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The Marketplace Wanderer, Litten! (950)

Discussion in 'Pokémon the Series: Sun & Moon' started by Serebii, Dec 15, 2016.

  1. SkittleBox

    SkittleBox Fanfiction writer

    Wow, I really thought he would catch Litten this episode. I guess we'll have to keep waiting, then.
    LilligantLewis likes this.
  2. Xenon Blue

    Xenon Blue No Hard Feelings

    I called it lol, I'm actually happy Litten didn't get caught right now. He will probably get some more screen time before getting caught.
  3. dman_dustin

    dman_dustin Well-Known Member

    Given the trends that Pokemon HAS broken for, maybe I was wrong to assume the starters would be on the main cast.

    Ash has bonded with Pokemon that he didn't capture, or are we going to ignore that for the sake of arguing with me at least in the tone (there's nothing in the episode that supports it).

    Hippopotas for example, the Butterfree from Decolore Islands.

    Let's not have Litten's starter status interfere what was likely a one off character Pokemon, showing it off for the sake of showing it off.

    We don't even have proof that it will show up later in the series, and the opening and intro could be there JUST because it is a starter so at least it has something.

    If a title mentions Litten again, fine, I'll be wrong but there was absolutely NO NEED to treat Litten like trash (as in a Pokemon that is so distorted, they actually have to go to great lengths just for it to be caught), they wrote themselves in a very stupid position that should NEVER be done to a starter. Again this is WHOLLY detrimental to the Litten species as a whole as well as a capture as Ash. Litten needs to grow and develop WITH Ash, there's no point in developing Litten as a wild Pokemon maybe evolving into Torracat and then maybe Ash catches it at some point, or Ash catching an Incineroar.

    The episode would've only been good if Ash captured Litten, but the writers chose to write it in a way that Ash might as well capture a completely different Litten, since this Litten obviously has TOO MUCH baggage making the bonding ultimately pointless.
  4. Lord Trollbias

    Lord Trollbias Y'all Salty Bishes

    How did they treat Litten like trash? Because Ash didn't catch it right away? Stop overreacting just because Ash didn't capture it on its first focus episode. There is literally NO RUSH right now for Ash to catch it. No Gym he has to make it to in a certain time frame and he just caught Rowlet. Let him develop the owl first and bond some more with Litten while Litten also develops in its own as well. Its obvious Litten was written with so much baggage so it could........resolve it before it ends up getting captured so as to give it a character arc pre-capture.
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2016
  5. PikaWaltz

    PikaWaltz Dancing Pikachu

    I actually really enjoyed this episode! The fact that the SM writers really seem to be trying to shake things up and subvert expectations is great. This anime does have a tendency to be repetitive, so I like it when the writers try to take certain parts in a different direction. I wouldn't have minded of Ash had caught Litten, of course, I was even expecting and looking forward to it. But the twist was a pleasant surprise, and I feel like it added more depth to Litten's character. He was established as being a self-sufficient, lone Pokemon who's first concern is Stoutland, who seems to be sick? My understanding of Japanese is very limited :)p), so I don't know if he was sick or old or injured, but he didn't seem to be in good health. Litten having a nightmare about Stoutland dying was really sad, and you could tell from that and just how happy he was whenever he would bring a small piece of food for Stoutland that he's really important to him. With all of that established, it wouldn't really have made sense for Ash to catch Litten, at least not yet.

    But I don't think that makes this episode a filler or useless, it's setting up Litten's character, his relation to Ash and Stoutland, and it's setting up an arc. I doubt this is the last we'll see of Litten, and, IMO, I think it's great the writers have decided to develop this story more and have things happen gradually, rather than just do your run-off-the-mill "Stubborn Pokemon doesn't like Ash at first, Ash is really nice to it, Pokemon changes mind, Ash gets Pokemon at the end" episode that we usually get all the time. It's great the writers want to elaborate on the stories and try new things! :)

    As for Ash, this is just my personal opinion, but I honestly feel like SM Ash is the most in character rendition of him we've had in a long time. He's temperamental, he's emotional, he gets overly excited and "acts first, thinks later". But he's also a competent Pokemon trainer, skilled battler, and doesn't even hesitate to jump in front of Stoutland, a Pokemon he's only met moments before, to take an attack from Alolan Persian to protect him. And then just smiles it off even though he's covered in scratches. :p

    I loved the scene where Ash tried to help Litten in the beginning, when he gets attacked by the Persian, and how persistent he was even though Litten kept biting and scratching him, haha :p It was cute, and pretty heartwarming. Especially since he was originally still mad at him for stealing his sandwich(?). Pikachu trying to convince Litten to go with Ash was pretty adorable too.

