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Rate Ash's Male Companions
- Thread starter Ignition
- Start date
GarchompTheAssassin
Water starter fan
I have like the exact same ranking as @Akkipeddi except I'd probably put Sophocles clear of Max
Akkipeddi
All set to be a nice guy
Well if we're talking about inventions, Clemont's gadgets tend to be 'high risk, high reward'. Yeah sure, because he attempts them so quickly, they tend to explode, but let's not forget Clembot was actually an engineering marvel, and Sophocles can never come close to inventing something of that scale (as well as the mini Clembot in assisting Ash Greninja). As for battling, he used 'Luxray, use swift' against those quick TRio battles, but I saw him use Bunnelby and Chespin a lot more for other reasons. Sophocles only has Togedemaru and Charjabug (with the latter missing 90% of the time), and with Togedemaru, I've only ever heard him say 'Togedemaru, use Zing Zap'. As for personality, Clemont was timid and shy around girls, but learned to take control when needed. Other than Sophocles trying to sometimes show off some snark and acting smart, I don't really see much for him either. And as for being unfit, we know Sophocles is pretty damn unfit as well, just that it's not played out as a gag like Clemont's was (and because the Alola gang don't need to travel anywhere).
Twilight-Kun
Pokemon World Champion
Clemont
Brock
Tracey
Kiawe
Sophocles
Max
Cilan
It takes a lot to be more boring than Max, but Cilan managed to do so with flying colors thanks to him being a terrible mockery of Brock
Brock
Tracey
Kiawe
Sophocles
Max
Cilan
It takes a lot to be more boring than Max, but Cilan managed to do so with flying colors thanks to him being a terrible mockery of Brock
PokemonBattleFanatic-
Hardcore Paul Fan
Isn't Cilan the only male companion to defeat one of Ash's rivals in a battle?
Akkipeddi
All set to be a nice guy
Uh Clemont beating Sawyer in the gym? I think that counts as well.
I guess it's in terms of opportunities given, since as mentioned while Clemont did have more battling skills than Sophocles, it's kinda undermined when he only had a handful of moments to show it off compared to 90% of it being said quick TRio battles. Sophocles feels like a character they have better grasp what and what not lets his character shine through, so while he isn't a great battler, he doesn't waste as much time doing it in favour of something more relevant to his personality. There's also the fact that a lot of the traits Clemont used more frequently like inventing were more for the purpose of running gags than development. They were fun but often quite repetitive, while with Sophocles it feels like you get a new little detail about him each time.
Twilight-Kun
Pokemon World Champion
Clemont had a few inventions that worked as advertised and didn't blow up in his face
They were few and far between, but they did exist
They were few and far between, but they did exist
Akkipeddi
All set to be a nice guy
Yeah a new detail for me to care even less about him each time.
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Slapstick-Olivia
Well-Known Member
Good
1. Clemont - very likable in terms of personality, can be very useful with his machines, had with Ash and his little sister bonnie an interesting bound.
2. Kiawe - I like his friendly rivalry he has with Ash, also he can be pretty useful when it comes to battles in general + he and Clemont are the most used male companions of the anime so far.
Underused
3. Sophocles - likeabale character, can be very useful in some episodes and also has some interesting episodes for his own, but he is a bit underused. They could do more with him.
4. Brock - sure, he is a cult character, but they really underused him + he became more of a running gag in the end rather than his own character, a running gag for 3 whole animes to be clear!
Not interested in
5. Cilan - ... well... he was there. He never annoyed me, but he never also hooked my interest in him as a character. He existed for me, and that's sadly all I can say about him
Bad
6. Max - never liked the trope of the smart, very young kid character. Also he sometimes really got on my nerves with his attitude against Ash and his older sister May.
7. Tracy - a complete forgettable character... boring personality, boring goal, had almost no interactions with any other characters and even his design is boring. The anime had even back than background characters with a more outstanding design.
1. Clemont - very likable in terms of personality, can be very useful with his machines, had with Ash and his little sister bonnie an interesting bound.
2. Kiawe - I like his friendly rivalry he has with Ash, also he can be pretty useful when it comes to battles in general + he and Clemont are the most used male companions of the anime so far.
