Religion - A Choice, or a Forced Requisition?

[Josiah]

zenotwapal find your own statement instead of something overused

and as J T said this debate is about religion so don't cry

Oh the irony.

 

[goash]

it is for ur own good..... ;153;

 

[natie]

People who throw kochoupink's quote around every time they can't respond to an Atheist's argument are lazy.

There you go, Zenotwapal, there you go.

 

[Yanmegamaster]

My parents are Christian, my whole family is Christian. I am not however but I am also not Athiest in anyway. I believe there is a superior being watching over all of us. But I also believe in way to much stuff so I might as well make a list: if you don't want to read it then skip my post.

1. I believe that maybe all the stuff in the Bible is a sham and the firery angels zooming across the sky in most of it are Aliens. Even in the story of Abraham he saw a flaming chariot (chariot being a synonym for a form of transportation) but what he saw was actually a UFO which took him away. I also maybe believe Jesus was an alien sent down to help us, same story with the mysterious women coming out of an alien craft in ancient chinese writing and text.

2. Jesus was a magician or maybe an advanced illusionist and his "followers" exxagerated his work and since it was a time of god they believed he was sent by god.

3. Hinduism; dealing with Reincarnation, a piece within your inner self.

4. The world of the Divine Comedy by Dante Allighieri, who is to say he didn't actually get to see the three worlds of the afterlife before us. Plus his version of Paradise seems really beautiful...

5. There are several divine beings, but all form the being known as "God" and they are all called Masters. They are the ones who guide you through heaven and let you have a decision on whether you want to stay in heaven or reincarnate so you may fix that which you have done wrong in your past life.

6. The cake is a lie.

Anyways yea thats a basic list of what I believe in, I could show you a whole book but I don't feel like it. Comments, criticisms, all is welcome because I have quite an open mind on Religion just no trolling....

P.S. I also believe Athietists and people who believe in deity's are cool to a certain point. But when you get annoying about it like telling other people their religion is wrong it gets really annoying unless you have proof.

 

[Zenotwapal]

P.S. I also believe Athietists and people who believe in deity's are cool to a certain point. But when you get annoying about it like telling other people their religion is wrong it gets really annoying unless you have proof

Oh hey.
Thanks YanmegaMaster, this goes perfectly with kouchupink's quote.
Seems to me that you cannot go into a religious debate without calling anothers religion wrong. Its like telling a bull to do something. The bull won't listen to you because it's normally a stubborn animal. How can you tell a bull to cut out all of its bias and listen to you? You can't. It's impossible, really.
Which is why I cannot argue with people like you. You cannot even sit there and listen to anything that uses the word "God" in it. Thats why that quote that's apparently overused, fits the contex of every religious debate perfectly. In fact, so perfectly, you can't bear to see it.
Which is why, unless deemed necessary by myself, I will stop. I really can't watch bitter people attempting to take down something they don't agre with. And many of you, like J.T, are sort of hypocritical because you told me the exact same thing, don't deem something wrong because you disagree with it, just like in the homosexuality debate.
I bid you all a good freakin' day.

 

[natie]

Zenotwapal, I hope you realise what major mistake you just made?

Hint: It's got something to do with the thing you quoted.

like telling other people their religion is wrong it gets really annoying unless you have proof

That's exactly what you're doing here.

I can't even be arsed to reply to your 'arguments' anymore, they're really lame and ad hominem. Sorry man, you'll have to think some more before you post.

 

[GhostAnime]

You cannot even sit there and listen to anything that uses the word "God" in it.

Funny thing is that you ignored my posts in the process (which seems to be a trend with you, your friend John and Sandshrew for some reason).

My responses were fine, right? Surely giving reasons why considering a being so improbable that they may as well not exist isn't "You can't sit here and listen to the word 'God'" right?

And many of you, like J.T, are sort of hypocritical because you told me the exact same thing, don't deem something wrong because you disagree with it, just like in the homosexuality debate.

You seem to be the king around here when it comes to ridiculous comparisons.

First of all, the wrong you use in this quote and the wrong we used in homosexuality debates are TWO DIFFERENT WRONGS. Equivocation.

Two, so what do homosexuality rights have to do with the current debate? Are we debating whether homosexuals exist? .. Where's the hypocrisy exactly? One debate is about the existence of something along with if we are forced to believe in it and another debate is about homosexuality marriage rights and why one should not get them.

 

[Ethan]

Actually the debate is on whether religion is a choice or not, so I'm curious as to why people are debating whether God exists as that's technically off topic.

 

[J.T.]

Oh hey.
Thanks YanmegaMaster, this goes perfectly with kouchupink's quote.

Yes, because saying "anyone who forces their beliefs on others is a douche" fits perfectly with "atheists are hypocrites".

Seems to me that you cannot go into a religious debate without calling anothers religion wrong.

Isn't that the point of most religious debates?

Its like telling a bull to do something. The bull won't listen to you because it's normally a stubborn animal. How can you tell a bull to cut out all of its bias and listen to you? You can't. It's impossible, really.

Bravo comparing us to "stubborn bulls".

Which is why I cannot argue with people like you. You cannot even sit there and listen to anything that uses the word "God" in it.

Oh, spare me this ********, you're going into exactly the same thing you went into on the last gay rights thread - whining about religious persecution and how atheists are so stubborn and anti-religious.

Thats why that quote that's apparently overused, fits the contex of every religious debate perfectly. In fact, so perfectly, you can't bear to see it.

"What? People don't like me pulling out a quote that everybody on my side and their mother has used at some point on this forum? It can't possibly be because it's not valid in the context I used it in, or because it's an immense overgeneralization, or because it's completely wrong. No, it must be because it's so right, it makes them all angry! I win!"

Do you read back what you type to yourself?

