Rate My Sand Team

[SlowPokeBroKing]

I've never battled competitively, but I thought I'd try my luck at building a team for the Battle Maison (hopefully that doesn't disqualify this thread).

Battle Maison Super Triples
I already made it through Triples with this team but can't seem to get past a 15-20 streak in Super Triples. Any help or criticism would be geatly appreciated.

Skarmory (Leftovers)
Sturdy
-Tailwind
-Spikes
-Whirlwind
-Steel Wing

I start with Skarmory on the left using Tailwind on the first turn and Spikes on the second turn. Whirlwind for annoying non-Poison/non-Steel types that lead opposing teams that I don't have effective attacks against.

Tyranitar (Smooth Rock)
Sand Stream
-Stealth Rock
-Crunch
-Stone Edge
-Fire Punch/Brick Break/Thunder Punch (I can't decide between the 3)

Not sure if Stealth Rock is the best choice for Tyranitar because it gets OHKO'd a lot in the middle like that, but I have it in the middle because it's the only real attacker I have of my leads if it makes it to a second turn. Fire Punch for Grass types as I have nothing else to stop them or Thunder Punch for Water types for the same reason.

Forretress (Custap Berry)
Sturdy
-Toxic Spikes
-Gravity
-Sandstorm
-Explosion

Sandstorm in case a Hail/Rain/Sun user comes in. Not really sure why I have Explosion over Gyro Ball. I guess I just feel like I'm set on Steel type attacks and Explosion is powerful once I'm done setting up. Gravity sometimes creates a vulnerable Skarmory, especially with all the powerful Earthquakes I use, but it works so well in conjunction with Toxic Spikes/Spikes against Flying types and Levitators.

Garchomp (Garchompite)
Sand Veil (Sand Force)
-Dragon Claw
-Shadow Claw
-Earthquake
-Stone Edge

Not sure if I have to explain this. Criticize away if you see an issue.

Excadrill (Focus Sash)
Sand Rush
-Iron Head
-Earthquake
-Aerial Ace
-Rock Slide

Aerial Ace for coverage against Fighting and Grass types that would be a threat otherwise and for its reach.

Durant (Wide Lens)
Hustle
-Iron Head
-X Scissor
-Shadow Claw
-Stone Edge

Seems like an odd choice to most competitive players, I'm sure. Durant is actually my trustiest late-game sweeper. It's speed and power are so helpful overall.

My overall assessment of my team:
It works in a lot of ways but falls short in others. Little coverage sucks and heavy Fire/Fighting weaknesses cause problems every now and again. I also see how bad it is that my team is entirely physical. I've considered M-Lucario over M-Garchomp but it is much more frail. A random Ice type attack from an unexpected opponent is really annoying but doesn't happen often enough to be a deal-breaker. My greatest opponent thus far was the Ferrothorn that ended my streak yesterday. The physicality of my team and lack of good coverage really screwed me in that regard.

Like I said, fire away. Any help is appreciated. Don't hold back.

 

[Lexya428]

Well, I'm not competitve genius myself. Are you just using it for the Maison or are you planning on going online with this team, if so, what tier (approximately) do you think you'd use? Also, are they IV bred and EV trained? Also, have you looked at the natures?

Either way, with my novice experience.. and I generally only do doubles and Multis, so correct me if I'm wrong anybody.
I'm pretty sure Skarmory is mainly a singles Pokémon, not saying it couldn't work here. Also, Brave Bird might be a better option as opposed to Steel Wing. You could also look at replacing Tailwind with Roost. For EV I would go with 252HP/252Def/4Speed. Impish or Bold natured would probably be good here. Steel/Flying.

....

Before I go any further. Your team has 4 Pokémon weak to fire types. 2 weak to fighting, ground, fairy, and water. Others are electric, steel, bug, grass, ice, and dragon.

As opposed to Tyranitar, you could look at the lesser used Hippowdan for Sandstreaming.

For sweeping... Heatran usually does well on a sand team. Lucario would do well here too. Empoleon, which would help cover your fire type weaknesses. I personally love Flygon, but it is frequently outshined by Salamence and Garchomp.

Sandstorm walls... Skarmory works well, but see notes above. Swampert and Forretress are also decent. Cradily does surprisingly well here and I think it's worth giving a look into it.

Other Pokémom that work well on a sandstorm team. Blissey, Tentacruel, and Starmie. Rotom-A and Spirtomb do well on defensive sandstorm teams. One of the main things to look out for are stall teams.

I would look at starting with replacing Durant and Excadrill.

I hope I help at least a little.

