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Team Skull, Aether Foundation and Plot Discussion Thread [Contains Story Spoilers]

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Wednesdayz

Meowth fanatic
When I first saw Guzma, I thought he'd specialize in dark types or poison types at least since I thought that his type specialty would coincide with the thuggish theme of Team Skull. So I'm surprised yet kind of glad that Guzma uses bug types, which I feel are underrated in general. ^^

Guzma was a joke as a villain regardless of his team. It was Lusamine who was the bigger threat in the long run, and she was a bad mother lol.
 

goodpeople25

Well-Known Member
I'm sorry, but i thought your text was really confusing. I'll try to answer it anyway.

Grinding is a chore and not giving you a faster way to do it is not really necessary to make the game difficult, since the game developers can just give the opponent stronger pokemon too.

Beating wild pokemon gives you less exp and it's less fun than beating trainers. 50% less might not seem like a lot to you, but with the Gen 5's exp system and without wild pokemon like Audino, it makes leveling pokemon tiresome, especially in a game where you have over 800 pokemon to catch and a lot of them require grinding to evolve or get decent (non op) moves.
Not to mention you can't enjoy the new bottle cap feature without leveling your pokemon to 100...

Also, there is a difference between something being hard and something being boring. Spamming a button while battling wild low level pokemon is not hard, it's just boring.
It's not 50% less for wild pokemon it's 50% more for trainers. Yeah that's perspective but from what I can tell it's a true one math wise and perspective is important. And you still haven't said how it is 50% less when all your pokemon can gain half exp and lower lvl pokemon get more.(plus catching will boost your ingame team) Honestly it seems like more grinding than the last two games, but if that's all you base things on your probably going to be in for a shock for a lot of things both new games and other peoples views. And if you consider this game having low level pokemon to grind against, you havn't seen anything from these games yet and are probably overleveled for that area.

And your not expected to do that (catch 800 pokemon,ect, which isn't even possible right now and might never be) and I'm baffled you'd even bring it up when you your trying to make a distinction of not just being harder postgame grinding. (which is only wild pokemon if you want it to be.)
 
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Xuxuba

Well-Known Member
It's not 50% less for wild pokemon it's 50% more for trainers. Yeah that's perspective but from what I can tell it's a true one math wise and perspective is important. And you still haven't said how it is 50% less when all your pokemon can gain half exp and lower lvl pokemon get more.(plus catching will boost your ingame team) Honestly it seems like more grinding than the last two games, but if that's all you base things on your probably going to be in for a shock for a lot of things both new games and other peoples views. And if you consider this game having low level pokemon to grind against, you havn't seen anything from these games yet and are probably overleveled for that area.

And your not expected to do that (catch 800 pokemon,ect, which isn't even possible right now and might never be) and I'm baffled you'd even bring it up when you your trying to make a distinction of not just being harder postgame grinding. (which is only wild pokemon if you want it to be.)
Let's not waste our time with semantics. Just answer me one question: Do you enjoy slow grinding by beating wild pokemon? Because i really doubt you do, you just can't admit it.

"when your trying to make a distinction of not just being harder postgame grinding"
No, i was talking about both the postgame and the main quest, that example just happened to be something that is more featured on the postgame, but some players do enjoy start filling their dex throughout their journey, you might not like it, but it would be dumb to act like there aren't people like me. It is impossible to catch every pokemon on the wild, but you can still use online/wireless fuctions for the ones you can't obtain. Thank you for telling us what we are expected to do in the game, but i'm fine doing what i want, if i want to fill my dex, i will. You can act like i'm the only one who does that, but then you'd be ignoring all the pokemon collectors out there and also the fact that one of this game's premise has been "gotta catch them all" for over 20 years.
 
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clbgolden12

Alolan (and soon to be Galarian) trainer
Which is a problem that wasn't fixed by making us fight weak wild pokemon.
And fighting a weak Trainer would be better?

Like, come on, let's not kid ourselves, the Trainers before gyms were almost never challenging and they weren't really meant to be challenging. They were just meant to be small obstacles and give some EXP before the real challenge, the gym leader. Same case with Trials, just with wild Pokémon and a Totem instead.

