat the gym leaders before, but they had weaker teams) = 30 battles.

We can do this all day.


I'm not rly sure how I feel about sun and moon's post game content, but comparing it to a remake and not a brand new game is unfair due to the difference in required creative direction.

Of course the remake is going to have more content, because they know what direction they're going to follow and have the main game already set up in skeleton, ontop of an engine already made and no excessive changes to it.

SM may still have a small post game still, but I disagree with that comparison.
You're talking as if they didn't have a lot to work with ORAS. ORAS is the 3ds remake of a 2d GB's game. The story changed a lot, the places changed a lot, many of the main features are completely new, such as the DexNav and Soaring, and they had way less time to work with. Besides, that game is SM's predecessor, the postgame shouldn't be better, otherwise we're giving steps backwards and that's not a good thing, especially when Gen 6 postgame was one of the major complaints.

Anyway, i wasn't really the one who started with the comparisons, but since people already were discussing that a few pages ago...
 
Last edited:

EmphaticPikachu

A tired little girl~
This has happened ever since the inception of remakes.

FRLG had more content then R/S. Emerald had more content then D/P (Probably the closest one as I can't remember if FRLG had more or less then DP)

HGSS had more additional content then even platinum, excluding the stuff johto already had. Both HGSS and platinum had more post game content then BW 1.

And BW 2 had way more content then XY.

Same thing happened with ORAS, it gained more because it piggy backed off of what XY and RSE already did and created.

Sun and moon were made from the ground up, this "regression" is well documented and recognized to be a reoccurring pattern throughout pokemon.

I'm sure they put plenty of effort into them, that isn't the point. The point is that more creative effort goes towards the creation of the game itself over extra content, because there's no preexisting baseline.
 
Last edited:

Xuxuba

Well-Known Member
This has happened ever since the inception of remakes.

FRLG had more content then R/S.

HGSS had more additional content then even platinum, excluding the stuff johto already had.

Same thing happened with ORAS, it gained more because it piggy backed off of what XY and the RSE already did and created.

Sun and moon were made from the ground up, this "regression" is well documented and recognized to be a reoccurring pattern throughout pokemon.

I'm sure they put plenty of effort into them, that isn't the point. The point is that more creative effort goes towards the creation of the game itself over extra content, because there's no preexisting baseline.

Except R/S didn't succeed FR/LG. Emerald did and it had way more postgame content than FR/LG.

Also, Platinum wasn't HG/SS's successor. Gen 5 was and it's postgame was far from being bad.
 
Last edited:

EmphaticPikachu

A tired little girl~
Except R/S didn't succeed FR/LG. Emerald did and it had way more postgame content than FR/LG.

Also, HG/SS didn't succeed Platinum. Gen 5 did and it's postgame was far from being bad.

What are you trying to prove with the first point?

That only furthers my point, the longer they had to get used to a gen's hardware and the more stuff they already have set up, the more post game content there is.

And what do you mean HGSS didn't succeed platinum? Yes it did, it was the last gen 4 game to come out, and by extension had the most post game content. (Perhaps being johto made it somewhat unfair lol.)

And are we speaking of gen 5 black and white or BW2?
There is a HUGE difference, BW 2 probably has the most content in any pokemon game ever, while BW 1 is middling at best at least in regards to options. It also completely falters when compared to its predecessors

The drop in content amount between BW2 and XY is drastic and further proves my point. Remake or not, the longer they have to play with a game and it's gen, the more possible content there is.
 
Last edited:

Xuxuba

Well-Known Member
What are you trying to prove with the first point?

what am i trying to prove? lol you said this postgame regression always happened between remake and it's successor and yet you compared the remake to it's predecessor.

That only furthers my point.
How does the fact that Emerald had better postgame than FR/LG helps you to prove that my point is wrong, that the successor shouldn't have a better postgame than it's predecessor? If anything it proves they were able to do this before.

the longer they had to get used to a gen's hardware and the more stuff they already have set up, the more post game content there is.

Remake or not, the longer they have to play with a game and it's gen, the more possible content there is.
Huh? This isn't even their first 3ds game, it's actually the third. They already had lots of experience with the hardware, unlike XY.

And what do you mean HGSS didn't succeed platinum? Yes it did, it was the last gen 4 game to come out, and by extension had the most post game content. (Perhaps being johto made it somewhat unfair lol.)
what i meant was exactly the opposite, but a typo happened. I meant to say that platinum wasn't hg/ss successor and yet you acted liked platinum succeed hg/ss, when gen 5 was the one who did.

And are we speaking of gen 5 black and white or BW2?
There is a HUGE difference, BW 2 probably has the most content in any pokemon game ever, while BW 1 is middling at best at least in regards to options. It also completely falters when compared to its predecessors
Pick any of them, both of them had lots of postgame content.

