~The Golden Summit!~

[Shiny Venusaur]

for god sakes SMOGON ISNT LAW, just cause smogon says it doesnt mean its true, if they told you guys Weedle was OU i bet half of you would agree just cause smogon said it

 

[-Discord-]

Manaphy's Tier Status / Uber Metagame Discussion - Palkia

for god sakes SMOGON IS LAW, just cause smogon says it doesnt mean its true, if they told you guys Weedle was OU i bet half of you would agree just cause smogon said it

Then obviously it was said because Weedle had good stats, and movepool. You don't have to agree with them, but if you're playing standards, it really is an awesome source of info.

BTW, Manaphy is Uber no matter what anyone says. It has 3 real counters, and none of the three are common AT ALL. These counters are Ludi, Raikou, and CMBliss. Who the **ck uses ANY of those? Manaphy has great moves, no matter how limited it's movepool. It has wonderful stats as well, and an ability that's broken with good support. This thing breaks OU.

Ubers

Discuss Uber metagame.

Intro: I've been disappointed how underrated the Uber metagame is. The pokemon there are awesome, it's a fast paced metagame, where even the walls have a crap time trying to hold off stuff. I know some stuff about Ubers(too bad I don't predict in Ubers, heh, while I can predict fine in OU lol)

One thing I wanted to note, Palkia is a BEAST. With Kyogre's Rain support, this eats teams alive, and with it's 100 Base Speed and 150 Sp.Atk, it outspeeds many Ubers and bangs them hard with a Triple STAB Surf(Specs, Rain, STAB), or a Double Stab Space Break(Spacial Rend). Lustrous Orb works awesomely too. Life Orb is another viable item choice for Sp.Sweeping Palkia.

 

[Expert Evan]

Misc.

for god sakes SMOGON IS LAW, just cause smogon says it doesnt mean its true, if they told you guys Weedle was OU i bet half of you would agree just cause smogon said it

Well anyways, I think your opponent is anxiously awaiting to battle you. Hope you're all ready.

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Ubers

Then obviously it was said because Weedle had good stats, and movepool. You don't have to agree with them, but if you're playing standards, it really is an awesome source of info.

BTW, Manaphy is Uber no matter what anyone says. It has 3 real counters, and none of the three are common AT ALL. These counters are Ludi, Raikou, and CMBliss. Who the **ck uses ANY of those? Manaphy has great moves, no matter how limited it's movepool. It has wonderful stats as well, and an ability that's broken with good support. This thing breaks OU.

Ubers

Discuss Uber metagame.

Intro: I've been disappointed how underrated the Uber metagame is. The pokemon there are awesome, it's a fast paced metagame, where even the walls have a crap time trying to hold off stuff. I know some stuff about Ubers(too bad I don't predict in Ubers, heh, while I can predict fine in OU lol)

One thing I wanted to note, Palkia is a BEAST. With Kyogre's Rain support, this eats teams alive, and with it's 100 Base Speed and 150 Sp.Atk, it outspeeds many Ubers and bangs them hard with a Triple STAB Surf(Specs, Rain, STAB), or a Double Stab Space Break(Spacial Rend). Lustrous Orb works awesomely too. Life Orb is another viable item choice for Sp.Sweeping Palkia.

Yep, but I would go for lustrous orb so it 2hko's bliss with waterfall and has a non recoil life orb on three of his moves. Uhmm... I have a ES arceus and damn, that thing pwns all after 1/2 SD's.

Kyogre is also a great poke with CScarf, it has a double STAB 150 pwr atk move and 3hko's bliss. Also outspeeds 1 DD Rayquaza and OHKO's back. Is also Metagross resist and can Ohko back, w00t. The only problem is his health, Water Spout is only good if Kyogre has full HP, if Kyogre had wish support of some sort I could stay great.

Giratina is one of the best walls in Uber play. Too bad it hasn't got a good recovery move, It can roar, WoW and CM, too bad it's weak to dragon.

Lugia, I think, is the best wall excisting. It has recover, one of the best recovery moves. Pressure, wich PP stalls the opp. to death. Whirlwind, the better version of roar. It can CM, has huge speed and learn reflect/light screen, best wall IMO. Also has the best CH move.