    And then the Cone of Shame hahaha. I thought that was pretty funny. It was cute how Ash was telling Litten he looked cool, despite Litten looking obviously displeased. :p And the scene where Ash puts Litten in his lap to sleep at night was so nice. (Professor Kukui falling asleep in the middle of working and drooling on his books was kinda funny, too :p)

    I also didn't mind the TRio only having a small role this episode, that's great! I almost thought it was them in the mansion at the end of the episode, but it was cool that the Alolan Persian ended up being the main antagonist (What was his deal though? Why was he so obsessed with bullying poor Litten? :p).
    The fact they only made a small appearance was a nice change of pace, and I think it's good that they don't have to be causing trouble every single episode.

    All in all, I personally thought this was a pretty good episode. I'm really enjoying SM so far ^^
    LilligantLewis likes this.
  6. Captain America X

    Captain America X Well-Known Member

    Ash has bonded with Pokemom he never captured but has the anime ever let a starter pokemon to not be captured and be on the main cast or are you gonna ignore that just so you can spend your timw whinning how your favourite starter was not immedietly captured and treated like "trash". And speaking of trash...

    How in the world was Litten treated like trash again?Because it wasn't captured straight away?Because they want to develop it as a wild pokemon first and then let Ash capture it later?All I see is pointless and stupid whining that makes no sense.

    They should make Ash capture a different Litten.Wow your so smart dude they should definitely go through all the trouble of creating a brand new Pokemon instead of using the one they have spent developing a relationship with Ash .

    I guess the writers wanting to try things a little differently is too hard for some people to understand.Maybe they ahould have just made Litten the fire starter abused by his trainer who Ash catches.That is much better I guess.
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2016
    LilligantLewis likes this.
  7. AuraChannelerChris

    AuraChannelerChris "Am I supposed to laugh?"

    You all told me Litten was going to get caught. Why would you predict a lie to me.

    I guess they're trying to have a slow bonding experience for Ash? This better not be an extended Iris-like episode.



    Holy crud, he's ugly.
  8. 345ash-greninja

    345ash-greninja Prince Of Balbadd

    Ash will most probably catch Litten I think, there were a lot of hints in this episode. But well, I was really disappointed that he didn't catch Litten in this episode. Litten, please don't be another Sandile!
  9. phanpycross

    phanpycross God-king

    I found it weird that Ash was mad at Litten when every episode of S&M has had him abused by pokemon, without taking issue. I found that part inconsistant...

    But I guess you could be overly malicious and strawman me.
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2016
  10. Ominous Wind

    Ominous Wind Well-Known Member

    I'm not even mad Ash didn't catch Litten because I think their friendship scenes were cute.
  11. dman_dustin

    dman_dustin Well-Known Member

    By treating it like it wasn't an actual starter but a convenience Pokemon. Rowlet and Popplio got focus by being with a trainer, while Litten only got focus for the sake of it being a starter, and it conveniently matches some random narrative. Litten's focus is now MORE than other starters at the whim and convenience of the writers rather than an obligation. There is no need for Ash to capture a Litten at all. Give him Alolan Marowak if he needs a fire type.

    Yes there is, IT IS A STARTER.

    Ash technically didn't need to take on those gyms within a certain timeframe it was all at the writers choice, if it was feasible, they could easily make every gym one year apart (52 episodes) if they had the time and money, and with no gyms, probably very few obvious battles, NOW more than ever do the writers have to rely on actual episodes to develop a Pokemon, which means the sooner they get caught the better. Litten isn't going to have the convenience of GYM BATTLES to grow and develop.

    And? Ash caught Fletchling the episode AFTER he obtained Froakie. By this episode in Unova Ash had all 3 starters and Pidove. 4th generation Turtwig and Starly. 3rd generation Taillow and Treecko, 1st generation he had Pidgeotto and Butterfree.

    2nd generation was the one and only one he only had 1 Johto Pokemon by the 10th episode, AKA Heracross, but when it actually focused on the starters (wild) then Ash ends up catching Chikorita.

    With a series that doesn't have gym battles, and most of the development has to be in the actual episodes they choose to write, Ash should've had his 2nd capture by now.

    Then Ash needs to get a Litten that doesn't have as much baggage. There was nothing saying that Kukui could've taken care of the Stoutland while Ash was developing Litten.

    Now it seems that Litten would only bother being caught when Stoutland dies, NOT exactly what I think Ash should deal with. Maybe he can comfort Litten and that's why Ash would catch it, but it shouldn't have been a story to begin with.

    And that's it on the subject, disagree with me all you want, fine, but this was a complete waste of an episode for the sake of "Showcasing" Litten. If Rowlet's development was so vitally important, then this episode should've been about Ash training or developing with Rowlet. Not a non capture episode. I find it rather disgusting that this wild Litten got so much MORE focus than Rowlet who was actually caught.

    But I guess Rowlet has the benefit of developing WITH Ash. To turn that lesser focus it got into focus comparable to Litten's.

    But I don't know maybe I am wrong about something, Litten wasn't treated like trash (character-wise), it has more going for it than Rowlet, which was caught for.....what the sake of Ash catching an Alola Pokemon? As long as Rowlet continually is being used as a backpack gag, it'll make me always wonder why Ash caught Rowlet and not Litten, since Litten and Ash had an obviously deeper connection. Am I really to believe Rowlet was caught just because it imprinted on Ash, in a lesser focus episode but NOT Litten?

