Should Pokemon be Linear?

[SBaby]

I think my biggest concern, if the games were to become more open directionally, would be with maintaining the steady difficulty incline. As we saw with the first few generations (particularly Johto, for some reason), when the game opened multiple routes for you to travel after accomplishment X, you eventually found yourself exploring a route where the challenges were calibrated to the team you had 15 levels earlier. Clearly, they can't have you beat the 3rd Gym Leader with your level 30 Pokémon and then give you the option of taking the path populated by level 45 Pokémon; but you also don't want to go spend six hours on one leg of your Pokémon game and then come back to your other choice and discover that you're suddenly a God in an environment of gnats...

So I'm all for increased exploratory freedom in Pokémon games, but only if it came with some mechanism of matching each stretch of your journey to the level your team reached at that point of the game. And then we also have to remember that the game must be amenable to childhood success, so they need to retain a high level of directionality and not-too-cryptic puzzles. To be honest, I'd say the argument that they've been doing it right enough so far is still pretty strong: kids have played every generation, and have been able to beat the games each time but also have themselves an enjoyable challenge doing it, and the sales figures are proof of the model.

There are a few solutions to the 'enemy strength' thing. If the game was going to be a completely open-world game, you could put a mechanic in it, similar to Skyrim where the enemies became stronger as you leveled up. Or you could go the Romancing SaGa route, where there would be thresholds, based on the number of battles you fought. This would require strategy and planning far ahead, as every battle, whether you run from it or not, would be counted. After hitting a certain number, the enemies would increase to the next level curve.

Personally, I don't think Pokemon has to be completely open-world like that though. It can still be linear, as far as the plot's concerned. But at the very least, you shoud be able to explore each area of the game in way more detail than you can now. Instead of following a straight path to your next destination, maybe the games could make the Routes more open, with field areas to explore, instead of always having a wall of trees blocking you. Kind of like how they do it in Ni No Kuni and Dragon Quest VIII. And they should make the individual Routes longer too. Make it feel like you really journeyed to get from one town to another, instead of traveling along one or two Routes and being there typically in a few minutes.

 

[(P.O.K.E.M.O.N)]

It depends on how linear it is, currently Pokemon is quite linear "especially for an rpg"

 

[telivisionhead]

I'm fine with it. I didn't really care i just chose to go the way that I was supposed to go to at the point in the game. Then again the "lines" for the pokemon maps of a region are well..... I don't like it that much....

 

[emawerna]

"Out of curiosity, why must the programmers ensure this doesn't happen? Games like Final Fantasy and Chrono Trigger have areas where the enemies are significantly harder than your team level, and it's possible to enter those areas roughly in the middle of the game(s)."

It has to do with enjoyability. If like most gamers, you spend hours trying to collect at least a fraction of the pokemon in the game. It would be devastating to restart. The risk isn't that they will stop playing, but that they would be forced to restart.

I haven't played those games, but it sounds like those are areas you can encounter and that you don't get trapped within. Pokemon XD felt that way as a matter of fact, and there have been battle towers where you can voluntarily fight higher level trainers in every pokemon game since Pokemon Crystal. Also, the game doesn't prevent you from pulling an Ash Ketchum by leaving behind or releasing virtually all your pokemon from time to time.

I was think more along the lines of a skilled and lucky trainer who fought through an area of level 50 wild pokemon using only his/her level 40 team and rushes to a pokemon center. Now, that trainer is likely to be trapped on all sides by routes with level 50 wild pokemon. That wouldn't be fun, and it would be difficult to get back.

I just got done challenging the elite 4 for the second/third/fourth etc. times in pokemon heart gold. The reason is because I wanted to catch Lugia and transfer to my pokemon black 2. However, none of my pokemon in the game could absorb attacks from a level 70 legendary. So, I went to the elite 4 with my level 50's pokemon against their level 60's. Even though I had planned this losing streak, it was draining from an emotional perspective. Also, it is very hard to fight much stronger trainers and get experience. The chance they knock you out is far too high, and it takes SO many super effective attacks to put a dent in them. (I did this rather than fight high level wild pokemon because heart gold maxes out with Mt. Silver pokemon who are at about level 45. It would take many hours to train a pokemon at level 55 up to level 68-70 using opponent pokemon of level 45.)

Reading through your post, I was also thinking of the other pokemon I needed to catch: Raikou. Imagine if Raikou at level 40 chose to fight trainers rather than to flee. He is usually released when your team is at level 25-30. If he chooses to fight you the first time you meet him, it would mean he would ambush you at random and wipe the floor with your team. In fact, the same would probably happen the next couple times you meet him also. Honestly, even though chasing him down and trapping with mean look several times (he knows roar) wasn't fun, an ambush would be even less fun.

