Pokémon Sun and Moon - General Discussion Thread

[Hero of Truth]

if you define new Megas as new Pokémon, as some insist they are, then ORAS was 6.5

Hypothetically speaking, I wouldn't put it past GF to cheat and put in new Alola forms or whatever that add new Pokémon without upping the Dex count

You forget that they count new forms as new Pokémon as well, so there's that. Yeah, ''Gen 7.5'''s not happening, boys and girls.

 

[RileyXY1]

You forget that they count new forms as new Pokémon as well, so there's that. Yeah, ''Gen 7.5'''s not happening, boys and girls.

Yep. I highly doubt new Pokemon would be introduced in a third version, sequel, or remake. It takes away from the feel and need of new gens.

 

[Bguy7]

Aren't there still plenty of other events that we still need to get besides Marshadow? We also never got Hidden Ability Raikou, Entei, and Suicune for instance. Or the Hidden Ability Tapu's. Or Oranguru and Passimian. I'm also expecting Mew at some point in the future. Not much point in giving out Mewnium Z if you can't even legally obtain Mew anymore outside of link trade.

If you're saying they can do that instead of event-exclusive Legendary distributions, then that doesn't doesn't really mean anything. A random Pokemon with a Hidden Ability is a far cry from an event-exclusive Legendary.

The people who think that Generation 6.5 was ever in the cards need a firm reality check. SM were planned from 2013; the Strange Souvenir is ample proof of that.

To be fair, there's also ample evidence that something along the lines of a Z Version was planned up until relatively last minute before the release of X and Y, as the Zygarde's signature moves were left in the games coding. Also, the awkward existence of Zygarde's extra forms is likely attributed to that as well. And if there was to be a Z Version, who knows what it had in store.

 

[Captain Jigglypuff]

If you're saying they can do that instead of event-exclusive Legendary distributions, then that doesn't doesn't really mean anything. A random Pokemon with a Hidden Ability is a far cry from an event-exclusive Legendary.



To be fair, there's also ample evidence that something along the lines of a Z Version was planned up until relatively last minute before the release of X and Y, as the Zygarde's signature moves were left in the games coding. Also, the awkward existence of Zygarde's extra forms is likely attributed to that as well. And if there was to be a Z Version, who knows what it had in store.

And don't forget AZ's Floette which was fully programmed into the game with its own stats and the move Light of Ruin. GF obviously had some sort of plan there. I don't get why they programmed it into X and Y if it wasn't supposed to be released or even cut. Cut Pokémon left in the programming aren't finished models that will function normally if hacked into the games. Shellos in Gen 3 is proof of this.

 

[lemoncatpower]

It'd be nice if they learned from leaving codes in games for new pokemon and they actually are planning a big surprise

 

[Orphalesion]

I mean, it's kind of obvious. The Eurogamer rumor specified a 2017 release date for Stars. If Stars is Gen 7.5 in 2018, then Eurogamer is wrong.

Why are we talking 2018 now?

People continuing to cling to the concept of "generation-point-five is"... puzzling, at best? Maybe by the time we don't get a 7.5 or an 8.5 it'll pass.

Because making a joke about something is "clinging to it" ;054;

Personally I think even if, IF, Stars introduces new Pokemon, it won't be a ".5" generation in the way people hope. The most likely scenario, imho, would be like 5-10 new Alolan forms (with 10 already being very generous) and a few event Pokemon they wanted to save from leaking multiple years in advance. Maybe a new Ultra Beast and/or some Megas.

Something I am hoping for and clinging to until disproven are Sinnoh forms.

 

[Xenomata]

Personally I think even if, IF, Stars introduces new Pokemon, it won't be a ".5" generation in the way people hope. The most likely scenario, imho, would be like 5-10 new Alolan forms (with 10 already being very generous) and a few event Pokemon they wanted to save from leaking multiple years in advance. Maybe a new Ultra Beast and/or some Megas.

Something I am hoping for and clinging to until disproven are Sinnoh forms.

I'd believe the Alolan forms. We got quite a lot of new Mega Evolutions between X/Y and OR/AS PLUS Primal Reversion.

Ultra Beasts I'm doubtful of, but it's so open for new and awesome possibilities.

Mega Evos... I have no hope for. Unless they suddenly reveal Mega Flygon. In which case I will die of fangirlgasm.

Sinnoh forms would be awesome. I mean, Sinnoh has some really cool and versatile/powerful pokemon, it'd be great to see those pokemon "reborn"... unless they're Bidoof. In which case... I'll just die because I facepalmed too much.

 

[meshir78]

I have been out of the loop since Heart Gold/Soul Silver, I was wondering if anyone would recommend jumping right into these games instead of picking up where I left off. I've just been stuck in the past replaying the second and third generation games, and I understand there's been a ton of changes and additions to the games since the first DS games, but I'm dying to dive back in here.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

But are Mythicals necessary? Can't they release a movie featuring other Gen 7 Pokemon, or perhaps a new form/e?

Necessary? Not quite. But a brand new Pokemon is much better for marketing than a new form. That's why we've seen new mythicals promoted in movies almost every year for the last 10 years.

