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Sets & Roles: What To Use & What Not To

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Me again! Another concise post coming up.

What to use

Role: Support


Tentacruel @ Black Sludge
Trait: Rain Dish
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spe
Timid Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Toxic / Toxic Spikes
- Scald
- Protect / Substitute

Another Gen I classic, Tentacruel returns to the BW2 meta as the premier Rapid Spinner for Rain teams. While Tentacruel was quite the defensive threat back in DPP OU, 2 things changed Tentacruels life forever. The first one being the DW giving Politoed Drizzle, which provides endless Rain on the field. The second thing that changed came via the DW as well, as they decided to give the jellyfish Rain Dish, which heals 1/16th of his health after every turn if it is raining. Tentacruel stands out from other Rapid Spinners, because of it's unique typing, which allows it to absorb those particularly nasty Toxic Spikes every time it comes in on the battlefield. Tentacruel can also spread status with Toxic or Toxic Spikes & racking up hazard damage with Protect & Substitute. Overall, Tentacruel has found a rather nice home in OU, mainly due to the prevalence of rain, it is able to compete with the best of the best.

Good Partners: There are quite a few solid partners for Tentacruel, both offensive & defensive. As you can obviously guess, Politoed is the premier teammate for the jellyfish, as he brings endless rain onto the battlefield, which activates Rain Dish, & allows him to gain up to 20% health at the end of each turn & Politoed enjoys that Tentacruel can absorb Toxic Spikes. Speaking of Toxic Spikes, should you be using them, Pokémon that can take advantage of them, such as Sub + CM Latias, Volcarona & Taunt Tornadus. As for defensive synergy, Ferrothorn is the #1 option here, as they have very solid synergy, with Ground & Flying the only types they don't resist. Ferrothorn also completes the trio of hazards with Spikes & Stealth Rock.

What Counters It: One of the premier counters to Tentacruel is Poison Heal Breloom, as it benefits from being poisoned, but it must watch out for burns with Scald if the Toxic Orb has not been activated or if Toxic Spikes aren't on the field. Toxicroak is another excellent counter to Tentacruel as it not only absorbs Toxic Spikes, it is also immune to Scald, which allows him to easily setup on him using the Sub + Bulk Up set. The arguably #1 counter to Tentacruel would be Celebi, as it can just heal its status ailments with Natural Cure & then hit the jellyfish hard with a STAB Psychic. Sub CM Latias is another great counter to Tentacruel, provided she hasn't been hit with Toxic on the switch-in. Alakazam & especially Reuniclus are solid checks to the jellyfish, as they are immune to Toxic damage & can threaten to KO Tentacruel with Psyshock. Finally, Starmie & Jellicent are nice counters, because the former isn't afraid of status due to Natural Cure & can threaten with Psyshock or Thunderbolt, meanwhile the latter can outstall him with a combination of Taunt & Will-O-Wisp.


Well-Known Member
The what not to use section needs so more sets, if i get time i`ll contribute more to my threads
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McDangerous has cried out for what not to use so i decided to post this pokemon who for some reason still sees a fair amount of OU usage.

What Not To Use:


Pokemon: Charizard
Role: Special Sweeper
Charizard @ Choice Scarf, Modest
Solar Power
252 SpA, 252 Spe, 4 SpD
Fire Blast
Air Slash
Solar Beam/ HP Ice
Focus Blast

Description: Okay, I'll level with you. I doubt anyone who likes Pokemon doesn't like Charizard. I mean it's cool. And DW gave it a nice ability, too. But that doesn't change the fact that it sucks in OU...and many other competitive tiers, but that's besides the point. It may hit like a truck but it is VERY predictable, which makes it easy to counter. To make matters worse, Charizard's defensive typing is so god awful I can hardly come up with words to describe it. It has weakness to Water, Electric, Rock, and lets not forget the bane of STEALTH ROCKS. Things like Volcarona need spin support just as much as Charizard, but Charizard comes coupled with the fact that Solar Power puts a timer on any sweep it tries to pull off. Basically, if you are afflicted by stealth rock and lack a spinner, Charizard is going to be utterly useless if your opponent has too many pokemon left. Also, Charizard is more or less outclassed by boosting sweepers (like Volcarona) whose superior stats help them a lot. Combined with horrible frailty and reliance on sun and spin support to be of any use, Charizard really isn't worth the horrendous amount of support needed to keep it kicking. I realize that many non-ou pokemon are capable of functioning in ou very well, but Charizard isn't one of them.

