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Thoughts on the Alola League?

Ignition

We are so back Zygardebros
Now that the final episode of the Japanese dub for the AL arc has aired, what are you thoughts on it? What did you (dis)like about it? What was your favorite battle/moment?

Can we try keep the comparisons between XY and SM to an absolute minimum? Both Leagues had highs and lows + comparing the two just leads to pointless fighting from both sides?
 

TheWanderingMist

Paladin of the Snow Queen
It was perfect except for the Jessie and James battle. Also, the Hau battle decision should have been interrupted before actually being called over.
 

Revolver Furious Dragon

Well-Known Member
Overall one of the worst. Ranked with unova in my opinion because it had such an unsatisfactory conclusion.

There were some good moments but the ending spoiled things completely for me
 

IkeBayern

Well-Known Member
First of all thank you for telling people not to make any comparisons because it’s so annoying to see threads close all the time because people get mad and insult each other over a foolish cartoon that the writers already planned out months in advance..

We should enjoy each series for what it had to offer and even if criticism is necessary, let’s keep it civil and reasonable

Anyways this league was quite memorable in its own way, it started off slow but ended on such a high note.. I am glad that it’s finally over though, 16 league episodes that lasted about 4 months.. This was a pretty good summer but it’s time to look forward to the new series of Pokémon!

Now for the positives:

Obviously since this is the tournament where Ash finally broke the curse and won, it’s a big positive.. Seeing Pokémon and non-Pokémon fans come together like to celebrate a 10 year olds victory was very nice and it reminded me why we love this show..

Yea there are fans that will always never be satisfied but honestly Alain was stronger in that match and he beat Ash fairly.. It still was a missed opportunity

Ash and Kukui’s full battle was iconic, Torracat winning and evolving after beating its main rival was fantastic.. I’m actually happy that they decided to pay homage to the games this time..

Tapu Koko vs Pikachu was magical and Ash’s other Pokémon managed to get a W on their record. Glad that they gave us this battle, as the animation was executed well and the music was top notch!

His battle vs Guzma in the semifinals was pretty good, it made Guzma realize that he was such a coward and needed to get his act together.. I liked seeing Lana and Primarina happy when they saw that Guzma lost...

Talking about Guzma, his ruthlessness was a breath of fresh air and I think he has a future as a legit Pokémon trainer if he ever chose to leave Alola.. How he pummeled Lana was a sight to see, she just couldn’t handle him!

Ash’s classmates managed to get some focus and development in this league and even if they weren’t portrayed as competent battlers, they managed to learn something by the time they got eliminated..

Negatives:

How they treated Hau was horrendous considering the fact that he was your main rival in the games. I would’ve loved to see more of his Pokémon from the games be used in the anime..

I was annoyed with the whole Rowlet sleeping gag at first but I felt more sorry for Hau because Ash didn’t really beat him properly imo and it kinda hurt to see him cry at the end.. PokeVAR at work lol

- Ash and Kiawe should’ve battled at the Pokémon League instead of Ash and Faba.. That was probably the worst first round battle I’ve seen ever, they made Faba look like an actual joke

- Gladion should’ve faced Faba and beaten him for revenge at Athear Paradise, would’ve loved to see him filled with rage as he destroys Faba.. His tournament path was too easy and imo he wasn’t challenged until he had to face Ash

- The Manalo Conference tournament itself was pretty lackluster until the end with all the 1vs1 battles, the Battle Royale round was rushed but I give them credit for the originality..

- The first round was a 1v1, BUT the QF and SF should’ve been a 3vs3 and the final round should’ve been a Full Battle like they did with the exhibition match..

I feel that more people would’ve been hyped for a potential Ash victory if we got a full battle instead.. I would’ve loved to see Ash vs Gladion be remembered as one of the most memorable full battles ever..

- The Team Rocket match was pretty disappointing, they hyped that battle up all week before it aired and it flopped massively..

Overall I will say that the Manalo Conference would be ranked somewhere right in the middle, it was very memorable but the quality of the league lacked in some parts, too many Single Battles imo..

It was better than Unova, Kanto, Hoenn and possibly Johto but not on the level of Kalos and Sinnoh.. I enjoyed the fact that they didn’t rush this league, as it compensated for the lack of battles in the S&M series..

While this isn’t a positive or negative, I would’ve liked to see Ash use some of his reserve Pokémon to signal his intent that he was serious and planning on winning the league just like he did in Sinnoh..

I can only give it a 7 at best.. Good league that finished strong after a slow start, certain tweaks here and there could’ve propelled this league into all-time status..
 