They didn't have two regions to visit, but there were so many new areas that it honestly felt like we had another one.

BW isn't by any means a regression, it just had a different focus. While HG/SS's postgame focused on revisiting certain places and meeting old friends, BW's postgame focused on exploring new places and meeting new people.
Again, the fact that BW2 had far more postgame content than BW1 doesn't help you to prove your point, it just proves that they were able to stepfoward, and not backwards, in the postgame before.
 
Last edited:

Fayh

Well-Known Member
Okay, so here is my opinion on the games after beating the League (haven't seen any post-game yet).

Positive:

1. The graphics.
It's pretty much what I have dreamt of ever since I played Pokémon Red.
I really enjoyed the small things like:
- Trainer models being visible in battles.
- The lack of those annoying circles underneath each Pokémon (I never got why those were there in gen 6)
- The battle backgrounds (battling on water finally makes sense, plus those wave splashes in the background? So pretty)

2. The removal of HMs/being able to ride Pokémon
No more HM slaves! I hope they stick to this concept forever.
I saw people complaining about the lack of a bike but I didn't miss the bike at all.

3. The Pokémon
When I first saw the leaks after the demo was out, I was super disappointed about the lack of new Pokémon and I hated a lot of the designs.
But when I actually played the game, it was hard to decide who would be in my team of 6 because I liked so many Pokémon!
I think besides the Ultra Beasts and the Totem Pokémon, I don't dislike any of them design-wise. Even the Anchor is all right because I like the theme (I just wish it had a proper face, like Honedge and its evolutions).

4. The return of trainer customization
I was sooo happy about this! Another feature I hope they keep around for good now.


Neutral:

1. The trials
I enjoyed the trials because they were a change from the usual story. I think the ghost one was my favourite. Some of the boss Pokémon were pretty tough to beat too and that was great.
But I think this should stay a one time thing. For the next game, I would like the normal gym leader concept to return. Things like shooting photos of Pokémon or battling extra strong boss Pokémon could be kept for side-quests though.

2. SOS battles
Cute idea. Sometimes it's fun, sometimes it's annoying.
I don't know if I would want this feature back in future games.


Negative:

1. Lillie and her cutscenes
I swear I have never been more annoyed and bored with dialogue in a Pokémon game.
Not only is this character absolutely cringe-worthy, but the cutscenes with her at the end (before and after the League) made me want to throw my 3DS against the wall.

2. The lack of a National Pokédex
This only applies if the rumours about the National Dex only appearing inside Bank are true. I am a collector and completing the National Dex is the main motivation for me in all Pokémon games. If we don't receive a National Dex with a future update, I will be very very very unhappy.

3. Alola
The graphics are definitely beautiful. But the design of Alola itself feels lacking after seeing Hoenn in 3D.
I felt like Alola was very small and there should have been more diverse areas and definitely more cities.


Things I missed:
- New fossil Pokémon
- A Safari Zone
 

janejane6178

Kaleido Star FOREVER in my heart <3
Okay, so here is my opinion on the games after beating the League (haven't seen any post-game yet).

Positive:

1. The graphics.
It's pretty much what I have dreamt of ever since I played Pokémon Red.
I really enjoyed the small things like:
- Trainer models being visible in battles.
- The lack of those annoying circles underneath each Pokémon (I never got why those were there in gen 6)
- The battle backgrounds (battling on water finally makes sense, plus those wave splashes in the background? So pretty)

2. The removal of HMs/being able to ride Pokémon
No more HM slaves! I hope they stick to this concept forever.
I saw people complaining about the lack of a bike but I didn't miss the bike at all.

3. The Pokémon
When I first saw the leaks after the demo was out, I was super disappointed about the lack of new Pokémon and I hated a lot of the designs.
But when I actually played the game, it was hard to decide who would be in my team of 6 because I liked so many Pokémon!
I think besides the Ultra Beasts and the Totem Pokémon, I don't dislike any of them design-wise. Even the Anchor is all right because I like the theme (I just wish it had a proper face, like Honedge and its evolutions).

4. The return of trainer customization
I was sooo happy about this! Another feature I hope they keep around for good now.


Neutral:

1. The trials
I enjoyed the trials because they were a change from the usual story. I think the ghost one was my favourite. Some of the boss Pokémon were pretty tough to beat too and that was great.
But I think this should stay a one time thing. For the next game, I would like the normal gym leader concept to return. Things like shooting photos of Pokémon or battling extra strong boss Pokémon could be kept for side-quests though.

2. SOS battles
Cute idea. Sometimes it's fun, sometimes it's annoying.
I don't know if I would want this feature back in future games.


Negative:

1. Lillie and her cutscenes
I swear I have never been more annoyed and bored with dialogue in a Pokémon game.
Not only is this character absolutely cringe-worthy, but the cutscenes with her at the end (before and after the League) made me want to throw my 3DS against the wall.

