Thoughts on the Masters 8/PWC as a whole?

[Sham]

Something I do not understand, was what was the point of even including the Champions in this? And if they had to, why did they include the losers? If Ash was going to battle Cynthia, Steven and Leon then they could've easily excluded Lance, Iris, Alain and Diantha. It's especially jarring since none of Diantha's battles were even suppose to be animated. Are you saying somehow the Champions were "mandated" to be there but only three battles were suppose to be displayed?

 

[Broseph08]

But they didn't have to make him that number and it felt pretty weird having him become number three in the PWC despite having the least amount of exposure out of all of them. Why was he the third best trainer in the world again? That's what I was trying to say

Because he's sexy as hell

 

[Sham]

Because he's sexy as hell

Yeah no, the dude is boring. He’s got as much personality as a bag of rocks. Immediately L making this a hyped match.

 

[Sham]

@UnovaMaster stay mad Steven is a flop and Metagross got no kills in.

 

[Broseph08]

Yeah no, the dude is boring. He’s got as much personality as a bag of rocks. Immediately L making this a hyped match.

Meh, the only champions with actual, distinct personalities are Iris and Leon. The rest are all some combination of nice, wise and powerful. Iris obviously wasn't gonna be #3 and Leon was already established with Cynthia for the later rounds. Might as well go with the champion from the universally liked games and most dripped out design

 

[Sham]

Meh, the only champions with actual, distinct personalities are Iris and Leon. The rest are all some combination of nice, wise and powerful. Iris obviously wasn't gonna be #3 and Leon was already established with Cynthia for the later rounds. Might as well go with the champion from the universally liked games and most dripped out design

Honestly then the best bet would be just go with Lance. At least he has that emotionless stoic thing that people find interesting. He has no personality either but at least that’s his thing which is showing no emotion and he’s been in the anime since OS and actually had a bunch of moments with Ash.

It’s not a big thing but just randomly making Steven the third most powerful and hype around him facing Ash was arbitrary tbh

 

[Broseph08]

Honestly then the best bet would be just go with Lance. At least he has that emotionless stoic thing that people find interesting. He has no personality either but at least that’s his thing which is showing no emotion and he’s been in the anime since OS and actually had a bunch of moments with Ash.

It’s not a big thing but just randomly making Steven the third most powerful and hype around him facing Ash was arbitrary tbh

It was random but I don't remember it being hyped. He was just the first matchup of the tournament for Ash. The equivalent of Titus/Astrid in Kalos or Nando in DP. Also I don't think Steven is really emotionless like Lance was. He's more of the 'cool and collected' type as opposed to being uber serious like Lance was

 

[Sham]

It was random but I don't remember it being hyped. He was just the first matchup of the tournament for Ash. The equivalent of Titus/Astrid in Kalos or Nando in DP. Also I don't think Steven is really emotionless like Lance was. He's more of the 'cool and collected' type as opposed to being uber serious like Lance was

Actually you’re right. It was mostly the fandom but them adding him onto the “1,2,3” thing along Cynthia was just a thing…I guess.

As far as the other Champions not showing any personality, I’d say Cynthia showed a more stoic take during battling that she didn’t before. She seemed more serious and aloof.

 

[GarchompTheAssassin]

After sitting on it for a week, I can say without a doubt that it was one of the tournaments of all time.

 

[Sham]

They should’ve properly explained how the rankings go. In some instances we have the anime implying that rankings does equate to strength and other instances—it’s who’s been longer.

Which is it? Lance went from number two, to number 4 yet we still don’t why or have Cynthia and Steven got to their places

 

[SerGoldenhandtheJust]

I like to think that Cynthia Steven and Diantha etc didn't participate in the original PWC where Leon first became World Champion by beating Lance. But after he did that, and his legendary status as the unbeatable, they got very interested in surpassing him and entered the tournament, giving us the first Masters 8 which featured all the champions upto that point
Makes it more satisfying to think about

 

[AJ97]

I like to think that Cynthia Steven and Diantha etc didn't participate in the original PWC where Leon first became World Champion by beating Lance. But after he did that, and his legendary status as the unbeatable, they got very interested in surpassing him and entered the tournament, giving us the first Masters 8 which featured all the champions upto that point
Makes it more satisfying to think about

This isn't logical.
Plus, the Champions entering the tournament to "Surpass" Leon doesn't make much sense. It would make more sense for the Champions to enter to get the title of being the strongest trainer in the world.

