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Team Building Help Thread

Onyx Tanuki

Ma! There's a weird 'nuki in the yahd!
I'm playing on wi-fi online battle rating which Blaziken is not banned on with that build.

My new plan:

Keeping Gengar

Keeping Blaziken

Instead of Dragonite
Mamoswine w/ life orb (don't know what you would call this build, but maybe mixed physical sweeper or mixed attacker? I could go for something else, like make it defensive)
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Snow cloak
EVs: don't remember off hand
-Earthquake
-Hail
-Protect
-Icicle Crush

Instead of Zoroark:
Crawdnaut w/ choice band (wallbreaker)
Nature: Adamant
EVs: don't remember off hand
-Knock Off
-Crab Hammer
-Aqua Jet
-Super Power

Instead of Gardevoir
Sylveon with Leftovers (cleric support)
Nature: Calm
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: don't remember off hand
-Hyper Voice
-Wish
-Protect
-Heal Bell

Instead of Vivilon:
Scizor w/ Lum Berry (physical attacker)
Ability: Technician
Nature: Adamant
-X Scizzor
-Sword Dance
-Bullet Punch
-Roost

Another option could be maybe Garchomp over Scizor?

Now you've gone pretty much the complete opposite direction, having replaced nearly all of your special attackers with physical attackers. The point is to make sure you're able to handle threats from both fronts. That's why I made such a to-do about Gardevoir having Psyshock over Psychic; it makes it capable of hitting things that are weak in either defensive stat effectively, rather than only being good at handling things with lower SpDef. This team could work if you go full-out special offense on Gengar, but otherwise you really only have Hex/Sludge Bomb and Hyper Voice to hit things on the special side. I do think this team is better, I just feel like you need more of a specially offensive presence. Here's what I'd do personally, with one adjustment in the roster:

Blaziken @ Blazikenite
Speed Boost
Jolly
252 Att, 4 Def/SpDef, 252 Speed
- Flare Blitz
- Low Kick/High Jump Kick
- Protect
- Baton Pass

High Jump Kick is a little risky, but is going to be dealing better damage than Low Kick even on most heavy enemies. Protect is there to ensure you get at least one stage of Speed Boost. Since his primary purpose is to pass Speed to your other pokemon, he'll be of most use once you've punched some holes in the opposition, but they may still have speedy threats on their side that you'd lose to if they're allowed to hit first. However, he also acts as a wallbreaker because he has massive power on his own and there's not that many things that resist both Fighting and Fire and have the defenses to stand up to his attacks. You'll have to watch out for things like non-Mega Gyarados, Altaria and Mega Altaria, and Pelipper.

Gengar @ Black Sludge/Choice Specs
Levitate
Timid
4 HP, 252 SpAtt, 252 Speed
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Bomb/Energy Ball/Dazzling Gleam
- Thunderbolt
- Trick/Will-O-Wisp/Toxic

I chose a more offensive direction for him to go, trading his Hex out for the overall-more-powerful Shadow Ball and giving him Thunderbolt for additional coverage. Sludge Bomb is a good STAB move, but since you're using another means to handle most Fairies now, you could sacrifice it for another coverage option like Energy Ball or Dazzling Gleam; the former will allow the team overall to cover more types, but Dazzling Gleam will give Gengar better personal coverage. The last slot goes to a support move, with Trick able to cripple opposing walls and physical attackers by giving them Gengar's item or one of its two status moves supporting your team by providing residual damage. IMO, the best option would be to go for Trick with Choice Specs.

Mamoswine @ Leftovers
Thick Fat
Adamant/Brave
252 HP, 252 Att, 4 Def/SpDef
- Ice Shard
- Avalanche/Icicle Crash
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock

Mamo is what you call a "bulky physical" because, while he lacks the speed to crush most of the foes in his wake, he's got enough defensive power to stand up to attacks for several rounds. Leftovers will improve his longevity, and going for Thick Fat will remove his weakness to Fire and make him resistant to Ice; I understand what you were thinking by having him with Snow Cloak and Hail, but none of your team benefits from Hail besides him, so you'd be better off not bothering. Whether you choose Icicle Crash or Avalanche is really a personal preference; Icicle Crash is better if he's got an excellent Speed IV, while he'll do better with Avalanche if you've got a poor Speed IV and/or you've studied up on pokemon speed tiers enough to know at a glance whether an opponent it likely to be faster. You should also use the right nature to match: Adamant will do better with Icicle Crash since it leaves Speed alone, while Brave will work better for Avalanche since it reduces Speed. Stealth Rock is pretty important, since it'll help defend your team against things like Charizard and Talonflame, and will put more damage on things as they switch in, making them much easier to kill.