Then we have Deoxys, the best attacking stats ingame. Attacking Deoxys has Superpower, to deal with Bliss, Psycho boost, to outclass Jumpmence with LO, Boltbeam and can be a great revenge killer. Even in OU if spd Deoxys is going to be allowed there. Personally I hate LG Deoxys, it just doesn't have to HP to wall/tank. But for a wall/tank it has the best movepool ingame.

Groudon, IMO, sucks in DP with Palkia/Kyogre combo outclassing it.

Mew, the best BP'er ever, I think it should stay that way, it just can't survive any other way in Ubers.

Mewtwo, it's a great Sp. sweeper that can OHKO bliss with Selfdestruct, wich is great. It can CM, boltbeam and use flamethrower. It also has recover.

Ho-oH is the same story as mew IMO, isn't good enough to sweep and get's OHKO'd by Kyogre/Palkia. Can work with groudon but will get problems when Kyogre comes in again to counter those two.

Lati@s, great movepool but get walled by every bliss. Can't wall because of all the dragon and get outclassed alot. Between Uber and OU IMO.

Dialga, stupid dragon that has no support in Ubers and is outclassed by two pokes: Palkia and Rayquaza.

Manaphy, ahhh, the non-uber if you believe Thunderhero. It has great stats and can Tail Glow. With it's ability all the status effects will be healed, this means it can Tail glow and use rest as a full recovery move if you use Kyogre. Has great type coverage in Ubers and <3 with salac, xD. It also gets Double STAB because of the rain.

Darkrai, the best ability together with it's moves. It can work in double battle with dark void/protect, but is a great status'er and counter Lugia and Giratina, 2 of the three main walls in Uber play. It can calm mind if you're afraid of Aura Sphere Mewtwo, but with Sub. you're fine anyway. Focus Punch counters blissey, that way it's kind of a "Uber metagame counter". This is one of my favourites, if I just could get a good one... ;_;

Well, don't list to Thunderhero AKA Shinyvenasaur. I'm sure all of the Smogon staff together with 3/4 of Smogon is smarter than him and has tested Manaphy a lot more to come to this conclusion.

Well, that's it, wait! We forgot one poke! Arceus. Well, it's everything, a dragon counter, a sweeper (all types), a SD'er with xtreme speed (my favorite!!!), a great wall, you name it!

Now, that's all, if you find something that should be added, tell me. Just PM for a Uber battle on Shoddy!

 

[-Discord-]

Yep, but I would go for lustrous orb so it 2hko's bliss with waterfall and has a non recoil life on three of his moves. Uhmm... I have a ES arceus and damn, that thing pwns all after 1/2 SD's.

I certainly agree with Lustrous Orb on Parukia, as it allows it greater versatility.

Yes, SD ES Normal Silk Scarf Arceus IS amazing in every way imaginable.

Kyogre is also a great poke with CS, it has a double STAB 150 pwr atk move and 3hko's bliss. Also outspeeds 1 DD Rayquaza and OHKO's back. Is also Metagross resist and can Ohko back, w00t. The only problem is his health, Water Spout is only good if Kyogre has full HP, if Kyogre had wish support of some sort I could stay great.

CSOgre is great and all, but it's just far too common and predictable. Also, if you want a good Wisher in Ubers, no joke, Latias is what you're looking for, really.

Giratina is one of the best walls in Uber play. Too bad it hasn't got a good recovery move, It can roar, WoW and CM, too bad it's weak to dragon.

Dragon, Ice, Ghost, and Dark happen to be some of the most common attack types in Ubers, and Gira is weak to all of them, eww. Too bad it's the only REAL ES Arceus counter in the entire game and everything.

Lugia, I think, is the best wall excisting. It has recover, one of the best recovery moves. Pressure, wich PP stalls the opp. to death. Whirlwind, the better version of roar. It can CM, has huge speed and learn reflect/light screen, best wall IMO. Also have the best CH move.

Lugia is far too underrated since Giratina popped it's ugly head into the Uber metagame.

Then we have Deoxys, the best attacking stats ingame. Attacking Deoxys has Superpower, to deal with Bliss, Psycho boost, to outclass Jumpmence with LO, Boltbeam and can be a great revenge killer. Even in OU if spd Deoxys is going to be allowed there. Personally I hate LG Deoxys, it just doesn't have to HP to wall/tank. But for a wall/tank it has the best movepool ingame.

I somewhat agree, and it would be incredible if CB Bullet Punch Meta wasn't such a popular fad. Mewtwo is still superior to Deoxys-F though.