 

[SlowPokeBroKing]

I'm going to preface any post I have from here on out with this:

Any questions I respond with are not meant to be defensive. I truly am trying to look at this as objectively as possible and hope to gain as much information as I can.

Well, I'm not competitve genius myself. Are you just using it for the Maison or are you planning on going online with this team, if so, what tier (approximately) do you think you'd use? Also, are they IV bred and EV trained? Also, have you looked at the natures?

Looking to battle strictly at the Maison. I may advance to competitive someday, but not before I accomplish my task of a 50 win streak in Super Triples.

The only two that are not IV bred are Tyranitar and Forretress.

Skarmory, Excadrill, and Durant are shiny with 6 perfect IVs and beneficial natures. I got them in trades and can just about guarantee they're hacked, but that doesn't bother me when I'm just battling in-game.

I bred Garchomp personally to have a Jolly nature and IV spread of 31/31/31/x/31/31.

As for EV training, I have never actually taken the time to figure out how to. For Battle Maison only purposes, would it still be recommended?

Either way, with my novice experience.. and I generally only do doubles and Multis, so correct me if I'm wrong anybody.
I'm pretty sure Skarmory is mainly a singles Pokémon, not saying it couldn't work here. Also, Brave Bird might be a better option as opposed to Steel Wing. You could also look at replacing Tailwind with Roost. For EV I would go with 252HP/252Def/4Speed. Impish or Bold natured would probably be good here. Steel/Flying.

Why would Skarmory be strictly Singles? Brave Bird makes sense. I've also considered Sky Drop as many opposing Maison Skarmory I've battled have temporarily crippled me with Sky Drop. Or do you think Brave Bird would be more beneficial? As for Roost, I can see why you would suggest it for a Singles Skarmory, but wouldn't Tailwind be more beneficial in a Triples setup?

Before I go any further. Your team has 4 Pokémon weak to fire types. 2 weak to fighting, ground, fairy, and water. Others are electric, steel, bug, grass, ice, and dragon.

Fire is my biggest issue. Unsuspecting Pokémon like Skuntank mess me up bad sometimes with Flamethrower. I'll be honest, I was under the impression that Ground resisted Fire when originally setting up this team. I found out the hard way.

Fighting and Ice are kind of hindrance, too, seeing as Tyranitar and Garchomp have double weaknesses to them, respectively.

As opposed to Tyranitar, you could look at the lesser used Hippowdan for Sandstreaming.

I can see why Hippowdon would be more beneficial there. I like the idea of not having a double weakness with an essential Stealth Rock lead. I guess I was so set on Tyranitar due to its attacking capabilities that I didn't consider other Sandstreamers.

For sweeping... Heatran usually does well on a sand team. Lucario would do well here too. Empoleon, which would help cover your fire type weaknesses. I personally love Flygon, but it is frequently outshined by Salamence and Garchomp.

Firstly, I didn't realize until you just mentioned Heatran that so many legendaries were eligible in the Battle Maison. Secondly, although I like the idea of a special attacker like Heatran on my team, its typing ruins it for me due to how often I use Earthquake.

I've tried Lucario and Empoleon but they haven't really been that effective for me. Again, I think it's the Earthquakes. Don't get me wrong, I love the idea of these guys as sweepers, but on a triples team with powerful Earthquakes, it's so hard for them to be viable. Unless there's something I'm doing wrong, which is entirely possible.

Sandstorm walls... Skarmory works well, but see notes above. Swampert and Forretress are also decent. Cradily does surprisingly well here and I think it's worth giving a look into it.

Swampert and Cradily are options I hadn't considered. I've been too focused on Steel types and heavy hitters. I will definitely consider them.

Other Pokémom that work well on a sandstorm team. Blissey, Tentacruel, and Starmie. Rotom-A and Spirtomb do well on defensive sandstorm teams. One of the main things to look out for are stall teams.

I'm not terribly keen on using Pokémon on my team who will be weakened by the sand, although I understand why you suggested them.

I would look at starting with replacing Durant and Excadrill.

Why is that?

I hope I help at least a little.

You have been more than helpful

 

[Twilightphoenix10]

to answer some of your questions. Skarmory is usually only considered for singles because of its high defenses and ability to set up stealth rocks/ spikes and use toxic and whirlwind to phase out opponents teams building chip damage and induce status through toxic with brave bird being its only attacking move used. it can't do this in multi battles effectively because the opponent will have multiple mons out at once reducing its effectiveness in this regard. as for ev training to be necessary for the battle maison I would think yes since the higher your win streak the more challengeing the opponents will be and all of their pokemon are ev trained and some will even have hidden abilities like speed boost sharpedo (this guy ruined my win streak once in singles!).