"Pattern" is no longer a strong argument nowadays considering Pokemon has broken a lot of "traditions".

Patterns are only really broken when there's a good business reason to.

Speaking of which, there's very good reason to believe that Game Freak is more likely to break the 3-4 year pattern than the mythical pattern, and that's because of the situation with the Switch. It's a virtual certainty that the Switch will be the home of future Pokemon games and Nintendo is going to want a good Pokemon game to help drive sales. And considering how unhappy Nintendo was with Game Freak taking until 2013 to transition Pokemon to the 3DS, they're going to want Game Freak to get on the Switch sooner and do everything in their power to get it out as soon as possible (short of rushing them into putting out an unpolished game).

Now you could say that that's what Stars is for, but the thing is that even if Stars is real (which I'm seriously doubting because there's a lot of issues with that), Stars would just be a stopgap game. Nintendo and Game Freak both have to know that as a third version, Stars would sell relatively poorly compared to other games, so that's not going to be the game that sells Switches to Pokemon fans, 8th gen is. So Nintendo is probably not just going to want Pokemon on the console as soon as possible, they're going to want 8th gen on the console as soon as possible. So most likely Nintendo had Game Freak start working on 8th gen as soon as they gave them a Switch devkit, probably around 2015, and intended for a 2018 release (again, possibly delayed into 2019 if they nee more time). There's no way in hell we're waiting until 2020 for 8th gen short of the game being stuck in development hell like BotW, but even then I doubt 8th gen will be nearly as ambitious.

Every generation has lasted 3-4 years. That's a pretty consistent pattern if ever there was one.

Eh, not really. 3 OR 4 years is kind of inconsistent, and there's also been inconsistencies with the number of releases per generation.

Oh, and Movie 11 had Shaymin; it's Movie 14 and Movie 16 that merely showcased Victini and Genesect around a year after their game debuts.

I meant 13. The one with Zorua/Zoroark. That's the only movie in the last 10 years to not feature a new mythical. 9 had Manaphy, 10 had Darkrai, 11 had Shaymin, 12 had Arceus, 14 had Victini, 15 had Keldeo, 16 had Genesect, 17 had Diancie, 18 had Hoopa, 19 had Volcanion and Diancie, and now 20 has Marshadow. Hell even before those the only movies that didn't feature new mythicals were 2, 3, 5, and 8. Pretty good track record for new mythicals being in a movie.

 

[nel3]

I have been out of the loop since Heart Gold/Soul Silver, I was wondering if anyone would recommend jumping right into these games instead of picking up where I left off. I've just been stuck in the past replaying the second and third generation games, and I understand there's been a ton of changes and additions to the games since the first DS games, but I'm dying to dive back in here.

i also came from gen 1, 2, 4 and to gen 6 and 7. it took a while to get used to the new changes that i missed in gen 5. i wouldnt suggest jumping into gen7 right away as gen7 took out many useful things from the game. gen7 is quite different from previous generations. maybe got to gen 5 or 6 before gen7 but it wasnt that hard to get used to gen6 from a gen4 jump. if im correct hidden abilities came in around gen5 but gen6 made EV training easier to track than in gen4.

Zoroa and Froslass (anime) brought me back into the games and i did discover some new fav pkmn when i got into gen4. i purchased gen4 (HG) and 6 (pkmn X) the same day but didnt start gen6 until i was nearly done with gen4.

 

[meshir78]

i also came from gen 1, 4 and to gen 6 and 7. it took a while to get used to the new changes that i missed in gen 5. i wouldnt suggest jumping into gen7 right away as gen7 took out many useful things from the game. gen7 is quite different from previous generations. maybe got to gen 5 or 6 before gen7 but it wasnt that hard to get used to gen6 from a gen4 jump. if im correct hidden abilities came in around gen5 but gen6 made EV training easier to track than in gen4.

Ok thanks, yeah after looking into it a little bit I think gen 7 would be a bit of a reach, I think I'll go with Black 2 or White 2 next.

 

[Captain Jigglypuff]

Ok thanks, yeah after looking into it a little bit I think gen 7 would be a bit of a reach, I think I'll go with Black 2 or White 2 next.

If you play Gen 5, you HAVE to play BW before BW2 as the sequels mention many plot points from the first set of games and you can follow it much better.

 

[meshir78]

If you play Gen 5, you HAVE to play BW before BW2 as the sequels mention many plot points from the first set of games and you can follow it much better.

Yeah I figure Id be missing something haha, gotta lot of catching up to do...

 

[Kein]

It's a virtual certainty that the Switch will be the home of future Pokemon games and Nintendo is going to want a good Pokemon game to help drive sales. And considering how unhappy Nintendo was with Game Freak taking until 2013 to transition Pokemon to the 3DS, they're going to want Game Freak to get on the Switch sooner and do everything in their power to get it out as soon as possible

Nintendo has never voiced unhappiness about the 3DS situation. Stop presenting your own opinion as fact.

(short of rushing them into putting out an unpolished game).

That's exactly what would happen if you were right. Game Freak need time to create HD games; it is completely acceptable for them to stick to another 3DS game and/or a Switch port in the meantime.