Groudon, IMO, sucks in DP with Palkia/Kyogre combo outclassing it.

Groudon never "sucked" and it honestly never will, especially when nothing switches into it very safely. Lugia is the only pokemon who doesn't really care about switching in, and it's not very much used anymore.

Mew, the best BP'er ever, I think it should stay that way, it just can't survive any other way in Ubers.

It's really the only thing Mew really CAN do in Ubers, despite it's massive movepool and awesome stats.

Mewtwo, it's a great Sp. sweeper that can OHKO bliss with Selfdestruct, wich is great. It can CM, boltbeam and use flamethrower. It also has recover.

Yeah, pretty much, but generally people don't use SD on it as much, and tend to use Aura Sphere which can't even 2HKO.

Ho-oH is the same story as mew IMO, isn't good enough to sweep and get's OHKO'd by Kyogre/Palkia. Can work with groudon but will get problems when Kyogre comes in again to counter those two.

Meh, I have mixed feelings on Ho-oh, personally I dislike the hell out of it.

Lati@s, great movepool but get walled by every bliss. Can't wall because of all the dragon and get outclassed alot. Between Uber and OU IMO.

I don't see how cm/safeguard/dpulse/cm lati@s gets walled by bliss at all, and this is one of the standard sets. Also Latias is great. It stops Parukia and Kyogre cold. Latias is only 3hko'ed by water spout, and it rapes kyogre with grass knot/light screen. Latias gets hit for lol damage by Parukia's Surf, and then OHKO's with Dragon Pulse. As far as I'm concerned, and most uber players out there, Latias is a great asset. Latios is okay too, but it doesn't have that sexy 130 Base S.Def.

Dialga, stupid dragon that has no support in Ubers and is outclassed by two pokes: Palkia and Rayquaza.

Lol, you totally overlooked it's amazing walling options, it makes for an amazing STer, and has awesome resists.

Manaphy, ahhh, the non-uber if you believe Thunderhero. It has great stats and can Tail Glow. With it's ability all the status effects will be healed, this means it can Tail glow and use rest as a full recovery move if you use Kyogre. Has great type coverage in Ubers and <3 with salac, xD. It also gets Double STAB because of the rain.

Meh, partial on Manaphy, everyone who tries to abuse Manaphy in Ubers utterly fails, and it has sh** for s.def, because 100 simply doesn't cut it in a predominantly special based metagame. Also being outsped by a load of things doesn't help either.

Darkrai, the best ability together with it's moves. It can work in double battle with dark void/protect, but is a great status'er and counter Lugia and Giratina, 2 of the three main walls in Uber play. It can calm mind if you're afraid of Aura Sphere Mewtwo, but with Sub. you're fine anyway. Focus Punch counters blissey, that way it's kind of a "Uber metagame counter". This is one of my favourites, if I just could get a good one... ;_;

Heh, Darkrai really is a gem in the Uber metagame. Personally I don't use the Sub set, I use the mix set: FPunch, Thunder, DV, DP. I don't even need sub for blissey seeing that everyone just switches it straight in anyway. =/

Well, don't list to Thunderhero AKA Shinyvenasaur. I'm sure all of the Smogon staff together with 3/4 of Smogon is smarter than him and has tested Manaphy a lot more to come to this conclusion.

Lol.

Well, that's it, wait! We forgot one poke! Arceus. Well, it's everything, a dragon counter, a sweeper (all types), a SD'er with xtreme speed (my favorite!!!), a great wall, you name it!

The question should really be, what can't it do amazingly? 720 BSTotal is wow, 120 in all, and an INCREDIBLE movepool and perfect typing(any lol) is really godly(no pun intended).

Now, that's all, if you find something that should be added, tell me. Just PM for a Uber battle on Shoddy!

Commented. And when I reinstall SB I'll be sure to challenge you to Ubers and OU.

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Ubers

Commented. And when I reinstall SB I'll be sure to challenge you to Ubers and OU.

Yeah, but lugia whirlwinds latis away. Manaphy CAN be used with calm mind. And I just hate Dialga, it's fugly and slow, and since I never liked support (stupid huh) I won't use it anyway. And yes, latis get 1/2HKO'd by ice beam Kyogre/Palkia. I just don't know a good spread for Lati's. ohhh, I'll maybe use latias for wish

Edit: groudon is just not good in Ubers cuz Kyogres are too common and water kills fire, not viceversa. (and for all that don't know: groudon is ground, just ground.) I like groudon, I'll just never use it in DP.