Sylveon @ Leftovers/Pixie Plate
Pixilate
Bold/Calm
252 HP, 252 Def/SpDef, 4 SpAtt
- Hyper Voice
- Wish
- Heal Bell
- Calm Mind/Substitute/Toxic

While Protect/Wish is a common strategy, it's one I personally am not a fan of, so I opted to replace Protect with either Substitute or Calm Mind. Hyper Voice is STAB, and of course Wish and Heal Bell are there for cleric duty. Substitute works better with Leftovers, Calm nature, and SpDef EVs, but I think Calm Mind is a more interesting option, as it works well with Bold and Def EVs, especially since Sylveon's the only defensive pokemon on your team. If Item Clause is in play, you may be better off holding a Pixie Plate to beef up Hyper Voice's power a little more. Toxic is a decent third option, too, since Sylveon is great at stalling out opposing walls and next to anything that relies a lot on special offense.

Scizor @ Life Orb
Technician
Adamant
4 HP, 252 Att, 252 Speed
- Bug Bite
- Bullet Punch
- Roost
- Swords Dance/U-Turn

If you're going to be using a non-Mega Scizor, there is absolutely zero reason to use X-Scissor over Bug Bite; it has no added effect and ten less power after Technician is considered. Swords Dance is viable since it has the bulk to take a hit while it sets up and has Roost to recover its health, but U-Turn allows it to be a pivot, baiting in pokemon that'd use a Fire move and swapping out for Mamoswine or Blaziken to take the blow.

Now, as much as I was advocating Crawdaunt, he was actually the weakest of the physically offensive pokemon on your revised team; he has good Attack and is pretty scary, but you have two other things that can use priority, and Gengar can ruin enemies that use Eviolite with Trick. Therefore, I opted to replace it with another special user that pairs well with Sylveon:

Magnezone @ Air Balloon/Assault Vest
Analytic
Quiet
252 HP, 4 Def, 252 SpAtt
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Volt Switch

This guy does very well as a defensive pivot, switching in on opposing pokemon that have physical Steel or Poison attacks they try to use on Sylveon. From there you could either predict a Ground type to switch in and hit them with HP Ice, or use Volt Switch so Magnezone takes a blow in place of what you really wanted in to finish the opponent off. Flash Cannon is also great against the small handful of physically defensive Fairies. Air Balloon will allow Magnezone to actually switch in on a Ground type attack, while Assault Vest will beef up its SpDef and let it potentially survive a Fire attack if you mispredict.

I think aside from keeping things too far on one side of the offensive spectrum (between physical or special), your biggest problem is team synergy. Many of them seem to be geared to work alone, not considering what they'll do for the other members of their team. Mamoswine is a prime example: you had him using Hail to exploit his Snow Cloak, but the fact is Hail is more of a harmful thing for your team. You need to build the team around one or two pokemon you really want to use, supporting those pokemons' weak points, or else work with a particular gimmick in mind and set your team up to handle things that could counter that gimmick.
 
Now you've gone pretty much the complete opposite direction, having replaced nearly all of your special attackers with physical attackers. The point is to make sure you're able to handle threats from both fronts. That's why I made such a to-do about Gardevoir having Psyshock over Psychic; it makes it capable of hitting things that are weak in either defensive stat effectively, rather than only being good at handling things with lower SpDef. This team could work if you go full-out special offense on Gengar, but otherwise you really only have Hex/Sludge Bomb and Hyper Voice to hit things on the special side. I do think this team is better, I just feel like you need more of a specially offensive presence. Here's what I'd do personally, with one adjustment in the roster:

Blaziken @ Blazikenite
Speed Boost
Jolly
252 Att, 4 Def/SpDef, 252 Speed
- Flare Blitz
- Low Kick/High Jump Kick
- Protect
- Baton Pass

High Jump Kick is a little risky, but is going to be dealing better damage than Low Kick even on most heavy enemies. Protect is there to ensure you get at least one stage of Speed Boost. Since his primary purpose is to pass Speed to your other pokemon, he'll be of most use once you've punched some holes in the opposition, but they may still have speedy threats on their side that you'd lose to if they're allowed to hit first. However, he also acts as a wallbreaker because he has massive power on his own and there's not that many things that resist both Fighting and Fire and have the defenses to stand up to his attacks. You'll have to watch out for things like non-Mega Gyarados, Altaria and Mega Altaria, and Pelipper.