 

[Cloud_Arcanine]

I'm not massively fussed either way really, although I was really miffed to find that you couldn't access Iccirus City in Black 2 until you'd beaten the league, it has my favourite city background track. I mean not being able to go through Twist Mountain because it was part of the plot was fair enough, but not being able to cross Tubeline Bridge bugged me.

Also I only found out a little while ago just how messed up rby was in terms of the order of gym leaders. I just automatically went linear, battled the leaders then went to go to the next town/city/island.

 

[dirkac]

No. Never again. Unova was horrid that you couldn't choose at least one Gym to do out of order. Every Region had that.

Well, I don't want it to be like Kanto, where only the first two, and the last had to be in order. That was a complete mess.

 

[ILK~CMP]

I'd say somewhere in the middle would be ideal. I've heard the linearity of BW was due in part to a desire to help new fans enjoy the Pokémon world, but honestly, I believe they put off more existing fans than they made new fans happy. Truthfully, though, as long as the next Pokémon games aren't as linear as Unova in BW I'll be a happy camper.

 

[Dragalge]

I'd say somewhere in the middle would be ideal. I've heard the linearity of BW was due in part to a desire to help new fans enjoy the Pokémon world, but honestly, I believe they put off more existing fans than they made new fans happy. Truthfully, though, as long as the next Pokémon games aren't as linear as Unova in BW I'll be a happy camper.

Actually the linearity was there because Unova is a metropolitan region unlike the vast regions like Sinnoh, thus why the cities were next to each other more closely. The Unova Pokémon only was the factor that gave new fans a welcome to the world.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

Actually the linearity was there because Unova is a metropolitan region unlike the vast regions like Sinnoh, thus why the cities were next to each other more closely. The Unova Pokémon only was the factor that gave new fans a welcome to the world.

Not really, they've made the region itself pretty nonlinear in BW2, actually (the storyline path was still linear, though).

The game was intentionally designed to be linear because little kids were complaining about getting lost.

 

[Bulba the Great!]

I personally really enjoy the game no matter what format. Each has its ups and downs, but a big thing I will say I do enjoy in a linear format - it gives a sense of purpose to what you're doing. If I say, take a week-long break from my game, if I come back to FireRed/LeafGreen, I have no frikkin' clue what I have to do next. At least when you're kinda trapped in the town until you've accomplished a,b, and c, it's always pretty clear what must be accomplished. You can travel freely post-game.

However, it is also kind of cool to have more of a 'choose your own adventure' type feel to the games, so I'm not knocking non-linear plots, either.

 

[AceOfSpadez]

I'd say somewhere in the middle would be ideal. I've heard the linearity of BW was due in part to a desire to help new fans enjoy the Pokémon world, but honestly, I believe they put off more existing fans than they made new fans happy. Truthfully, though, as long as the next Pokémon games aren't as linear as Unova in BW I'll be a happy camper.

It would have helped the new fans because it is a straight region so the kids won't get lost or confused. The storyline satisfied veteran players.

 

[Nil Nuane]

I didn't even think that the old games were that non-linear. But then again, I associate non-linear with games like Super Metroid. I did notice that BW1 were very linear, which put me off a little bit. It felt so restrained, like a "game", and not in a good way. But I didn't think Unova was that much more linear than say, Sinnoh really.
Overall, Hoenn striked the best balance of linearity.

 

[IAintObeezy]

1.I was think more along the lines of a skilled and lucky trainer who fought through an area of level 50 wild pokemon using only his/her level 40 team and rushes to a pokemon center. Now, that trainer is likely to be trapped on all sides by routes with level 50 wild pokemon. That wouldn't be fun, and it would be difficult to get back.

2. Reading through your post, I was also thinking of the other pokemon I needed to catch: Raikou. Imagine if Raikou at level 40 chose to fight trainers rather than to flee. He is usually released when your team is at level 25-30. If he chooses to fight you the first time you meet him, it would mean he would ambush you at random and wipe the floor with your team. In fact, the same would probably happen the next couple times you meet him also. Honestly, even though chasing him down and trapping with mean look several times (he knows roar) wasn't fun, an ambush would be even less fun.

1.*blacks out* *Still ends up in pokecenter*
Just sayin

2.*blacks out* *goes to pokecenter*
Im just not seeing the problem here. You'll just be unlucky and get moped the floor with.

 

[Wishing Star]

1.*blacks out* *Still ends up in pokecenter*
Just sayin

2.*blacks out* *goes to pokecenter*
Im just not seeing the problem here. You'll just be unlucky and get moped the floor with.

The very fundamental aspect of the game, simply traveling from one place to another, shouldn't be rudely interrupted by luck that just so happens to be against you. It's incredibly bad game design.