 

[-Discord-]

Yeah, but lugia whirlwinds latis away. Manaphy CAN be used with calm mind. And I just hate Dialga, it's fugly and slow, and since I never liked support (stupid huh) I won't use it anyway. And yes, latis get 1/2HKO'd by ice beam Kyogre/Palkia. I just don't know a good spread for Lati's. ohhh, I'll maybe use latias for wish

Edit: groudon is just not good in Ubers cuz Kyogres are too common and water kills fire, not viceversa. (and for all that don't know: groudon is ground, just ground.) I like groudon, I'll just never use it in DP.

At the bolded part: Lol are you kidding, Latias with Soul Dew is barely 3hko'd by parukia's lustrous orb/life orb ice beam, and i'm sure specs is a 3hko. Sh**, Spacial Rend is only a 2HKO . =/

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Latias

At the bolded part: Lol are you kidding, Latias with Soul Dew is barely 3hko'd by parukia's lustrous orb/life orb ice beam, and i'm sure specs is a 3hko. Sh**, Spacial Rend is only a 2HKO . =/

Srry, didn't take soul dew in account. But I just got a great latios, the boltbeam set, it's great. I also got a double flawless TIMID darkrai, gonna change it to the "lucius" set. Cuz it's Voldemort ATM. I think that isn't working with timid. BTW, the omly counter to darkrai is Giratina if darkrai isn't CM'd up. It'll roar it away unless it has taunt.

Uhmmm. I meant CS, and spacial rend is better. Then WITHOUT soul dew it's a 2HKO. BTW, CM bliss still counters. 'The great about them is that latias will have 450 sp def and 525 sp atk, hehe. One CM and it beats specsmence Draco meteor big time.

 

[-Discord-]

Meh, I still find Latias' best set to be GK/DPulse/LS/Wish, but it's because the support does wonders for me.

Also, I got 4-2'ed(server fu**ed up) by Fighting_Master lol.

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Meh, I still find Latias' best set to be GK/DPulse/LS/Wish, but it's because the support does wonders for me.

Also, I got 4-2'ed(server fu**ed up) by Fighting_Master lol.

i'm sure it does. I use CM and recover ibstead of wish and ls

 

[-Discord-]

So exactly what set do you use? boltbeam/cm/recover?

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Latias

So exactly what set do you use? boltbeam/cm/recover?

GK
CM
recover
Dragon Pulse

More offensive, but doesn't really support the team. Destroys Kyogre and Groudon BTW

 

[-Discord-]

That also beats Palkia, which is possibly more important at this point. That works fine.

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Yeah, great huh, I just have to balance my team since I have to much sweepers for Uber play.

 

[-Discord-]

Are you on shoddybattle, because I'm going to go on now, and I'd like to battle you in an OU battle. My name is Discord+, and yours is SC right?

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Yes it is, BTW, I'll use a try-out team, just for fun k?

 

[-Discord-]

Fine with me.

 

[Pokemonger49777]

Ev spreads

i need an ev spread and moveset for electivire, magmortar, skarmory (PLZ), and if it ain't pushing it, regigigas.

Also, I just got my final Gold BF symbol, so I will never have to play my old emerald again. I have to say, the Factory was the hardest because of the constant legendaries used by the opponent. But now the only reason I play my emerald is because It's the best pokemon game for ev training.

 

[Shiny Venusaur]

Manaphy

for everyone who's saying manaphy is uber please read this


http://www.pldh.net/pldhforums/viewtopic.php?t=6531&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

 

[Shiny Crobat]

Stop it, Manaphy is Uber

for everyone who's saying manaphy is uber please read this


http://www.pldh.net/pldhforums/viewtopic.php?t=6531&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Who said it was one moveset? His ability, movepool and moves together make it a great poke. Smogon took over 4 months to make the tier list, please stop making links with dumb people saying manaphy isn't Uber. Manaphy is Uber, it can survive better than mew in the Uber metagame so please stop, you don't have ANY good arguments why it should not be Uber.

Smogon is the most competetive pokemon site in the world, I'm sure people like Surgo, Misty or Jumpman are alot smarter than you.