I mean, Cynthia, Steven and Diantha could easily request an official battle with Leon and challenge him outside the PWC setting if it was just about battling him. Unlike Ash, the former 3 are celebrities and actual Regional champions from credible leagues.

Plus, makes no sense to think that they all started the exact time Ash had. I mean, Ash barely had any roadblocks in the tournament outside of the small struggle after his initial loss against Bea. Cynthia was already in the Master Class even before Ash entered the Hyper Class; based on Volkner's comments post their battle.

Additionally, Leon seemed to know all of their battle styles and have a good idea of how strong the rest of them were.

I think Lance is being necessarily looked down upon. Diantha wasn't necessarily superior to Lance. One crucial reason she came out ahead was that she was able to predict Lance's last strategy. If she hadn't done this, the battle could've gone the other way.

That said, I do agree Lance doesn't seem stronger than Steven or Diantha (And the writers seem to see this as well based on how they allocated the ranks). Maybe Leon defeated Cynthia and Steven in the last PWC? Or perhaps Cynthia defeated Steven and lost to Leon?

I mean, what if this years final tournament had Leon, Cynthia, Steven and Ash in the second block with Iris, Diantha, Lance & lain in the first block?
Even if one of them reached the finals, it doesn't mean that they are necessarily stronger than everyone in the other Block (Or at least until they beat the strongest trainer from their block).

 

[jrizza88]

After watching the world cup so far, I wish the PWC followed this format where pre knockout rounds (or top 8 given the current format) followed the world cup where you'd have to win a certain amount to guarantee a spot in the top 8 (or top 16 if we got what we wanted including reserves). That way, Ash could have lost one or tied a round in the pre knockouts, we could have saw more elite 4, powerful trainers, reserves, etc. They could have even just had the reserves for the pre-elims and gave us the Journeys team for the top 8 or 16...

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

After watching the world cup so far, I wish the PWC followed this format where pre knockout rounds (or top 8 given the current format) followed the world cup where you'd have to win a certain amount to guarantee a spot in the top 8 (or top 16 if we got what we wanted including reserves).

The anime already did this in Johto.

 

[jrizza88]

The anime already did this in Johto.

Well they should have done it again lol

 

[Ragnarok4]

In my opinion, the PWC as a whole was a massive waste of potential. For what should've felt like a celebration of the show's long history and a grand stage for Ash to achieve some of his greatest accomplishments, the execution was absolutely terrible. Off-screened battles, missed chances to pull out ignored or 'jobber' reserves and give them some glory, very little use of past rivals Ash never beat, only one E4 match, complete lack of SwSh characters...honestly, it felt less impactful than a badge quest.

The M8 was slightly better, but it was still far from what it should've been. With the lack of reserves and almost none of Ash's friends in attendance, what should've felt like the culmination of Ash's journey as a battler felt rather weak.

perfect comment, nothing more to say

 

[SatoSereFan224888]

I really hope its legacy is properly continued tho in the future as we have confirmation Ash is continuing
Hope this isn't just swept away and is treated as monumental as the narrative established it to be

I’m afraid the writers will reset Ash again which is stupid. I’d rather have Ash become an adult and be a supporting character instead of the main hero.

 

[ShuckFam]

The PWC could have be used to settle some scores some of us older, pettier fans, wanted to be settled. It would have been nice to see Ash overwhelm Trip in the normal class to show the levels between them, along with Ash's growth. Tobias coming back would have been so cool, too. He would have slotted in nicely as a Project Mew guy, what with him catching so many legends and all.

I would have made Ash fight Alain in the Ultra class and lose (with Ash Greninja), leading to the Greninja/Lucario training arc where the frog passes the torch to his superior ally. Alain then loses to Ash in the M8, with Lucario solo'ing his entire team.

 

[vondecayle]

I’m glad that quite a few pokemon got some much needed screentime. Aurorus, Spiritomb, Cradily and Mr. Rime.

 

[Ragnarok4]

I would have made Ash fight Alain in the Ultra class and lose (with Ash Greninja), leading to the Greninja/Lucario training arc where the frog passes the torch to his superior ally. Alain then loses to Ash in the M8, with Lucario solo'ing his entire team.

I don't want to be rude but this is horrible. It is not possible that you talked about this rematch without mentioning that Alain and Serena should have appeared together, like a couple. Also, MCX vs Greninja again sounds silly, Bisharp's revenge is better, with the Steele boy winning, and then, being avenged (Greninja)by Lucario Base who would make a monumental sweep.