Should all of Ash's battles in any given league be shown?

[blizzardblaze]

Let's not have another fiasco where we just get one shots every battle with Z Moves. I want to see ones where Z Moves do some damage but can be shaken off easily, if necessary, or they are still able to keep going with what they have, like Olivia's battle. I'm getting the feeling that Kiawe VS Ash in the league could happen, considering the buildup and Hau VS Ash and Gladion VS Ash are going to be there as well.

 

[Epicocity]

Let's not have another fiasco where we just get one shots every battle with Z Moves. I want to see ones where Z Moves do some damage but can be shaken off easily, if necessary, or they are still able to keep going with what they have, like Olivia's battle. I'm getting the feeling that Kiawe VS Ash in the league could happen, considering the buildup and Hau VS Ash and Gladion VS Ash are going to be there as well.

Olivia's battle is a template for best battles in SM, though I hope they cut down on the battle-stalling commentary. XY was smart to do away with it by integrating it with the action on screen for the most part or just trimming it because it can be a real momentum killer.

 

[Mew2]

If Ash is going to win a League, then yes, all of Ash's battles should be shown, even the preliminary ones. If that means making the League arc an episode or two longer, then they should do just that. There really is no excuse for all of Ash's battles to not be shown in a League. It's supposedly the main event of the region/series. To not show it in full diminishes its meaning and, in my mind, does a disservice to the animé as well as to Ash. Even if Ash isn't going to win the League, he should have at least part of all of his battles being shown, and not just in a montage, either.

 

[Yuugis Black Magician]

The problem with the Leagues--other than a lack of available animators--is also a lack of good directors. Asada Yuuji is the franchise's best regular director. Unless the schedule is worked so that he can somehow storyboard--if not also act as episode director--for every episode of the Alola League there's going to be a need for some new directors, unless Series Director Tomiyasu Daiki himself can personally direct.

EDIT: I just realized that Iijima Masakatsu, who storyboarded and directed the second episode of Satoshi's battle with Alan at the Kalos League, also storyboarded and directed Sun & Moon Episode #43. With luck he'll also work on an episode of the Alola League.

 

[keepitsimple]

I feel like this is one of the series where he doesn't really deserve the win. We hardly see him training, he only has a team of 4 90 episodes in and he barely battles at all. To win a big League would be...insulting at best, I fear.

Ash has been capable of winning a league for a long time now though. I think winning in Alola would be fine if he uses reserves.

It would only be undeserved/insulting if he wins using just his Alola team since it's horrendous as well as incomplete and I can't see it becoming league ready in time. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Victorian Rush]

I personslly think the battles where he is battling a minor character, who is not needed should not be shown. If the character is an important character, kind of like Astrid in the Kalos League was, the battle in its entirity should be shown. Astrid is the same trainer Ash battled in the beginning of the Diancie movie and lost so I have no idea why the battle wasn’t shown.

If he would win now, many people would go insane

Of course they would. Ash has never won a single league and most people have given up hope of seeing him a win a league, especially after the Kalos League.

 

[Epicocity]

Ash has been capable of winning a league for a long time now though. I think winning in Alola would be fine if he uses reserves.

It would only be undeserved/insulting if he wins using just his Alola team since it's horrendous as well as incomplete and I can't see it becoming league ready in time. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I disagree. Even with reserves, Ash hasn't shown the same kind of passion and zeal in training or battling that he did in the past, and has only gone to even do the trials when something prompts him, when usually he'd be jumping out of his chair and running off to the next or going exploring.

I wouldn't want him to win just because it's "overdue" or he takes an easy way out. Especially since it would come to them mostly advertising Gen 1 again anyway, just like how (if you notice) Sinnoh actually mostly focused on Gen 2 during the League (barring Sceptile he used Quilava, Noctowl, Heracross and Donphan).

 

[FlygontheRavager]

I disagree. Even with reserves, Ash hasn't shown the same kind of passion and zeal in training or battling that he did in the past, and has only gone to even do the trials when something prompts him, when usually he'd be jumping out of his chair and running off to the next or going exploring.

I wouldn't want him to win just because it's "overdue" or he takes an easy way out. Especially since it would come to them mostly advertising Gen 1 again anyway, just like how (if you notice) Sinnoh actually mostly focused on Gen 2 during the League (barring Sceptile he used Quilava, Noctowl, Heracross and Donphan).

I’ve personally never felt a drop in his passion for training or battling. Sure, they don’t show him doing those kind of things as often as in previous series, but that’s not to say he doesn’t do them. In one episode of the Ula’ula arc, I believe it was mentioned that Ash still keeps a pretty consistent training schedule.


