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Satoshi Haters - Explain Yourselves

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mockingjay

swift and lol
Ash is in every single episode - and you seem to watch the Anime. Don't be frightened to say you like him, we all do. ;)
 
Anyways, my main problem with Satoshi is, well...it's been 10 years, right? A little over that, maybe...at the beginning of every region, it seems that his skills and mentality just completely disappear. At the beginning of the regions, he makes beginner mistakes, and Pikachu seems to be reset to level 1 somehow. It's his mother's cooking, I'm tellin' ya. I just can't seem to figure out why the writers seem to love doing that. Is it to try and make the new Region Girl seem better or feel better about her skills? I dunno, but that's just my problem with him. :/
Hm, not in Hoenn it didn't seem like that. With Sinnoh I do agree Ash's power seems to be reset, especially considering this saga is after Ash conquered the Battle Frontier and was taking down legendaries no less.

In Hoenn though Ash seemed to be at his strongest, he only lost one Gym battle that entire arc, and really did have a strong powerhouse team that entire saga.

I honestly think the AG version of Ash was probably the best version of him in terms of maturity in the series. I think the fact that he seemed to look over May and Max a lot seemed to help, whereas with Dawn they're more like siblings.
 

pikapokepower

Active Member
^^ Yea, I too am a major TR fan <points at status>, but I also really like the main group. I think Ash is a good main character, my only wish is that the Chronicles would come back so we could see the old main character's stories(May's Johto journey, Misty's time at the Gym, Casey(maybe), Tracey, etc).

I'm personally getting a little tired of people jumping at hoping this characger replace Brock, or whatever. When the writers wanna replace Brock, they will. Happiny could work, Brock could leave with a Nurse Joy, or maybe leave to start a breeding center with Holly.

good ideas-i like them all. especially that they should have some episodes all about misty or may or tracey etc...
but i dont think brock should go... it would be too Much of a difference, you know?
 

Rave

Banned
I guess these mean kids just like to see the rise and most likely the fall of such a nice interesting kid. =\
 

octoboy

I Crush Everything
I don't hate Ash at all. I can see where people are tired of seeing him in the anime after 500+ episodes, but at this point I think it's kind of a waste to keep hoping the anime will ditch him for a new protagonist.
This is one of the times where Pokemon has screwed itself over. When the writers got rid of Brock and introduced Tracey, for fear of offending people, Tracey didn't blow over, but he did open floodgates; after that, they realized that they didn't have to keep the main cast permanent. Now not only is one spot in a constant mode of recycling, people now feel that since people are replaced in this show that they can have a reason to complain about Ash and Brock's presence. Because they know people can be removed from the show, they feel they can expect people to be, even if there isn't much of a good reason.

I've heard arguments that it's boring to keep the same person in the show for the whole time, but who's to say you don't feel that way just because you've developed that expectation due to some character replacements? Many shows go through every season with the same main cast, and it works because of character development. But instead, the anime had to make a move to avoid offense, and made a realization that they can just give people the axe.

So, thank you, Carol Weatherford for that one.

Hm, not in Hoenn it didn't seem like that. With Sinnoh I do agree Ash's power seems to be reset, especially considering this saga is after Ash conquered the Battle Frontier and was taking down legendaries no less.
One thing to remember: It's not Ash who's actually doing the fighting, it's his pokemon. So, sure, it's odd for pikachu not to win everything after defeating a regi-something (which apparently isn't totally uber, as it's been captured), but pokemon like turtwig and staravia haven't been trained much, so if Ash doesn't win when using them, it's because they're not strong enough to be able to carry out the plan.

So, it's not his fault his pokemon don't always win. Just as it's not our fault our pokemon don't always win when we're starting over in Hoenn or Sinnoh (if you even play...).

And as for pikachu, you can't blame Ash if pikachu's power levels randomly fluctuate.
 

randomspot555

Well-Known Member
And as for pikachu, you can't blame Ash if pikachu's power levels randomly fluctuate.
It's an unwritten rule in anime. A character is only as strong or as powerful (or as weak and inexperienced) as the story calls for.

This is double true for Pokemon.
 

Amazing Red

Well-Known Member
Ash is annoying to me. (Basiclly the whole show is) So whenever I Gary or Paul kick his *** I'm glad. Because Ash is old enough to know what he's doing in pokemon battles and not act like a retard
 

Gravy

Contaminated KFC
I'm largely indifferent to Ash as a character, so any complaints about his personality or the direction in which he is headed are a rarity from me. If any do crop up, they're usually based on occurrences during singular episodes and those just so happen to be ones that are easy to forget. The only problem I can say I have with the road he's gone down is that his interaction with the rest of the group is hardly stellar, as Jup already addressed, but that same argument could be applied to all of them. At the very least, he's fun when around Shinji or Jun.
As others have stated already, the vast majority of issues people seem to have with him have little relevance to the character himself, or rely on twisting existing information into fictitious drivel.

Because Ash is old enough to know what he's doing in pokemon battles and not act like a retard
Honestly now, does this argument hold any real ground? The majority of the time he does use his head and is quite capable of thinking on his feet. There are a plethora of examples that prove this, which just makes the structure of your reasoning all the more flimsy.
 

