Sun & Moon Characters Speculation Thread

[lolipiece]

Would Black Hole Eclipse even be a threat since Ash already figured out how to counter it?

Of course, there could be moments where Lycanroc isn't there for whatever reason.

 

[DatsRight]

Would Black Hole Eclipse even be a threat since Ash already figured out how to counter it?

Of course, there could be moments where Lycanroc isn't there for whatever reason.

I would be interested in cases where TRio go up against the other twerps (I mean it'd be nice if they didn't have them back to punching bags for Lillie and Mallow straight after they put Ash on the ropes AGAIN, let's not insult the poor guy).

I'm kinda hoping that, even if it's not Trio, Ash gets at least one opponent who outdoes him in terms of Z Moves, since they're an element he's starting to get OP in regard to (not only has he gotten 'special treatment' in regards to receiving them, but from the very beginning, he has recurrently evaded or no-sold opponent's Z Moves while his have never failed). He's lost battles, but only when Z Moves aren't in use.

 

[Deleted member 384931]

Z-move are nice, but they make it to easy to win. Ash is OP. He never lost on official Trail or Grand Trail to date, make it better then the most gyms he does par region. I must say Ash even in SM is still serious and even sweeter to others. Tbh I don't really understand Mallows goal, did she already achief it?

 

[DatsRight]

I don't mind Ash having a good track record, it's about time his experience gave him an upper hand anyway, I just think he shouldn't be as unmatchable concerning the Z Moves, especially the Kahunas. He should get outdone with one at least once.

 

[Leonhart]

Satoshi having a good battle record in SM wouldn't bother me if his personality was in-sync with his battling skills, but those two facets of his character are currently polar opposites.

 

[lolipiece]

Satoshi having a good battle record in SM wouldn't bother me if his personality was in-sync with his battling skills, but those two facets of his character are currently polar opposites.

Why? Just because he's a little more hyper doesn't mean he can't be a good battler.

 

[Deleted member 384931]

Tbh, it is a whole diffrent peacing. In XY there were each week new discussions and now, it isnt that frequent aymore. I feel like many people aren't that excited for pokemon Sun and Moon. Correct me if I am wrong. The only thing we are discusing now is Ash his 6th pokemon and Lillies focus episode. Not about Mallow,Lana or Kaiwe. Don't begin about the "but they are the protags". Mallow,Lana,Kiawe are even important like Lillie. Lol the irony, even Black and White was more discussed and many people still think that was a bad series! Where are the times people were excited for battles like Greninja,Infernape and Septile? Ash has good pokémon in Alola too. But why do they get so much critism? Like "Rowlet hasnt done anything", Chespin didnt either or even Torkoal. Or like "wow Rowlet learns finaly a new move", Ash his Snivy learned one new move, but you didn't complain. And the complaint that "pokémon dont evolve much" (I am a complainer about that too,but that is wrong of me). Remember that it took alot of time before others evolved like Grovile or Pignite.

 

[Satomine Night]

Z-move are nice, but they make it to easy to win. Ash is OP. He never lost on official Trail or Grand Trail to date, make it better then the most gyms he does par region. I must say Ash even in SM is still serious and even sweeter to others. Tbh I don't really understand Mallows goal, did she already achief it?

I wouldn't say Ash is OP. It might not have been an official Trial or Grand Trial, but Ash did lose to Nanu the first time he battled him, and that should count.

Mallow's goal is easy to understand: She wants to make the Aina Cafeteria the number one restaurant in Alola. If anything, she is one of the few SM main characters who has a goal with a definite "goal line." She hasn't fully achieved her goal, but she has made steps toward achieving her goal. She won the bread festival in the name of the Aina Cafeteria, for one even though a lot of people around here seem to disregard that victory.

Satoshi having a good battle record in SM wouldn't bother me if his personality was in-sync with his battling skills, but those two facets of his character are currently polar opposites.

There is no synchronization between personality and battle skills, because the two have nothing to do with each other. A character can be goofy and be a great battler; and a character can be serious and be a poor battler. The fact that Ash is easily excited and hyper doesn't and shouldn't affect his skills as a Trainer. If anything, it makes him more of a "Crouching Moron, Hidden Bad***" type character.

 

[Ignition]

I wouldn't say Ash is OP. It might not have been an official Trial or Grand Trial, but Ash did lose to Nanu the first time he battled him, and that should count.

