Team Skull, Aether Foundation and Plot Discussion Thread [Contains Story Spoilers]

[Taodragon]

I do agree that some elements of the story are actually somewhat underwritten. Even though the story does a good enough job for us to get a feel for the characters and plotlines, some of them really could've used more time to have been fleshed out as things like the Aether, Guzma, Plumeria, Lusamine, and Gladion only appear once or twice before the twist and climax, and they don't give the player enough focus to give them too much depth. Some like Plumeria really suffer in this regard as she appears twice before the twist and then once after, the first time was kind of out of nowhere in the scheme of things since she comes in right before you fight Olivia and then leaves just as soon as you came, and the last time she just gives a bit of exposition and calls off her grunts, which doesn't give us much of her character. For a character that should be important, she should've had more time in the sun, especially since Skull was in the picture long before she came in.

Personally, Sun/Moon still have a great story as most of the characters are likeable, the sense of community and the background is good, and the plot serves its role rather well, but I think it could use some ironing out to be stronger as a story (though I'd prefer a sequel, but I have my doubts on that).

 

[clbgolden12]

I've never bothered to try PokePalego, so could someone explain this theory of Mohn being Lillie and Gladion's father to me?

To put it in short, Mohn is mentioned at Aether and the Dimensional Reserach Lab to be the first to discover Ultra Wormholes, and disappeared going into one. Gladion says his dad was the first to discover the Ultra Wormholes. Finally, Mohn said he discovered the Pelago upon washing up there, and has blonde hair and green eyes like the others.

Add all that up, and...

 

[Nerdy McNerdface]

I do agree that some elements of the story are actually somewhat underwritten. Even though the story does a good enough job for us to get a feel for the characters and plotlines, some of them really could've used more time to have been fleshed out as things like the Aether, Guzma, Plumeria, Lusamine, and Gladion only appear once or twice before the twist and climax, and they don't give the player enough focus to give them too much depth. Some like Plumeria really suffer in this regard as she appears twice before the twist and then once after, the first time was kind of out of nowhere in the scheme of things since she comes in right before you fight Olivia and then leaves just as soon as you came, and the last time she just gives a bit of exposition and calls off her grunts, which doesn't give us much of her character. For a character that should be important, she should've had more time in the sun, especially since Skull was in the picture long before she came in.

Personally, Sun/Moon still have a great story as most of the characters are likeable, the sense of community and the background is good, and the plot serves its role rather well, but I think it could use some ironing out to be stronger as a story (though I'd prefer a sequel, but I have my doubts on that).

I think the impact they were going for with Plumeria was make her seem like other admins before her (not much development, appears out-of-context) and then when the third encounter rolls by we think "oh it just gonna be another admin battle" and then she instantly drops the sorry bomb to shock us. She wasn't meant to look like a developed character until she said that quote, because GAME FREAK likely wanted to surprise us with a character who looked to be like a usual character of their type and then differ from it instantly. For example, in the main plot of HeartGold/SoulSilver, the Rocket admins only appear once or twice for battles, and never really got much development. GAME FREAK disguised Plumeria as one of those before suddenly giving us a twist.

That's how I see it at least.

 

[Bguy7]

To put it in short, Mohn is mentioned at Aether and the Dimensional Reserach Lab to be the first to discover Ultra Wormholes, and disappeared going into one. Gladion says his dad was the first to discover the Ultra Wormholes. Finally, Mohn said he discovered the Pelago upon washing up there, and has blonde hair and green eyes like the others.

Add all that up, and...

Okay, I guess I had seen all that stuff, I just hadn't put two and two together. Does he make any indication of having memory loss like Anabel?

 

[clbgolden12]

Okay, I guess I had seen all that stuff, I just hadn't put two and two together. Does he make any indication of having memory loss like Anabel?

Not much. He just appears to have washed up on the island given his ripped pants.

 

[cl94]

Not much. He just appears to have washed up on the island given his ripped pants.

But there also isn't any indication that he didn't have memory loss, as he says nothing about his past life.

 

[mew 2000]

http://www.serebiiforums.com/showthread.php?653444-Ultra-Beasts-Discussion-Thread/page51

My little theory on Anabel and Looker, but linking it to the current discussion it could also mean theres two Mohns

 

[Kai-zero]

Man, I feel great. I just finished my first play through of Pokémon Sun's main story. That ending just gives me the feels my friends! It's a wonderful time for all Pokémon fans when we get such great feelings of joy from our favorites series. Anyone else feel like I do after their first play through of the main story? Let me know!

