Twilight-Kun
Pokemon World Champion
Then you don't know Ash as well as you say you do
Those were all pokemon that left to do their own thing away from Ash and he didn't try to force them to stay
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The Duo Splits Up!? Ash & Rotom (1041)
- Thread starter Serebii
- Start date
Those were all pokemon that left to do their own thing away from Ash and he didn't try to force them to stay
Sceptile Leaf Blade
Nighttime Guardian
Primeape left after what, four episodes? One capture episode, one release episode, one episode in which he considered using it but decided not to because Primeape didn't listen to him, and one episode where it didn't show up at all. Ash didn't even have time to grow to care about Primeape. And the rest of them left for reasons Ash could identify with and understood, most of them had their own families to go back to and/or something to protect. Rotom wanted to leave for a show Ash doesn't give a crap about with a couple of people Rotom just met, so his first response was to go into denial and get upset, he didn't understand Rotom's reasoning and felt like Rotom was just ditching him for something that (in Ash's mind) was not important. It is later on when he has had time to think about it and talked with Lillie that he decided how selfish he was being and he went on and apologised, and he was okay with Rotom leaving by the end. Rotom didn't leave, but that's not the point.
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Twilight-Kun
Pokemon World Champion
Except Ash was totally okay with it at first, which is said several times before the bombshell gets dropped, so...
Sceptile Leaf Blade
Nighttime Guardian
Because he didn't know about the Rotom leaving part, the part that was actually important for Ash. That's kind of vital information.
If there's one thing I kind of appreciate about this episode, it's that, as OOC as it was, it was at least a moment of Ash being flawed and frustrated, and being given a moment of solid empathy about it.
Let's face it, Ash didn't get a lick of sympathy in Kanto. If the same situation occurred with Misty he'd likely have got the usual chewing out "You're so selfish! Care about someone else for a change, you little jerk!" which likely would have only driven his defensive streak further. Even with his one acting up in XY, the premise seemed to be that empathy wouldn't work and tough love was the only way he'd learn. Same for the Lycanroc arc where, after repeatedly showing calmness towards Lycanroc's behaviour, when it's Ash's turn to act up, Lycanroc's first initiative is to knock some sense into him.
While he does get the facts justifiably laid out to him by Rotom, Lillie takes her time to empathise with Ash, comparing his situation to her own trials, and explaining how to go about things while still showing understanding towards his emotions (which makes valid sense given how Ash shown her the same level compassion during her down times). I think this is one element that makes the situation, still a badly conceived one, but at least not unbearably so due to execution. I'd have loved if Lillie consoled Ash over something far more characteristic of him.
It's annoying how many things this episode does well and yet revolves around such a HUGE blunder, and even that, as mentioned before, could have been circumvented pretty effectively.
Let's face it, Ash didn't get a lick of sympathy in Kanto. If the same situation occurred with Misty he'd likely have got the usual chewing out "You're so selfish! Care about someone else for a change, you little jerk!" which likely would have only driven his defensive streak further. Even with his one acting up in XY, the premise seemed to be that empathy wouldn't work and tough love was the only way he'd learn. Same for the Lycanroc arc where, after repeatedly showing calmness towards Lycanroc's behaviour, when it's Ash's turn to act up, Lycanroc's first initiative is to knock some sense into him.
While he does get the facts justifiably laid out to him by Rotom, Lillie takes her time to empathise with Ash, comparing his situation to her own trials, and explaining how to go about things while still showing understanding towards his emotions (which makes valid sense given how Ash shown her the same level compassion during her down times). I think this is one element that makes the situation, still a badly conceived one, but at least not unbearably so due to execution. I'd have loved if Lillie consoled Ash over something far more characteristic of him.
It's annoying how many things this episode does well and yet revolves around such a HUGE blunder, and even that, as mentioned before, could have been circumvented pretty effectively.
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Twilight-Kun
Pokemon World Champion
"Go do whatever makes you happy until it's inconvenient for me, then become my pokémon so I can keep you by my side for as long as I need you."
Yep, that sure sounds like a good guy and totally not a villain
Sceptile Leaf Blade
Nighttime Guardian
You're missing the point... I already said Ash was in the wrong on the previous page. And he's not a villain, he's a ten-year-old losing his temper, he got into a fight with Rotom over it, and made up later. There's a whole range of possibilities between good guys and villains.
Anyway, my point wasn't that Ash was in the right or anything like that, he wasn't. My point was that being in the wrong does not mean he's badly written. Ash is not a perfect moral beacon, he's a ten-year-old kid. Well-written characters, even protagonists, can and even should have flaws. My point was that him acting the way he did makes sense in the context of this situation.
It's one of those cases where you can see the writers had heartfelt intents (rather than just 'We need a quick plot, throw anything in'), but they haven't really thought the whole process through, which is ironic given the meta text at the start (wonder if that put-upon girl that made the script error was meant to represent Matsui). It feels like they keep prat falling slightly in trying to make Ash flawed in a serious way rather than just quirky and silly (it's also annoying because there are other characters who could use these vices as development stepping stones, there were hints to Mallow having a childish temper towards being unappreciated for example, and she needs that introspective a lot more than Ash does).
