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The Eighth Wonder of the Sinnoh World! (647)

Almighty Zard

He has returned.
.This battle was pretty bland until Luxray was summoned. I didn't care for Dr. Electivire's repetitive attack pattern, and Jolteon and Torterra could have benefited from maybe a bit more screentime (although if they didn't have enough time for those two, what makes you people believe they could have crammed Raichu into this thing?), but the battle really took an upswing at Pikachu vs. Luxray.

To each thier own it seems, I rather enjoyed watching Pikachu and Electrivire fight because like Jaun's gym battle he accidently gave the opponent a helping hand, but then quickly rectified it with Static, and I loved watching the big pokemon trip over itself trying to strike Pikachu. Funny enough all Electrivire did was use Fire and Ice Punch, kinda sad it didn't bust out any electrical moves.

This wasn't quite as good as Clair's or Juan's battles, although I think Maylene was the only gym battle this saga that did hold a candle to those.

I disagree to an extent, Clair was definitely handled better, Jaun on the other hand I always saw as rediculious. I mean ok sure the battle format of the gym was ok and Swellow stood out more than the others but what happened to Grovyle was rather pathetic (almost as pathetic as what happened to Torterra...coincidence?) and i'm inclined to believe Pikachu paralyzing Electrivire and Iron Tailing it in the face for the kill more believable than lifting a water pokemon that is ten times it size with those tiny arms and being able to throw it over it's head into water and then suddenly ko it after it kept healing itself repeatedly.
 

wind21

Well-Known Member
My first impresssion was that this gym battle was not that good. But you know, the more I watch it, the more I like it. Luxray was pretty cool. And the lights turning off so that Infernape could light up the room was a neat touch.

I'm glad Raichu was not used, since Volkner and Flint are supposed to be/have been rivals. If Flint's Infernape can tear apart Ash's team, then Raichu should have comparable power. I'm sure that's not the reason why Raichu was not used, but it makes things a little more believable for me.
 

TheNewGuy

Well-Known Member
What a good battle. Not quite worth the wait but nothing would have been: it was as good as I could have realistically hoped.

And man, I love the orchestral Sinnoh Gym Leader remix thing. Played when Infernape was first battling Luxray, brilliant and fit really well. Think I heard GSC rival music as well. Really great music, good ep.

Oh yeah and gif request: DAT SMILE (from Infernape) Almost as good as Jack Bauer's in the 24 finale. It's like "uh-oh, stuff is going to get burned now".
 
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thunderblade12

Well-Known Member
Well at least something came out of Infernape starring again. It learned to control Blaze. Now hopefully that's the end of it until Ash vs Paul. It's official up to Johto-era Charizard in the annoyingness meter. I don't begrudge Infernape this gym, I just wish Staraptor or someone got to star against Candice rather than Chimchar. It got two wins in all four of Ash's previous gym battles and starred in three of them.
 

uber gon

Accept Change
At least the D/P saga let Pikachu beat some form of Elekid. Hope we'll see him beat an Electabuzz.
 
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Kazuki Mirai

Well-Known Member
Dawn in her cheerleader outfit. When was the last time we saw that?

Man, Torterra is pwned terribly. Though he scored a hit even if it didn't seem to hurt Electivire much. Well, they did acknowledge that it's part ground-type here from the dialogue. But hey, we get to see him again, right?

Is Ice Punch and Fire Punch the only moves it has? Where's the good ol' Thunderpunch?

Ah, Static. Then Iron Tail. Just like how Norman's Vigorath was defeated.

And Infernape makes short work of Jolteon.

Infernape still knows Dig? Dang. I can't remember the time when Ash ever have two Pokemon on his team that knows the same moves.

Oh! You know what that means when the anime's opening plays! It's time to kick butt!

Probably not the best gym battle there is but it's still great to watch.
 

Skwog

PurpleHaze
Too bad Gible wasn't used. It would have been nice to see him be utilized. Hopefully he will be in the league :D

It was nice seeing Motor Drive being used. I laughed so hard watching Electivire running around in the background.
 
Hopefully this marks that Infernape has mastered its Blaze, though its convenient how when they mentioned the past times Blaze happened, they failed to remember the one time during the full battle between Ash and Paul that he didn't go out of control.

Monferno didn't activated Blaze in full battle, it was its battle spirit to keep fighting.

On Topic: Two things I hated about this battle:
1. Ash was going to use Torterra(as he was holding the Pokeball since the start) no matter what Pokemon Volkner chooses.
2. Torterra used two times in a row. Thats coming from a trainers whose two Pokemon had Overheat as a move. He should have known that it works best first time.