Gengar @ Black Sludge/Choice Specs
Levitate
Timid
4 HP, 252 SpAtt, 252 Speed
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Bomb/Energy Ball/Dazzling Gleam
- Thunderbolt
- Trick/Will-O-Wisp/Toxic

I chose a more offensive direction for him to go, trading his Hex out for the overall-more-powerful Shadow Ball and giving him Thunderbolt for additional coverage. Sludge Bomb is a good STAB move, but since you're using another means to handle most Fairies now, you could sacrifice it for another coverage option like Energy Ball or Dazzling Gleam; the former will allow the team overall to cover more types, but Dazzling Gleam will give Gengar better personal coverage. The last slot goes to a support move, with Trick able to cripple opposing walls and physical attackers by giving them Gengar's item or one of its two status moves supporting your team by providing residual damage. IMO, the best option would be to go for Trick with Choice Specs.

Mamoswine @ Leftovers
Thick Fat
Adamant/Brave
252 HP, 252 Att, 4 Def/SpDef
- Ice Shard
- Avalanche/Icicle Crash
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock

Mamo is what you call a "bulky physical" because, while he lacks the speed to crush most of the foes in his wake, he's got enough defensive power to stand up to attacks for several rounds. Leftovers will improve his longevity, and going for Thick Fat will remove his weakness to Fire and make him resistant to Ice; I understand what you were thinking by having him with Snow Cloak and Hail, but none of your team benefits from Hail besides him, so you'd be better off not bothering. Whether you choose Icicle Crash or Avalanche is really a personal preference; Icicle Crash is better if he's got an excellent Speed IV, while he'll do better with Avalanche if you've got a poor Speed IV and/or you've studied up on pokemon speed tiers enough to know at a glance whether an opponent it likely to be faster. You should also use the right nature to match: Adamant will do better with Icicle Crash since it leaves Speed alone, while Brave will work better for Avalanche since it reduces Speed. Stealth Rock is pretty important, since it'll help defend your team against things like Charizard and Talonflame, and will put more damage on things as they switch in, making them much easier to kill.

Sylveon @ Leftovers/Pixie Plate
Pixilate
Bold/Calm
252 HP, 252 Def/SpDef, 4 SpAtt
- Hyper Voice
- Wish
- Heal Bell
- Calm Mind/Substitute/Toxic

While Protect/Wish is a common strategy, it's one I personally am not a fan of, so I opted to replace Protect with either Substitute or Calm Mind. Hyper Voice is STAB, and of course Wish and Heal Bell are there for cleric duty. Substitute works better with Leftovers, Calm nature, and SpDef EVs, but I think Calm Mind is a more interesting option, as it works well with Bold and Def EVs, especially since Sylveon's the only defensive pokemon on your team. If Item Clause is in play, you may be better off holding a Pixie Plate to beef up Hyper Voice's power a little more. Toxic is a decent third option, too, since Sylveon is great at stalling out opposing walls and next to anything that relies a lot on special offense.

Scizor @ Life Orb
Technician
Adamant
4 HP, 252 Att, 252 Speed
- Bug Bite
- Bullet Punch
- Roost
- Swords Dance/U-Turn

If you're going to be using a non-Mega Scizor, there is absolutely zero reason to use X-Scissor over Bug Bite; it has no added effect and ten less power after Technician is considered. Swords Dance is viable since it has the bulk to take a hit while it sets up and has Roost to recover its health, but U-Turn allows it to be a pivot, baiting in pokemon that'd use a Fire move and swapping out for Mamoswine or Blaziken to take the blow.

Now, as much as I was advocating Crawdaunt, he was actually the weakest of the physically offensive pokemon on your revised team; he has good Attack and is pretty scary, but you have two other things that can use priority, and Gengar can ruin enemies that use Eviolite with Trick. Therefore, I opted to replace it with another special user that pairs well with Sylveon:

Magnezone @ Air Balloon/Assault Vest
Analytic
Quiet
252 HP, 4 Def, 252 SpAtt
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Volt Switch

This guy does very well as a defensive pivot, switching in on opposing pokemon that have physical Steel or Poison attacks they try to use on Sylveon. From there you could either predict a Ground type to switch in and hit them with HP Ice, or use Volt Switch so Magnezone takes a blow in place of what you really wanted in to finish the opponent off. Flash Cannon is also great against the small handful of physically defensive Fairies. Air Balloon will allow Magnezone to actually switch in on a Ground type attack, while Assault Vest will beef up its SpDef and let it potentially survive a Fire attack if you mispredict.

I think aside from keeping things too far on one side of the offensive spectrum (between physical or special), your biggest problem is team synergy. Many of them seem to be geared to work alone, not considering what they'll do for the other members of their team. Mamoswine is a prime example: you had him using Hail to exploit his Snow Cloak, but the fact is Hail is more of a harmful thing for your team. You need to build the team around one or two pokemon you really want to use, supporting those pokemons' weak points, or else work with a particular gimmick in mind and set your team up to handle things that could counter that gimmick.
I definitely want to use genagar, blaziken, sylveon, and scizor. Could Crawdnaut or Dragonite work in place of Mamoswine? Cuz I only want to go through the hastle of getting one more pokemon. I traded Ninetails out today for Scizor. I have a couple Pokemon I could trade to hopefully get one more. Since Mamoswine can be used to hurt Talonflame and Charizard, couldn't Crawdnaut do the same?
 