IkeBayern

Well-Known Member
While this isn’t related to your post I’d just like to point out here that Ash has managed to face and beat different types of rivals throughout his time as the protagonist of the Pokémon anime!

Childhood friend: Gary
Arrogant rival: Paul
Mentor/parent figure: Kukui
Someone that wanted to surpass Ash: Sawyer
Edgelord: Gladion
Nice guy: Hau
 

Frozocrone

Miraculous!
Pros:
- Ash won
- Pikachu confirmed GOAT
- A variety of trainers/strategies on display
- Classmates strictly not fodder material
- Showed every battle
- Arguably one of Ash's strongest teams in the fact that it's balanced across the board with no obvious weakling being carried

Cons:
- Hau's battle was the biggest troll
- Jessie/James battle
- Sort of turned into a Z-move spam fest at points
- Some characters not utilised well in anime and as a result, had potential outcome development hindered

Overall: Good league in my books.
 

DatsRight

Well-Known Member
It was pretty good for a try at a different approach. It didn't live up to the prestige of some of the best conventional leagues, but I get the idea that if they'd broken the formula earlier for some of them it wouldn't be as glaring. Everyone got a role and some attempt at character development, even the guys who got screwed over earlier in the series felt like they got some degree of a decent payoff. This is not the fruits of the series' arc development, this is them still continuing it in full force.

I liked they didn't try any cheap tricks with the less experienced trainers, they did as well as they were expected to and lost quickly in. It's not really attacking, it's just in fairness not what they trained for the whole series. Mallow knows as much about battling as Ash does cooking. Only Lana and Sophocles got maybe an overhaul to make them look more competent, though they at least bothered to establish them as training their Pokemon hard beforehand and the strategy of their battles still had their progression make sense. Kiawe actually got a good position, only really underwhelmed by how well Ash did this time round. I admit even just bringing him into the league would have been a nice gimmick, especially since his battle run was probably the most consistent in it.

Ash got power boosts throughout the league, though they made the right choice to have them before or after matches, not have them save the match for him. There's a curious attempt to give a lot of his Pokemon a 'crash course' to make up for being discarded previously. Torracat didn't get a lot of official battles beforehand but now very much feels like he got a decent run, his contribution to the later league matches was that impressive. Even Melmetal feels pretty memorable despite appearing so late in the series. They really did try to give everyone a fair shot here, no 'jobbers' or spotlight hogs in the team this time. Lycanroc is the nearest to being sidelined, and even that is balanced tremendously by winning the final for Ash.

What is interesting is how fleetingly it plays Ash's accomplishments here, that he got much further than any previous league but it's still the ride that's most integral here. Ash can win and the world is still turning, which in hindsight, after six regions of failure and make it seem like it was impossible, isn't a bad way to go about it.

The Alola League I think really directs its tastes the same way SM's entire series has, aiming more for fun character driven layout over a professional goal development heavy approach. I do think Ash vs Kukui did make up for the lack of full intense battles beforehand though, while still focusing a lot on characterisation.
 
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TheNewGuy

Well-Known Member
Ash won, then had maybe the series' best ever battle afterwards.

Previously I expressed concern, saying that the battle where Ash won the league should be among the series' best ever and Ash/Gladion really, really wasn't (it was fine, but maybe not even in the series' top 10). But now I see they merely saved the best for last.

Ash winning twice, making the series culturally relevant - even if only for a day - and the Kukui battle put it over Unova, Kanto and Hoenn. Maybe Johto too. Against the odds, and after a rough start, it ended up being one of the best leagues. It delivered two of the anime's seminal moments (Ash d. Gladion and the Pikachu/Tapu finale), and they were both executed either well or exceptionally well.
 
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AuraChannelerChris

Easygoing Luxray.
It was a horrible slog of a league. I know we all always wanted a long league, but this one was ridiculous, especially since a bunch of people who didn't honestly have any business battling were seen battling.

The Kalos League was 7 episodes. This one? 17.

I guess it was too much asking for an entertaining long league like the Johto League was.
 

Red and Blue

Well-Known Member
A slog at times like Aurachannelerchris mentioned but the final two battles were well worth the wait.

The only true mark against it was Ash vs. Hau
 

SerGoldenhandtheJust

Deluded Dreamer
It was amazing. I LOVED how every battle was shown unlike other leagues and I loved how characters developed. That guzma plot was golden. Nobody got BS wins they deserved their losses and victories. The only fight that turned me off was Jessie James but it wasn't too offending like BW or kanto lol. The hau battle unpopularly didn't bother me, it just made me happy how they **** on the Kanto league lol. I loved the finals. And the kukui battle was splendid. It was satisfying to see and I love how ash is unstoppable in alola. He deserved that win. Finally.