Underused
3. Sophocles - likeabale character, can be very useful in some episodes and also has some interesting episodes for his own, but he is a bit underused. They could do more with him.
4. Brock - sure, he is a cult character, but they really underused him + he became more of a running gag in the end rather than his own character, a running gag for 3 whole animes to be clear!
Not interested in
5. Cilan - ... well... he was there. He never annoyed me, but he never also hooked my interest in him as a character. He existed for me, and that's sadly all I can say about him
Bad
6. Max - never liked the trope of the smart, very young kid character. Also he sometimes really got on my nerves with his attitude against Ash and his older sister May.
7. Tracy - a complete forgettable character... boring personality, boring goal, had almost no interactions with any other characters and even his design is boring. The anime had even back than background characters with a more outstanding design.
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Dragalge
"Orange" Magical Girl
Kinda. Still, this was before Ash met him so Sawyer wasn’t a rival to anyone beforehand.
Blue Saturday
Violet Prince❤️
1. Takeshi - He was pretty awesome and had a great presence in the show as a mentor figure and guiding light, shame he fell into the wayside so much but still he was great. Teaching lessons to the younger trainees, caring for his baby Pokemon captures as a breeder, intervening several times in certain affairs or giving his perspective on things like the whole situation in DP with Satoshi's abused Hikozaru. His biggest setback in falling into the background, staleness and a lack of activity outside generic battle dialogue.
2. Kaki - Great, fun to be around, great focus episodes, good Pokemon, nice gimmick with his Z-Move respect, unique as being the only battler from the get-go of his class. He's great, plus we've never had a fire specialist. It's refreshing to see Satoshi have a male traveling companion as more of an equal and he more or less seems confirmed for the Alola League.
3. Dent - Fun, active, has done the most battler and had the most goal-related episodes of the male companions. Fast to take action in a crisis which was refreshing after Takeshi. Great Pokemon, awesome voice actor. Best interactions of any PokeBoy as he often had many characters to bounce off of whether it be the more dense and hyperactive Satoshi, snarky Iris, salty Cabernet, his insecure brother, he worked well with even Iris and Satoshi's rivals. You didn't forget he was ever there which is unique for PokeBoys. Biggest shortcoming was that he was more so stagnant but did get some development but that's expected of his role.
4. Citron - Strong start, weak middle, weak finish. He seemingly broke the mold at first giving us a male companion with insecurities, focus and flaws more in line with a PokeGirls. His fat!Harimaron and hijacked Gym episodes seemingly set the pace for that, in early XY episodes he's alive and actively adding his input in on things and existing. Even offering guidance to Corni during her Lucario arc. and taking responsibility for Pikachu's abduction and saving the day. After those first 30-esque episodes he fades into the background. No more battling, very little training, little self motivation to be his own character. He essentially became Satoshi's satellite character, maybe not to the extent Serena did but he did. His penultimate episode, the gym battle was simply okay at best. Pretty animation and art but several bad calls and handling of his Pokemon bring it down. His interactions simply are Eureka and Satoshi. I don't remember him even talking to another character in a worthwhile way. Not even his father, Burysamo Kamen . Essentially a running gag after that point, very frustrating.
5. Kenji - Nothing offensive, he was clearly just meant to be filler until Johto. He's fine, enjoyable Pokemon, nice presence, fun episodes, he didn't wear out his welcome. He did a good job making himself very distinct from Takeshi as a replacement.
2. Kaki - Great, fun to be around, great focus episodes, good Pokemon, nice gimmick with his Z-Move respect, unique as being the only battler from the get-go of his class. He's great, plus we've never had a fire specialist. It's refreshing to see Satoshi have a male traveling companion as more of an equal and he more or less seems confirmed for the Alola League.
3. Dent - Fun, active, has done the most battler and had the most goal-related episodes of the male companions. Fast to take action in a crisis which was refreshing after Takeshi. Great Pokemon, awesome voice actor. Best interactions of any PokeBoy as he often had many characters to bounce off of whether it be the more dense and hyperactive Satoshi, snarky Iris, salty Cabernet, his insecure brother, he worked well with even Iris and Satoshi's rivals. You didn't forget he was ever there which is unique for PokeBoys. Biggest shortcoming was that he was more so stagnant but did get some development but that's expected of his role.
