1. We have moved to a new forum system. All your posts and data should have transferred over. Welcome, to the new Serebii Forums. Details here
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Be sure to join the discussion on our discord at: Discord.gg/serebii
    Dismiss Notice
  3. If you're still waiting for the e-mail, be sure to check your junk/spam e-mail folders
    Dismiss Notice

September 1st: SM137 - Guzma the Undefeated!

Discussion in 'Animé Spoilers' started by Dephender, Aug 6, 2019.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Doppelgänger

    Doppelgänger Superancient Member

    Take it from a sports fan: it's much more satisfying to expect a win, and then be disappointed when it doesn't happen. When the win happens, it's a party that goes on forever and ever.

    If it's a loss, you forget about during the start of the next season.

    If you are chronically expecting a loss, you will never be happy. You just become more negative and pessimistic, which breeds more negativity and pessimism, in a feedback loop that ends when you become apathetic about anything and everything.

    Just look at how toxic the gaming side of things is now with Generation VIII. That's no way to live.

    The reason I came back to Serebii, the reason I'm still watching SM, is because I had an inkling fairly early on that Ash was going to win. If I honestly felt that Ash was going to lose, I wouldn't waste my time on a league that isn't very fun to watch. Why watch mediocre battles with no payoff?

    If SM138 isn't a troll title, Ash is going to the finals. You need to at least make the finals to have a shot at winning it all. There is as much, if not more reason to believe here, than in Kalos.

    If this isn't a time to believe, when will be?
  2. GarchompChain

    GarchompChain Well-Known Member

    Thanks Dr. Phil.
    CMButch, _AISP, mehmeh1 and 3 others like this.
  3. Zoruagible

    Zoruagible Lover of underrated characters


    In all seriousness though, I could honestly see Torracat evolving here. If they want to go full out with the Ash-Kukui similarities, and have Ash win with Torracat.
    mehmeh1 and GarchompChain like this.
  4. Leonhart

    Leonhart Imagineer

    I feel like that would've been foreshadowed via merchandise however since Satoshi's Pokemon evolving is usually a big deal and that typically gets promoted ahead of time, and unless I missed something we haven't had any major Gaogaen merchandise lately.
  5. Joltik-Kid

    Joltik-Kid Same thing, day in;day out ಠ_ಠ

    Is every episode Torrecat appears in now just gonna be its evolution episode? That's like the third consecutive time people have speculated it. Its just not happening and the sooner we deal with it, the better off we'll all be.
    Even if we did have Gaogaen merchandise unless it specifically mentions Satoshi's name, we know a battle with Royal Mask is the ultimate prize for winning the League and any merchandise would instantly be associated with him .
    mehmeh1 likes this.
  6. Sham

    Sham Aang could never

    ....I don’t understand why people feel the need to be openly malicious

    Anyway I’m still betting Ash ain’t winning this sorry
    Ignition and Pokegirl Fan~ like this.
  7. Master Pikachu 11

    Master Pikachu 11 Well-Known Member

    Oh I agree with you and as another sports fan, I know the feeling. One of the reasons I got back to watching the anime was because I thought Ash had the chance to finally win and I was waiting to finally see him accomplish this after 23 years. I’m still holding out hope that he will win and finally put to rest that he is a loser. I unfortunately, will be a little pessimistic because of what happen in Kalos and I believe the writers are incapable of coming up with another reason for to him to continue his journey while he wins the league, instead of constantly having him lose. Even though a great writer can easily come up with a way to have him continue his journey, while still wins the league. Him losing the league is fine at first, but it starts to get even more annoying after a while to the point that you stop caring all together. I think he wins the league because Royal Mask would be the final opponent and he is also considered a rival of Ash’s. So for that reason alone I am still cautiously optimistic.
  8. TheWanderingMist

    TheWanderingMist Gaganga, Keeper of the Gates Impartial

    Plus, he already won the Orange League and continued. I know it's not a game canon League, but it's still a League. Also, the Battle Frontier, which is more impressive than winning any League in the games.
  9. Lord Starfish

    Lord Starfish Fond of owls

    Quite frankly, it's insanely easy to justify him continuing to travel even after winning a League;
    "So now that you're the Champion, I guess you're done traveling?"
    "What? Why would you think that?"

    ...At this point I don't see why he'd have to justify going off somewhere new. He's much like Son Goku in that regard; He keeps adventuring because it's just what he loves doing.
  10. JC317

    JC317 Well-Known Member

    While that is true, Goku doesn't just shirk off his responsibilities to go fighting. He does (attempt to do) farming to support his family; he only fights when the opportunity comes up, and I wouldn't say he actively seeks out opponents to fight (most of the time, at least).

    While Goku definitely wouldn't refuse an invitation for a fight, he also wouldn't head off on an adventure just on a whim.
  11. Almighty Zard

    Almighty Zard He has returned.

    Well if it was to evolve, we would get a discussion about fire types getting all the attention and how it's unfair that the grass pokemon aren't the alpha dominant species on the team.

    considering how few trainers have beaten the battle frontier in the anime according to scott, you'd think that alone would be a strong accolade for Ash, but it isn't.

    Look i'm all for optimism as much as the next person, but my problem with this league (not just the tournament) is how it's been structured from start to finish.