That doesn't affect only the post-game though. Some people like to fill part of their dex as they progress further in the story and not having many places to grind makes leveling and evolving pokemon just for the dex a pain.
But again, this has almost always been a problem. Yes, there was the Chateau and rematches in gen 6, those take awhile to refresh in the first place.

Some people also want to use certain pokemon on the main quest, pokemon that only obtain decent moves on high levels, but since we do not have many ways to grind, aside from wild pokemon, we have to stuck with terrible moves.
Uh... Why is this a problem? Assuming that by "high level" you mean like, level 50, then obviously there aren't gonna be places to grind that high during, let's say, mid-way in the game.

Also, there are players like me who like to rotate their teams and use as many pokemon as possible, but without a reliable way to grind it's quite likely that all of your pokemon will be underleveled.
Going back to my other point, this has always been something present. Most main-game grinding spots can only be accessed once a day, so chances are your other members will be underleveled anyways (especially pre-gen 6).

I guess you can use the PokéPelago, but there are many problems with that feature, like:
a) obviously, you're not going to be able to use those pokemon until they're done with their training
Just put them in overnight, along with some Pokébeans. When you wake up they should be done their training.

b) it takes a lot of time. You can use beans to make it a bit faster, but it still takes time and beans are necessary for upgrades, so you're better off keeping them.
Use the beans to upgrade Abeens to level three. You'll be swimming in beans, trust me.

c) they don't get evs there
d) the pokemon forget their moves there, so you have no control over your pokemon's moveset. Since the move relearner is only postgame, you're going to be stuck with those moves for a really long time.
... Yeah, can't argue with this.
 

mystic9899

Pokemon fan
isn't it revealed by gladion in the postgame that lusamine's obsession with ultra beasts stemmed from her desire to find her missing husband, professor mohn? if so then it's kinda sad since we can just see him anytime we want to with the press of a button.
 
I kinda want to shift this back to the theme of the thread.

So, what did people think was the funniest plot moment? My favourite moment has got to be when Hau points out to Faba that if Faba had remained with Lusamine then The Player, Hau and Gladion would be stuck anyway. Faba's reaction is golden.
 

clbgolden12

Alolan (and soon to be Galarian) trainer
isn't it revealed by gladion in the postgame that lusamine's obsession with ultra beasts stemmed from her desire to find her missing husband, professor mohn? if so then it's kinda sad since we can just see him anytime we want to with the press of a button.
Yeah. It's one of the reasons I really hope Sun and Moon get a sequel. It's so sad that Lillie, Gladion, and Lusamine think he's gone, when really he's just chilling on an island accepting Pokébeans from 11 year olds...

I kinda want to shift this back to the theme of the thread.

So, what did people think was the funniest plot moment? My favourite moment has got to be when Hau points out to Faba that if Faba had remained with Lusamine then The Player, Hau and Gladion would be stuck anyway. Faba's reaction is golden.
My favorite moment...

"Y'all are stupid!"

Nah, I have a lot of favorite moments. Mostly lines of Lillie, Hau, and Skull. :D
 
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Yeah. It's one of the reasons I really hope Sun and Moon get a sequel. It's so sad that Lillie, Gladion, and Lusamine think he's gone, when really he's just chilling on an island accepting Pokébeans from 11 year olds...

I found something the other day, actually. The Heahea City Information Centre knows about Poke Pelago, which has sparked my interest because I thought only the player and a couple of Aether grunts were meant to know about it...

But I do want a sequel.
 

mystic9899

Pokemon fan
it's really interesting how lusamine pretends to care about pokemon when she's actually just obsessed with ultra beasts. but her husband lives away from society in seclusion and spends his carefree life taking care of pokemon and making them happy.
 

BlitzGirl41

Well-Known Member
I kinda want to shift this back to the theme of the thread.

So, what did people think was the funniest plot moment? My favourite moment has got to be when Hau points out to Faba that if Faba had remained with Lusamine then The Player, Hau and Gladion would be stuck anyway. Faba's reaction is golden.

