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September 15th: SM139 - He's Born! The Alolan League Winner!!

Discussion in 'Animé Spoilers' started by Dephender, Sep 5, 2019.

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  1. Doppelgänger

    Doppelgänger Superancient Member

    Kanto Battle Frontier was huge at the time, but it was dampened by Tobias, Palmer and the Sinnoh Elite Four. There was a significant power gap between Tobias, Palmer and Ash with no obvious place for Ash to reach that level. He faced Palmer and Flint shortly before Volkner, who didn't use Raichu.

    What this meant is despite placing Top 4 in Sinnoh, he wasn't ready for the Sinnoh BF or Champion League. There was no place in Sinnoh to bridge that gap, he had to move to a new region. Then the reset happened.

    So, we should stop trying to cross compare Alola to other series, since it makes Ash's progress in those leagues less impressive in context. While he's not the strongest in Alola, he wouldn't disgrace winning like a Cameron would have.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2019
  2. Touma Callum 13

    Touma Callum 13 New Member

    I remember has kid, watching Ash on his journey to become a Pokemon Master. He was a novice and only got to the Indigo league though luck, but still I was shock when he lost in the top 16. But at the same time, I knew he was not ready and still had a logn way to go. Watching all of Johto, Ash had grew stronger and seeing him and Chaizard beat Gary was amazing but after losing to Harrson and Blaziken in the Johto League, I was heart broken but still wanted to keep watching. Ash went into the Hoenn League and lost again, I was sad but not like how I was with Johto because I felt the Hoenn League was meh. After Ash beat the Battle Frontier, it give me hope that maybe Sinnoh will be it. Sinnoh came around and Ash was going to use all his old Pokemon, I thought for sure Ash would win even with BS Tobias around. I remember reading crazy rumours of Ash vs Tobias being a 3 parter and Chiazard would return has Ash 6th Pokemon. After the amazing 3 part battle with Paul, to see Ash lose to Tobias was just soul crushing. I knew at that point Ash was never going to win untill Pokemon was over because the writers were scared people would stop watching if Ash was not the MC. I stop following Pokemon for 6 years after that and did't bother with Unova/B/W. Then Kalos around and give it one last shot, seeing Ash and Graninja bond grow and the battles they had was incredible has it remind me of Ash and Chaizard throughout the Orange Islands and Johto. Yet even after all that and the huge hype built up throughout. In a cruel twist of fate, it would be a Chaizard (my fav Pokemon of all things) that would crush the dream. When Granninja lost, I saw new and old school fans souls crushed to the point of they did't even want anything to do with Pokemon anymore. It was too much for some fans to take in and they just wanted to leave. I was upset, but my soul was already crush to dust back in Sinnoh so I was use to the pain.

    Now here we are again 3 years later

    While I would have love it had Ash won back in Sinnoh or Kalos, I pray to Arceus that Ash wins and destroys this illusion of never wining a full Pokemon League and some fans can wake up from this never ending nightmare.

    Go Wild Ash, no matter if people love or hate you, you deserve to win it now.
     
    04n70n10, nameman and RedR like this.
  3. nameman

    nameman Well-Known Member

    That depends on how you define strength though. There's the strength and skill of the Trainer, and the strength and skill of their Pokemon. Ash's team isn't the best; they're good enough to be a strong unit for Aloa. That's more than compensated by Ash's own skill and will as a Trainer though. In a way, Ash is willing this ragtag group into a League win, and they're answering him by doing their best. Ash is the best Trainer in the League which is confirmed by how eliminations have mostly happened by strength of Trainer and Pokemon.
     
  4. ash&charizardfan

    ash&charizardfan Humanity's greatest soldier

    Lol when ash faced palmer his grotle pushed rhyperior who was unbeaten at that point to a tough match, if grotle (who is nowhere near the strong pokemn of ash) could do that much damage, ash would have won sinnoh BF its just DP idiotic circlejerkers to think that everything in the sinnoh is superior to all the other regions. Guess what by the time of kalos even the champion cynthia w/o mega garchomp would be weaker than other champions with ME like steven or diantha.
     
    345ash-greninja likes this.
  5. RedR

    RedR Well-Known Member

    Great story! Love it!

    Sinnoh felt like a good place for him to win to me because he was using ALL of his Pokemon, not just Sinnoh region ones. It gave it a johto league vibe.
     