 

[Bguy7]

http://www.serebiiforums.com/showthread.php?653444-Ultra-Beasts-Discussion-Thread/page51

My little theory on Anabel and Looker, but linking it to the current discussion it could also mean theres two Mohns

Interesting. I hadn't considered the thing about Looker in Omega Ruby Alpha Sapphire before. However, there is one flaw in your theory that I see. Assuming that traveling through the Ultra Wormhole does not cause you to travel through time, the sequence of events just don't line up. Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire presumably take place before Platinum and the Gen V games. This means that if Looker from the original universe were to be stranded in the Mega Universe then there'd be no Looker to appear in Platinum. Of course, this problem can be solved in two very easy ways. Either traveling through the Ultra Wormhole can allow for time travel, which it is theorized that actual wormholes can do this, or the Looker we see in Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire is not the original Looker from Platinum, but in fact from a third universe.

Regardless, I love the idea that there could be some secret narrative going on here. Maybe in the Diamond and Pearl remakes we might get some more light shed on this mystery, as Looker was introduced in Gen IV.

 

[MysticKnives]

I kinda want to shift this back to the theme of the thread.

So, what did people think was the funniest plot moment? My favourite moment has got to be when Hau points out to Faba that if Faba had remained with Lusamine then The Player, Hau and Gladion would be stuck anyway. Faba's reaction is golden.

My favorite plot moment for me was the way Hau trolled Faba, along with Faba's reaction. Funniest moment would have to be Guzma's line, "Y'all are stupid."

 

[YonaNoveau]

Interesting. I hadn't considered the thing about Looker in Omega Ruby Alpha Sapphire before. However, there is one flaw in your theory that I see. Assuming that traveling through the Ultra Wormhole does not cause you to travel through time, the sequence of events just don't line up. Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire presumably take place before Platinum and the Gen V games. This means that if Looker from the original universe were to be stranded in the Mega Universe then there'd be no Looker to appear in Platinum. Of course, this problem can be solved in two very easy ways. Either traveling through the Ultra Wormhole can allow for time travel, which it is theorized that actual wormholes can do this, or the Looker we see in Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire is not the original Looker from Platinum, but in fact from a third universe.

Regardless, I love the idea that there could be some secret narrative going on here. Maybe in the Diamond and Pearl remakes we might get some more light shed on this mystery, as Looker was introduced in Gen IV.

Oh yeah, there's a bigger plot shaping up in the background. I hope it gets adressed at some point, the feeling of... "incompleteness" it causes to have all the lingering questions regarding multiverses, government and stuff, is killing me XD. This whole stuff started with Zinnia's interdimensional meteors in ORAS and seems to be getting more complex with the Ultra Beasts and "Faller" being an actually defined term. Though I did get mixed feelings of how the more you found out about the UBs and the mess behind the smaller the whole main plot of the game felt, especially how Lusamine wasn't so much of a bad guy as much as an indirect puppet from a single UB and the whole conflict with her simply introduced the whole background instead of fully dealing with it.

I just hope if the go with alternate universes/timelines they keep things more or less organized, time travel and alternate universe are way too volatile plot devices if uses carlessly.

Perhaps the Sinnoh remakes can adress all this, I mean the Space Time Bros. themselves are the stars of them.


My favorite funny moment? I guess when Lusamine reveals she's over 40. Aside from Hau's funny reaction I was... "She's not a 17-18 supergenius like most characters in japanese media? That's rare."

 

[Gunwing]

They are talking so much about Kanto in the game that I assume it will be possible to go there in the sequels. It would fit with the end of the story.

 

[cl94]

They are talking so much about Kanto in the game that I assume it will be possible to go there in the sequels. It would fit with the end of the story.

I've learned not to assume anything, but there are a shocking number of Kanto references. No other game has referred so much to another region.

 

[YonaNoveau]

Could work as a post region like in Gold and Silver. Then again it could simply be references and call backs due to the 20th anniversary. It would be unlikely to discard the new region for a revisit of the old ones, though.

 

[cl94]

I was thinking the post-region thing as well. Maybe Johto as well, as the Switch might have more available space for locations and Pokemon. The Johto references are pretty prominent as well.

 

[YonaNoveau]

I was thinking the post-region thing as well. Maybe Johto as well, as the Switch might have more available space for locations and Pokemon. The Johto references are pretty prominent as well.