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Onyx Tanuki

Ma! There's a weird 'nuki in the yahd!
I definitely want to use genagar, blaziken, sylveon, and scizor. Could Crawdnaut or Dragonite work in place of Mamoswine?

Absolutely. Dragonite would be my choice between the two thanks to access to Extremespeed. And since none of the pokemon I listed are actually setup attackers, he could be used as your setup sweeper.
 
Absolutely. Dragonite would be my choice between the two thanks to access to Extremespeed. And since none of the pokemon I listed are actually setup attackers, he could be used as your setup sweeper.
Okay, then I will use Dragonite over Mamoswine and work on getting a Magnezone.

Thanks for helping me out there!

So i think is what u meant for magnezone?

Magnezone @ Air Balloon/Assault Vest/Choice Scarf (most places say choice scarf cuz he needs speed)
Ability: Magnet Pull
Nature: Timid
-Volt Switch
-Flash Cannon
-HP Ice (since I have nothing else that could hit ground types)
-Thunderbolt

Also, if you had to chose, Milotic (physical defensive-bold nature w/ scald, recover, ice beam, and haze) or dragonite?
 
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firepanda

Active Member
Can you guys think of a good physical wall that was introduced in Gen III? So not stuff like Skarmory or Donphan, even though they're found in Hoenn.

At the moment, all I've got is M-Aggron, but that uses up a precious mega slot. Normal Aggron has crippling quad weaknesses to Close Combat and EQ. Neither have reliable healing.
Claydol has SR and screens, but it's typing is just so awful and it's really more special than physical anyway. Again, no reliable healing.
Torkoal has terrible typing and no recovery, like Claydol.

Of all the Pokemon introduced in Gen III (excluding Metagross) which would you recommend as a physical tank?
 
Can you guys think of a good physical wall that was introduced in Gen III? So not stuff like Skarmory or Donphan, even though they're found in Hoenn.

At the moment, all I've got is M-Aggron, but that uses up a precious mega slot. Normal Aggron has crippling quad weaknesses to Close Combat and EQ. Neither have reliable healing.
Claydol has SR and screens, but it's typing is just so awful and it's really more special than physical anyway. Again, no reliable healing.
Torkoal has terrible typing and no recovery, like Claydol.

Of all the Pokemon introduced in Gen III (excluding Metagross) which would you recommend as a physical tank?
maybe mega camerup w/ modest nature @ passho berry
EVs: 252 HP/252 Sp Def/ 4 SP att
-earth power
-stealth rock
-lava plume
-stone edge

milotic can be a mixed wall.

all though, but i think r u in UU tier.
 
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firepanda

Active Member
*for some reason it doesn't let me quote you*



Mixed tier. I want to make a team of my favourites + some others to play online.
M-Camperupt has the same problem as M-Aggron: it uses up the mega slot (and I don't think it has reliable healing either). It is incredibly tempting to have a volcanic roomba though.
I did think of Milotic, but it needs to be exposed to Marvel Scale to work. That pretty much means restalk, which is pretty unreliable.

Also, re Magenzone, HP Fire works as well. In fact, I'd recommend it over ice to deal with Scizor and Ferrothorn. Trapping steel types is one of Magnezone's big selling points and fire helps it deal with them.
 
Mixed tier. I want to make a team of my favourites + some others to play online.
M-Camperupt has the same problem as M-Aggron: it uses up the mega slot (and I don't think it has reliable healing either). It is incredibly tempting to have a volcanic roomba though.
I did think of Milotic, but it needs to be exposed to Marvel Scale to work. That pretty much means restalk, which is pretty unreliable.

Also, re Magenzone, HP Fire works as well. In fact, I'd recommend it over ice to deal with Scizor and Ferrothorn. Trapping steel types is one of Magnezone's big selling points and fire helps it deal with them.
yeah u need marvel scale on milotic.

yeah but my team is pretty specific and i think needs hp ice.
 

firepanda

Active Member
yeah u need marvel scale on milotic.

yeah but my team is pretty specific and i think needs hp ice.

Hm. Keeping in mind I know nothing, I'd probably still go with fire over ice. Your team hates steels almost as much as ground (Blaziken aside). Magnezone is perfect for killing steel types with HP fire. Otoh, it is pretty risky to try and bait in a Pokemon that probably outspeeds it and can easily kill it in one hit. You kind of already have ground-type counters with Gengar and Dragonite. Magnezone has really good synergy with Dragonite: Dragonite is immune to ground attacks and Magnezone can ruin fairies and steels (the latter with HP fire).