 

[VampirateMace]

I the mostly linear style of pokemon games is nice, because it keeps you going towards foes who are of an appropriate level and makes it feel like you have a goal. In BW2, post E4 there's more new places to explore than before (excluding G/S/C - HG/SS) and you're not forced to visit them in order, so there's a good chunk of non-linear game there in my opinion.

Because you can have multiple levels of pokemon on your team, I can't see much of a fix for the level problem caused by non-linear travel (except removing levels which would cause a whole new set of problems, like not being able to evolve).

 

[Ditto B1tch]

Non-linearity is good because you can avoid a gym that you're not in advantage and back again later when you have gotten a stronger team. Also, non-linearity is a nice way to beat a game taking different ways and making it less boring.

It's noticeable that linear games are the ones that got better plots. Gen 1 and 2 were somewhat non-linear, but their story were a lot simple. Gen IV and V got the best plots ever made, and their games were highly linear. The linearity is a way GF found to make the events of the plot occur in order to make its sense instead to turn it easy to beat the game.

 

[AceOfSpadez]

"Out of curiosity, why must the programmers ensure this doesn't happen? Games like Final Fantasy and Chrono Trigger have areas where the enemies are significantly harder than your team level, and it's possible to enter those areas roughly in the middle of the game(s)."

It has to do with enjoyability. If like most gamers, you spend hours trying to collect at least a fraction of the pokemon in the game. It would be devastating to restart. The risk isn't that they will stop playing, but that they would be forced to restart.

I haven't played those games, but it sounds like those are areas you can encounter and that you don't get trapped within. Pokemon XD felt that way as a matter of fact, and there have been battle towers where you can voluntarily fight higher level trainers in every pokemon game since Pokemon Crystal. Also, the game doesn't prevent you from pulling an Ash Ketchum by leaving behind or releasing virtually all your pokemon from time to time.

I was think more along the lines of a skilled and lucky trainer who fought through an area of level 50 wild pokemon using only his/her level 40 team and rushes to a pokemon center. Now, that trainer is likely to be trapped on all sides by routes with level 50 wild pokemon. That wouldn't be fun, and it would be difficult to get back.

I just got done challenging the elite 4 for the second/third/fourth etc. times in pokemon heart gold. The reason is because I wanted to catch Lugia and transfer to my pokemon black 2. However, none of my pokemon in the game could absorb attacks from a level 70 legendary. So, I went to the elite 4 with my level 50's pokemon against their level 60's. Even though I had planned this losing streak, it was draining from an emotional perspective. Also, it is very hard to fight much stronger trainers and get experience. The chance they knock you out is far too high, and it takes SO many super effective attacks to put a dent in them. (I did this rather than fight high level wild pokemon because heart gold maxes out with Mt. Silver pokemon who are at about level 45. It would take many hours to train a pokemon at level 55 up to level 68-70 using opponent pokemon of level 45.)

Reading through your post, I was also thinking of the other pokemon I needed to catch: Raikou. Imagine if Raikou at level 40 chose to fight trainers rather than to flee. He is usually released when your team is at level 25-30. If he chooses to fight you the first time you meet him, it would mean he would ambush you at random and wipe the floor with your team. In fact, the same would probably happen the next couple times you meet him also. Honestly, even though chasing him down and trapping with mean look several times (he knows roar) wasn't fun, an ambush would be even less fun.

Simply run from Raikou.

 

[Chapter]

I would like a little more non linearity, although they sort of made it slight less in bw2, bit not much. In the end though, non linearity isn't that great. Just maybe battling a couple of gyms out of order, but you still need to do ll of them at some point.

That quote is from the first page- sorry I'm too lazy to read a lot of them.

I think that in the pixel-games they should be more linear, but the new 3D style could proove to be a kinda, I dunno, maybe this a stretch, except, kinda like Xenoblade Chronicles. Not the story or anything, just the gameplay style. Like, the 8 direction movement in a 3D artwork style. Though, hmm... IDK but I think that this game could be more of a competitor with games similar to Blue Dragon and stuff. Like, intense RPG'S, though, PKMN has more strategy than those games really.

 

[HolyNova Lucario]

Well personally if they made it a too linear younger players would have a hard time figuring out what to do next......well when I was 8 I had trouble if you think of it, you might miss something along the way which could prove important for a certain obstacle and a good chance for you to raise your Pokemon's exp and gain new items. It could be a bad thing if they made Pokemon a little too linear but a good thing if they did. Sorry if this is a little bit out of topic but if they expanded the Pokemon region to be more spacious and roomy it would be nice and make the main story a little longer.

 

[Frost Mage]

Gym battles would have to be scaled down to however many gym battles you've won, so that, say, if you went to the first gym first on your 8th badge, you'd be fighting Pokemon around level 50. But I think some less linear gameplay aspects would do a lot of good, and with X and Y as a new beginning, I think they will.