There is more to this episode than catches the eyes.
Now we know what the trust thing that Ash has been saying all the Sinnoh. Infernape is coming towards him in blazing fury but he has faith in the ape and stands there knowing that all his training has worked at last. I would have liked to see Paul in here but maybe he will learn his lesson in the league.
Infernape and Ash are nearly of same size.
One thing to notice in last four gyms: Chimmy\Infernape gets a win then gym leader chooses a powerful Pokemon so Ash recalls the monkey but the replacement Pokemon also goes down making way for the ape to come back in battle to beat the same Pokemon.
 

streetlightdsb

Uni hiatus
Well. Still a bit disappointed about Torterra, but Pikachu beating one of the Electabuzz line, Jolteon getting roofed (XD) and Infernape not going out of control saved it for me. Again, it was annoying that Infernape starred and got 2 kills again, but actually watching the battle made it ok... Anyone else think that Pikachu's loss against Luxray was a bit forced? It hit it with like 3 Iron Tails before it blocks with one Thunder Fang last minute. I'll agree with the Discharge KO, but it seems like Thunder Fang shouldn't have matched Iron Tail in those circumstances.

Also, TR saved Infernape! If they hadn't turned out the lights then he probably would have been KO'd by Thunderfang when it was on the floor.

Overall, I'd put this battle at third of the saga, after Maylene then Roark. IMO it's also better than against Juan.
 

thunderblade12

Well-Known Member
In all but three of the Sinnoh gym battles someone's lost without getting a single win.

Maylene: Chimchar
Fantina: Pikachu
Byron: Buizel
Candice: Gliscor
Volkner: Torterra

At least they're being fair about it. It wasn't the same pokemon twice. The only ones that didn't suffer this fate is the badass bird and Aipom(even in Dawn's gym battle.) Gible doesn't count for obvious reasons.


I don't get why people are whining about the overuse of Pikachu's Iron Tail. Against Electivire, electric attacks would have been a hindrance if anything.

From the looks of things, the Sinnoh League is gonna be a OHKO-fest just like the previous two. Ash vs Gary and Ash vs Katie were the biggest offenders.
 

TheNewGuy

Well-Known Member
Well at least something came out of Infernape starring again. It learned to control Blaze. Now hopefully that's the end of it until Ash vs Paul. It's official up to Johto-era Charizard in the annoyingness meter. I don't begrudge Infernape this gym, I just wish Staraptor or someone got to star against Candice rather than Chimchar. It got two wins in all four of Ash's previous gym battles and starred in three of them.

Chimchar starring against Candice made sense though, particularly because of the 4x advantage over Snover/Abomasnow.
 

thunderblade12

Well-Known Member
Well yeah, but type isn't everything. I would have much rather seen Abomasnow vs Staraptor. That way it would have been a showdown between two physically powerful pokemon, each with a type disadvantage against the other. So it would have come down to which has the most strength and endurance.
 

cauldronmaster

Well-Known Member
My opinions on the battle.

Torterra being the dead weight pokemon is understandable when the following are taken into consideration.

Looking at Ash's sinnoh team (Including Gilscor and Gible), Torterra, along with Staraptor and Infernape, are the only ones that have yet to play that role in any relevant battle (vs gym leaders and significant recuring characters). Not only that, pikachu, who played dead weight against Fantina, fought in just as few gyms as torterra.

Unlike swellow, staraptor does not have the ability to sponge electric attacks. The writers have no need to empazise a "flying vs electric = poor matchup" point so that rules it out.

Infernape was shown to activate blaze. It would be conpletely anticlimatic if it were KO'ed in that state as that would complicate the blaze plot even further that it already is.

Each pokemon getting a KO (no dead weight pokes) would make this battle a generic KO fest, which in turn would have undermined the gym reputation as the toughest gym in sinnoh. In addition, the writers given time constraints were too small to allow for a substitution fest (ie. Ash vs Paul @ Lake Acuity), so someone had to be KO'ed. And Torterra was their only option.

Other than that:

Music played (GSC rival theme and RBY champion theme are always epic, as was the Cerulean city theme. The OP theme, which was the first time it was played outside of previews and the OP itself, complimented its scene perfectly.)

Pikachu KO'ing Electivire is a huge plus, not only for the fact that it's his first win against a member of the electabuzz family, but also for that fact that he won by brute force, a rare sight for pikachu, who is usually portrayed as a hit and run pokemon.

Eh, given the time constraints of the battle, the writers couldn't have done much with jolteon. At least they emphasized the power of its thunderbolt (so the ape wouldn't leave the battle unscathed).

Luxray's voice actor did an excellent job of portraying its ferocity, specifically when executing thunder fang.