Partners: Ninetales and spinners at all cost. Starmie, Donphan, whatever. Xatu and Espeon can work too, since they magic bounce. Eh, Wish support from Blissey or Chansey can be helpful too, if you want help extending Charizard's lifespan. Dugtrio can trap non air balloon Heatran which is a pain for Charizard to deal with, even with Focus Blast.

Counters: OH MY GOD SO MANY. The easiest way to counter Charizard is by keeping Stealth Rocks active and/or eliminating sun with your own weather. Tyranitar can switch in on a fire blast and tank it like a champ (though be careful for focus blast). Politoed is one of the worst things Charizard has to deal with. Hard hitting choice scarf users with higher speed than Charizard like Terrakion, Garchomp, Salamence, and Thundurus-T all outspeed and trash him.

Just so you know, Charizard is one of my favorites, and I don't want to shoot down people for trying to use him, but I know from personal experience the kind of headaches trying to use him in Gen V OU will bring. Here's hoping he gets some major buffs next gen!
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Well-Known Member
After some technical difficult, post has been updated, what not to use will be on post 2 because of the character limit, which we exceeded

What To Use:


Pokemon: Tornadus-I
Role: Physical Sweeper
Tornadus @ Flying Gem
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Jolly/Naive Nature
- Acrobatics
- Superpower
- Bulk Up/Taunt/Heat Wave
- Tailwind/Bulk Up

Description: Acrogem Tornadus is not to be taken lightly. Gem boosted acrobatics can OHKO many offensive mons with ease. The beauty of this set is that, unlike most specially based Tornadus sets, rain is not entirely necessary for success. In fact, you can run this Tornadus without weather, or even in sun. Aside from just hitting hard, Acrotorn offers great utility as a good lure for Blissey and Chansey, annihalating them with its physical moves. Lastly, the combination of prankster and tailwind gives handy support to any team that has trouble outspeeding enemy pokemon. Imagine how good you will feel when your *Insert Offensive Mon Here* can outspace scarf Latios and Venusaur in sun for 3 turns.

Now, like all pokemon, Acrogem Tornadus has some downsides. For starters, its bulk isn't very good, so don't expect it to take many hits. Also, it is stealth rock weak which requires a spinner. Lastly, physically defensive steel types like Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Skarmory are VERY bothersome (though if you want to avoid having them as a problem, you can run Heat Wave with a Naive nature). Fortunately, building a team to support Tornadus is not very difficult, so long as you take advantage of the support Tornadus provides for its teammates as well.

Partners: A spinner is crucial to ensure Tornadus' survivability, as Stealth Rock is a real pain. Starmie, Forretress, Tentacruel, and maybe even Donphan. If you choose NOT to run Heat Wave, you'll need something to deal with meddlesome steel types. Magnezone is an obvious choice, and a pretty good one considering it also covers all of Tornadus' weaknesses as well. It would also be a good idea to have something that can help deal with Mamoswine, such as Rotom-W. Most importantly, make sure that you are using pokemon that benefit from the support Acrotorn provides. Anything that struggles with Blissey, anything with good coverage that can become a serious threat when provided with tailwind boost, etc.

Counters: Acrotorn, as a lure, is hard to see coming, but once you've identified it you can usually counter it provided you have the right team. You want a good flying resist to counter Acrotorn. Bronzong, Rotom-W, Metagross, Jirachi, the list goes on. Tornadus has impressive speed, but still falls short of a few offensive mons. Starmie, Specs Jolteon, as well as various scarfed mons such as Terrakion, Garchomp, and Salamence before Tailwind is set up. AFTER tailwind is set up, outpacing Tornadus and the rest of its teammates is going to be difficult, but Tornadus is vulnerable to priority attacks from various pokemon. In this respect, Scizor, Mamoswine, Dragonite, and Lucario can be very helpful for hitting Tornadus with priority attacks. Status abusers should also be considered, as Acrotorn won't be doing much after it is Burned/Paralyzed. Finally, keeping Stealth Rocks in play is one of the best ways to help wear Tornadus down.


