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Rumors & Leaks - Speculation/Discussion Thread [⚠️PLEASE HIDE STORY SPOILERS⚠️]

Pudimon

Certified Pudding Monster
If rather a non open world with a rich environment like Kalos then
I very much would like that too, I didn't even want it to be open world anyway. But from a market standpoint, this is the right move. The games are going in the direction of what seems to be the natural evolution of games like these. But man, they are going so slow. The Pokémon franchise is such a huge thing, but game freak's work culture is not made for this. They have a very estabilished culture that is just too slow to catch up with bigger games nowadays.

People in general still love the games, they sell really well, but they are far from what they could be with a franchise THIS huge.
 

Smeargle-Sketch

Sketcher of Smeargles
I very much would like that too, I didn't even want it to be open world anyway. But from a market standpoint, this is the right move. The games are going in the direction of what seems to be the natural evolution of games like these. But man, they are going so slow. The Pokémon franchise is such a huge thing, but game freak's work culture is not made for this. They have a very estabilished culture that is just too slow to catch up with bigger games nowadays.

People in general still love the games, they sell really well, but they are far from what they could be with a franchise THIS huge.
Will say though, the Pokemon interacting with the overworld as they are is definitely a big deal to see it happening.
 

Captain Jigglypuff

Leader of Jigglypuff Army
This is outright the worst design for Gen IX. Its outright lazy. Also I'm so sick of people calling them RFakes. There's no such category.
I think it looks better than Lickilicky looks. And other gens had some pretty lazy designs as well. Alolan Dugtrio just getting hair and slightly brighter noses, Ditto is just a blob with a face slapped onto it, and Grimer and Muk are literally the Smooze from the 80s My Little Pony movie.

Take a look:

The Smooze
full.jpg


Grimer
088.png
 

Det. Viper

That’s Detective Viper to you
We’re acting like convergent evolution is something new in Pokémon. On top of Diglett/Wiglett we have Wingull/Ducklett, Tauros/Bouffalent, Magnemite/Klink, Sawk & Throh / Hitmonchan & Hitmonlee, Geodude/Boldore, Magikarp/Feebas… do I go on? It’s just that in this case they were just way up front about it. I don’t find it to be a bad thing.
 

mtqc

MY BEANS!
Because we don't need yet another group of Pokemon that are basically remixes of older, especially Kanto ones?
If it goes on like that gen 12 will have, like 10 new designs and the other 70 Pokemon will be various groups based on older designs.
Guess that's personal preference then, cuz I love when they do this lol. I do agree that Kanto is overdone, though. Would love to see these guys for Hoenn or Kalos, as that's where most of my favorites come from.
 

Kazuniya

how cute~
We’re acting like convergent evolution is something new in Pokémon. On top of Diglett/Wiglett we have Wingull/Ducklett, Tauros/Bouffalent, Magnemite/Klink, Sawk & Throh / Hitmonchan & Hitmonlee, Geodude/Boldore, Magikarp/Feebas… do I go on?
I don't think most of those qualify.

Diglett and Wiglett actually look very similar.

Most examples you named look completely different, except maybe Sawk and Throh. Like, Wingull and Ducklett, or Geodude/Boldore? Magikarp/Feebas. They don't look even remotely similar to each other, so I'm not sure why you see these a convergent evolution examples.

And Hitmonlee/Hitmonchan/Hitmontop are literally evolutionary lines of a single Pokemon, they don't count either.
 

Akashin

Well-Known Member
We’re acting like convergent evolution is something new in Pokémon. On top of Diglett/Wiglett we have Wingull/Ducklett, Tauros/Bouffalent, Magnemite/Klink, Sawk & Throh / Hitmonchan & Hitmonlee, Geodude/Boldore, Magikarp/Feebas… do I go on? It’s just that in this case they were just way up front about it. I don’t find it to be a bad thing.
Those are all better described as reimaginings of other Pokémon; there’s nothing officially stated to imply there’s any actual genetic link between any of them.