Of all the Pokemon introduced in Gen III (excluding Metagross) which would you guys recommend as a physical tank?

EDIT: I'll bump this, since I'm still looking for a reliable gen III tank (status is too unreliable). They all seem to have bad typing.
 

Onyx Tanuki

Ma! There's a weird 'nuki in the yahd!
Okay, then I will use Dragonite over Mamoswine and work on getting a Magnezone.

Thanks for helping me out there!

So i think is what u meant for magnezone?

Magnezone @ Air Balloon/Assault Vest/Choice Scarf (most places say choice scarf cuz he needs speed)
Ability: Magnet Pull
Nature: Timid
-Volt Switch
-Flash Cannon
-HP Ice (since I have nothing else that could hit ground types)
-Thunderbolt

Also, if you had to chose, Milotic (physical defensive-bold nature w/ scald, recover, ice beam, and haze) or dragonite?

That set looks decent for Magnezone. And personally I'd go ahead and use Dragonite, between the two, but if you wanted to use Milotic, I'd prefer a Rest-Talk set:

Milotic @ Leftovers/Chesto Berry
Marvel Scale
Bold
252 HP, 252 Def, 4 SpAtt
- Scald
- Ice Beam/Dragon Tail
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Why use Rest when you can use Recover? Because of Marvel Scale. When afflicted with status, the pokemon's Def is boosted 50%, and with Milotic's excellent SpDef and decent HP, it makes it pretty hard to kill. Scald for STAB, and you can pick between Ice Beam for more coverage or Dragon Tail to swat away anything that thinks it can set up on you. This also makes Milotic great for jumping in to take a Will-O-Wisp or Toxic, since it can Rest the bad status away when the damage starts racking up, where one with Recover might not be able to keep up with Toxic damage eventually. The negative is that Sleep Talk picks a move randomly, so there's a 1/3 chance it'll attempt to use Rest again. You'll also need to keep in mind how long it's been asleep for you you don't accidentally use Sleep Talk on the turn it wakes up. Leftovers is better overall for recovery, but Chesto allows it to be more easily controlled for a little while longer before you start relying on Sleep Talk.

Can you guys think of a good physical wall that was introduced in Gen III? So not stuff like Skarmory or Donphan, even though they're found in Hoenn.

At the moment, all I've got is M-Aggron, but that uses up a precious mega slot. Normal Aggron has crippling quad weaknesses to Close Combat and EQ. Neither have reliable healing.
Claydol has SR and screens, but it's typing is just so awful and it's really more special than physical anyway. Again, no reliable healing.
Torkoal has terrible typing and no recovery, like Claydol.

Of all the Pokemon introduced in Gen III (excluding Metagross) which would you recommend as a physical tank?

Pelipper @ Leftovers/Wacan Berry
Rain Dish
Bold
252 HP, 252 Def, 4 SpAtt
- Scald/Air Slash
- Scald/Air Slash/Ice Beam/Toxic
- Roost
- Substitute

It doesn't have the absolute best HP, sure, but Pelipper isn't too shabby defensively. Water/Flying is a great typing with only two weaknesses (albeit one a double weakness) and a decent number of defenses, and is a good typing from an offensive point as well. Roost and Substitute are pretty much needed, the former for recovery and the latter to prevent status. You don't necessarily need both STABs, but it does have two viable ones in Scald and Air Slash, and you could either pair the STABs together, or sub one out for Ice Beam for different coverage or Toxic to try and stall enemies out. I will warn not to get too comfortable around things like Aurorus, Lapras, or other Ice types, though, as they could be packing Freeze-Dry.

Wailord @ Leftovers
Oblivious
Bold
252 HP, 252 Def, 4 SpAtt
- Scald
- Clear Smog
- Substitute
- Aqua Ring

This one's another really interesting option that, while lacking in actual defenses, has insane HP to cover that, second only to Chansey, Blissey, and Wobbuffet, and this set is one I've found pretty effective. Scald burns the foes to supplement Wailord's defenses, Clear Smog prevents enemies from setting up on it and provides a weapon against at least some Grass type threats, Substitute prevents status and gives it time to recover, and Aqua Ring pushes the 1/16th recovery from Lefties up to 1/8th. This one does need to watch out for things with strong SpAtt, though, as well as anything that'll phase it out.

