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Sun & Moon Pokémon Speculation Thread

Discussion in 'Animé Spoilers' started by Sushi, Oct 29, 2016.

  1. Kintaro

    Kintaro Well-Known Member

    Yeah I don't get it either. Lillie is also the only main character of the entire series (not just SM, but the entire series not counting Max and Bonnie), who only has 1 pokemon and no evolutions (like Mallow) for 100+ episodes.

    Hell even Tracey of all characters had 3 pokemon...and he was only on the main cast for 30 episodes!
     
    Kawaii Emolga, Ignition and Redstar45 like this.
  2. Twilight-Kun

    Twilight-Kun Pokemon World Champion

    I'm sure Lillie will get her Z-ring with no fanfare and no buildup

    I wouldn't bat an eye if next episode she just had one and nobody asks where it came from
     
    janejane6178 and Redstar45 like this.
  3. Joltik-Kid

    Joltik-Kid I'm too old ಠ_ಠ

    If we're gonna be honest here... the main problem was always the regional Pokedex, something I constantly point out when we discuss the lack of team members. The fact of the matter is we haven't had a good one since Best Wishes when Ash caught the most Pokemon he's ever had since the Indigo League, of course, we all are aware of how well that team worked out. The other problem was the decision, which I've also made clear before not all too recently, was having a big cast knowing full well that you just can't make work. Ash is never allowed to promote past generation Pokemon, hence why he never got a Mega Evolution and why Alolan forms are still treated as Kanto Pokemon, just alternate colors. That already hampers the group dynamic as he still has to be the one to truly promote the series, meaning he's gotta have the most regional Pokemon available yet it cannot be a legend of any kind. Damn man, it took till the 6th generation for him to even get an official Pseudo Legend, albeit the weakest one to date going be game standards. On top of all that, Ash has 2 rivals that need full teams, 5 companions for some reason who indeed need some relevance, and Kakui is also a major player as the Mask Royal. That's nine characters right there... NINE! Oh wait, can't forget Jessie and James, so that makes eleven characters... ELEVEN! What the number of Pokemon in this dex excluding Legends, Ultra Beast, and Alolan forms again? Thirty-Four species were available to Ash from the start, of which there is now only currently , and I'm being generous with this, fifteen thanks to everyone else needing to be accounted for.

    Yeah, you can thank Hau and Kakui for the reason Rowlet and Torrecat are likely to never evolve... that and this dumb focus on popularity despite the fact neither of these guys seem to be focused on nearly as much as Lycanroc. You'd think they'd have Ash use both constantly, especially Rowlet given its #1 status, but nope, just there in the backpack for no reason.
     
    janejane6178 and Redstar45 like this.
  4. Master Pikachu 11

    Master Pikachu 11 Well-Known Member

    You know since you mention it, there is always a chance that she could get her Z ring in the Lycanroc battle episode and I know that the episode is going to focus on the battle and that will be the main event, however, the episode is not only going to focus on Ash but it will also focus on Lillie as she will be talking and catching up with her brother in the episode before the battle. I would not be shocked if Hapu plays a roll in Lillie getting her Z ring. And since the next episode is focusing on two characters who could potentially get two evolutions in the same episode, I would not be surprised if they give Lillie something in this battle and if not then it will be a future episode.
     
  5. kickachu

    kickachu Momentai!

    That's not true remember what happened with gligar and it evolved into gliscor and during that time ash was promote past gen pokemon and aipom too before that trade with buziel
     
  6. Spider-Phoenix

    Spider-Phoenix Go, Go Power Rangers

    Iris is the only one whose first pokémon can be said to be her first capture since she battle it herself lol
     
  7. nickdt

    nickdt Well-Known Member

    Its really simple.

    If you start out without a Pokemon, you don't have a team. If you get or catch your first Pokemon, you have a team, since you change from not having one to having one, so yes, Lillie has had a team change.

    If Vulpix doesn't count for Lillie, then you cannot count Mallow having a team change either, since she started with one and stayed with one, despite the evolutions (Which as such, isn't a team changes, since she doesn't add anything new to her team).

    So if we apply logic, Mallow is the only one who didn't have a team change, since nothing new got added.
     
    Blaze Master X and Pokegirl Fan~ like this.
  8. DatsRight

    DatsRight Well-Known Member

    Mallow is the only character who hasn't actively worked for a team change at least.

    Lillie trained Snowy to learn two moves (and generally worked against her phobia to bond with her), Lana and Kiawe went out of their way to gain a Z Move and teach it their Pokemon, Sophocles battled and caught Charjabug (and trained it for occasions such as the Charjabug kart race), Ash trained his Pokemon and worked against their defects on multiple occasions. Nearly all secondary captures involved some sort of bonding with the Pokemon beforehand as well. All of these have at least played into the trainer's distinctive proactivity.