As for him not traveling as much, I don’t see why that’s a problem. It’s true that is at the core of Ash’s being, but exploration doesn’t always equal traveling. Going to school may seem mundane to us living here in the real world, but for Ash, it’s just another adventure - one he gets to share with his friends.

 

[Yuugis Black Magician]

School in the Pokemon world is a lot more fun because the Pokemon world appears to be post-Capitalism, thankfully. The funding for the sciences is truly inspirational. If only we could get money out of politics in the US.

 

[Leonhart]

Going to school may seem mundane to us living here in the real world, but for Ash, it’s just another adventure - one he gets to share with his friends.

But it's not as though he's learning much at the school anyway, and what little he has discovered could've happened in a typical traveling setting. The school he attends just doesn't feel like a place of true education to me. It feels more like a clubhouse where Satoshi hangs out with his friends during his leisure time to have some fun than an institution dedicated to learning.

 

[FlygontheRavager]

The school he attends just doesn't feel like a place of true education to me.

It’s true that the school’s curriculum is definitely eccentric; it consists mostly of hands-on experiences rather than academic lessons. Consider this, however: doesn’t that fit Ash perfectly? If the school was a “place of true education,” he wouldn’t be nearly as comfortable with it.

 

[FlygontheRavager]

I'm willing to bet Ash will never use his reserves in a league again. He hasn't since DP, and he sure won't use them in the Alola league if he didn't in BW or XY. The only time I can ever see Ash using old pokemon again is in some "final league" type deal when the writers are wrapping up the show for good, having Ash win that league with all his older pokemon, etc. But since that will probably not happen anytime soon, don't expect.

It actually blows my mind so many people expect Ash to use "reserves" when he's technically only done it in 2 out of the 6 leagues he's been in. The Johto and Sinnoh leagues were the only two leagues Ash used older pokemon, why are people acting like it's something that happens regularly? 2 out of 6 times means it almost never happens.

I certainly don’t expect it...but it would be very nice if that happens. And given that this series has had many callbacks to the past, I think there may be a chance to see some of Ash’s older battlers in the League this time around.

 

[Epicocity]

I'm willing to bet Ash will never use his reserves in a league again. He hasn't since DP, and he sure won't use them in the Alola league if he didn't in BW or XY. The only time I can ever see Ash using old pokemon again is in some "final league" type deal when the writers are wrapping up the show for good, having Ash win that league with all his older pokemon, etc. But since that will probably not happen anytime soon, don't expect.

It actually blows my mind so many people expect Ash to use "reserves" when he's technically only done it in 2 out of the 6 leagues he's been in. The Johto and Sinnoh leagues were the only two leagues Ash used older pokemon, why are people acting like it's something that happens regularly? 2 out of 6 times means it almost never happens.

I'd argue it was really 1 time. Johto and Kanto are essentially treated as one by the anime since the Kanto troupe was around for a lot of Johto, and thus made sense to return for the big brawl at the end.

That said, I'd prefer Ash using his regional Pokemon to win the regional League and then bring his reserves in for a Champion League deal. I feel it'd be far more effective, personally.

 

[Mew2]

I could potentially see him using his Kanto reserves in the Alola League since it would advertise Pokémon Let's Go. Personally, if Ash were to start winning Leagues, I would prefer for him to start by using a combination of his regional team and reserves, just to give the impression that he still has a ways to go beyond just going up to the next level of beating the Champion's League since he likely relied on his older, more experienced Pokémon to get him through the League.

 

[LilligantLewis]

Some fights should be more extended for sure. Ash's Hawlucha win against Astrid's Mega Absol was BS.

This is the exact fight I thought of when I saw the thread title. Up until this point, beating a Mega was seen as a big deal.

I feel like this is one of the series where he doesn't really deserve the win. We hardly see him training, he only has a team of 4 90 episodes in and he barely battles at all. To win a big League would be...insulting at best, I fear.

But it's not a big league. It's the first-ever iteration, thus it won't draw as many people who might think it's a big deal. In fact, I think this is the perfect time for Ash to win his first league, specifically because it's the first-ever time it's happening, thus making it a small league. In fact, I think it would be epic if Ash became the first-ever winner and they named the stadium Ash Ketchum Stadium just like at the U.S. Open Arthur Ashe Stadium. Arthur Ashe wasn't an "all-time great" like Rod Laver or Bjorn Borg or John McEnroe, but he was the first-ever winner of the U.S. Open, quite an accomplishment, but still not "too much" of an accomplishment, which is exactly how I feel an Alola League victory would feel for Ash. A small league, barely bigger than the Orange League.