Mallow's goal is easy to understand: She wants to make the Aina Cafeteria the number one restaurant in Alola. If anything, she is one of the few SM main characters who has a goal with a definite "goal line." She hasn't fully achieved her goal, but she has made steps toward achieving her goal. She won the bread festival in the name of the Aina Cafeteria, for one even though a lot of people around here seem to disregard that victory.


There is no synchronization between personality and battle skills, because the two have nothing to do with each other. A character can be goofy and be a great battler; and a character can be serious and be a poor battler. The fact that Ash is easily excited and hyper doesn't and shouldn't affect his skills as a Trainer. If anything, it makes him more of a "Crouching Moron, Hidden Bad***" type character.

I disagree. While, yes, you could have a serious character be a terrible battler and a goofy character can be a good battler, saying that personality doesn't/can't impact the skills of a Trainer is wrong. Ash is known to be spontaneous, quick, resourceful, and impatient (some of his personality quirks). That's clearly shown in his battle style. Him coming with unorthodox and creative ways to throw off his opponents based off variables like environment, Pokémon's movesets, the way a move works etc. It's shown in battles like vs Valerie and outside the battlefield situations like the Morelull episode. His personality does impact his battle skills (which can be good or bad.)

The skills of a trainer doesn't equate to how capable of a battler they are.

 

[Leonhart]

Correct me if I am wrong. The only thing we are discusing now is Ash his 6th pokemon and Lillies focus episode. Not about Mallow,Lana or Kaiwe.

Well Satoshi and Lilie get the most attention in SM, so of course most people focus on them. I think it's unfair how neglected Mao and Maamane usually are, although with a cast as big as SM's, this was always unavoidable.

 

[Satomine Night]

I disagree. While, yes, you could have a serious character be a terrible battler and a goofy character can be a good battler, saying that personality doesn't/can't impact the skills of a Trainer is wrong. Ash is known to be spontaneous, quick, resourceful, and impatient (some of his personality quirks). That's clearly shown in his battle style. Him coming with unorthodox and creative ways to throw off his opponents based off variables like environment, Pokémon's movesets, the way a move works etc. It's shown in battles like vs Valerie and outside the battlefield situations like the Morelull episode. His personality does impact his battle skills (which can be good or bad.)

The skills of a trainer doesn't equate to how capable of a battler they are.

While Ash's character traits do affect his battling style, they don't exactly affect his battling skills—"skills" in this case referring to his strength as a Trainer (which is what I believe @Leonhart was referring to, since he referred to Ash's battle record). Ash being spontaneous, quick, resourceful, and impatient all factor into and affect his battling style. His personality does not affect how good of a Trainer he is. It affects the kind of Trainer he is.

 

[Ignition]

While Ash's character traits do affect his battling style, they don't exactly affect his battling skills—"skills" in this case referring to his strength as a Trainer (which is what I believe @Leonhart was referring to, since he referred to Ash's battle record). Ash being spontaneous, quick, resourceful, and impatient all factor into and affect his battling style. His personality does not affect how good of a Trainer he is. It affects the kind of Trainer he is.

I don't think skill is the right word to use. Skill isn't always related to how good of a trainer one is. Capability is a better word.

 

[DatsRight]

Well Satoshi and Lilie get the most attention in SM, so of course most people focus on them. I think it's unfair how neglected Mao and Maamane usually are, although with a cast as big as SM's, this was always unavoidable.

Sophocles actually tends to get reasonable development in terms of characterisation, he's probably had the most episodes after Ash and Lillie, the problem is his development in terms of ambitions and Pokemon training has been mostly stagnant. We get some cool bits of bonding between him and his two Pokemon, and they come in handy odd occasions, but they aren't used for much dynamic. They haven't even learned new moves yet. I'm kinda hoping we haven't seen the last of the observatory and they can be equipped for something related to that, maybe even a lite adaptation of the Electrium Z trial.

I don't think skill is the right word to use. Skill isn't always related to how good of a trainer one is. Capability is a better word.

Yeah. SM seems like it's trying to abolish the whole 'comedy = gag character' standard. Even Team Rocket have gotten to do a bit more this series instead of being mere jobbers for the more important 'serious' characters.

Truthfully I like this setup. I like when characters that would usually be deemed unimportant comic relief actually shine and make a difference. Ash is endearing this series in how in spite of being a clown, he can still often pull through when it's needed. If anything quirks can often help play into more defining moments of importance and gaining some degree of character agency. I think all the SM cast have this potential, just that only Ash and Kiawe get it realised on a frequent basis.