I kinda get that throughout the series they've tried to demonstrate that Ash is used to going about things his way, just this is for a process in his travels he's gotten used to MANY MANY time over by now, and is even guilty of himself. The AF arc was a better case of demonstrating Ash having a shrewdly thoughtless side from how one track he usually is (and he also maintains his developed maturity in the matter by quickly catching himself on it).
Even the new opening titles established a secretly broken side to Ash in spite of how lighthearted he is on the outside. Maybe this is alluding to something in the long run.
I kinda get that throughout the series they've tried to demonstrate that Ash is used to going about things his way, just this is for a process in his travels he's gotten used to MANY MANY time over by now, and is even guilty of himself. The AF arc was a better case of demonstrating Ash having a shrewdly thoughtless side from how one track he usually is (and he also maintains his developed maturity in the matter by quickly catching himself on it).
Even the new opening titles established a secretly broken side to Ash in spite of how lighthearted he is on the outside. Maybe this is alluding to something in the long run.
Satomine Night
The Power of Z!
For starteres, I want to give Rica Matsumoto kudos for the way she voiced Ash in this episode, and the animators kudos for the great facial expressions. Ash's emotions came through really well in this episode.
IMHO, Ash's reaction to Rotom leaving to film the detective show was understandable. He was extremely upset at the idea of a good friend leaving him, and the fact that, in his mind, Rotom was more than happy to leave him just for the sake of filming a TV show just made him more upset. Yes, Ash has let Pokémon go before, but there always a sense of regret on the Pokémon's part. Rotom, on the other hand, seemed to be making excuses as to why it was okay for it to leave, and then lashed out at Ash. Ash simply lashed out in return.
Was Ash being a hypocrite? Maybe. But Rotom's arguing with him didn't help the situation. To me, this seemed like two friends lashing out at each other. To be honest, Rotom's enthusiasm at joining the Alolan Detective Laki cast seemed more like a fanatic fan's reaction at the chance to be alongside his favorite TV star, than the reaction of someone for whom this was truly a dream. Rotom was caught up in the moment, without really thinking about the consequences. And in fact, Rotom realized being a TV star wasn't its dream, which is why it chose to stay with Ash in the end.
What was a little out of character was Ash holding a grudge, rather than realizing on his own what a jerk he had been. However, that grudge led to Lillie's talk with him, and really, that was the highlight of the episode. It was so nice to see Lillie, whom Ash has encouraged so much throughout the series, encourage Ash for a change, by empathizing with him and sharing her own personal experiences with her workaholic mother.
IMHO, Ash's reaction to Rotom leaving to film the detective show was understandable. He was extremely upset at the idea of a good friend leaving him, and the fact that, in his mind, Rotom was more than happy to leave him just for the sake of filming a TV show just made him more upset. Yes, Ash has let Pokémon go before, but there always a sense of regret on the Pokémon's part. Rotom, on the other hand, seemed to be making excuses as to why it was okay for it to leave, and then lashed out at Ash. Ash simply lashed out in return.
Was Ash being a hypocrite? Maybe. But Rotom's arguing with him didn't help the situation. To me, this seemed like two friends lashing out at each other. To be honest, Rotom's enthusiasm at joining the Alolan Detective Laki cast seemed more like a fanatic fan's reaction at the chance to be alongside his favorite TV star, than the reaction of someone for whom this was truly a dream. Rotom was caught up in the moment, without really thinking about the consequences. And in fact, Rotom realized being a TV star wasn't its dream, which is why it chose to stay with Ash in the end.
What was a little out of character was Ash holding a grudge, rather than realizing on his own what a jerk he had been. However, that grudge led to Lillie's talk with him, and really, that was the highlight of the episode. It was so nice to see Lillie, whom Ash has encouraged so much throughout the series, encourage Ash for a change, by empathizing with him and sharing her own personal experiences with her workaholic mother.
Except the director made the decision not to take filming overseas after Rotom had decided not to join the cast. Initially, the director said filming would be overseas for at least six months, perhaps longer if the episodes were popular enough. So, as far as Ash and Rotom knew, their separation would be a long one.
I think it was kept ambiguous when Rotom found out, maybe he had in fact found out before but made his decision regardless due to the aforementioned reasons and realising Ash did ultimately consider his wishes first, which may if anything make it more heartwarming.
I like the role Laki played, knowing Rotom had doubts and wanting him to guide him the right way, even if he didn't get a co star as a result. It also meant Rotom didn't come as guilt tripped out of his dreams since whether that was his true desire was actually directly put into question.