What to Use: Breloom


Breloom @ Fighting Gem
Trait: Technician
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
Adamant Nature
- Focus Punch
- Mach Punch
- Bullet Seed
- Spore

With this set, you ditch sweeping with a +2 Mach Punch for the ability to remove many of Breloom's normal counters for other Pokemon to come in after it and sweep. This set effectively removes Latios, Offensive Latias, Dragonite (With rocks up), Salamence, Thundurus-T, Volcarona, Skarmory, and some Celebi while also severely denting some of it's other counters, forcing them to spend a turn recovering, which allows you to take momentum. Spore is for basically getting a free KO, Mach Punch for finishing off weakened threats and one of your 2 main attacking move, Bullet Seed as you other main attacking move, and finally, Focus Punch to beat many of his counters off the switch. You'll generally want to activate the Fighting Gem on Focus Punch, but it still hits hard if you've burned the gem on Mach Punch. EV's are for max power on the Fight Gem + Focus Punch while retaining a good speed. All in all, this Breloom set makes a fantastic lure and is still the bane of stall teams.

Good teammates for this Breloom include Pokemon whose main counters are the Lati twins, or dragon and flying types in general. Alakazam makes a nice teammate by giving you a strong special sweeper, and takes advantage of Lati@s being gone, and also like E-Speed Dragonite being dead. In addition, Alakazam can help out Breloom by removing Landorus-T, Gliscor, and Celebi for Breloom. Another nice partner is Rock Polish or Double Dance Landorus-T, who enjoys having the Lati's weakened or dead, as well as Skarmory and Forretress dead or weakened. However, Gliscor is still a major threat to this combo. Lastly, Choice Band/Scarf Kyurem-B enjoys being paired with this Breloom, as it can remove many of the faster dragons, and can dent the steels that keep Kyurem-B from spamming his Outrages.

The best counter to this set is without a doubt Gliscor. It can recover damage with Poison Heal, is immune to Spore once his Toxic Orb activates, can take all Breloom's attacks reasonably well, and can remove Breloom with Ice Fang. Landorus-T also makes a solid counter, as it can Intimidate Breloom to weaken his Bullet Seed, and the offensive variant can use him for set-up bait. As usual, Gengar still demolishes this Breloom once Spore has been used. Physically Defensive Celebi also demolished this set. Tentacruel in rain can heal off the damage he takes from Brelooms attacks and fish for a Scald burn.


Well-Known Member
the color it hurts DX
added to the post

all updated, sets will be added via links like the core thread so make sure they`re readable
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Artistically angry
What to Use: Latios

Latios (M) @ Light Clay
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
Timid Nature
- Dragon Pulse
- Light Screen
- Reflect
- Memento

So I noticed a lack of What to Use Leads, so I figured HO is the only way to go when it comes to leads. Basically you just slap this onto any HO team that isn't obsessed with rocks and proceed to set up both screens since they will last a while. Depending on what is in (aka if it can actually do damage to you) will determine if you hard switch into one of your sweepers or just use Memento. Memento is what sets Latios apart from other Screeners, as it can get your sweeper in for free and acts as a second set of screens on whatever is in. This will force your opponent to switch out (most of the time) which guarantees a turn of set up, and another turn since you can probably take 2-3 hits with screens up. If they don't switch out and try to attack your sweeper they will do next to no damage depending on your sweeper. If they are using something that can run a status move (will o wisp, toxic, etc.) it may be a good idea to bring in something that is faster with Substitute or a lum berry.