Cradily @ Leftovers
Storm Drain
Bold
252 HP, 252 Def, 4 SpAtt
- Giga Drain
- Recover
- Stealth Rock
- Leech Seed/Earth Power/Sandstorm

Cradily's unique typing makes it an interesting choice, as well. Due to its Rock type it'll do especially well in a Sand team, thus the inclusion of Sandstorm as an option, but it's got other decent options. Between Giga Drain, Recover, and Leech Seed, it can be very tough to kill unless the foe has its weaknesses easily at hand. It also gets access to Stealth Rock, which can be essential to keeping Bug and Ice types from trying to come in on it, and Earth Power could give Steel types reason to fear, especially if you've got a SpAtt buff from switching in on a Water move.

Those are the ones that jump out at me the most. There's also Dusclops, but its only recovery is Pain Split and you mentioned wanting some solid recovery. Mega Sableye's alright if you have the Mega slot open, but regular Sableye's better as support than walling if you can't use its Mega. Mega Altaria's great too, but is more of a bulky offensive pokemon than a wall, and Shelgon, while an effective wall, needs to have Wish, which isn't easy to get since it's an event move.
 
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Hm. Keeping in mind I know nothing, I'd probably still go with fire over ice. Your team hates steels almost as much as ground (Blaziken aside). Magnezone is perfect for killing steel types with HP fire. Otoh, it is pretty risky to try and bait in a Pokemon that probably outspeeds it and can easily kill it in one hit. You kind of already have ground-type counters with Gengar and Dragonite. Magnezone has really good synergy with Dragonite: Dragonite is immune to ground attacks and Magnezone can ruin fairies and steels (the latter with HP fire).




EDIT: I'll bump this, since I'm still looking for a reliable gen III tank (status is too unreliable). They all seem to have bad typing.
all right I'll go with HP fire and then i can use energy ball on Gengar so I have more coverage against ground and water types.
 
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firepanda

Active Member

Wow thanks! Very thorough.

I think I might use the Cradily set, for the simple reason I don't like Pelipper. Nah, I'm actually planning on using a Milotic as well, so Cradily offers way better synergy. I might actually use Torkoal in addition to that, since it resists grass, steel and ice and can set up rocks, freeing a slot for Toxic/coverage on Cradily. I'll get back with a more complete team.

EDIT: Cradily can't use leech seed, btw. I'll replace it with Rock Slide.
 
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Mye

Someone has to win..
Wow thanks! Very thorough.

I think I might use the Cradily set, for the simple reason I don't like Pelipper. Nah, I'm actually planning on using a Milotic as well, so Cradily offers way better synergy. I might actually use Torkoal in addition to that, since it resists grass, steel and ice and can set up rocks, freeing a slot for Toxic/coverage on Cradily. I'll get back with a more complete team.

EDIT: Cradily can't use leech seed, btw. I'll replace it with Rock Slide.

If you really wanted an interesting option, you could always run swords dance and turn cradily into a bulky offensive rocks setter. Despite its low attack stat, its typing/ability and access to recover allow it to completely ruin would-be defoggers by either pushing to +4 attack or just outright killing them with rock slide. Using an EV spread of 252HP/40Attack/216Def with either an impish or relaxed nature allows it to have as much bulk as possible while still giving it the ability to dent things without a boost (namely torkoal, who takes roughly 55% without one).
 

Onyx Tanuki

Ma! There's a weird 'nuki in the yahd!
Wow thanks! Very thorough.

I think I might use the Cradily set, for the simple reason I don't like Pelipper. Nah, I'm actually planning on using a Milotic as well, so Cradily offers way better synergy. I might actually use Torkoal in addition to that, since it resists grass, steel and ice and can set up rocks, freeing a slot for Toxic/coverage on Cradily. I'll get back with a more complete team.

EDIT: Cradily can't use leech seed, btw. I'll replace it with Rock Slide.

My bad, I was sure it could run Leech Seed :p I do remember when I used to run it on Showdown it was pretty damned difficult to kill. Then, it was part of a UU Sand team, basically the team's answer to Water types, and I ran a physical variant with Bullet Seed and Rock Slide IIRC. Swords Dance would be an awesome variant, too, since it has the bulk to set up and Recover to keep from being smooshed too quickly. I may have actually tried ingrain on it, though on that tier that made it really vulnerable to Steel and Fighting types switching in on it, so more trouble than it's worth. Also keep in mind that it can also use Stockpile, if you want to go REALLY defensive.

The set I offered was based in special offense because I figured Earth Power would be a good thing to run on it; Ground and Rock special attacks are rare to come by, and Cradily's only other options are HP Rock and Ancient Power (depending on if you want more PP or that chance for all stats to rise). It's a shame that literally the only thing that uses Power Gem STAB effectively is Sand Force Probopass. Not that it's the only thing that uses the move; I love using Power Gem on Nasty Plot Persian or Mismagius, but neither gets STAB, and most Rock types with Power Gem have very low SpAtt. Hell, Diancie doesn't even get it, and the only other Rocks that have it are Corsola, Gigalith, and Carbink. >_> But I digress.