As said despite the awkward breach of character with Ash, it felt like it was for purpose of heartfelt storytelling, not just them going by the quick 'protagonist screws up any old way and learns things' formula, especially since Ash was in character in nearly every other regard, listening calmly to Lillie and even before then seemed to be realising his mistake. I'm fine with it so long as it doesn't become a habit to make Ash an OOC jerk for the sake of a quick plot (you're through two seasons now SM, you can make it).
I also kinda liked the extra depth of showing Lillie was coming to understand her mother's actions, if anything I could argue they could have made an episode about that, since in the AF arc Lillie still seemed pretty standoffish about this approach.
Sceptile Leaf Blade
Nighttime Guardian
In the Drampa episode it was stated that Lillie went shopping with her mother. I can imagine their in-depth talk was somewhere around that time period. I believe that Lusamine getting Lillie involved in the Ultra Guardians also helped heal that relationship, it was the first time Lusamine showed genuine trust and faith in Lillie instead of treating her like a baby. And Lusamine going shopping with Lillie also shows Lusamine learned from her mistakes and is spending more time with her daughter. Lusamine also came to watch the school play a couple of episodes ago. It's been in the background, but Lusamine changing her ways towards Lillie has been shown several times.
Vipsoccermaster
Well-Known Member
Fine episode, but this one just felt out there and sort of forgettable. Ash and Rotom, stick to what your true dreams are!
As for the Eevee short, it was awesome, having Eevee play with Pikachu and the others for fun. Seems that by the end, Eevee already misses them.
As for the Eevee short, it was awesome, having Eevee play with Pikachu and the others for fun. Seems that by the end, Eevee already misses them.
OnceUponATime
Wicked
While it maybe wasn't the most enjoyable episode to watch in my opinion, I think the character arcs in it were interesting. Ash lashing out is something we don't see too often, and here it felt pretty natural. He didn't initially realize he would be losing Rotom, after all. Having Lillie actually say something along the lines of "Ash, let's talk" was really mature and I appreciated that. I loved their conversation together and Lillie talking about having to live away from her mother. For me personally, Rotom can be forgettable, so this episode was nice in the fact that I got to see Ash and Rotom's bond considering I usually don't think about it. I'm glad the detective wasn't angry that Rotom decided last minute not to leave with him, lol.
The Eevee segment was cute. I loved that it bonded with Pikachu and all of the others, leading to its imminent capture. It fits in so well with all of them. Also, there's something about Tsareena holding Charjabug in this segment that made me crack up. Not sure why but it was kind of funny to see, lol.
The Eevee segment was cute. I loved that it bonded with Pikachu and all of the others, leading to its imminent capture. It fits in so well with all of them. Also, there's something about Tsareena holding Charjabug in this segment that made me crack up. Not sure why but it was kind of funny to see, lol.
Bguy7
The Dragon Lord
Well, I do like it when they do Rotomdex episodes. I'm not really sure why we don't get those more often. Though, I do wish they would do one that wasn't focused on Alolan Detective Loche(?)
Anyways, not really sure how to feel about this episode. I like that fact that they had Ash show some emotion and get some character focus, but at the same time it just seemed so out of character. He's let so many of his Pokémon leave to do their own thing because that's what they wanted to do. He even once let Pikachu go, as much as it hurt him to do so (but it came back anyways). Why should Rotom be any different? Same could be said for any of his human friends. He never refused to let Brock or Misty leave to do what they wanted to do. I appreciate the attempt to write Ash in an emotional way, but it could have been handled better.
Anyways, not really sure how to feel about this episode. I like that fact that they had Ash show some emotion and get some character focus, but at the same time it just seemed so out of character. He's let so many of his Pokémon leave to do their own thing because that's what they wanted to do. He even once let Pikachu go, as much as it hurt him to do so (but it came back anyways). Why should Rotom be any different? Same could be said for any of his human friends. He never refused to let Brock or Misty leave to do what they wanted to do. I appreciate the attempt to write Ash in an emotional way, but it could have been handled better.
Sceptile Leaf Blade
Nighttime Guardian
When the Dutch dub is half a year behind the Japanese... Gioia Parijs seems to change her interpretation of Lillie in this episode. A bit of an accent to her performance as Lillie, very proper, like someone coming from high class. But without a trace of looking down at others. That accent hasn't been there in her performance up until this episode. It'll probably take a while to get used to it, but I can't say it's unsuitable for her, I think it suits her character and background. Too bad it took them this long to get that interpretation. I don't blame Parijs, she's only 12 now, she was 9 when she was cast as Lillie.
Soaring Pikachu
Cool Trainer
The drama intensifies when the gang hears that Rotom might be going away. I thought it was kind of funny and realistic that the thought of being separated did not hit Rotom immediately. Then once they both realize what the news could mean Rotom declares something like "You never caught me, I can do what I want!" to this, Ash responds that he will just have to catch Rotom and begins throwing poke balls! Ash's efforts to capture the Rotomdex are unsuccessful but I thought this was a really nice scene. Kind of like a friendship moment and we do not know how the conclusion might play out when Rotom is offered such a big opportunity.