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Pokémon Sun & Moon Discovery Discussion Thread [Contains Story Spoilers]

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Thepowaofhax

Well-Known Member
oh yeah cuz calling everyone who disagrees a circlejerk isn't a personal attack....

i wasn't even the one who was using that argument, it was the person that posted:

all i did was say: "are you sure every other people don't agree with me?"
I know what he posted is a fallacy, i just said even if that were true, even if the popular opinion was the right one, you still can't say for sure everyone doesn't agree with me.
I didn't say that, rofl. I said your entire thread is filled with low-quality posts that do nothing to discuss these flaws and are thus just a huge circlejerk. I didn't even say you were circlejerking to begin with, I said you're letting those people get to your head. Most of these people aren't even saying their huge flaws. I skimmed through the entire thread, and the only notable ones are the huge quote pyramid talking about the gaming being slow/slow mons (which they were having a hard to distinguishing from "too slow", ranting on Pokemon stats, and the Battle Tree not having the more memorable characters. The rest just parrot that Gamefreak took two steps back.

In fact, the closest thing to an actual personal attack was when I told you to use basic reading comprehension because you were still misinterpreting my arguments.

And again, I didn't say that no one agrees with you. If you would actually read the posts, I am saying most of the people who are agreeing with you on the thread aren't even discussing anything. You're making it out like most of them think that game is ruined from the flaws.
 

thiagomestres

Well-Known Member
It's already been announced by GF that bank is having the national dex. It's even on the sun and moon website. Maybe you should fact check your posts first.

How does that change anything? I literally said my point is that, even if it's true, the game itself not having the national dex is a flaw and that we have to wait until 2017 to get the new version of the pokébank and we still would've to pay for it.
 

DrakeKoryu

Active Member
I really don't see S&M as a flaw, it took a risk by changing the mechanic that had been implemented since the games started 20 years ago, and it really works, the trial challenges seem more fun and interactive than the gym leaders, and not everything is battling, even in pokémon, the story is good and I really loved it, and even though there are things that many people will complain about, let's be honest, that whould have happened even if those things were different, even with a National Dex, people will still complain about the number of new pokémon, even with longer post game (which I think is fine by itself) people will complain about the content propably, and even if the new pokémon have had better spd stat they will be people complaining about them being "unoriginal or dumb designed", there will always be complains, GF can't please everyone, but they gave us a fine game, and one that changed so many things and gave the franchise a fresh tone, so let's just enjoy the games, that by the way have not even arrived yet! :D come on guys let's just be poké trainers and have some fun
 

future.newyorker

Well-Known Member
How does that change anything? I literally said my point is that, even if it's true, the game itself not having the national dex is a flaw and that we have to wait until 2017 to get the new version of the pokébank and we still would've to pay for it.

Actually, what you said was that Bank having the national dex is just a rumor.
 

Hero of Truth

Lillie Fan
If Bank has the National Dex and we have to pay extra for something that SHOULD BE in the dang game, that's it, I'm done with the franchise. Let's hope we can get it for free because not everyone uses the Bank and that would be a jerkish move to force us use it.
 
How does that change anything? I literally said my point is that, even if it's true, the game itself not having the national dex is a flaw and that we have to wait until 2017 to get the new version of the pokébank and we still would've to pay for it.

...you know they could update the games as well as Bank, too, right? Though I think it goes without saying that the National Pokédex is pretty pointless in SM anyway considering that there aren't many, if any at all, Pokémon to be added to it in-game in the post-game.

I really don't see S&M as a flaw, it took a risk by changing the mechanic that had been implemented since the games started 20 years ago, and it really works, the trial challenges seem more fun and interactive than the gym leaders, and not everything is battling, even in pokémon, the story is good and I really loved it, and even though there are things that many people will complain about, let's be honest, that whould have happened even if those things were different, even with a National Dex, people will still complain about the number of new pokémon, even with longer post game (which I think is fine by itself) people will complain about the content propably, and even if the new pokémon have had better spd stat they will be people complaining about them being "unoriginal or dumb designed", there will always be complains, GF can't please everyone, but they gave us a fine game, and one that changed so many things and gave the franchise a fresh tone, so let's just enjoy the games, that by the way have not even arrived yet! :D come on guys let's just be poké trainers and have some fun

Well put. The only problem I really agree is a problem - but I'm sure will be handled appropriately - is the omission of the National Dex. In terms of post-game, we have at least another round of entries into the core series this generation to set things right. Ever since the transition to 3D models as opposed to animated sprites it has certainly become apparent that the typical timeframe for a 2D Pokémon main series entry is nowhere near long enough for an equally long 3D entry, but obviously that goes without saying.
 
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Thepowaofhax

Well-Known Member
If Bank has the National Dex and we have to pay extra for something that SHOULD BE in the dang game, that's it, I'm done with the franchise. Let's hope we can get it for free because not everyone uses the Bank and that would be a jerkish move to force us use it.

True, but it's not like we're all going to use it to transfer Gen 6 and Gen 1 mons.
 

thiagomestres

Well-Known Member
Actually, what you said was that Bank having the national dex is just a rumor.
My original post was this one:

Cuz it's not part of the game and you have to pay Pokémon Bank'subscrition fee in order to get it which is only going to comeback in 2017.

which was a answer to this:
What is the issue again with a lack of a national dex when its been confirmed that we are getting it later?