4. Citron - Strong start, weak middle, weak finish. He seemingly broke the mold at first giving us a male companion with insecurities, focus and flaws more in line with a PokeGirls. His fat!Harimaron and hijacked Gym episodes seemingly set the pace for that, in early XY episodes he's alive and actively adding his input in on things and existing. Even offering guidance to Corni during her Lucario arc. and taking responsibility for Pikachu's abduction and saving the day. After those first 30-esque episodes he fades into the background. No more battling, very little training, little self motivation to be his own character. He essentially became Satoshi's satellite character, maybe not to the extent Serena did but he did. His penultimate episode, the gym battle was simply okay at best. Pretty animation and art but several bad calls and handling of his Pokemon bring it down. His interactions simply are Eureka and Satoshi. I don't remember him even talking to another character in a worthwhile way. Not even his father, Burysamo Kamen . Essentially a running gag after that point, very frustrating.
5. Kenji - Nothing offensive, he was clearly just meant to be filler until Johto. He's fine, enjoyable Pokemon, nice presence, fun episodes, he didn't wear out his welcome. He did a good job making himself very distinct from Takeshi as a replacement.
AuraChannelerChris
Easygoing Luxray.
Best to trash:
Brock -> Tracey -> a tie between Clemont (failed bro), Cilan (WASTED potential), and Max (annoying).
Brock -> Tracey -> a tie between Clemont (failed bro), Cilan (WASTED potential), and Max (annoying).
TheWanderingMist
Paladin of the Snow Queen
What about the SM duo, Kiawe and Soph?
AuraChannelerChris
Easygoing Luxray.
They don't count to me because they aren't traveling, and Kiawe is a weird companion/rival.
NanoMoltres
Well-Known Member
~ Brock
~ Kiawe
~ Tracey
~ Clemont*
~ Max
~ Cilan
~ Sophocles
*May be subjected to change in terms of ranking in the future, I have only seen a small handful of episodes of XY(Z) as of the time of writing.
~ Kiawe
~ Tracey
~ Clemont*
~ Max
~ Cilan
~ Sophocles
*May be subjected to change in terms of ranking in the future, I have only seen a small handful of episodes of XY(Z) as of the time of writing.
World Turtle
Well-Known Member
https://translate.google.com/transl....jp/article/2017/05/11/33827.html&prev=search
According to the translator this is a list of most wanted characters to travel with Ash again.
Serena has the biggest shipping fleet with the rest of the girls (save for two) right behind her in order of appearance.
Then comes the rest of the third wheels and Bonnie-the tagalong kid. This is followed by Iris in last place.
And apparently nobody likes Max.
According to the translator this is a list of most wanted characters to travel with Ash again.
- Brock
- Serena
- Misty
- May
- Dawn
- Clemont
- Cilan
- Tracey
- Bonnie
- Iris
Serena has the biggest shipping fleet with the rest of the girls (save for two) right behind her in order of appearance.
Then comes the rest of the third wheels and Bonnie-the tagalong kid. This is followed by Iris in last place.
And apparently nobody likes Max.
LilligantLewis
Bonnie stan
Unlike the Pokégirl thread, where most posters actually took into consideration the criteria that OP gave, this thread hasn't followed that. However, because it's easier for me to do it that way, I am going to break it down by the criteria @Ignition gave.
-Their teams
7. Max
6. Sophocles
5. Kiawe
4. Cilan
3. Tracey
2. Brock
1. Clemont
-Their personality
7. Max
6. Sophocles
5. Tracey
4. Brock
3. Clemont
2. Kiawe
1. Cilan
I realized after making this personality list that it's very distinctively broken down by era, besides Sophocles who just annoys me. The bottom 4 are all Gen I-IV, and the top 3 are all Gens V-VII. I think to me it's just that over time in the Pokémon anime, the writers realized how to elevate the male companions to the level of importance and focus that the female companions get, which is something I really didn't see with Brock and Tracey, who were very clearly third wheels, and Max who was a fourth wheel. Cilan's personality often outshone Iris's, Kiawe's seems more emphasized than any of the girls', and Clemont's added a funny dynamic to the XY group that at least made him feel not as much of a third wheel as characters from Gens I-IV.