    Ash can get "gag" Pokemon easily but it takes forever for Ash to catch a Pokemon that actually got development?

    And no, I'm not ignoring Rowlet's upcoming battle, but honestly maybe THAT episode should've came first. Perhaps they shouldn't have thrusted Litten into our laps the way they did so early without any actual benefit.

    It pretended to like him then stole his food, and clawed him, of course he was mad.

    Ash has been angry at Pokemon before. Not out of character.
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2016
  12. Janovy

    Janovy Banned

    Why are you upset about the writers actually bothering to write an organic capture?

    It would be OOC for Litten to suddenly start liking Ash and decide to join it.
  13. Soniman

    Soniman Break the Limit

    I guess he just brushed off the prior instances as his own fault (though he was annoyed enough at Grubbin to chase it into the woods so...) wheras Litten stole his food even after he offered

    Lulz I was responding to Locormus' sweeping generalization of how "SM Ash hasn't acted like Ash at all!1" dude, I'm not sure how you got that impression when I specifically quoted his post
  14. Red and Blue

    Red and Blue Well-Known Member

    Another SM= DP 2.0 comparison. Ash didn't get the fire starter right away, lol.
  15. phanpycross

    phanpycross God-king

    Ahh, alright. The post was weirdly structured.
    I partially agree.

    This way of handling things is more interesting, but I dont think Litten liking Ash would have been inorganic. He did care for it when it was hurt, and save it's master.
  16. DatsRight

    DatsRight Well-Known Member

    Ash has been attacked by unruly Pokemon, but not in a conniving way. Litten pretended to be his friend then attacked him when it got what it wanted. It's an interesting play on accepting some Pokemon won't want to be his friend, because this one is far more persistent about it, given all Ash does for it in this episode and it still acts like complete ******* to him. The nearest to a similar comparison was that loaned Hoot Hoot that would only be nice to Misty all the way in the Johto series.

    It would make sense to be a bit jarring given we just had a series where Ash was near completely infallible in temper. As long as they don't overdo it, I think this works fine for Ash, he's had a few times this series personalities have clashed but when things get serious or he sees the whole situation, he gets over it, as shown here the moment he sees Litten with the Stoutland and understands the bond immediately.

    I'm not too bothered about no capture or big conclusion, since Litten has thus far been a recurring Pokemon and will continue appearing and likely developing throughout the series. It can still have a pay off, though I hope Litten does end up far more likeable by the end of it.

    Oh and the Team Rocket cameo didn't bug me. The relaxed motto variation was funny (hey, at least it's a humorous different animation, we've rarely seen those since DP). Having a Pokemon as the main antagonist instead was an interesting change in formula, even if it admittedly played more or less the exact same role (except less effectively because the rescue didn't even gain Litten's respect). Wonder how TR evaded Bewear so long though. So is it capturing them constantly or just rescuing them whenever they're in trouble and bringing them back to 'home base' or what?

    The animation seemed a bit choppy this episode though, like rarely a scene the characters moved more than five frames per second. That walk from the Persian seemed like it was supposed to be some cocky strut, but instead just looked like someone kept pausing the video.
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2016
  17. dman_dustin

    dman_dustin Well-Known Member

    Because they didn't do it with Rowlet and Ash actually caught it.

    Oh sort of like how they WROTE the episode THAT way? I could've done without the dying Stoutland plot. Or as I said, wait until this episode actually has merit rather than coming off as "Well we HAVE to do something with Litten"
  18. Daniel31

    Daniel31 HopingGaryReturns

    So this episode was ok, had a couple funny moments, like Litten kicking away Rotomdex in the beginning and then its scan later at the Pokemon center thinking it was a Heliolisk I guess lol. I still like the fact that Ash will always stick up for other Pokemon, I was glad to see Pikachu hit the Persian with a Thunderbolt. TRio's 1 min of screentime was a complete waste also, didn't really see the point of them being around after watching this episode.

    I really didn't mind that Ash didn't capture Litten also. I think Litten will eventually join Ash like most people have said already, either because Stoutland will tell it to, or something will happen to it (Litten's dream) and it'll have no choice but to go with Ash, who's knows when that'll happen though.
  19. Janovy

    Janovy Banned

    Apples and oranges.

    Rowlet and Litten have a completely different personality. For Rowlet it makes sense to fall for Ash easily. Litten...not so much.
  20. dman_dustin

    dman_dustin Well-Known Member

    I wasn't referring to their personalities I was referring to the "development"

    Rowlet has a pretty poor development with Ash ends up getting caught. Litten and Ash "bonded deeply" but was NOT caught.

    Rowlet only went with Ash because Ash saved it and then fed it? Meanwhile Ash saved and helped Litten throughout the episode and nothing happened as a result of it. And Litten was just as cold towards Ash as the beginning of it.

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