There's also the whole deal with the dimensions and the ultra beasts which may link with the potential Sinnoh remakes because Dialga and Palkia are there. Not to mention that while the game's main plot of beating Lusamine and completing the Island Challenge was completed, the game left quite a big mark regarding the UBs and some lingering background plot to address later,, to which the main events feel like a snippet if anything.... or more like big on a personal level, but big on a grander scale.

And well, of course, there's to see how's Lillie doing with Lusamine in Kanto.

 

[Nerdy McNerdface]

I just came up with a little theory.

Zinnia said that the portal device made by the Devon Corporation would create a portal that might lead to another universe. The Ultra Wormholes are portals that can stretch between timelines. Similarities much? If the portal device was going to be used to recreate some kind of a Ultra Wormhole, this could possibly mean that the energy given from an Ultra Wormhole is infinity energy, seeing as that's what is used to create the portal device. By extension, this means that the UBs, plus any Pokemon to have gone through effects like Lusamine's, normal totem Pokemon and fallers all are surrounded by infinity energy. This would make sense as Pokemon seemingly bring out their power with the help of their infinity energy, and these wormholes are made by the Pokemon-like beings of Ultra Beasts, Necrozma and the Cosmog line.

Infinity energy could be the key to almost everything. Pokemon life energy, how Pokemon can be stored in PCs and Poke balls, and now how people and Pokemon can travel through to alternate dimensions and timelines.

Of course, one of the major disproving factors is that they could be trying to create a portal more like the ones Hoopa creates with its rings, but I don't see why Zinnia would mention it as a form of Sun/Moon foreshadowing (which is probably what it was) if it was simply a portal like Hoopa's. Another factor is that for this to be true, the Devon corporation must have even more resources and intellect than Aether, seeing as even Lusamine had to use a Pokemon in order to open a wormhole, which is unlikely when we look at the two groups, however this could also be just judging a book by its cover. The biggest thing that disproves it is that infinity energy could simply be a substitute for what it is actually made of.

I'm probably just thinking through this way too much. But it's an interesting thing.

 

[YonaNoveau]

It could also be accidental on Devon's part, at least on the extent of what the infinite energy does. Remember that nobody at Devon genuinely didn't knew that dangers of the experiments with the energy until Zinnia started pointing them out.

 

[Nerdy McNerdface]

I've learned not to assume anything, but there are a shocking number of Kanto references. No other game has referred so much to another region.

I'm hoping we don't go back to Kanto. For me it just wouldn't quite feel right, but I don't know how to describe the feeling.

 

[Taodragon]

I just came up with a little theory.

Zinnia said that the portal device made by the Devon Corporation would create a portal that might lead to another universe. The Ultra Wormholes are portals that can stretch between timelines. Similarities much? If the portal device was going to be used to recreate some kind of a Ultra Wormhole, this could possibly mean that the energy given from an Ultra Wormhole is infinity energy, seeing as that's what is used to create the portal device. By extension, this means that the UBs, plus any Pokemon to have gone through effects like Lusamine's, normal totem Pokemon and fallers all are surrounded by infinity energy. This would make sense as Pokemon seemingly bring out their power with the help of their infinity energy, and these wormholes are made by the Pokemon-like beings of Ultra Beasts, Necrozma and the Cosmog line.

Infinity energy could be the key to almost everything. Pokemon life energy, how Pokemon can be stored in PCs and Poke balls, and now how people and Pokemon can travel through to alternate dimensions and timelines.

Of course, one of the major disproving factors is that they could be trying to create a portal more like the ones Hoopa creates with its rings, but I don't see why Zinnia would mention it as a form of Sun/Moon foreshadowing (which is probably what it was) if it was simply a portal like Hoopa's. Another factor is that for this to be true, the Devon corporation must have even more resources and intellect than Aether, seeing as even Lusamine had to use a Pokemon in order to open a wormhole, which is unlikely when we look at the two groups, however this could also be just judging a book by its cover. The biggest thing that disproves it is that infinity energy could simply be a substitute for what it is actually made of.

I'm probably just thinking through this way too much. But it's an interesting thing.

I doubt it, we know Ultra Wormholes existed in the past as Ultra Beasts had sightings in Alolan lore and history, and the Ultra Wormholes have appeared across the alternate timeline with examples like Anabel being a faller. So at the very least it can't be tied to the Devon Corporation's doing as their activities happen after the activities of the Ultra Beasts in the past.