Sun & Moon Characters Speculation Thread

[AuraChannelerChris]

What are you all talking about. Hau is precious and takes all loses with a laugh...and he can be refought many times.

Ash simply sighs and brushes his better fighter with an impossible promise for another battle.

Donuts and malasadas.

 

[PorcelainVulpix]

My biggest concern is that with Hau being so similar to Ash's current personality, he might fill in that gap and with Misty and Brock returning, Ash might regress a bit into his earlier OS persona. I mean I don't mind Ash having some of his old banter again, but I see it being the perfect excuse to flanderize him again.

I..wouldn’t mind this actually. Of course I don’t want him to regress into a clueless, arrogant rookie but in terms of sense of humor, I preferred OS Ash over any other version. I’d rather have sarcastic/savage Ash over slapstick Ash.

Definitely agree he shouldn’t be an arrogant hot head again though just because he’s matured so much since then. Although I will say that I never hated that side of Ash. It could be entertaining sometimes but that’s just a personal opinion.

 

[Ignition]

This ironically describes Satoshi somewhat as well given how he handles the vast majority of his losses with a positive outlook.

That's one aspects of Ash I don't like honestly

 

[p96822]

I would rather the writers not go into the past and pull out jerkiness Ash from kanto because one it didn't lead into any entertainment and two it lead into some really bad episodes like Path to the Pokemon League and The Mandarin Mismatch

 

[DatsRight]

I would rather the writers not go into the past and pull out jerkiness Ash from kanto because one it didn't lead into any entertainment and two it lead into some really bad episodes like Path to the Pokemon League and The Mandarin Mismatch

Yeah that's my main concern. I mean Ash's chemistry in the Kanto two parter was okay, there is some sort of balance with him being inherently flawed but still competent and learning from some of his mistakes. I don't want him to go back to a stock insolent protagonist who always needs to be taken down a peg. Especially so since OS's main source of balance was that a lot of characters like Misty were just as abrasive and needed humbling as Ash, which wouldn't quite be the case in SM. Many complain SM Ash is already too much of a designated butt monkey, but I could stand that since he still had his redeeming qualities and wasn't just the generic 'always wrong/always the one causing problems' type.

Besides that I like the dippy but good natured Ash of current SM.

 

[p96822]

I know I'm not to supposed to say this, but I don't really felt that Misty or Brock inaction with Ash was that good in the first part because they were just remembering about the good old days. Even though the second part did has some interacting with Ash, but they are so far and inbetween that I didn't care about neither of those characters .

 

[lemoncatpower]

I know I'm not to supposed to say this, but I don't really felt that Misty or Brock inaction with Ash was that good in the first part because they were just remembering about the good old days. Even though the second part did has some interacting with Ash, but they are so far and inbetween that I didn't care about neither of those characters .

I sort of agree, it wasn't anything too amazing. I hope they do it better this time with them being in more episodes, maybe actual recurring characters for Alola.

 

[ash&charizardfan]

I know I'm not to supposed to say this, but I don't really felt that Misty or Brock inaction with Ash was that good in the first part because they were just remembering about the good old days. Even though the second part did has some interacting with Ash, but they are so far and inbetween that I didn't care about neither of those characters .

No i agree with you except for that half minute talk during the flashback time and the departure time they didn't really talked that much, i think all the previous companions have talked to present companions, misty during her hoenn cameo talked more to max, may to dawn and dawn with iris (tho dawn did talked with ash as well), but its a old norm. Let see whats in store this time.

 

[Leonhart]

I would rather the writers not go into the past and pull out jerkiness Ash from kanto because one it didn't lead into any entertainment and two it lead into some really bad episodes like Path to the Pokemon League and The Mandarin Mismatch

His rarely seen cocky attitude isn't fun to me either since he always gets knocked back down whenever he shows his ego. Thankfully, SM Satoshi has no major ego issues.

 

[DatsRight]

His rarely seen cocky attitude isn't fun to me either since he always gets knocked back down whenever he shows his ego. Thankfully, SM Satoshi has no major ego issues.

