The Cleffa That Became a Star! (1172)

[Morax]

Spoiler

Lmao, flash apologists are a special breed of retards

 

[LazySpy]

Lmao, flash apologists are a special breed of retards

Aren't apologists of everything like this?

 

[Morax]

Aren't apologists of everything like this?

True true

 

[Soniman]

I mean if you're gonna pick apart episodes of the Pokémon anime with a fine tooth comb no one's gonna stop you, people "enjoy" the show in different ways I suppose. If people don't wanna see it that's what the ignore button is for (lord knows I've made liberal use of it since JN started airing), however.

A small moment but one that hurts the episode and Cynthia's characterization.

Cynthia is in the town longer than the boys, is researching on the potential mystery for longer, has more experience with myths/lore, but somehow Goh manages to instantly solve it within 10 minutes after arriving in the town from a vague description?

You're telling me that she's slower than a 10 y/o rookie?

Ignoring the fact Cynthia isn't a main character, Goh just happened to run into the girl who did all of this and Cynthia did not, it was luck more than anything they were just in the right place at the right time to met that girl and be told it was a Unown.

If I was Cynthia and I heard a town was shrouded in eternal night I probably wouldn't be investigating random children as possible causes

 

[LazySpy]

Ignoring the fact Cynthia isn't a main character, Goh just happened to run into the girl who did all of this and Cynthia did not, it was luck more than anything they were just in the right place at the right time to met that girl and be told it was a Unown.

If I was Cynthia and I heard a town was shrouded in eternal night I probably wouldn't be investigating random children as possible causes

I haven't seen the episode actually just yet, but her being a main character is not relevant to this discussion. In universe nobody is able to recognize that fact and act based on it, and prefferably whether someone's a main character shouldn't affect how they interact with the world.

 

[SerGoldenhandtheJust]

I haven't seen the episode actually just yet, but her being a main character is not relevant to this discussion. In universe nobody is able to recognize that fact and act based on it, and prefferably whether someone's a main character shouldn't affect how they interact with the world.

If you haven't even seen the episode yet why are you nitpicking over something that you don't even know is there in the episode....

 

[LazySpy]

If you haven't even seen the episode yet why are you nitpicking over something that you don't even know is there in the episode....

I don't? It's a comment on generall writing principles. I'd say the same about everything.

 

[Soniman]

I haven't seen the episode actually just yet, but her being a main character is not relevant to this discussion. In universe nobody is able to recognize that fact and act based on it, and prefferably whether someone's a main character shouldn't affect how they interact with the world.

Fair enough I'll concede that one but I'll stand by the rest is my argument

 

[LazySpy]

Fair enough I'll concede that one but I'll stand by the rest is my argument

Neat. I'll see the episode now. Hopefully it holds.

 

[LazySpy]

I enjoyed the episode. I liked Cynthia's strategy at the end and what the episode was going for thematically. I have some problems, though. Will maybe talk about them later.

Ignoring the fact Cynthia isn't a main character, Goh just happened to run into the girl who did all of this and Cynthia did not, it was luck more than anything they were just in the right place at the right time to met that girl and be told it was a Unown.

If I was Cynthia and I heard a town was shrouded in eternal night I probably wouldn't be investigating random children as possible causes

You are correct. Cynthia wouldn't investigate random children and running into the right person would be unlikelly. However it's worth remembering the girl's mother knows her child met a strange Pokemon. Given Cynthia's status as a champion and a person well-versed in Pokemon world's history and mythos, it would be reasonable to share this information with her. Especially, if Cynthia is present in the town to investigate this mystery specifically.

Spoiler

I also kinda disagree with what @Panky.. said about it damaging Cynthia's character. Thing is Cynthia was acting with the information available to her. She should have had more, like I just demonstrated but the fact she did not is not really to blame on her specifically.

 

[Dephender]

Fun little behind-the-scenes comment from Tomiyasu:

The truth is that Shirona really loves ice cream, and in earlier series she'd be standing in front of the store for an eternity, pondering what to order. The scene in episode 83, "The Py That Became a Star", where Shirona brings donuts was actually going to have a bit where she sits there for an eternity pondering which donut to eat in it as a callback to this, but it had to be cut for time (laughs). She's the Pokémon League Champion of the Sinnoh region, yet she's still a bit eccentric, and I think that's what makes her so cute. I hope we'll be able to depict that side of her eventually.

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

Couldn't they adapt the fact that she's a very messy person when it comes to her room.

I like how in Masters she's happy to be at a hotel where the room service actually cleans up her messes.