So most likely Nintendo had Game Freak start working on 8th gen as soon as they gave them a Switch devkit, probably around 2015, and intended for a 2018 release (again, possibly delayed into 2019 if they nee more time).

Too bad that this theory assumes that they were developing two generations simultaneously, which is ridiculous. Not to mention that Masuda and Ishihara are still, in 2017, voicing uneasiness about the Switch.

Eh, not really. 3 OR 4 years is kind of inconsistent, and there's also been inconsistencies with the number of releases per generation.

It's perfectly simple: The only generations that lasted 4 years were those with three game releases. What you're suggesting is that either this generation won't get even a second game release, or there won't be any gap year, which would all be unprecedented and quite frankly risky as hell.

I meant 13. The one with Zorua/Zoroark. That's the only movie in the last 10 years to not feature a new mythical. 9 had Manaphy, 10 had Darkrai, 11 had Shaymin, 12 had Arceus, 14 had Victini, 15 had Keldeo, 16 had Genesect, 17 had Diancie, 18 had Hoopa, 19 had Volcanion and Diancie, and now 20 has Marshadow. Hell even before those the only movies that didn't feature new mythicals were 2, 3, 5, and 8. Pretty good track record for new mythicals being in a movie.

That laundry list is a nice way to ignore my point that Victini and Genesect weren't new by the time they appeared in those movies.

 

[nel3]

Ok thanks, yeah after looking into it a little bit I think gen 7 would be a bit of a reach, I think I'll go with Black 2 or White 2 next.

np, glad to help you out. i honestly prefer gen6 to gen7 even at this point. i didnt get much into OR (farming game file) and stuck to X for the most part. i hope gen 8 proves to be more true to the game series though im not counting the chicks before the eggs hatch at this point.

just going from gen6 to gen 7 was drastic enough. i honestly did consider black/white 2 for some time to fight Roxie in the game but decided the battle wasnt worth getting a game for it. though given my view of Sun/gen7 at this point, getting a gen5 game might be able to keep my interest as i wait for what potential gen 8 has to offer on down the line.



if i do get a gen5 game, will the PKbank app even be available to drop pkmn into? if so i guess PK transporter would be whats needed to bring them over to gen 6 or 7?

 

[Bolt the Cat]

Too bad that this theory assumes that they were developing two generations simultaneously, which is ridiculous.

Not really. Game Freak has been starting on new generations as they're still finishing new generations, we saw this with the Strange Souvenir in XY.

Not to mention that Masuda and Ishihara are still, in 2017, voicing uneasiness about the Switch.

This is PR, it means very little. All we can glean from that is that they're not ready to announce anything yet. Doesn't mean they're not working on one.

It's perfectly simple: The only generations that lasted 4 years were those with three game releases. What you're suggesting is that either this generation won't get even a second game release, or there won't be any gap year, which would all be unprecedented and quite frankly risky as hell.

Considering that Game Freak has consistently been able to release 3 games in a row before a gap year, it's perfectly reasonable to expect no gap year this gen.

That laundry list is a nice way to ignore my point that Victini and Genesect weren't new by the time they appeared in those movies.

They were new enough. There's a significant difference between a current gen mythical that we saw a few months before and past gen legendaries that have little connection to the current gen.

 

[Kein]

Not really. Game Freak has been starting on new generations as they're still finishing new generations, we saw this with the Strange Souvenir in XY.

No, what we saw was foreshadowing. We know from interviews that SM only entered its actual development cycle after Ohmori was done with ORAS in late 2014. That's how ridiculous your theory is.

This is PR, it means very little.

Ishihara saying that the Switch is a very different system that will taking getting used to isn't meaningless PR.

Considering that Game Freak has consistently been able to release 3 games in a row before a gap year, it's perfectly reasonable to expect no gap year this gen.

Except we've never had three consecutive games that included two different sets of initial versions. Platinum-HGSS-BW and B2W2-XY-ORAS are much different beasts than what you're suggesting.

They were new enough. There's a significant difference between a current gen mythical that we saw a few months before and past gen legendaries that have little connection to the current gen.

If they revisit Kanto/Johto/Sinnoh in the next games, it stands to reason that old legendaries will become relevant. For heaven's sake: They're already promoting Ho-Oh over Marshadow.

 

[Zoruagible]

Wow. The Global mission was just overkilled. lol
Setting the goal that low for hatching eggs was just ridiculous.
Bit curious on how the Pokebean one will go.

 

[Karrio]

I am thinking about picking up Sun in a couple of weeks.

How far behind would I be if I want to become a competitive battler?

 

[Xenomata]

I am thinking about picking up Sun in a couple of weeks.

How far behind would I be if I want to become a competitive battler?

Depends on if you have the proper breeding materials beforehand, which is to say in gen 6.

You won't be THAT far behind since you can SOS chain grind for Dittos with good IVs, but you will definitely wish you could start immediately, since the Destiny Knot is locked behind a 48 BP wall... which you earn by battling in the Battle Tree and Battle Royale. Which largely requires competitive pokemon.

...it helps to just Wonder Trade for a while.