 

[VileSlanders]

There's a lot of Fire weakness on that team, and not much speed or switch in coverage to counter it. My Sand Team incorporates an adamant Sand Setting Tyranitar, Jolly Mega-Garchomp and the Game Changer Choice Banded Jolly Aerodactyl for covering Excadril's, Klefki's, and Aegislash's Fire weakness. I could forward you the setups, but I've only ever used them in Doubles. That said, they've handily won me the 50 streak Maison Super Doubles several times now, so I like to postulate about my genius.

 

[Snoo]

Excadrill @ Life Orb / Air Balloon
Nature: Adamant / Jolly
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
~Earthquake
~Iron Head
~Rock Slide
~Swords Dance / Rapid Spin

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Nature: Careful
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
~Iron Head
~Spikes
~Roost
~Whirlwind / Taunt

Tyranitar @ Smooth Rock
Nature: Relaxed
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 248 HP / 80 Def / 180 SpD
~Stealth Rock
~Pursuit
~Stone Edge
~Ice Beam / Fire Blast / Crunch

 

[Lexya428]

I've found EV Training has helped out in the Maison a quite a bit. It's up to you if you want to take the time to train them in whichever stats you are looking at. It takes me approximately 15 minutes per Pokémon to EV train. Sometimes I can have it done in 10 minutes, sometimes 20. Either way, your looking at least an hour of just EV training your team.
I started at the Maison, using non-IV bred and non-EV trained Pokémon. I've found it much easier to take the opponents down or OHKO them once I had trained Pokémon.
Their IVs are great so that's good.

As for Brave Bird and Sky Drop, you could always try Sky Drop and if you don't like it, just switch the moves. However, is personally use Brave Bird as opposed to Sky Drop. I've never used Sky Drop, so I can't even garuntee how well it works.

Tailwind's not necessarily a bad choice here. Roost would just aid it the recovery process and keep Skarmory on the field longer.

With so many weaknesses, I feel you should have a counter strategy. Since fire types are you main weakness, enlisting a water type Pokémon. You could always give Tyranitar and Garchomp counter strategies for defeating weaknesses, like a fire type move for the ice types. You just want to make sure that if one Pokémon is weak to a move/type, that theirs another one to back it up.

Personally, I prefer Tyranitar and have never actually used Hippowdan. I'm hoping to have one on my team at some point. I've battled them and have also heard a lot of great things about them. Give Hippowdan a shot if you'd like, just an option. Removing the duel weakness would be especially helpful on this specific team.

Earthquake. Both Garchomp and Excadrill have the move, which is a good move, seeing as it's Triples I'm not really sure on what move to Suggest, if you were to, to allow other Pokémon to battle. This is just as much of a learning process for me as it is for you. I'd love to see what others suggest as well.

Especially on your team Swampert may be the best option. It will help cover fire weaknesses!

There is Safety Goggles, if being weakened by the sand worries you. I used them on my Azumarill to allow an appearance on Sand Teams. You do not have to.

Both Excadrill and Durant have low stats. Plus, you have a lot of weaknesses and it may help cover them, if you consider using other Pokémon.

Again, I hope I was helpful!

 

[Twilightphoenix10]

I don't know how usefull a choice scarf would be on an excadrill in triples but it would solve the speed problem if you ev trained it in speed and atk, combined with mold breaker you'll be locked in to a single attack but it will almost be a guaranteed k.o. and if you felt like spamming EQ you would only have to worry about flying types since mold breaker negates levitate, of course I doubt this is a viable stratagy for triples and if you're using sandrush then there shouldn't be any issue about speed since few things will out speed it in the sand.

 

[Snoo]

I don't know how usefull a choice scarf would be on an excadrill in triples but it would solve the speed problem if you ev trained it in speed and atk, combined with mold breaker you'll be locked in to a single attack but it will almost be a guaranteed k.o. and if you felt like spamming EQ you would only have to worry about flying types since mold breaker negates levitate, of course I doubt this is a viable stratagy for triples and if you're using sandrush then there shouldn't be any issue about speed since few things will out speed it in the sand.

Excadrill's speed is doubled in sand thanks to Sand Rush.

Choice Scarf Excadrill is best used not on a sand team, where it can take advantage of Mold Breaker. Sand Rush Excadrill is mainly used on sand teams for sweeping potential.

 

[VileSlanders]

Okay, long story short. Too much fire weakness, too much defense, not enough offense, not enough speed.