-Their goals
7. Max
6. Sophocles
5. Tracey
4. Brock
3. Cilan
2. Clemont
1. Kiawe
Just going to talk about the top 3
Cilan - first male companion to have his own rival
He also had his own goal, and I truly thought they were going to elevate him to S class connoisseur by the end of it, when they mentioned he was only A. Surprised they did nothing with that after mentioning that rating scale. He also should have continued to Kalos with Ash - not only because it's France and perfect for the food, but connoisseurs were actually mentioned in Kalos, one of them as a judge at one of the showcases, and that could have been his job in Kalos tbh, and the reason he stays in Kalos at the end when Ash continues to Alola. However, despite the negatives I just mentioned, just the fact that he's the only male companion to ever have his own rival and actively battle her multiple times, this makes him automatically better than anything before. The only reason I mentioned those negatives above is because I still felt they could have done more with him, which could have potentially elevated him to #1 or 2.
Clemont - even though they messed him up between his gym battle and the Xerosic arc, the buildup to the gym battle, his desire to be like Ash, and the Xerosic fight, both during and after the arc, giving him more to do in a villain arc than previous male companions, are what elevate him to me to that #2 spot.
Kiawe - only companion ever to join Ash in competing in the league, which to me is the best goal in the whole show
-Interactions with Ash + the other Main Characters
8. DP Brock
7. Tracey
6. Sophocles
5. Kiawe
4. Brock
3. Max
2. Clemont
1. Cilan
Overall ranking based on combining the above 4:
When I assigned a point system to the above and used it to calculate the overall ranking, Max and Sophocles ended up tied, so my final tiebreaker is just that I like Max more. Sophocles feels irrelevant to me and I wouldn't miss him at all if he didn't exist, I still feel the SM saga overall could move along just fine, with minimal differences/changes. Max was a cool guy to be the first younger sibling, it was interesting to have a group of 4 because of him in the episodes where they split up into 2 and 2 for example, and I liked his dynamic with May which is why I put him #3 on character interactions.
7. Sophocles
6. Max
5. Tracey
4. Brock
3. Kiawe
2. Cilan
1. Clemont
Because of Quilladin and Chesnaught debuting so late, as more and more episodes happened, 90+, and they still hadn't debuted yet, I was actually convinced it was because they were saving their debut for Chespin's evolutions, so I was even more disappointed than I would have been otherwise, that it never evolved. For example, when Delphox debuted so early, the second-earliest of any starter final stage (Blaziken debuted before AG even started), I immediately set my expectations low for Serena to ever get it, and that ended up being the right move. I did not do the same with Clemont and Chespin
By this I'm assuming you mean that he did not feel the same after the gym battle. I agree with you and I wish they had made Clemont 8th. We always talk about how anime does not equal games, and this was a perfect opportunity for them to take advantage of that and make Clemont the 8th gym, especially considering that the league was at Lumiose City so it would have made sense anyway for the final gym to be right there in the same city as the league. I also wish it had been a 6on6 2-episode battle, in which he used Dedenne, Bunnelby, Chespin, Luxray, Heliolisk, and Magneton.
I agree with what you say about what Tracey would have benefited from, but I get the sense that at the time the writers added and then removed Tracey, they weren't even thinking about how to give him development to compare to future companions, and in fact it was very possible they hadn't even thought of the concept of future companions and just thought it was going to be Ash, Misty, and Brock forever, with Tracey being a temporary replacement who had served his purpose. I even think if they looked back at his situation now, considering how many traveling companions there have been since then, they would probably agree with you, it's just that at the time, the concept of rotating traveling companions each region, and giving each of them proper development, wasn't even in the writers' mind.