Then somebody asked me for sources and i said i didn't have them, because i believed it was just a rumour but even if it were true, it wouldn't change the fact that my point still stands, the national dex being part of the pokebank =/= the national dex being part of the game itself.

But yeah thanks for not reading my posts and trying to act like you know them better than me
 

Orphalesion

Well-Known Member
Well let's be honest, the vast majority of Pokemon not having a Dex entry in a game that is all about "gotta catch'em all" is a serious design flaw.

If this is the truth, and we are going to rely on the Pokemon Bank for the Nat. Dex from now on, then it kills all arguments about "they are making fewer pokemon so that the nat dex doesn't get too large" because apparently that's not a factor anymore if it isn't even part of the games but only part of some subscription-based supplementary software.
 
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Thepowaofhax

Well-Known Member
Well let's be honest, the vast majority of Pokemon not having a Dex entry in a game that is all about "gotta catch'em all" is a serious design flaw.

If this is the truth, and we are going to rely on the Pokemon Bank for the Nat. Dex from now on, then it kills all arguments about "they are making fewer pokemon so that the nat dex doesn't get too large" because apparently that's not a factor anymore.

To be fair though, it could be added in via patch. Though it does seem odd to remove it from the actual game itself and put it behind a pay wall.

I'm just hoping they go along and actually fix this breeding debacle, because it's just as ridiculous.
 

clbgolden12

Alolan (and soon to be Galarian) trainer
If Bank has the National Dex and we have to pay extra for something that SHOULD BE in the dang game, that's it, I'm done with the franchise. Let's hope we can get it for free because not everyone uses the Bank and that would be a jerkish move to force us use it.
But as I said, the first year of Bank is free.

Not to mention, GF can easily put the National Dex in Sun and Moon later.

Also, chances are if you're completing the Nationak Dex then you're gonna use Bank anyways.
 

Orphalesion

Well-Known Member
To be fair though, it could be added in via patch. Though it does seem odd to remove it from the actual game itself and put it behind a pay wall.

I'm just hoping they go along and actually fix this breeding debacle, because it's just as ridiculous.

They could, however they also could have added the data of the ORAS megas to X/Y via a patch so that online battles would have been a possibility, but they didn't.
 

Zarxiel

Active Member
Guys, seriously, why nobody updated Pokémon and UB pages with Celesteela, Kartana, Necrozma and Cosmoem (showed in TGS this last)?
 

Thepowaofhax

Well-Known Member
They could, however they also could have added the data of the ORAS megas to X/Y via a patch so that online battles would have been a possibility, but they didn't.

True, there was that. I'd hate it if they don't patch in the national dex and fix the breeding, as they essentially lockdown Pokemon from being allowed in any official online battle because they somehow have offspring that aren't like them.

Guys, seriously, why nobody updated Pokémon and UB pages with Celesteela, Kartana, Necrozma and Cosmoem (showed in TGS this last)?
Probably because Serebii doesn't want a bounty on its head.
 

sketchersmeargle

Well-Known Member
Keep in mind, these take outs are for most likely due for heightening performance issues and to avoid crashing. This is just another huge step in game development they've taking like XY, so the normal formula has to keep changing until they completely know how to make it work with pass-gen compatibility. No new megas, yet we have ultra beasts, z-moves and alola forms, 3 things that they wanted to make unique and the focus of gen 7. Also most likely the low speed stats is to hinder op competitive battling, we have seen this with their new stricter online rules.

With the increase and surge of fans from Pokemon Go, young, new and old but less experienced to the games, gamefreak has it made it their goal for easier learning streaks and fair game for competitive battling, not like the terror it was online in ORAS.

However to many, it seems to just be nerfing the game, remember we are 800 pokemon now and due to it, makes it a lot harder for new fans to immerse into, due to being offputted by the large amount of data.
 

GDK

Well-Known Member
What's this with having to pay for national dex?
You can't fill it without using the bank anyways.

What sucks is the island scan pokemon don't have dex entries and I wonder why, they ar ein the game.
 

thiagomestres

Well-Known Member
But as I said, the first year of Bank is free.

Not to mention, GF can easily put the National Dex in Sun and Moon later.

Also, chances are if you're completing the Nationak Dex then you're gonna use Bank anyways.
The pokebank is only going to comeback in 2017, by that time most people would already have finished the game without the dex, besides most of us don't even have the 1 free year anymore.

Why would they put the National Dex in the Pokébank if they are going to add in the game itself?

This is just a way to make us pay for the Pokébank.
 

Thepowaofhax

Well-Known Member
What's this with having to pay for national dex?
You can't fill it without using the bank anyways.

What sucks is the island scan pokemon don't have dex entries and I wonder why, they ar ein the game.
Actually, the scans are pretty useful. They give you the location of a Pokemon, which does wonders. Also, it does allow you to get non-Alolan mons apparently. I just looked at it on Project Pokemon and apparently it's for every 10 scans.

They have been revealed in Corocoro, and Cosmoem was shown with the TCG jazz, so it aint no thang.
Ehh, true, so it does seem a bit weird.
 
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