Let's not have another fiasco where we just get one shots every battle with Z Moves. I want to see ones where Z Moves do some damage but can be shaken off easily, if necessary, or they are still able to keep going with what they have, like Olivia's battle. I'm getting the feeling that Kiawe VS Ash in the league could happen, considering the buildup and Hau VS Ash and Gladion VS Ash are going to be there as well.

Given the last 3 leagues, I think two of the rivals will face each other. (Paul vs. Barry, Bianca vs. Cameron, Alain vs. Trevor, Sawyer vs. Tierno). I don't see Ash facing all 3 of them.

only gone to even do the trials when something prompts him

I think that's mainly because the writers don't know how else to stretch out a quest with only 4 trials (as opposed to 8 gyms) to last 3 years.

But it's not as though he's learning much at the school anyway, and what little he has discovered could've happened in a typical traveling setting. The school he attends just doesn't feel like a place of true education to me. It feels more like a clubhouse where Satoshi hangs out with his friends during his leisure time to have some fun than an institution dedicated to learning.

Yes, tbh, after all the complaints in 2016 that a school anime would be boring, now I kinda wish we had more actual classroom lessons where they learn things about Pokémon that haven't been touched on in the show before.

2 out of 6 times means it almost never happens.

One third is far from "almost never happens"

 

[Epicocity]

I think that's mainly because the writers don't know how else to stretch out a quest with only 4 trials (as opposed to 8 gyms) to last 3 years.

Considering there are, in the anime-sense, 4 trials and 4 Grand Trials, that's the same 8 as the usual Gyms. If they'd actually followed the game it would have been 11 trials altogether.

But either way, my problem is less with them not knowing where to place the trials and more that they don't even touch on Ash's interest in them until they become relevant. In all the past series Ash was always excited by the next gym he was heading for and headed there straightaway. Suddenly in Alola he only does trials when something relevant to the plot forces him to. Yes, yes, I know he's in school, but given there have only been 16 lessons shown in 90 episodes, I don't think finding time is super hard.

 

[LilligantLewis]

Considering there are, in the anime-sense, 4 trials and 4 Grand Trials, that's the same 8 as the usual Gyms. If they'd actually followed the game it would have been 11 trials altogether.

But either way, my problem is less with them not knowing where to place the trials and more that they don't even touch on Ash's interest in them until they become relevant. In all the past series Ash was always excited by the next gym he was heading for and headed there straightaway. Suddenly in Alola he only does trials when something relevant to the plot forces him to. Yes, yes, I know he's in school, but given there have only been 16 lessons shown in 90 episodes, I don't think finding time is super hard.

I understand what your point is, and I agree with you, but I'm saying it's because the writers don't know how to do it now. In the past, because they could stuff how many ever fillers they wanted between cities, it was fine for Ash to always say "I can't wait to get to ______ City!" Now they can't really do that because they go to the next city in a matter of minutes, so for Ash to say "I can't wait to get to _______ City" wouldn't really make sense.

 

[Epicocity]

I understand what your point is, and I agree with you, but I'm saying it's because the writers don't know how to do it now. In the past, because they could stuff how many ever fillers they wanted between cities, it was fine for Ash to always say "I can't wait to get to ______ City!" Now they can't really do that because they go to the next city in a matter of minutes, so for Ash to say "I can't wait to get to _______ City" wouldn't really make sense.

There are still a number of workarounds for it like "The Kahuna isn't accepting trials right now" or something equivalent. So I guess we'll have to chalk it up to Matsui's inability to give arcs a proper build outside of the arc.

 

[LilligantLewis]

There are still a number of workarounds for it like "The Kahuna isn't accepting trials right now" or something equivalent. So I guess we'll have to chalk it up to Matsui's inability to give arcs a proper build outside of the arc.

Is it Matsui or Daiki? Something I've been really confused about this generation is that there are two people whose names get thrown around as being in charge of the show, whereas before it was just Tomioka.

 

[Epicocity]

Is it Matsui or Daiki? Something I've been really confused about this generation is that there are two people whose names get thrown around as being in charge of the show, whereas before it was just Tomioka.

I mean, it still gets signed off on by Daiki Tomiyasu, but Matsui is the one writing. And I only attribute it to her because it's not the first time she's poorly paced and poorly foreshadowed a series and arc.