I really can't watch bitter people attempting to take down something they don't agre with.

You decided coming into a debate forum was a good idea when you don't like watching people argue their views?

And many of you, like J.T, are sort of hypocritical

How exactly am I being hypocritical?

because you told me the exact same thing, don't deem something wrong because you disagree with it, just like in the homosexuality debate.

I'm... not even sure what you're trying to say here. I guess this answers one of my earlier questions...

 

[Yanmegamaster]

Zenotwapal, I believe you misunderstood what I said. It is true that calling another one's religion wrong is annoying but only if you don't have solid proof. This is why debates are formed, not to troll at other people's religion, but to politely tell them why they are wrong in your opinion or through solid evidence. Anyways, to end this post I will conclude that Religion is not a forced choice and that one's choice on religion may or may not be solely influenced by the religion of the parents or the family.

 

[tyranitar90]

Hey I am an athiest. Religions were created during times where there was no science to explain stuff. such as earthquakes and eclipses. So now that we have science and logic, we don't need religion. We also don't need religion to tell us how we should live life. I believe in helping others and sharing. I dislike racism and i don't need a religion to tell me what is right.

 

[Mr. Mudkip]

You have it all wrong, what religion is about.

You cannot prove the origin of matter, how Earth came to be, how we ended up in our Goldilocks Zone, or the origin of life itself.

ITT science ***s say everything is explained when the origins of existence are just as much a mystery to them.

EDIT: Evolution is not an argument either.
Who's to say an omnipotent God couldn't have used evolution as a tool for the creation of life.

 

[Skiks]

Well as for the actual topic I think Religion happens to be both a choice and something forced on people. Some people do get forced into their beliefs because of what they are taught. Others may disagree with them once they get older and reject them.
I know I'm failing to take a side here but because of the way people act.
Also the bible seemed to know a lot of scientific things before they were discovered. Such as people turning to dust after death and the fact that the world was round. I guess if people actually read the bible they may understand it for what it really is.

 

[Mr. Mudkip]

I agree with Skiks, religion is sometimes forced and somethimes chosen. Force I would mostly associate with predominiately Islamic nations.

 

[Skiks]

I agree with Skiks, religion is sometimes forced and somethimes chosen. Force I would mostly associate with predominiately Islamic nations.

As you said those religions are mainly forced upon people because of their culture. In Hispanic culture I feel Catholic beliefs are forced upon a lot of people.
We can say at the start of life beliefs may be forced upon you but that does not mean you can't change them or even believe they were right all along.

 

[harryheart]

So while there isn't anything built-in to you that forces you to follow religion, I can udnerstand why people feel like it is not a chocie because they have strong values, and I suppose those could be something that force you into a religion (though you still have the choice of not to join or not.)

Umm... I know I've gone back a few pages but I can disprove this. I unfortunately can't show the proof because I don't know how to get a newspaper article on the internet but I'm sure it can be found. The basics of it though are that the need for idolising and worshiping something is built into us. Scientists over the past decade have been recording scans of people's brains during different activites. One being someone in chruch worshiping the Christian God, and one being someone at a Michael Jackson Concert. While these two events were unfolding a certain part of the brain kicked in and began to be used causing the Michale Jackson person to breakdown and cry with joy and the a similar situation for the church goer. I myself happen to be Christian and have been for 2 years based on a decision I made after looking into things for a period of time, and that is the thing I think people need to do more. Instead of instantaneously deciding, gather all the info, or as much as possible and then gage your beliefs from that. The vicars son, although a Christian decided to do this for himself and has managed to concrete his faith. It's useful for anyone to do really and concrete their beliefs.

Although I might beleive different things to you we are all (in my faith) sons and daughters of God worthy of the chance to explore.

 

[Skiks]

It is true we have a big need to idolize something. Whether it be a person or some higher existence or even things we may not realize. I think people just don't take notice because they believe religion is a separate topic.

 

[harryheart]

2. Jesus was a magician or maybe an advanced illusionist and his "followers" exxagerated his work and since it was a time of god they believed he was sent by god.

A little off topic but they didn't actually, most of them wanted to kill him because they thought he was blastfeaming (or however you spell it) and going against God siding with Satan.

It is true we have a big need to idolize something. Whether it be a person or some higher existence or even things we may not realize. I think people just don't take notice because they believe religion is a separate topic.

Hmm I completely agree with you. Me, being religious would say that this need came from God but I'm sure Science can also prove someway it occured over evolution. And then I could respond saying God sparked it and so on and it only causes arguments and people get lost in the religion vs. athiesm argument. My point with that is that religion and science go hand in hand, science sort of answers the question posed by religion and vice versa on occasion. One needs the other and I think that the idolising thing say it all, religion is not seperate to the material possesion of the world.

I hope the post made sense

 

[Skiks]

A lot of scientist who do believe in a God of some sort always say they are not out there to disprove God. They are just there to explain his marvelous creations. I kinda disagree that science and religion cannot coexist. It's just people that make it hard to let it coexist. Although now I feel I am slightly off topic.

 

[GhostAnime]

Such as people turning to dust after death and the fact that the world was round. I guess if people actually read the bible they may understand it for what it really is.

Where does it say it? All I remember is it saying the world is actually a circle (or at least, suggested that it wasn't round).

There are also things in the Bible said that CONTRADICT reality as we know it.

As for religion and science co-existing? That depends on how much we cling to the holy books. Things like prayer and a global flood obviously have no scientific basis, but a supreme being alone isn't really an issue. The issue just comes in when you mention things that can't be tested or studied and have to be known as 'faith'. Generic theism is fine, but once you get to the specifics, I wish you luck.

ITT science ***s say everything is explained when the origins of existence are just as much a mystery to them.

Who in this topic said that?