2. The lack of a National Pokédex
This only applies if the rumours about the National Dex only appearing inside Bank are true. I am a collector and completing the National Dex is the main motivation for me in all Pokémon games. If we don't receive a National Dex with a future update, I will be very very very unhappy.

3. Alola
The graphics are definitely beautiful. But the design of Alola itself feels lacking after seeing Hoenn in 3D.
I felt like Alola was very small and there should have been more diverse areas and definitely more cities.


Things I missed:
- New fossil Pokémon
- A Safari Zone

I feel the same way regarding Alola.. I feel like it was too small and less diverse than the previous regions
 

Hero of Truth

Lillie Fan
Seriously, whoever thought of locking certain Pokémon behind SOS battles with a Pokémon with an 1% encounter rate would be fun, really needs to be cremated alive. Been grinding for an hour for a Bagon to appear and then those mofos keep calling Bagons! Second Pokémon to be sick of after Eevee.

Don't even bother hoping for a Salamence to appear, fellas. Evolving a Bagon into a fine Salamence will be faster, trust me.

Also, what's with the game hating the idea of exploring random NPC's houses? You can't even enter the random buildings in Paniola and Heahea and Hau'oli! And the most random is that those buildings have doors! What the heck, GF?!
 
Last edited:

Requiem Aeternam

Dance like an eggplant!
I can't stand the SOS battles. It was okay at first but now it happens constantly when I just want to catch a Pokemon. I ended up KOing 4 Eevee trying to catch one and ended up catching an Espeon that appeared instead. Not to mention I'm still playing on my old 3DS until I can get a new one so the frame rate takes a hit every time this happens too. It's not always bad but it does really annoy me. I'm dreading having to spend hours doing these to find HA Pokemon. Also the Totem Wishiwashi battle was absolutely horrible. Who's bright idea was it to make it call for help from Alomomola with Heal Pulse?

Other than that I'm having a blast with these games. I just finished some weird trial with Kiawe and his dancing Marowak (I'm playing Moon) so I still have a long way to go before I finish the story. After that it'll be breeding for my first Doubles team and spending hours in the Battle Tree. I also want to build a team for the Battle Royal but I'll definitely not be doing that before I get a new 3DS. The frame rate during the story one was the worst lag I've seen on my 3DS.
 

Hero of Truth

Lillie Fan
I can't stand the SOS battles. It was okay at first but now it happens constantly when I just want to catch a Pokemon. I ended up KOing 4 Eevee trying to catch one and ended up catching an Espeon that appeared instead. Not to mention I'm still playing on my old 3DS until I can get a new one so the frame rate takes a hit every time this happens too. It's not always bad but it does really annoy me. I'm dreading having to spend hours doing these to find HA Pokemon. Also the Totem Wishiwashi battle was absolutely horrible. Who's bright idea was it to make it call for help from Alomomola with Heal Pulse?

Other than that I'm having a blast with these games. I just finished some weird trial with Kiawe and his dancing Marowak (I'm playing Moon) so I still have a long way to go before I finish the story. After that it'll be breeding for my first Doubles team and spending hours in the Battle Tree. I also want to build a team for the Battle Royal but I'll definitely not be doing that before I get a new 3DS. The frame rate during the story one was the worst lag I've seen on my 3DS.

You caught an Espeon and you are complaining? Those things are SUPER-RARE. You should be grateful it appeared.
 

Captain Jigglypuff

Leader of Jigglypuff Army
I find the Anchor Pokemon typing is a bit confusing. I get why it would have the Grass and Ghost typings but Water/Steel would have made sense as well. Or have it be part Steel and either Grass or Ghost type. That would have much better use for its Ability.
 

Requiem Aeternam

Dance like an eggplant!
You caught an Espeon and you are complaining? Those things are SUPER-RARE. You should be grateful it appeared.

I'm not complaining about the Espeon, just about the fact that it took me so long to be able to catch anything that battle because Pokemon just kept appearing. I wasn't actually aware of how rare Espeon are either. The SOS battles happen far too frequently IMO especially when I'm just trying to catch Pokemon I don't have for my PokeDex so it really annoys me more than anything now.
 

Akashin

Well-Known Member
I'm not complaining about the Espeon, just about the fact that it took me so long to be able to catch anything that battle because Pokemon just kept appearing. I wasn't actually aware of how rare Espeon are either. The SOS battles happen far too frequently IMO especially when I'm just trying to catch Pokemon I don't have for my PokeDex so it really annoys me more than anything now.

I have no problem with SOS battles in and of themselves, but their frequency was definitely both a blessing and a curse. It was a pain when I didn't want them, but things like EV training would be that much more time consuming if they were less frequent.

If nothing else, these games would have benefited from a counterpart to the Adrenaline Orb that blocks or at least reduces the frequency of successful calls for help.
 