One of the best teammates I have found for this Latios is Dragonite. Let's look at how one common lead, offensive Politoed (non specs) does with a 4X SE move against Dragonite with rocks off the field: -2 252+ SpA Politoed Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Multiscale Dragonite through Light Screen: 45-53 (13.93 - 16.4%). That ladies and gentleman is less than a fifth of Nites health being taken out with multiscale up, and it can easily take a second allowing you at least 2 turns to set up while Nite still sits at above 50% with a double max roll (16%+32%=48%). Now lets be honest, if they switch out you still have screens and multiscale to keep you at a very good amount of health and may have even more turns to set up because they switched out. Another great partner is any mon that abuses substitutes. Fun examples include Sub Calm Mind Keldeo, Sub Salac Garchomp, and Bulky Dos (using intimidate maybe?). They would all like to come in to this situation. The fun still doesn't end though, literally any set up sweeper would like to come in here and set up shop, so do not let my suggestions limit you if you decide to try this set out. Another excellent teammate is Magnezone as Scizor, Skarmory, Forretress and Ferrothorn are arguably the only things Latios doesn't want to lead against. This is mostly because you will not want hazards on your side of the field (scizor is an issue for Latios 1v1) and Latios cannot really do anything against them as they stack hazards. You can then lead with Magnezone, knock them out, and pretend like they never existed to set up the screens.

Considering Latios has a really supportive roll that normally results in him dying by turn 3, pretty much the only counters are scarfed mons that can one shot before he gets up screens (or come really close to prevent a second screen) and Taunt Azelf/anything else faster than it (a slower taunt user could prevent a second layer or memento). The true difficulty of countering this Latios set is most people don't expect Dual Screen Memento Latios and expect it to be a choice set that is trying to put a hole in their team on turn 1. This basically means when you run this set you will almost never be countered.


Well-Known Member
What to use

Role: Physical Sweeper
Terrakion @ Salac Berry / Rock Gem / Leichi Berry
Trait: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Substitute
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Swords Dance / Rock Polish

Description: Terrakion is a big OU powerhouse, and with the release of black and white 2, this became a common set because of the release of the salac berry again. The goal of this set is to set up a substitute on something that terrakion will for out ex ninetales or tryannitar, and set up a swords dance, then keep subbing till the salac berry activates, or set up up swords dance on a hit you know terrakion will live so the salac activates. Because of the substitute, terrakion can act as a nice check to stall because of his coverage, his resistance to status behind a sub, and his raw power. In the best case situation, terrakion can get the salac berry and keep his sub, allowing him to check threats like scizor and breloom for behind the sub.
Another item that can be used is a rock gem, allowing terrakion to power through slower teams and check a big threat, landorus therian. This makes it so terrakion can break through its wall checks with a doubled power stone edge, helping with threats like jellicent and celebi. A third variant of this set is a reverse of the first, using a leichi berry to boost its attack and rock polish to raise its speed. This set aims to power through faster teams and works better on teams that pack wallbreakers or another sweeper to weaken threats.

Partners: Partners vary on terrakion's set, but constant ones are magnezone, skarmory, and garchomp. Magnezone is a big one as he can trap scizor, the best terrakion revenger as well as jirachi, letting terrakion set up with little fear. Skarmory and terrakion work excellent together as terrakion loves hazards, and skarmory lays them down easily, while garchomp wall breaks common walls for terrakion, mostly landorus therian, as well as baits in keldeo who he can check with a yache berry. The salac-swords dance set likes a faster sweeper to follow it up as its fast, but it can be outspeed by scarfed keldeo, scarfed latios, and stoutland. As such, scizor and breloom are two good partners as they can check faster threats with their powerful priorities. The rock gem set functions more as a wall breaker at times, and likes sweepers like scarfed salamence as they share similar checks in scizor, scarfed jirachi, and landorus therian. Lastly, leichi-rock polish likes powerful wall breakers like garchomp and mixed victini to check threats like landorus therian, while still appreciating magnezone to trap scizor.

Counters: Basic counters are still the same, scizor is still the best, followed up by breloom. Sashed breloom deserves a special mention as it breaks terrakion sub and can KO it with bullet seed. Rock gem terrakion is a bit harder as you have to get it to stone edge or you`ll lose your main check, such as landorus therian or jellicent, and lastly landorus therian is one of the best for the leichi set as terrakion gets +1 attack as compared to +2 making it harder for him to sweep.
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