    When you look back at regions like sinnoh or kalos, where Ash's pokemon had to push themselves to their limits, and then you look at his alolan team where 2-3 pokemon have done most of the work, there's hardly been any struggle at all against the toughest trainers (the Kahuna's), and isn't even a completed team, the contrast is just too great from previous regions in that even if Ash was to win, it wouldn't feel like an achievement to me if he did win because this team has no where the intensity his previous teams did, heck I would argue even his jouto and unova teams are better than his alolan team because despite their shortcomings they still had to fight tough battles, battles that I feel were way tougher than anything alola has produced.

    Besides their is the concept of a "champion's league" which Kakui probably doesn't know about, i'm pretty sure Ash ain't getting into that if he was to win since I doubt Kakui has the credentials or influence to pull it off.

    anyway I think this discussion's gotten way off topic.
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2019
    PokemonKnight and Zoruagible like this.
  12. Leonhart

    Leonhart Imagineer

    Given how Mokuroh's been treated compared to Nyaheat, I feel like there have probably already been tons of complaints about the writers' favoritism towards Satoshi's Fire-types. So Gaogaen causing more discussion about that seems like a minor inconvenience at best.
  13. Zoruagible

    Zoruagible Lover of underrated characters

    People hate Fire starters for simply existing, they'll complain regardless!
    Haven't had a fully evolved one since Infernape yet they always act like it's the end of the world, and they always hog battles whenever a Fire starter is being discussed.
    Lycanroc and Pikachu hogged everything this series, any argument they make against Incineroar is automatically null and void. Besides, Scorbunny's obviously not going to evolve...

    People did the exact thing with Rowlet, the thing that actually has an everstone on it! The one Pokemon practically confirmed to not evolve
    Does Torracat have one? No

    This would be the best place for it, especially if they want to go all out with Guzma seeing the worst professor in Ash. If Torracat's going to end up pulling a Lycanroc on Guzma's team, then he most certainly deserves one! Certainly better than evolving after beating Incineroar, or doing it while battling him.
  14. mehmeh1

    mehmeh1 ^Probably Steven Universe?

    Tournament of Power arc says hi
  15. Bortgreen

    Bortgreen UP NE-Let's just appreciate this for this week

    so, another comeback battle huh
    It's quite likely, in fact
  16. Bladewinger

    Bladewinger Member

    I thought it was a strong accolade for Ash. It's probably his second or third best accolade, in fact.

    Alola is a different region than Sinnoh or Kalos. The emphasis is more on the daily activities of Ash and friends at school or outside of school. The Kahuna trials are more secondary objectives, unlike the gym quests, which are more primary. There have been fewer battles overall for Ash in this series. However, his Alolan team isn't poor though: Pikachu and Lycanroc are both strong. Torracat is built like Quilava, Torkoal, or Pignite. Meltan displayed grit against Ryuki, and has a decent chance of evolving into Melmetal, which is a legendary Pokemon. Ash used to always have one not fully evolved Pokemon, and that is Rowlet, who just defeated Decidueye so it's not weak by any means either.

    Guzma's Golisopod pushed Pikachu to the limit, and Gladion has beaten Ash twice. Those will be the two trainers who will push Ash's Pokemon to their limits in the upcoming league battles, I suspect. Guzma and Gladion are not on the same level of Tobias, Alain, or Paul, but they could do well or win against any of the other trainers that Ash has battled in previous leagues.

    That would only apply to regions that already have an established Elite 4 and Champion. Things are just starting in Alola.
    KenzeyEevee likes this.
  17. I think if Ash gets to win, he will get more popular in Alola. Wonder if they would call him champion
  18. Red and Blue

    Red and Blue Well-Known Member

    Champion is literally the title that will be granted to the Alolan League winner
    KenzeyEevee likes this.
  19. TheWanderingMist

    TheWanderingMist Gaganga, Keeper of the Gates Impartial

    I feel like Ash has more chance of actually winning this League than any of the others, simply because it's the first one. That makes the Champion title extra special, since rather than being just the next one in a long line, he'd be the very first one.
  20. Almighty Zard

    Almighty Zard He has returned.

    But it doesn't help Ash towards his goal, which apparently only winning a league (and a "true one" at that) can do.

    which is a problem, because Pokémon were created to battle each other, this slice of life format is hurting the show more than helping and needs to go away come sword and shield, cause that is not what a show of this genre should be about, another problem is that most battles this series are determined by Z-moves (I said most before anyone brings up Rowlet vs Decidueye) and weather or someone can take one or not, cause generally when both people are using Z-moves, whoever fires off first and fails to win with it(unless you have a double failure like the previous match), is the one to lose.

    Rival characters alone should not be the only ones to push Ash to his limits.

    The Kahuna's should've pushed him to the limit as well, but none of them could really do that, not even Nanu despite his cheating since Tapu Bulu gave Lycanroc a berry to circumvent the unfair rules of the battle.

    From what we know, it sounds like the champions league is it's own thing that champions and tournament winners are allowed to enter, however since Alola seems to be doing it's own thing, I doubt winning would get Ash in since there is no established connection between alola and other regions.

    Besides If your going to do something, do it right. I still feel like Kakui doesn't know all the details of what a league entails (partially Ash's fault in that time travel episode), and I personally do not approve of how the alola league tournament is being done, plus we've already got major controversy following last week's episode, so even if Ash wins it'll feel tainted in the eyes of some, I don't care about that "Call" but I know others do.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page