I feel like Ash is evened out within the SM cast at this point, he's eccentric and reckless, but he is rather good natured and experienced. I think that keeps balance within the other companions and their own shortcomings. Giving Ash represent the standard protagonist failings he had in the OS like ego, temper, and rudeness would likely too easily relegate him to the jerk member of the team, and likely more prone to mean spirited treatment given he already can't get away with nothin'.

The fact the newer anime tends to be more fond of the female cast being winners or coming out smelling like a rose in most situations (I think Lillie's the only one to routinely do slapstick or even fail a single class exercise) also leaves me worried they would simplify his and Misty's dynamic to be one sided, when one of the better depths of the OS was that BOTH of them were egotistical butt monkeys who took turns knocking the hot air out of each other. I don't want a predictable 'Ash is always wrong, Misty is always right' formula like they do with so many other cartoons with a male and female dynamic.

 

[PorcelainVulpix]

I feel like Ash is evened out within the SM cast at this point, he's eccentric and reckless, but he is rather good natured and experienced. I think that keeps balance within the other companions and their own shortcomings. Giving Ash represent the standard protagonist failings he had in the OS like ego, temper, and rudeness would likely too easily relegate him to the jerk member of the team, and likely more prone to mean spirited treatment given he already can't get away with nothin'.

The fact the newer anime tends to be more fond of the female cast being winners or coming out smelling like a rose in most situations (I think Lillie's the only one to routinely do slapstick or even fail a single class exercise) also leaves me worried they would simplify his and Misty's dynamic to be one sided, when one of the better depths of the OS was that BOTH of them were egotistical butt monkeys who took turns knocking the hot air out of each other. I don't want a predictable 'Ash is always wrong, Misty is always right' formula like they do with so many other cartoons with a male and female dynamic.

Agreed. Their constant roasting of each other was a big part of the group dynamic in OS. In Brock and Misty’s previous appearances in SM, I was happy to see Misty call Ash a kid to knock his ego down a little and it made me smile when Brock and Misty hinted towards Ash getting pity badges, but I guess that was kind of one sided and only Ash’s ego ended up getting knocked down.

 

[DatsRight]

It felt like the point of their battle was Misty going in thinking Ash was his usual cocksure self (especially with how childlike he still was at face value), but proving he had genuinely became more collected and resourceful. She could annoy him a little, but she was no longer his 'superior'.

Also while Ash is a butt monkey in SM, it's sort of his personality to take it in stride, other characters usually provide more of the neuroses nowadays.

 

[DuquÊ?]

That's Misty's modus operandi, not something new, she loves humble someone. If anything, it showed Brock sure knows better than her how much Ash grew as a trainer, if only by the fact he wasn't surprised about how pikachu fled from the whirlpool and just went "Heh, classic Ash" face.

SM flanderizes pretty everyone, not only Ash, I'm just rolling with it, now.

 

[DatsRight]

That's Misty's modus operandi, not something new, she loves humble someone. If anything, it showed Brock sure knows better than her how much Ash grew as a trainer, if only by the fact he wasn't surprised about how pikachu fled from the whirlpool and just went "Heh, classic Ash" face.

SM flanderizes pretty everyone, not only Ash, I'm just rolling with it, now.

Yeah but right now, due to the right choice of foils and situations, Ash is still kept well balanced in spite of said flanderization. I dunno how he would fare if Brock and Misty were his main foils again, or vice versa (Misty always targeted Ash's ego, for that she would need Ash's ego to exist at all on a regular basis, and when Ash didn't need a straight man as much, Brock slowly dwindled in interactions).

A lot of characters' roles and importance start to wax and wane when the rest of the show doesn't bounce off of them correctly anymore (eg. Team Rocket).

 

[Leonhart]

So it's not surprising SM Ash and Misty/Brock's interactions don't feel the same. Misty also didn't have any temper in her first SM cameo, so you didn't see her get angry like she used to either.

I did feel like Kasumi was calm when we last saw her in SM compared to her OS days, and I'm not looking forward to seeing more of that when she comes back since I prefer her angry side. Still, SM has taught me to appreciate the goofy side of each character, so I've learned to temper my expectations when it comes to in-fighting and bickering in the cast.