PokemonHero

I can see the future
I only hate him because he never learns, come on after what over 10 years you'd think they'd make him a wiser trainer...;196; Come on look at gary.. nuf said.
Ash is annoying to me. (Basiclly the whole show is) So whenever I Gary or Paul kick his *** I'm glad. Because Ash is old enough to know what he's doing in pokemon battles and not act like a retard
*Nearly rips his hair out*

This is the one thing that annoys me about Ash haters. They say that he never learns. But that's not true. Compare Ash during Kanto to Ash now. Honestly, do you think that Ash during Kanto would use the spin technique in battle, much less use it effectively.

Look at the Battle Frontier. There were many things Ash came up with on the fly that won him those battles. Creating the fog at the Battle Dome, using Hyper Beam strengthen Snorlax's Body Slam in the Battle Arena...those things he would have never done back in the day.
 
I think the problem is Ash still makes mistakes at times.

Like Ash telling Charizard to use Seismic Toss on Brandon's Dusclops, not only did it cost him that match but Ash says, "I forgot" when Brock yells that fighting type moves don't work on ghost types.

Granted the writers probably do stuff like that for a reason, i.e. they wanted Charizard out of the game early since it already got its glory against Noland's Articuno
 

grounder

*sneezes*
I just think that the main character should change soon. Ash needs to resolve his journey and let a new person take center stage. They did it with Yu-Gi-Oh already, yet Ash is still the main character in the Pokemon Series.
 
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Gravy

Contaminated KFC

ShinyCollector007

Trainin's Over! DIE!
Well the only thing I dont like about him is that he sees all the legendaries and doesnt even try to catch them!!Other than that he is a good character
 
But the thing is; Who doesn't?
True, but by that I mean repeating something he already learned in a previous season. Telling Pikachu to use Quick Attack on Agatha's Gengar pretty much cost him that match as well.

Then again Glalie managed to headbutt Misdreavous in the Hoenn league, so its like the writers themselves change the rules with ghost types all the time.
 

Kipcha

Well-Known Member
I just think that the main character should change soon. Ash needs to resolve his journey and let a new person take center stage. They did it with Yu-Gi-Oh already, yet Ash is still the main character in the Pokemon Series.
The thing is, when shows do that their ratings drop, especially if that character is well-liked. Many of the younger kids who watch Pokemon kind of associate it with Ash and Pikachu, and if they're gone, kids lose interest. I don't think changing the main character would be a good move.

To some people, Ash is their favourite character, and if your favourite character left the show, would you still watch it?

After all, children like consistancy, and they like having characters they can relate too. The fact that Ash makes mistakes every so often, that he loses, it makes him more realistic. If you actually had the pressure on for something that important, plus you were telling another living creature how to stay alive out there, wouldn't you maybe make a mistake or two because you panic? Ash is a good character because he has personality, and his reactions to events are realistic.
 

Faerie

MONS
Um...I wouldn't exactly say I hate Satoshi, but he is my least favorite character in the show.

When I say I don't like him, it doesn't have anything to do with his role in the show. His team doesn't really matter to me, nor does the way he overshadows or doesn't overshadow the other main characters. There's nothing wrong with switching around your team when you go to another region. It's the way the writers showcase the new pokemon. And he's the main character, so even if I cared about him getting all the limelight, there's no reason to complain about it.

What I dislike is his personality and utter lack of character development. Some people might argue that he's changed over time. He is a little more knowledgeable and mature than he was at the beginning of the series, but he hasn't changed enough to be able to justify fans' claim that he's undergone genuine character development. He's still painfully naive, still has a complete one-track mind when it comes to battling, and still acts like a total idiot whenever the chance arises.

I'm not complaining that he has flaws. All characters should have flaws, otherwise they become perfect and unrealistic. My complaint is that his flaws are annoying, used too often as comic relief, and make it difficult for many fans to like him as a character.
 

Shinneth

Fail-Leader!
They did it with Yu-Gi-Oh already, yet Ash is still the main character in the Pokemon Series.
Yeah, because Jaden Yuki and GX in general was just such an improvement over Yugi and the original series.

Alright, maybe that's just totally based on opinion, but I would've taken more years of the original series, no matter how tired it was, over GX replacing it. Sure, Yugi won pretty much all the time, but at least most victories were for very important plot-related reasons. Jaden not only does the exact same thing, but he also wins for the heck of it and makes the entire cast look useless in comparison. Oh wait. That's roughly the same thing the original series did too, right (though at least Kaiba and Jounouchi were still kinda relevant... and the useless people hardly even dueled in the first place)? ... (No, don't question why I use dub names for GX while using the original names for the first series)

Point is, series reboots can go either way. I think Digimon did rather well with it. Yu-Gi-Oh!, on the other hand, not so well. I don't think it's a guarantee that rebooting the series, eliminating Ash and replacing him with someone else will automatically make it better than what it is now.

I mean, maybe it's just the crappy dub that makes me feel this way, but I don't think I'd want a full series based on the GSC characters from the HoSos.
 
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