Scrap skarmoy in favor of Aerodactyl. Jolly nature, 252 Atk, 252 Spd, 4 HP. Unnerve/Pressure
Item: Choice Band
Movepool:
Earthquake
Rock Slide
Ice Fang
Sky Drop

Excadrill is solid. Best design for the Maison? I might have your answer: Adamant. 252 Atk, 128 Def, 128 Sp. Def. Sand Rush
Item: Life Orb
Movepool:
Magnet Rise
Iron Head
Rock Slide
Earthquake

Tyrannitar, the staple weather setter. He can also play the role of bulky offense as well. Adamant. 252 HP, 252 Atk, 4 Def. Sand Stream.
Item: Smooth Rock
Movepool:
Rock Slide
Assurance
Earthquake
Protect

Garchomp, Mega-Evolution's King of Sand. My most successful setup? Jolly. 252 Atk, 252 Spd, 4 HP. Rough Skin
Item: Garchompanite
Movepool:
Dual Chop/Dragon Claw
Earthquake
Rock Slide
Protect

-Those four are the backbone to my best sand doubles team. Excadrill is the fastest of the lot, extremely powerful, and surprisingly tough with the split defenses. On top of that, Magnet Rise gives Excadrill the advantage of a high speed ground-type immunity, effectively reducing his weaknesses to fighting, fire, and water. That ground type immunity also allows Excadrill to stack attacks with his teammates' EQs. Imagine the damage output of a Sand Force Mega-Chomp EQ combined with a Life Orb/STAB backed Iron Head. That does a lot of damage, mark my words.

Aerodactyl is the second fastest of the lot, stupidly powerful, and an absolute nightmare for unsuspecting teams to deal with. Sky Drop? I know the base damage of 60 looks off-putting, but trust me, breaking up the enemy allows to you focus on high priority threats. And it can totally screw over so many delicate strategies. So many strategies...

...Ahem, Aerodactyl also gives you your switch in Flying Type, so in situations where Tyrannitar's protect has been spent in the prior turn, BUT YOU NEED Garchomp's EQ to raze the enemy again: Aerodactyl provides you with your EQ offensive switch-in.

Tyranitar. I know what you're thinking: What is Assurance, and why would I use it over Crunch?

Answer: Because Crunch has a base power of 80. With a tinsy-winsy amount of damage support (Which his other Teammates can easily provide due to their higher speed and AOE moves like Rock Slide) Assurance has a base power of 120. Then add STAB. Then you realize that Assurance is Tyranitar's STRONGEST technique. So use it.

Garchomp is pretty self-explanatory: Power, and lots of it. I prefer Dual Chop over Dragon Claw, due to Dual Chop's ability to bust Substitutions and Sturdy. You do sacrifice accuracy, but that's the cost of strategic opportunity.

Other teammates I might suggest include Scizor, Aegislash, Klefki, Landorus, and safety Goggles Gyarados(Seriously). Klefki can be extremely useful in the Maison, due to his prankster Safeguard/Swagger set (I run a tanky Klefki with Safeguard, Swagger, Foul Play, and Magnet Rise) you can use Klefki to prevent your team from getting wrecked by status, thanks to Safeguard, while simultaneously boost your teammates attack with Swagger. SwagPlay made Klefki infamous, so this set includes that, but utilizes Magnet Rise T-Wave because PRIORITY IMMUNITY TO GROUND, which limits Klefki's weakness to just fire.

Aegislash is a favorite counter for Fighting types, he uses a Weakness policy, has access to Rock Slide, Shadow Sneak and Iron Head/Sacred Sword, but he does need *minor* speed investment (8-12 EVs) to synergize with Assurance Tyrannitar. Thanks to King's Shield, Aegislash also synergizes very well with the aforementioned Safeguard/Swagger Klefki:

THE KEY-BLADE COMBO:

Round 1: Kelefki uses Safeguard, Aegislash uses King's Shield.

Round 2: Klefki uses Swagger on Aegislash, Aegislash gains a priority +2 to Atk before attacking.

Round 3: Klefki uses Swagger on Aegislash, Aegislash uses King's Shield. Because King's Shield doesn't protect against status, Swagger still procs, but thanks to Safeguard, the confusion is ignored. But Swagger's +2 to attack still procs on Aegislash all the same, allowing you to buff, defend, and if your opponent makes a bad call: debuff all in ONE TURN.

Aegislash and Klefki make a wonderful alternative Lead to Garchomp and Tyranitar, seeing as both combo effectively counter the alternate Lead's weaknesses. And given that Slash settles for the Weakness Policy, and Klefki longs for the Leftovers/Sitrus Berry...

-There's no squabble for Life Orbs or Choice Bands, meaning that the Key-Blade duet compliments the aforementioned backbone VERY WELL.