 

[Dephender]

Honestly, I feel like this comment speaks volumes about the surface-level approach to everything that's present all over PM2019. Tomiyasu goes on and on both here and in the Christmas Q&A about Shirona's sweet tooth being such an appealing part of her character... yet it's still a part that gets cut for time and treated as disposable. In DP, this aspect of the character was literally how we got introduced to her, here it's "something the executive director hopes they can include in an episode at some point". Characterization is being treated as an unnecessary bonus.
We saw this in the Omode interview about the Mawhip episode too, where she said she was happy she got to include Dande's poor sense of direction in the episode, since nobody else had shown that part of his character before.

 

[Deleted member 384931]

Honestly, I feel like this comment speaks volumes about the surface-level approach to everything that's present all over PM2019. Tomiyasu goes on and on both here and in the Christmas Q&A about Shirona's sweet tooth being such an appealing part of her character... yet it's still a part that gets cut for time and treated as disposable. In DP, this aspect of the character was literally how we got introduced to her, here it's "something the executive director hopes they can include in an episode at some point". Characterization is being treated as an unnecessary bonus.
We saw this in the Omode interview about the Mawhip episode too, where she said she was happy she got to include Dande's poor sense of direction in the episode, since nobody else had shown that part of his character before.

It is really sad. We just have to assume things from interviews and stuff, while we dont get to see the real thing. Dawn is also an example of this in Journeys . Little personality treats that make a character who they are, are forgotten or cut due time. It is more tell, but do not show. It is a sad fact

 

[masdog]

Honestly, I feel like this comment speaks volumes about the surface-level approach to everything that's present all over PM2019. Tomiyasu goes on and on both here and in the Christmas Q&A about Shirona's sweet tooth being such an appealing part of her character... yet it's still a part that gets cut for time and treated as disposable. In DP, this aspect of the character was literally how we got introduced to her, here it's "something the executive director hopes they can include in an episode at some point". Characterization is being treated as an unnecessary bonus.
We saw this in the Omode interview about the Mawhip episode too, where she said she was happy she got to include Dande's poor sense of direction in the episode, since nobody else had shown that part of his character before.

I'm usually pretty forgiving of JN (because its escapism), but this kind of ticks me off. I get that they try to fit everything into a single episode, and that means there are some compromises. But they couldn't find 30 seconds to cut or work in a character moment some other way?

The interview snippet kind of comes across as rubbing the characterization and continuity moments that are dropped from the episode in our face. "Yeah, we know we could write our continuity moments better, but we choose not to."

 

[Deleted member 384931]

I'm usually pretty forgiving of JN (because its escapism), but this kind of ticks me off. I get that they try to fit everything into a single episode, and that means there are some compromises. But they couldn't find 30 seconds to cut or work in a character moment some other way?

The interview snippet kind of comes across as rubbing the characterization and continuity moments that are dropped from the episode in our face. "Yeah, we know we could write our continuity moments better, but we choose not to."

They think that is the most basic continuity is good for pokemon fans. Tho they are wrong. Pokemon continuity has to have meaning, not bland references without reasons lol.

 

[Twilight-Kun]

"We somehow couldn't find the time for a character to do something amidst all the absolutely nothing happening for 90% of the episode. But we DID have time for several scenes of random nobodies remarking the same thing. That's too important to drop, obviously."

 

[Deleted member 384931]

"We somehow couldn't find the time for a character to do something amidst all the absolutely nothing happening for 90% of the episode. But we DID have time for several scenes of random nobodies remarking the same thing. That's too important to drop, obviously."

That is very very sad when you think about it. How deeper you look at how Journeys handles certain things, the sadder and weirder it gets. Like was it too hard to give Cynthia ice cream instead of Donuts?

 

[Remix2]

It is really sad. We just have to assume things from interviews and stuff, while we dont get to see the real thing. Dawn is also an example of this in Journeys . Little personality treats that make a character who they are, are forgotten or cut due time. It is more tell, but do not show. It is a sad fact

Sadly that classic tomiyasu writing style of tell don’t show,where we tell people how characters are growing when it show to not to be the case.
which have been a problem since sun and moon especially during the league build up.

 

[Remix2]

SM was still heavy on character based storytelling (helps that they dropped the CotD format in favor of recurring character). JN, a series that has a much smaller cast and is far more in need of it, hasn't had this outside of obligatory episodes where the showrunners throw them a bone.

I don’t know why JN drops the COTD and just have more recurring characters like every other anime.