Funniest plot moment...? Hmm... Off the top of my head, without digging too much, I'd say it was every time Nebby would hop out of Lillie's bag without any of the characters realizing it at first. At first, I wasn't so interested in Lillie and saw Nebby as the cute little sidekick pet gag...but then I found myself chuckling every time it popped out with its little "arms" waving in the air (like it just don't care!). And Lillie's reaction every time, even if she has reasons to be concerned. Nebby doesn't care! XD
 

Kanethedragon

Veteran Pokegamer

Yeah, for me my favorite funny plot moments were all the time whenever you answered Hau's excitement by being a Killjoy. His expressions when you do are just so precious.
 

Bguy7

The Dragon Lord
So I'm finally finished all the story and post-game story, and ready to come back here without fear of spoilers. I must say, this game had without a doubt the best story of any main-series Pokemon game yet. At first I thought it was annoying being stopped every half a route or so for events, but the depth it added to the story was certainly worth it. I'll admit it wasn't quite perfect. While the story really excelled in giving character to Lillie, I felt like everyone else was kind of left in the dust. Both Hau and Gladion started off with what seemed to be strong character arcs, but both just kind of got shoved off in the end in favor of Lillie, especially Hau. Of course, that doesn't quite matter as much when Lillie alone had more character development than most characters in Pokemon combined. The game also did a good job of actually making the playable character feel like a participant in the events, rather than just an observer.

Despite all that, I do have one major disappointment about the story. What the heck happened to the post-game story? How could these games such a strong initial story, but then fail so badly in the post-game story. Both the Looker Quest in X and Y and Delta Episode were far better examples of a post-game story, and given the bar set by Sun and Moon's initial story, I thought we were going to get something far better than those, but instead we got a highly repetitive catch quest with very little actually story. How disappointing.

Yeah. It's one of the reasons I really hope Sun and Moon get a sequel. It's so sad that Lillie, Gladion, and Lusamine think he's gone, when really he's just chilling on an island accepting Pokébeans from 11 year olds...

I've never bothered to try PokePalego, so could someone explain this theory of Mohn being Lillie and Gladion's father to me?
 

Zoruagible

Lover of underrated characters
I kinda want to shift this back to the theme of the thread.

So, what did people think was the funniest plot moment? My favourite moment has got to be when Hau points out to Faba that if Faba had remained with Lusamine then The Player, Hau and Gladion would be stuck anyway. Faba's reaction is golden.

That definitely is my favorite line. It cracked me up when I read it and proves how stupid villain characters can be in games.
 

Tropios

':o Me is stinky??'
Despite all that, I do have one major disappointment about the story. What the heck happened to the post-game story? How could these games such a strong initial story, but then fail so badly in the post-game story. Both the Looker Quest in X and Y and Delta Episode were far better examples of a post-game story, and given the bar set by Sun and Moon's initial story, I thought we were going to get something far better than those, but instead we got a highly repetitive catch quest with very little actually story. How disappointing.

I actually thought the post-game story was quite good? It brought back an old frontier brain and expanded a lot on the lore surrounding the ultra beasts!

I've never bothered to try PokePalego, so could someone explain this theory of Mohn being Lillie and Gladion's father to me?
This line shocked me the most though. :p Why wouldn't you use poke pelago? I often turn on my 3DS for a few minutes just to check on it, it's really one of my favorite new features. Really useful too.
 

Bguy7

The Dragon Lord
I actually thought the post-game story was quite good? It brought back an old frontier brain and expanded a lot on the lore surrounding the ultra beasts!

It was cool seeing Anabel and Looker for sure, and it was certainly better than just running around randomly until all the Ultra Beasts were found, but if we're talking about it as a story, it just didn't work. It was essentially the exact same event repeated with minor variations five times over. We got a little bit of lore on the Ultra Beasts and a tiny sliver of character development for Looker and Nanu, but not much else. It wasn't so much a narrative like the Looker Quest and Delta Episode were, as it was a glorified event.

This line shocked me the most though. :p Why wouldn't you use poke pelago? I often turn on my 3DS for a few minutes just to check on it, it's really one of my favorite new features. Really useful too.