 

[lolipiece]

So, with Lillie getting a Z-Crystal, a Z-Ring is inevitable.

I don't think she'll get it immediately like Lana did after getting her Waterium Z, but that remains to be seen.

Still though, I have to wonder what type of Z-Ring it'll be.

The anime has made it a good point to follow what the games did by giving each Alola island its own personal Z-Ring.

Ash has a Melemele Z-Ring/Z-Power Ring. Kiawe and Lana have Akala Z-Rings, just like in the games. Team Rocket have an Ula'ula Z-Power Ring since they got it from Nanu. Gladion also has one, just like in the games. I guess if they want to show off each variety on a main/major recurring character, the only logical solution is a Poni style.

But that would require going to Poni, right? I mean, they don't have to go right away, but I hope if they do go, it's not for the trials. Not just yet.

 

[andrewscott48209]

So, with Lillie getting a Z-Crystal, a Z-Ring is inevitable.

I don't think she'll get it immediately like Lana did after getting her Waterium Z, but that remains to be seen.

Still though, I have to wonder what type of Z-Ring it'll be.

The anime has made it a good point to follow what the games did by giving each Alola island its own personal Z-Ring.

Ash has a Melemele Z-Ring/Z-Power Ring. Kiawe and Lana have Akala Z-Rings, just like in the games. Team Rocket have an Ula'ula Z-Power Ring since they got it from Nanu. Gladion also has one, just like in the games. I guess if they want to show off each variety on a main/major recurring character, the only logical solution is a Poni style.

But that would require going to Poni, right? I mean, they don't have to go right away, but I hope if they do go, it's not for the trials. Not just yet.

The reason that Lana got a Z Ring immediately was because she had found a sparkling stone prior to taking the water trial.

 

[Leonhart]

Lilie attaining a Z-Ring someday intrigues me, although I can't help but feel tetchy given that Mao would be the only female SM cast member without one of her own, and she could use the development more than Lilie.

 

[DatsRight]

Lilie attaining a Z-Ring someday intrigues me, although I can't help but feel tetchy given that Mao would be the only female SM cast member without one of her own, and she could use the development more than Lilie.

The Z Moves are better given to the characters who can make utility of it in some way. The Kahunas and rivals obviously do well with the power boost to make them good adversaries, Ash and Kiawe are battlers so can make use of them, even TRio work getting a power boost to keep them less stagnant antagonists. Lillie I suppose works getting the boost to show her growing as a trainer, even if she seldom battles in the first place, while Lana I question getting one besides to show off the Water Z Move. Mallow and Sophocles at this point don't really have much use for the Z Moves because their agendas rarely involve battling or power either (though if Sophocles continues to be tech heavy, I suppose he could use the extra electric power).

 

[Eddieursa]

Guys, although I would LOVE to see all the past villains again in an arc about Team Rainbow Rocket, I believe I just discovered another way for the "Team Rainbow Rocket".

You see, the villain Bourgain is the president of the RAINBOW Happy Resort Company. So, how about if the Team Rainbow Rocket comes from alliance between Giovanni and Bourgain? Don't you think it sounds probable?

EDIT: Now that Torracat has a Fighting move like Revenge, do you think Tapu Koko will return Ash the Fightinium Z stolen from when Ash defeated Hala?

 

[Deleted member 384931]

Guys, although I would LOVE to see all the past villains again in an arc about Team Rainbow Rocket, I believe I just discovered another way for the "Team Rainbow Rocket".

You see, the villain Bourgain is the president of the RAINBOW Happy Resort Company. So, how about if the Team Rainbow Rocket comes from alliance between Giovanni and Bourgain? Don't you think it sounds probable?

EDIT: Now that Torracat has a Fighting move like Revenge, do you think Tapu Koko will return Ash the Fightinium Z stolen from when Ash defeated Hala?

Interesting! L

 

[Zoruagible]

Now that Torracat has a Fighting move like Revenge, do you think Tapu Koko will return Ash the Fightinium Z stolen from when Ash defeated Hala?

Tapu Koko didn't steal it, he swapped it out for Electrium.
Ash is owed a crystal for the whole Ghost trial thing but I'd like to see him do something to earn his crystal rather than just getting it handed to him.
Hopefully they don't do another switcheroo in order for him to get Fightnium. Just let him earn Fightnium from doing a non-trial thing like Lillie and Jessie