This is especially true of the Gen 5 examples, as that Gen very explicitly reimagined much of the Kanto Dex (Woobat/Zubat, etc).
This is outright the worst design for Gen IX. Its outright lazy. Also I'm so sick of people calling them RFakes. There's no such category.
I’m slightly curious, just because I’ve seen this come up numerous times… but what exactly is the hang up over people calling them RFakes, exactly? I’m really failing to see the issue with people using an unofficial descriptor for something currently lacking an official one.

Is it just because the RFake name started as a now-disproven concept?
 

Det. Viper

That’s Detective Viper to you
I don't think most of those qualify.

Diglett and Wiglett actually look very similar.

Most examples you named look completely different, except maybe Sawk and Throh. Like, Wingull and Ducklett, or Geodude/Boldore? Magikarp/Feebas. They don't look even remotely similar to each other, so I'm not sure why you see these a convergent evolution examples.

And Hitmonlee/Hitmonchan/Hitmontop are literally evolutionary lines of a single Pokemon, they don't count either.
The Pokémon I mentioned are mostly from Unova and fulfill the same role in Unova as the counterpart I mentioned from another region. The Unova Pokémon “evolved convergently” to act in the same role as other Pokémon. I understand that it was done because only the Unova Pokédex was available in BW. But the idea and process is similar. As I said it isn’t quite as obvious as the new Wiglett but I can’t say it’s entirely different than what was done with creating Unova Pokémon.
 

Ultra Beast Lover

Well-Known Member
I don't mind the convergent Pokemon, I honestly think Wigglet looks fine. A major part of Pokemon is evolution so I like that they're experimenting with them.

We know there's some relation between Diglett and Wiglett, but I think it's too soon to say if it's an evolution.
No, we're not saying that it's an evolution. We're saying that it's a convergent evolution, two animals that developed similar traits but are unrelated, like dolphins and sharks.
 

Ultra Beast Lover

Well-Known Member
I don't mind the convergent Pokemon, I honestly think Wigglet looks fine. A major part of Pokemon is evolution so I like that they're experimenting with them.

We know there's some relation between Diglett and Wiglett, but I think it's too soon to say if it's an evolution.
No, we're not saying that it's an evolution. We're saying that it's a convergent evolution, two animals that developed similar traits but are unrelated, like dolphins and sharks.
 

Akashin

Well-Known Member
I don't mind the convergent Pokemon, I honestly think Wigglet looks fine. A major part of Pokemon is evolution so I like that they're experimenting with them.
I like it quite a bit, personally. The only thing I’m not a huge fan of is it’s name; it’s a bit too straightforward for my liking.
 

Pokemon Power

Well-Known Member
I don't mind the convergent Pokemon, I honestly think Wigglet looks fine. A major part of Pokemon is evolution so I like that they're experimenting with them.


No, we're not saying that it's an evolution. We're saying that it's a convergent evolution, two animals that developed similar traits but are unrelated, like dolphins and sharks.
Sounds to me like an excuse to re-use certain design points from past Pokemon, but OK.
 

Litleonid

Well-Known Member
I’m slightly curious, just because I’ve seen this come up numerous times… but what exactly is the hang up over people calling them RFakes, exactly? I’m really failing to see the issue with people using an unofficial descriptor for something currently lacking an official one.

Is it just because the RFake name started as a now-disproven concept?
Its because they're not a thing. They're not a category, yet people like Khu continued to push this term. Also I just don't like Khu's term in general. Convergant is a better term and not inappropriate like Khu whined about, but either way, there is no specific in game category for these 4 Pokemon.
 

Orphalesion

Well-Known Member
Guess that's personal preference then, cuz I love when they do this lol. I do agree that Kanto is overdone, though. Would love to see these guys for Hoenn or Kalos, as that's where most of my favorites come from.

If you don't like new Pokemon, there's always old ones to be found.
And we have Regional Forms for this very concept, in fact if they had made it a regional form, I might have kinda liked it.
 

Nave

Well-Known Member
I like Wiglett. It's cute, and I like how they're using convergent evolution.
Would have liked a bigger trailer though.
 
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