I honestly just haven't got around to it yet, as there's been so much other stuff to do. Now that I've pretty much done everything else the game has to offer, I'll try the side things like Pelago and the Battle Rayal.
 

Tropios

':o Me is stinky??'
It was cool seeing Anabel and Looker for sure, and it was certainly better than just running around randomly until all the Ultra Beasts were found, but if we're talking about it as a story, it just didn't work. It was essentially the exact same event repeated with minor variations five times over. We got a little bit of lore on the Ultra Beasts and a tiny sliver of character development for Looker and Nanu, but not much else. It wasn't so much a narrative like the Looker Quest and Delta Episode were, as it was a glorified event.

The looker quest was a really thin narrative though, I don't even really remember what it was about exactly, just that the errands weren't as fun.

Idk, the Ultra Beast quest worked for fine me.
 

Bguy7

The Dragon Lord
The looker quest was a really thin narrative though, I don't even really remember what it was about exactly, just that the errands weren't as fun.

Idk, the Ultra Beast quest worked for fine me.

It had a story all about Looker and Emma. I totally admit that it amounted to series of quests in the end, but it at least had a half decent narrative holding it together, unlike the Ultra Beast story. I totally admit it wasn't even that good, I just expected this Ultra Beast story to be better than it, and I personally don't think it was.
 

Emperor Empoleon

Honor of Kalos
I think this game's story suffers from having a bit too many things to cover, and I was worried about this during pre-release...There's a-lot of great world building and characterization, but none of the major story elements really get enough attention in my opinion. With the main antagonists for example. Its only in the post-game that we learn about the depth behind the Aether / Ultra Beast relationship, and how the influence of the Beasts reaches back into Alola's past and even the other dimensions of the Pokemon Universe. Lusamine's missing husband (where her tattered mental state started), the concept of Fallers, International Police dealing with the UBs ten years ago, the nature of each of the UBs introduced in this game, UBs attacking the OG Pokemon continuity, Ultra Wormholes resulting in both Z-Power and the Aura of Totem Pokemon...Like, where was any of this during the main game? It seems awfully important! To me this is where all of the intrigue is. I feel like the appearance of the UBs in this Universe could've easily been the plot of a game entirely by itself if focused upon. But instead, we have to deal with Team Skull, the construction of a new Pokemon League, and the Island Trials with a wee bit of Aether mixed (very disappointed that we only got one visit to Aether Paradise before they became hostile). And the Tapu...Do next to nothing. I won't say that the journey is messy, but it isn't as cohesive as it could be to me. I definitely enjoyed it, but I kind of wanted more out of it once I finished the Looker Episodes.
 
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Bguy7

The Dragon Lord
I think this game's story suffers from having a bit too many things to cover, and I was worried about this during pre-release...There's a-lot of great world building and characterization, but none of the major story elements really get enough attention in my opinion. With the main antagonists for example. Its only in the post-game that we learn about the depth behind the Aether / Ultra Beast relationship, and how the influence of the Beasts reaches back into Alola's past and even the other dimensions of the Pokemon Universe. Lusamine's missing husband (where her tattered mental state started), the concept of Fallers, International Police dealing with the UBs ten years ago, the nature of each of the UBs introduced in this game, UBs attacking the OG Pokemon continuity, Ultra Wormholes resulting in both Z-Power and the Aura of Totem Pokemon...Like, where was any of this during the main game? It seems awfully important! To me this is where all of the intrigue is. I feel like the appearance of the UBs in this Universe could've easily been the plot of a game entirely by itself if focused upon. But instead, we have to deal with Team Skull, the construction of a new Pokemon League, and the Island Trials with a wee bit of Aether mixed (very disappointed that we only got one visit to Aether Paradise before they became hostile). And the Tapu...Do next to nothing. I won't say that the journey is messy, but it isn't as cohesive as it could be to me. I definitely enjoyed it, but I kind of wanted more out of it once I finished the Looker Episodes.

I agree entirely. As great as the game was with its story, it was far from perfect. I have my fingers crossed for a third version that will iron out these kinks.
 
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