Also, Fire really isn't as bad a typing as you might think. It's real downside is Rock weakness. It resists Fairy, and you could paritally mitigate Ground weakness with Air Balloon. It's just better as a specially defensive pokemon, IMO, due to the types it does resist, and the only one that really comes to mind as a special walling Fire type is Flareon, which isn't 3rd gen.
 
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What do you all think of my Diancie build?

Diance @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Clear Body
Nature: Lonely (+Att, -Def)
-Rock Polish
-Moon Blast
-Diamond Storm
-Stealth Rock

Idea here is to come in quickly and set up stealth rock or to use rock polish followed by diamond storm or moon blast.

I don't know if this is competitive good, but at least for in-game. I didn't plan on using diancie competetively, so I didn't bother soft resetting for a good nature.
 
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Onyx Tanuki

Ma! There's a weird 'nuki in the yahd!
What do you all think of my Diancie build?

Diance @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Clear Body
Nature: Lonely (+Att, -Def)
-Rock Polish
-Moon Blast
-Diamond Storm
-Stealth Rock

Idea here is to come in quickly and set up stealth rock or to use rock polish followed by diamond storm or moon blast.

I don't know if this is competitive good, but at least for in-game. I didn't plan on using diancie competetively, so I didn't bother soft resetting for a good nature.

NEVER use a setup move on a Choice set, man XD What Choice Scarf does is lock you into a move, so the setup move would never be able to be used. Stealth Rock wouldn't be recommended either, but at least it actually does something for you. I'd either replace Rock Polish with Earth Power or give it a different item like Diancite or Lefties. Since it's Lonely, that's not a shabby nature for a mixed sweeper Mega Diancie.

I should probably note that, because Diancie's base Speed is only 50, even fully invested it's not going to be a very good choice to use a Scarf. If you're going to have it with a choice item it should be Specs IMO. But again, never EVER with a setup move.
 

firepanda

Active Member
Thanks for all the feedback. :D This is the current team I'm looking at. It's a mixed tier team that I can use for online battles or with friends. There are the following self-imposed restrictions:
  • Only Pokemon introduced in Generation 3.
  • Only Pokemon catchable before Lilycove City.
  • Include Sceptile, Gallade and Milotic, my favourite Pokemon.
(Kind of arbitrary, I know.)


Sceptile, M-Gallade, Milotic
[spoil]Sceptile w/ Life Orb
Overgrow (Max Spd, SpA)
Giga Drain, Leaf Storm, Focus Blast, HP Ghost

Standard special attacking Sceptile: hit stuff as hard as possible. HP Ghost gives neutral or better coverage on everything.


Gallade w/ Galladeite
Steadfast (Max Spd, Atk)
Swords Dance, Zen Headbutt, Close Combat, Knock Off

Standard Mega-Gallade. The three attacking moves again have neutral or better coverage.


Milotic w/ Leftovers
Marvel Scale (Max HP, Def)
Scald, Ice Beam, Dragon Tail, Recover

Not entirely sure on this one. I wanted to go with something more specially defensive, since Cradily and Torkoal are already really defensive, hence no restalk. However, every set online seems to favour a physically defensive EV spread regardless, so I went with that.[/spoil]

Cradily and Torkoal
[spoil]Cradily w/ Leftovers
Suction Cups (252HP/40Attack/216Def)
Swords Dance, Rock Slide, Earthquake, Recover

Trying out Mye's set here. I'm guessing Curse could also work, but it would probably take to long to set up, during which I'll get burned or hazed.


Torkoal w/ Leftovers
Shell Armor (Max HP, Def)
Stealth Rocks, Rapid Spin, Lava Plume, Toxic

Standard SR/rapid spin set. I'm a bit unsure on the last slot, which is usually Yawn on most sets. I have Toxic is just because there's nothing else to dissolve walls, unless I replace Dragon Tail on Milotic.[/spoil]


So yeah. Whether Milotic is more specially or physically defensive will depend on what other defensive Pokemon I have. Currently Cradily and Torkoal have pretty good defensive coverage, although they are a bit unorthodox and mostly see play in NU. That's probably because Gen III didn't introduce any of the current top-tier non-mega walls.

The biggest problem I see so far is three (!) leftovers. Torkoal might get by with Sitrus berry or Air balloon, but Cradily and Milotic both love their lefties. Maybe give Cradily Shell Bell, since it's a bit more offensive and has less HP?