 

[DatsRight]

I feel like even with character development her kinda sulky disposition was part of her, we saw it in bits even in the specials. She's childish just like Ash has stayed childish, but in a different manner.

A problem is also that Misty had different people to bounce off of. She didn't really connect with any of the SM companions, they had to give Ash back a bit of his hubris just to make them connect again, and Team Rocket, well....I think the writers are just done putting any effort into 'twerps vs Team Rocket' scenarios. A shame because I liked some of the Jessie vs Misty banter, but I don't see them doing anything more than a stock curb stomp if they ever met again now.

 

[DuquÊ?]

Yeah but right now, due to the right choice of foils and situations, Ash is still kept well balanced in spite of said flanderization. I dunno how he would fare if Brock and Misty were his main foils again, or vice versa (Misty always targeted Ash's ego, for that she would need Ash's ego to exist at all on a regular basis, and when Ash didn't need a straight man as much, Brock slowly dwindled in interactions).

A lot of characters' roles and importance start to wax and wane when the rest of the show doesn't bounce off of them correctly anymore (eg. Team Rocket).

It depends purely of writing, actually. In a world of fair writing, I can see current Ash not actually that fond of how he was in his Kanto days (that's why sounds out of character now for him lying about his first badges like in SM Kanto episodes). Kanto Ash was a slacker and wouldn't miss an easy win. Current Ash, despite how he changed along the years, is consistent about be humble, train and win fairly (even if training in SM consist about twerking, what bizarrely works).

Dynamics with Brock would be mostly the same, since he followed Ash's gradual change into a good trainer (who still sucks in any other non battle related department, though), and since everyone in Alola is chill as heck + lots of girls, Brock would be in a paradise (eh, no pun intented). It isn't as he was in need of a foil years ago. If anything, Kiawe (in "manliness") and Mallow (in cooking) would serve to that role. Misty is other case, her main thing was press Ash's buttons and nag him down. While he still need to be called off some times, Ash doesn't need so much of that nowadays, since he is, to all effects, a better battler than her, with temper or no. Again, no one in Alola is that confrontational, and while Misty can be bratty, she would feel out of place. Technically, they could focus only on her water thing and make her feeling at home.

Personallly, I don't miss Brock or Misty or Kanto shenanigans, not even a little bit (but, Kanto pandering, LGPE promotion and all). I'm expecting they're comming for a short time (three episodes at most) and then, bye.

 

[PorcelainVulpix]

The SM anime generally writes everyone as nice and happy and friendly all the time. We already saw the previous SM cameo how Misty was more energetic or smiling all the time, not even her AG cameos had her like that. SM also has what I'd say "cuter designs" for the main cast, so Misty looked more bubbly in her SM design.

I suspect it will be similar, don't expect any OS-style arguments or bickering at all, it wouldn't fit into the SM series.

Well there was a little bit of OS style banter after Ash and Misty’s battle so I wouldn’t rule it out completely but I definitely think the writers will tweak the original trio’s dynamic a little to make it fit in with the SM dynamic.

 

[Leonhart]

I do miss Musashi's occasional angry banter with Kasumi back in OS, so it's sad to know that SM might not even have any more moments like those. The fact that the Rocket-dan is in LG: P/E makes me think that the trio might do something big for promo purposes soon, however.

 

[DatsRight]

Yeah the reason Ash lasts every series is that his personality is tweaked or developed to still bounce off of the new supporting cast so he doesn't feel like an irrelevant artefact. Even if you think his own arc is stale, he makes a fun foil for some of the newer characters.

They made that mistake with Brock, he didn't gain many new interactions as the show went on so slowly got reduced to a background character or running gag. Team Rocket slowly lost their funny chemistry with any of the new protagonists as well, making them really boring as antagonists regardless of how they were as individual characters (their personalities are fine in SM, but the twerps just completely stonewall them now so they don't work at all). If they want Misty to work in SM she's gonna have to bounce off of someone, and I'm hoping they don't just reset Ash into a hot tempered braggart to appease that.

Hell even with the newer cast you can tell whose working just by how well they can interact with Ash or any of the other characters. Even with the Pokemon the ones that seem to stick out most are the ones with team mates or funny chemistries.