    We skipped past Mallow catching and bonding with Bounsweet and both of her change ups so far have been random plot armour after all of ONE attempt at training her the entire series. Many of the trainers have been handed team changes (especially Ash) but it's balanced by some demonstration of how they actively work with them and put their own personality into it, while Mallow has by far been given the least to do with nothing about Tsareena being fully evolved adding to her agency.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2019 at 1:54 PM
  9. Sceptile Leaf Blade

    Sceptile Leaf Blade Happy Minun

    My point is mostly that focusing on team changes (regardless of how you count them, whether you count evolutions or not, first pokémon or not, newly taught moves or not) is a very limited way to view development of characters in Sun and Moon, especially when considering Lillie. Using team changes as an argument that Lillie is not being developed is just not a very good argument when Lillie's development is not about becoming a strong battler but about conquering her fear of touching pokémon and later on conquering her own doubts and insecurities regarding her own abilities in a variety of circumstances (like battling, but also other things like pokémon sled jumping, and in the future probably also learning Z-Moves). Lillie is arguably the most developed character out of everyone in Sun and Moon. If you compare her as she is now to how she was at the start of SM she's a very different character. Back then she had to be metaphorically pulled along by Mallow to get development and take some first steps towards touching pokémon, and now she is far more pro-active without needing Mallow to push her every move. She is still on her first pokémon because she had to start deeper than other characters in the cast, she couldn't even touch pokémon in the beginning and that was development that she had to go through first, before going to catching other pokémon, getting Z-Crystals, evolutions, and all that.
     
    Blaze Master X, i2i, Zhydra and 3 others like this.
  10. Ignition

    Ignition Why are the angry characters always the best ones?

    I’m just saying you act like her acquiring a full part (lots of Pokèmon) is not the same as as her simply having a team change. I’m aware of her development and didn’t suggest that it’s limited to changes in her roster
     
  11. DatsRight

    DatsRight Well-Known Member

    I do think this series was hindered by lack of team changes, which likely came from the larger amount of companions and all the Pokemon being regularly on screen requiring some moderation. I think the show wanted to go for 'quality over quantity' but I think the problem is only a few have gotten even the basics to achieve that. I can forgive Ash's smaller team for example because usually only the same amount get proper screentime anyway, and all four of them are pretty loveable and work well with what they get. Kiawe is arguably doing better than most previous male companions despite only two Pokemon as well. Mallow on the other hand is suffering horribly from being stagnant, Lana similarly seems to be a character they struggle for ideas unless she gets a new change up. Sophocles is palpable for comic relief I guess, though it feels like they could have done way more with him.

    Lillie does okay with one Pokemon, but at the same time she's now struggling for limelight without any dynamic changes to her direction, and Snowy as mentioned is kind of flat without any team mates. Getting one of her games Pokemon such as Ribombee or Comfey could also increase her agency within the main group and give a more distinct idea what she wants to do.
     
    Kawaii Emolga likes this.
  12. Joltik-Kid

    Joltik-Kid I'm too old ಠ_ಠ

    Gen 2 Pokemon that evolve into Gen 4 Pokemon... what about that did I miss exactly? Neither was there promoting Gen 2, say like Dawn's Cyndaquil and Ash's Cyndaquil evolving before the league, rather they were there to showcase the new evolution methods. Yeah, strange it took Aipom so long, actually after he traded her to be precise, but Ash's Gligar was around for a short 21 episodes where it's only big accomplishment outside of its evolution episode was jobbing hard to Paul's Gliscor.
     
  13. Zariful

    Zariful Well-Known Member

    It would be a great time for Rowlet to learn a ghost type move in preparation for Ash’s trial. Knowing the anime, they’ll probably allow electro web to hit the ground types.
     
  14. MiloticTwins

    MiloticTwins Well-Known Member

    Hey, what's happening guys? Do you think that Blaziken should have its role in the Pokémon franchise because it is one of the popular Pokémon with its fans?
     
  15. Twilight-Kun

    Twilight-Kun Pokemon World Champion

    It had its time in the limelight back during AG and briefly in XY thanks to Mega Evolution and ORAS

    It's done with, and like 90% of every other pokémon, will probably never show up outside of random crowd shots
     
    Kawaii Emolga likes this.
  16. nickdt

    nickdt Well-Known Member

    I have the same feeling regarding Charizard, but still..... their we have one again.
     
  17. Illusio

    Illusio Well-Known Member

    Yeah, Blaziken is one of those Pokemon where it'll come in for whatever promotion they want to do, leave for a bit, and then come back in and repeat. It's a second tier Charizard in that regard.
     
  18. kickachu

    kickachu Momentai!

    shouldn't we be expecting a new opening soon?
     
    Kawaii Emolga likes this.
  19. mehmeh1

    mehmeh1 Well-Known Member

    we got the current one in october, so no, it'll probably be like XY&Z, which lasted a whole year
     
  20. Spider-Phoenix

    Spider-Phoenix Go, Go Power Rangers

    The closest I can see is a Rika Matsumoto cover but that's mostly likely going to be exclusive to a random CD release (maybe the new ED?)
     

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