For the last slot, I'm not sure what to do. Prankster Sableye's meant to be good, but as a battling novice, I don't know how to use it. So I don't actually know how well it suits my team.

Manectric and Flygon can both be scarfed revenge killers, to hit fast and switch out with volt switch/u turn. Flygon's probably preferable, since I already have a lot of special moves and it can take ground moves for Torkoal.

I could use some priority, so maybe Breloom mach punch or Absol sucker punch?
 
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NEVER use a setup move on a Choice set, man XD What Choice Scarf does is lock you into a move, so the setup move would never be able to be used. Stealth Rock wouldn't be recommended either, but at least it actually does something for you. I'd either replace Rock Polish with Earth Power or give it a different item like Diancite or Lefties. Since it's Lonely, that's not a shabby nature for a mixed sweeper Mega Diancie.

I should probably note that, because Diancie's base Speed is only 50, even fully invested it's not going to be a very good choice to use a Scarf. If you're going to have it with a choice item it should be Specs IMO. But again, never EVER with a setup move.
thanks for the tip! :)
 

Dark Mephiles

Fryin n Dryin
Hi everyone, I need a bit of help. I'm going to be participating in a local Monogen tournament within the next few days, however my standard method of testing my teams (Showdown), isn't being as accurate as I'd like due to a lack of Monogen options. I can't get a very accurate read on how good my team is, since any opponent I face in OU has an inherit advantage over my team. I'd appreciate any advice that I'm given. My current plan for the Monogen tournament is to run Gen V, and my usual battle style is hyper offensive. My team is as follows, in no particular order:

Thundurus-Therian (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Thunderbolt
- Focus Blast
- Sludge Bomb

Just your standard boosting Special attacker, get one nasty plot off and Thundurus's special attack is massively boosted. After which I just need to pick the best move for the situation and then use it. Not the best strategy in the world I'll admit, but I needed a good special attacker and Thundurus fits the bill.

Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Fusion Bolt
- Ice Beam
- Iron Head

The main goal is for the Kyurem to come in on a Baton Pass here, receiving a few speed boosts and at least one swords dance from Scolipede. Life orb is held for additional attack power, but I'm considering switching to Expert Belt for extra longevity provided it doesn't cause any major problems in it's survival. The current moves are used to gain the best amount of coverage possible, with the hope being that it's sheer attack power will cover up any holes in it's type coverage.

Keldeo-Resolute @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Hidden Power [Electric]

A powerful water type with it's ability to boost with CM. Adds additional coverage options for the team, in particular secret sword which allows it to function as a psuedo mixed attacker. It was mainly picked just to add additional coverage, and because of it's status as the best Gen V Water type in OU. I've been considering switching Meloetta into this spot though due to better overall coverage.

Conkeldurr @ Assault Vest
Ability: Iron Fist
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Mach Punch
- Ice Punch
- Stone Edge

Priority. Conkeldurr brings with it high attack power, and the use of a priority move in Mach Punch. Drain punch is used to help it survive, along with ice punch and stone edge for coverage. Iron Fist is used over Guts due to not wishing to run a status condition. Conkeldurr is mainly used over other fighting types like Terrakion so that the team has a priority option.

Zoroark @ Life Orb
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 196 Atk / 96 SpA / 216 Spe
Naive Nature
- Knock Off
- Flamethrower
- Grass Knot
- Sucker Punch

The first option for a lead for this team, a decent mixed attacker that will usually be sent out in the front of the team, with Scolipede in the back if my opponent runs something that may be problematic for Scolipede. Thrown in to cause some confusion before it dies due to it's coverage and power. I understand it's not the best option in the world, but I couldn't think of a good special attacker in Gen V that could really contribute anything more useful to the team than Thundurus.

Scolipede (F) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Baton Pass
- Earthquake
- Megahorn

The second option for a lead for the team, used if the opponent isn't running something which would act as a major enough threat to Scolipede's ability to perform it's task. A decent attacker who's main job is to pile on a bunch of attack and speed boosts then pass them onto Kyurem-B (Or Conkeldurr if the situation calls for it).

If there's any recommendations over the Pokemon I'm currently using then I'd welcome them, I have access to at least a 5IV version of every Gen V Pokemon as well, so I'm not limited on Pokemon, but the tournament I'm participating in has all Uber Pokemon banned. Thanks.
 
I am trying to make a good Serperior, so far I have a lvl 1 snivy w/ HA and timid nature w/ HP ground.

It knows these 4 moves:
-glare
-mean look
-iron tail
-mirror coat

I think HP ground would be nice to counter fire types. But HP fire would be good to counter ferrothorns. But HP Ground gives some more extra protection for serperior. I think i might start building a new team using HA serperior and gardevoir and zoroark.
 
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