  6. C00kie_173

    C00kie_173 Member

    I feel that if ash first pokemon isnt a small tiny mouse pikachu but a charmander that evolves into a charizard eventually, he will have already completed his dream as a pokemon master. I dont understand why ash has to give so much attention to a tiny mouse pokemon.
     
  7. mysticalglacia

    mysticalglacia Alola Shill

    I don’t see how people are DP circlejerkers when they point out that the Sinnoh BF and Cynthia were portrayed as incredibly strong. Cynthia would 100% be able to hold her own against Diantha and Steven; Ash-Greninja which is semi-comparable to Infernape w/ Blaze nearly took Mega Gardevoir out. He wasn’t ready for the Champion League in either of those regions; considering how he was continuously bested by an OP Charizard in Kalos and wasn’t near the power levels of the stronger trainers in Sinnoh.
     
  8. Doppelgänger

    Doppelgänger Superancient Member

    Cynthia is absolutely equal to Steven and Diantha, Megas or no. XY fanboys see evolution as an insurmountable advantage, even more than typing, despite Guzma demonstrating in Alola that Megas don't mean anything. He beat one without even knowing what it was.

    It's bizarre because even in XY, we had Pokemon like Fletchinder defeating an evolved Talonflame. Evolution is just one quick, dirty shorthand for power level. It's not the definitive metric at all.
     
    mysticalglacia likes this.
  9. nameman

    nameman Well-Known Member

    That OP Charizard was brought to 1 knee by Ash-Greninja. That Final was really close come down to the wire. It's why I think Ash would've done well in the Kalos Champion's League if he did manage to win the Kalos League. No he wasn't ready to be Champion then (still isn't ready to be Region Champion now), but he wouldn't have been crushed like he'd been in past E4 matches.
     
  10. 345ash-greninja

    345ash-greninja Prince Of Balbadd

    Infernape got destroyed by Flint while Ash-Greninja was giving Mega Gardevoir a helluva tough time.....so not really.
     
  11. ash&charizardfan

    ash&charizardfan Humanity's greatest soldier

    Yeah and kanto BF were hyped to be strong as that E4 agatha but ash was still able to win it, sinnoh BF is round that same level. No cynthia wouldn't be able to hold her own against steven and diantha without mega garchomp. As for ash greninja it is leagues above infernape (blaze or not), it was able to lose to only OP charizard who had earlier beaten an E4 ace mega houndoom, alain's MCX would have alone singlehandidly destoyed paul's best team that's just how much strong it was and its been known that ME increases the strength by many folds. Kalos had many tainers who were on that or even higher levels than that of sinnoh. There are many people who think that flint of E4 would beat dintha or steven stone in proper battle.

    Pre evolved form beating fully evolved form has been common since kanto days so its not a big deal. And no cynthia is not equal to diantha or steven without a mega i, DP fanboys dont realize that anime has constantly shown ME pokemon are way more superior than ordinary pokemon brock's MS at severe type disadvantage was able to destroy turtunator including taking head on its z move or mega aggron taking out faba's pokemon and kukui's baviary in just one hit, guzma is not the only one who defeated mega with a non mega pokemon pikachu has done it many times beides guzma is way more experienced than ilma.
     
    345ash-greninja likes this.
  12. Xeogran

    Xeogran Hajimemashite.

    I can't believe this thread is finally ending it's run soon. It was fun theorizing with you all. The day has finally come.
     
  13. Dragalge

    Dragalge Countey

    I think @Dephender forgot to lock the thread when the episode discussion thread was posted a little while ago. Regardless, I agree and look forward to outcome!
     
  14. ash&charizardfan

    ash&charizardfan Humanity's greatest soldier

    Look forwad and order the popcorn i would be fun to enjoy the salt.
     
    TheWanderingMist and Dragalge like this.
  15. 1rkhachatryan

    1rkhachatryan Call me Robert guys

    30 more minutes!! I'm not gonna get hyped up this time but I will be watching live lol.
     
    TheWanderingMist and Dragalge like this.
  16. ash&charizardfan

    ash&charizardfan Humanity's greatest soldier

    Well good luck to you, thou i wont be jinxing the guy like 3 yeas back so i probably will give it a miss, my badluck is whenever i watch my teams live they tend to lose so i most of the times give them the miss.
     
    TheWanderingMist likes this.
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