-Their teams
7. Max
6. Sophocles
5. Kiawe
4. Cilan
3. Tracey
2. Brock
1. Clemont
-Their personality
7. Max
6. Sophocles
5. Tracey
4. Brock
3. Clemont
2. Kiawe
1. Cilan
I realized after making this personality list that it's very distinctively broken down by era, besides Sophocles who just annoys me. The bottom 4 are all Gen I-IV, and the top 3 are all Gens V-VII. I think to me it's just that over time in the Pokémon anime, the writers realized how to elevate the male companions to the level of importance and focus that the female companions get, which is something I really didn't see with Brock and Tracey, who were very clearly third wheels, and Max who was a fourth wheel. Cilan's personality often outshone Iris's, Kiawe's seems more emphasized than any of the girls', and Clemont's added a funny dynamic to the XY group that at least made him feel not as much of a third wheel as characters from Gens I-IV.
-Their goals
7. Max
6. Sophocles
5. Tracey
4. Brock
3. Cilan
2. Clemont
1. Kiawe
Just going to talk about the top 3
Cilan - first male companion to have his own rival
He also had his own goal, and I truly thought they were going to elevate him to S class connoisseur by the end of it, when they mentioned he was only A. Surprised they did nothing with that after mentioning that rating scale. He also should have continued to Kalos with Ash - not only because it's France and perfect for the food, but connoisseurs were actually mentioned in Kalos, one of them as a judge at one of the showcases, and that could have been his job in Kalos tbh, and the reason he stays in Kalos at the end when Ash continues to Alola. However, despite the negatives I just mentioned, just the fact that he's the only male companion to ever have his own rival and actively battle her multiple times, this makes him automatically better than anything before. The only reason I mentioned those negatives above is because I still felt they could have done more with him, which could have potentially elevated him to #1 or 2.
Clemont - even though they messed him up between his gym battle and the Xerosic arc, the buildup to the gym battle, his desire to be like Ash, and the Xerosic fight, both during and after the arc, giving him more to do in a villain arc than previous male companions, are what elevate him to me to that #2 spot.
Kiawe - only companion ever to join Ash in competing in the league, which to me is the best goal in the whole show
-Interactions with Ash + the other Main Characters
8. DP Brock
7. Tracey
6. Sophocles
5. Kiawe
4. Brock
3. Max
2. Clemont
1. Cilan
Overall ranking based on combining the above 4:
When I assigned a point system to the above and used it to calculate the overall ranking, Max and Sophocles ended up tied, so my final tiebreaker is just that I like Max more. Sophocles feels irrelevant to me and I wouldn't miss him at all if he didn't exist, I still feel the SM saga overall could move along just fine, with minimal differences/changes. Max was a cool guy to be the first younger sibling, it was interesting to have a group of 4 because of him in the episodes where they split up into 2 and 2 for example, and I liked his dynamic with May which is why I put him #3 on character interactions.
7. Sophocles
6. Max
5. Tracey
4. Brock
3. Kiawe
2. Cilan
1. Clemont
Because of Quilladin and Chesnaught debuting so late, as more and more episodes happened, 90+, and they still hadn't debuted yet, I was actually convinced it was because they were saving their debut for Chespin's evolutions, so I was even more disappointed than I would have been otherwise, that it never evolved. For example, when Delphox debuted so early, the second-earliest of any starter final stage (Blaziken debuted before AG even started), I immediately set my expectations low for Serena to ever get it, and that ended up being the right move. I did not do the same with Clemont and Chespin
By this I'm assuming you mean that he did not feel the same after the gym battle. I agree with you and I wish they had made Clemont 8th. We always talk about how anime does not equal games, and this was a perfect opportunity for them to take advantage of that and make Clemont the 8th gym, especially considering that the league was at Lumiose City so it would have made sense anyway for the final gym to be right there in the same city as the league. I also wish it had been a 6on6 2-episode battle, in which he used Dedenne, Bunnelby, Chespin, Luxray, Heliolisk, and Magneton.
I agree with what you say about what Tracey would have benefited from, but I get the sense that at the time the writers added and then removed Tracey, they weren't even thinking about how to give him development to compare to future companions, and in fact it was very possible they hadn't even thought of the concept of future companions and just thought it was going to be Ash, Misty, and Brock forever, with Tracey being a temporary replacement who had served his purpose. I even think if they looked back at his situation now, considering how many traveling companions there have been since then, they would probably agree with you, it's just that at the time, the concept of rotating traveling companions each region, and giving each of them proper development, wasn't even in the writers' mind.
Technically, you cannot count companions if the show isn't over, since they can still progress.