Blaze plot was epic for reasons already stated, as was its aftermath. I suspect that the reason the writers closed the blaze plot now, rather than vs Paul in the league, is that in the latter (vs Paul in the league), they could have Infernape learn a new move then, though the only move I can see it learning is flare blitz.

The only correctable problem with this episode is the excess TR screentime, but this has been an ongoing problem for years, so ranting about it would be pointless.

I'll finish with this note: PUSA better not screw up the blaze scene, specifically when Infernape approaches Ash.

9/10
 

NES

Flip me to the side!
Very fun episode. The battle was great, Infernape was a bit overpowered, but still the match was good =).

Lol poor Dawn, she is going to be a cheerleader for the whole league.
 

jolteonjak

*swoons for Noland*
I feel like this gym battle could have been better. For starters 2 episodes, more Pokemon please. Torterra is further proof Ash cannot handle a tank. I don't care how weak to Ice it is, anyone using a Torterra should have been able to take out anything in that gym.

Pikachu finally got a win against the bane of its existence, the Electibuzz family. And to the person who commented on Luxray having Intimidate, while that may be possible, Luxray did just use Thunder Fang. It flnched.

Infernape...damn it had to have severly injured that Luxray. I imagine 3rd degree burns along its body. I think it will murder the Pokemon of Paul's that activates its Blaze. That thing is super scary. =\
 

shac

Well-Known Member
The more I watch this episode, the more I like it. The moment when Ash calls for Infernape and it gives that crazy smirk, and the saikodu (or whatever it's called) music starts playing is just too epic. I can't remember getting such chilled since 'charizard chills!'. Ash does have a way with fully evolved fire starters, doesn't he? I can't wait for Infernape to meet Charizard. I bet Charizard would get superiority complex - well, he won't, but would be cool if he did. He has advantage over Infernape though - being flying type and all.

I am surprised that none has that Ash n Infernape in we-won-whee-around moment in gif in their sig. already. I wish I knew how to make one. Any kindhearted people up for making me one? Please??

Oh, can't wait for Paul to meet this crazy Infernape.....Infernape, Mortar final showdown! Epic, Epic, Epic!!!
 

Dax

Legend
Looking at Ash's sinnoh team (Including Gilscor and Gible), Torterra, along with Staraptor and Infernape, are the only ones that have yet to play that role in any relevant battle (vs gym leaders and significant recuring characters).

Chimchar was the "dead weight" against Maylene.
 

cauldronmaster

Well-Known Member
^yeah, i realized that i forgot about a couple of battles (that and vs wake, where turtwig was actually the dead weight poke)

Still, if torterra didn't play dead weight, it would've been pikachu. In that case, instead of ranting about Ash's "inability to handle a tank" (despite the fact that he showed it vs candice, but thats another story), the fandom would be ranting about Ash "not training his starter."

Besides, I'm sure torterra will get its fair share of wins come the league.
 
I disagree to an extent, Clair was definitely handled better, Jaun on the other hand I always saw as rediculious. I mean ok sure the battle format of the gym was ok and Swellow stood out more than the others but what happened to Grovyle was rather pathetic (almost as pathetic as what happened to Torterra...coincidence?) and i'm inclined to believe Pikachu paralyzing Electrivire and Iron Tailing it in the face for the kill more believable than lifting a water pokemon that is ten times it size with those tiny arms and being able to throw it over it's head into water and then suddenly ko it after it kept healing itself repeatedly.

Although I might sound nerdy but I can explain it using Physics. Pikachu used Law of conservation of energy and momentum in there. Pikachu used all its momentum from running and converted it into energy to lift and then throw Milotic. Circus people use this same law to do some tricks of moving heavy objects.
Writers don't usually use their mind but when they do, bu when they do, they include so much stuff in there which is beyond a normal person imagination. But I guess writers deserve some respect in there.
With that said its obvious that Juan's gym battle was as good as Claire's gym battle.

Lol poor Dawn, she is going to be a cheerleader for the whole league.

Thats the least she can do. Either she can sit back like May or cheer for Ash to gain screen time. You can't expect her to be like Misty and help Ash by providing information on type advantage and all.

The more I watch this episode, the more I like it. The moment when Ash calls for Infernape and it gives that crazy smirk, and the saikodu (or whatever it's called) music starts playing is just too epic. I can't remember getting such chilled since 'charizard chills!'. Ash does have a way with fully evolved fire starters, doesn't he? I can't wait for Infernape to meet Charizard. I bet Charizard would get superiority complex - well, he won't, but would be cool if he did. He has advantage over Infernape though - being flying type and all.

At last one person besides me who feels that gym battle was awesome. I guess all that Infernape hatred had effect on people mind.
 
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