EmphaticPikachu

A tired little girl~
I was tired last night so I probably messed up quite a lot. I focused way to hard on the word Remake because thats what you were comparing it to, its both the remake and the generation switch (not console generation, a gen generation like 1,2 3, etc.) Second, I'm not sure how much it matters because...

what am i trying to prove? lol you said this postgame regression always happened between remake and it's successor and yet you compared the remake to it's predecessor.

How does the fact that Emerald had better postgame than FR/LG helps you to prove that my point is wrong, that the successor shouldn't have a better postgame than it's predecessor? If anything it proves they were able to do this before.
It proves the my point because when you compare both FLRG and Emerald, they have about the same or more post game content then D/P. Emerald especially with that battle frontier, FRLG comes probably the closest interms of content comparison to the next generation, but my point still stands. Less or equal content.



Huh? This isn't even their first 3ds game, it's actually the third. They already had lots of experience with the hardware, unlike XY.
when the heck did I say anything about hardware? I was talking about the next generation, as in, gen 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and now 7. Its usually not the hardware that limits them, its the change in creative direction between gens. (Or really, between entirely new game and a remake/reimagining.)


what i meant was exactly the opposite, but a typo happened. I meant to say that platinum wasn't hg/ss successor and yet you acted liked platinum succeed hg/ss, when gen 5 was the one who did.


Pick any of them, both of them had lots of postgame content.

They didn't have two regions to visit, but there were so many new areas that it honestly felt like we had another one.

BW isn't by any means a regression, it just had a different focus. While HG/SS's postgame focused on revisiting certain places and meeting old friends, BW's postgame focused on exploring new places and meeting new people.
Again, the fact that BW2 had far more postgame content than BW1 doesn't help you to prove your point, it just proves that they were able to stepfoward, and not backwards, in the postgame before.

you are completely exaggerating the amount of post game content BW 1 has goodness gracious. A new region? There are 3 new cities (4 if you count village bridge, 3 if you discount white forest as a "city" due to its multiplayer requirements.) 4 new routes, and I believe the challengers cave.
you had the looker side quests but so do XY and SM, I don't think thats fair at all. And then you fight Cynthia; I love Cynthia but come on.

Also i was comparing BW 1 to HGSS or BW2 to XY to show the drop in post game content that happens, not BW 1 to BW2, but even that comparison furthers my point somewhat, because it proves how having more time in a generation ramps up the content to ridiculous extremes, not to mention how being able to have a baseline of the game already made makes it so much easier to throw stuff ontop of it.


I'm not complaining about the Espeon, just about the fact that it took me so long to be able to catch anything that battle because Pokemon just kept appearing. I wasn't actually aware of how rare Espeon are either. The SOS battles happen far too frequently IMO especially when I'm just trying to catch Pokemon I don't have for my PokeDex so it really annoys me more than anything now.
if you're only trying to catch just bring paralysis or sleep, it prevents SOS battle apparently and you're probably gonna want them anyway for catching purposes.

Although that said, early game, this doesn't help to much, as you're limited in resources and options for your team. It was quite grating when first playing through...

I don't know why the hell GF contiunes to be unable to allow you to throw a pokemon when theres more then one pokemon on the field. I can't find a good reason for the life of me. colosseum got it right, take a hint gamefreak
 
Last edited:

Excitable Boy

is a metaphor
I get why the appearances of evolved forms via SOS are rare, but it doesn't make sense for Pokemon that only appear via SOS.

If it wasn't for the datamine, we might still think some of those Pokemon are unobtainable.
 

Requiem Aeternam

Dance like an eggplant!
I have no problem with SOS battles in and of themselves, but their frequency was definitely both a blessing and a curse. It was a pain when I didn't want them, but things like EV training would be that much more time consuming if they were less frequent.

If nothing else, these games would have benefited from a counterpart to the Adrenaline Orb that blocks or at least reduces the frequency of successful calls for help.

I was thinking about an item like that myself. It's a shame GF didn't include one. As for EV training I'm nowhere near ready to do that but, if I can find the best EV training spots then I'll probably like the SOS battles a lot more.

if you're only trying to catch just bring paralysis or sleep, it prevents SOS battle apparently and you're probably gonna want them anyway for catching purposes.

Although that said, early game, this doesn't help to much, as you're limited in resources and options for your team. It was quite grating when first playing through...

I don't know why the hell GF contiunes to be unable to allow you to throw a pokemon when theres more then one pokemon on the field. I can't find a good reason for the life of me. colosseum got it right, take a hint gamefreak

I still have a lot of the story to play through but I'll definitely be keeping this in mind for when I'm trying to catch stronger Pokemon. I plan on hunting for a lot of HA Pokemon so stopping them calling for help when I do eventually find them will be a blessing.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top