Overall my league rankings are
DP>Johto>SM>XY>hoenn>BW>Kanto
(While XY had good animated battles it just skipped alot and the end result was very stupid. Also I hate how Meowth defeated Pikachu in hoenn that is so stupid and I'm surprised not many speak of it)
 

Revolver Furious Dragon

Well-Known Member
For me the ranking would go

Sinnoh - johto - hoenn - kanto - alola - unova

Never saw much of xy so can't really place it's league
 

Soniman

Break the Limit
Pretty mediocre but had a incredible finale. Give it the edge to Kanto, Unova, and maybe Kalos but no further
 

JustAStatistic

Super Casual Trainer
I think the only part I straight up disliked was the Ash vs Hau fake-out. The league by itself was on par with Johto, but the Kukui fight catapults it past Hoenn and Kalos and just shy of Sinnoh.

Sinnoh >= Alola > Kalos >= Hoenn > Johto > Unova
 

VoltTacklingPika

Well-Known Member
It was a slow burn, but once it caught fire, it exploded. Intentional or otherwise, the league picked up momentum as it went on, culminating in some truly memorable moments, which I think is exactly what you want for something which spanned so many episodes.

The early slowness can be attributed to open nature of the tournament and the decision to show every match. As anyone could compete, there was a build-up of characters who, while recognisable, were not very significant to the story. Each of these characters then got a match. Whereas past season have skipped to the conclusion of early battles, SM decided to give them full matches, albeit mercifully short ones. The benefit of this was that it gave the weaker battlers such as Lillie, Mallow and Sophocles an opportunity to do something and have a moment when they otherwise would not have. The downside is that if you're not enamoured or invested in these characters, it's going to feel like a slog. The 1v1 format seemed to be a compromise between giving these characters a chance while also keeping things as breezy as possible.

What I appreciated the most about the league was that everyone got a chance to shine. This was especially notable with Ash's team. Meltan gets a win, evolves and contributes in the final and exhibition match; Rowlet defeats Decidueye; Naganadel got a strong showing in the last two matches; Lycanroc overcame Gladion's Lycanroc to win Ash the trophy; Torracat defeats its rival Incineroar and evolves; and Pikachu defeats Tapu Koko, who had beaten it twice in the serious before then. Nobody felt underused or sidelined. At the same time, nobody felt more special than the others, either. The league should be a crowning moment for Ash's Pokemon, and this one delivered on this front.

Ultimately, the whole league was elevated by Ash's victories. He defeats Guzma, the supposedly unbeatable trainer. Then he defeats Gladion, who had won every battle between them beforehand. Then he even beats Kukui and Tapu Koko, the so-called strongest combination of all of Alola. Kukui even remarks how Ash grew stronger as the tournament went on. We're so used to tournaments ending on a downer that all of this was an amazing surprise.

There were some smaller things the league did well, too. Ash's friends were more interesting to watch in the crowd than in previous seasons, because they had a level of investment and expression than went beyond them. Ash's reaction to winning those big matches were nice, too. The shock he actually won the final vs Gladion, and then the exhausted contentedness after defeating Kukui were better choices to me than raw elation. Also, plus points for having Delia there to see her boy finally win the big one.

As a showcase of battling, there have been stronger leagues. The battles throughout were simplistic, with little strategy deployed beyond using the strongest attacks available. Even Ash vs Kukui lacked that strategic element to it, despite being an extremely fun spectacle otherwise. I thought this was the league's biggest downside.
 
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shoz999

Back when Tigers used to smoke.
It was alright. I give it a 3 out of 5 knocked out Ash-Greninjas with a Blast Burn seal of approval.
 

DatsRight

Well-Known Member
I feel like the Alola league is something they could only do in SM's premise, where the legendary/mythical Pokemon are extremely chill and more direct with humans. Having loads of them would have felt ridiculous in a previous league, the likes of Tobias were already a mockery, but here having them as 'guest' contestants fits perfectly with their sporting attitude to the civilisation they guard.

I also feel like this was perhaps the best series to utilise a full victory for Ash, largely because of how damn character driven it was. His and the others' reactions and banter throughout the entire thing made it feel like a proper fun journey to get invested in rather than a formal quota call. I also feel like, while it wasn't the best display for his team strategy wise, it was agency wise, it did feel like all his and his Pokemon's quirks were put on full display for these battles.
 
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